1-cyclopropyl-6-fluoro-4-oxo-7-piperazin-1-yl-quinoline-3-carboxylic acid

Also known as H2O...

DoctorRx1986 said:

Just out of curiosity, will we have to know some of the IUPAC/systematic names of certain drugs? The above is for Ciprofloxacin.

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You're going to NSU right? No you won't...the curriculum is far more clinical-based. So you'll know everything about quinolones in that regard, but IUPAC naming won't be in the picture.

I'm yet to have to IUPAC name a thing in pharmacy school.

If you have med chem (some schools apparently don't) you may discuss numbering just so you know where groups are (like steroids) but you'll never name the molecule.

There's a lot you can tell about cipro by looking at that name though...

SpirivaSunrise said:

There's a lot you can tell about cipro by looking at that name though...

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what's that? It's a Pro at Ci? See Ipro!? C-I-P-R-O?

I almost crapped in my pants when i saw the name of this thread....

Caverject said:

what's that? It's a Pro at Ci? See Ipro!? C-I-P-R-O?

I almost crapped in my pants when i saw the name of this thread....

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How much have you been drinking tonight??

SpirivaSunrise said:

How much have you been drinking tonight??

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just 1 diet pepsi! I got the right one baby...

DoctorRx1986 said:

Excellent! good memory! You remember I'm going to attend NSU this fall. Now that i'm at it, what was your first week of study at NSU like? If i'm not mistaken, the program doesn't offer an actual course in medicinal chemistry, but elements of this course are incorporated in pharmcodynamics...am i correct? How much different are the pharmacy textbooks compared to undergrad?

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she looked at your posting history...never give a woman any credit

seriously, simmer down dude.

(psst. that was intended for DoctorRx1986.)

Do you really think anyone would learn that? There's 13 parts to that name. Seriously.

Hello sir, I see you're taking *deep breath* 1-cyclopropyl-6-fluoro-4-oxo-7-piperazin-1-yl-quinoline-3-carboxylic acid,

or as the laymen like to say "Ciprofloxacin". Would you mind if I spend a few minutes going over WHY THE HELL I LEARNED THAT?

As much as I would love spending time to memorize a ridiculously long crazy chemical name, I think I have better and more worthwhile things to do like staring blankly at the wall.

DoctorRx1986 said:

Excellent! good memory! You remember I'm going to attend NSU this fall. Now that i'm at it, what was your first week of study at NSU like? If i'm not mistaken, the program doesn't offer an actual course in medicinal chemistry, but elements of this course are incorporated in pharmcodynamics...am i correct? How much different are the pharmacy textbooks compared to undergrad?

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Well, I remember you posted asking what orientation was like. First week of classes? Heck, I don't really remember anything specific that's worth mentioning. It's not really that memorable. Mainly just meeting new people that you're going to spend the next four years with! Professors will dive right in...but don't get all panicky like some type-A personalities do. Sit back and enjoy it.

You're right though...no class speicifically called med chem. Most of that will be wrapped into dyanimcs I, first semester. But it's very minimal. Remember: think big clinical picture.

Textbooks? Well...the ones in undergrad just provided a good solid foundation for what you're about to get into. Now it's time for the fun stuff...clinical pharmacology, drug therapy, patient care.

Take njac's advice though...don't worry about it all too much. You're in a good program! Relax, enjoy it, and you'll do well. Once you've become settled with the workload, be sure to get varied pharmacy experience early on...figure out what fits you best. Good luck!

I don't have enough room in my brain to memorize IUPAC naming. It's pointless and it won't be useful in practice. We don't even hear the names in our Med Chem class.

Our medicinal chemistry professor usually asks some in the form of multiple choice. You really don't have to know what drug it is , but by looking at the structure he gives you, you should be able to name the structure out of a list of answers. He requires us to know the most of the major ring systems or functional groups for every therapeutic class and all that. Don't know about your school but just be able to remember your IUPAC naming conventions and recognize functional groups.

Man you guys are lucky, here we have IUPAC naming on every Organic Chem test, and in almost every fashion.. drawing the structure from the name and naming the structure etc

I'd much rather learn laymen terms, (which we do on a really small scale) but I don't really have a choice in the matter

Knipps said:

Man you guys are lucky, here we have IUPAC naming on every Organic Chem test, and in almost every fashion.. drawing the structure from the name and naming the structure etc

I'd much rather learn laymen terms, (which we do on a really small scale) but I don't really have a choice in the matter

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Hmm... Organic chem =/ Pharmacy school. We all did chemistry courses which require IUPAC... this is for pharmacy school courses.

P.S. How can you be a graduate in 2012, 6 year program or something?

Requiem said:

Hmm... Organic chem =/ Pharmacy school. We all did chemistry courses which require IUPAC... this is for pharmacy school courses.

P.S. How can you be a graduate in 2012, 6 year program or something?

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I would love to be in Organic Chem again compared to this Med Chem crap.....

Requiem said:

Hmm... Organic chem =/ Pharmacy school. We all did chemistry courses which require IUPAC... this is for pharmacy school courses.

P.S. How can you be a graduate in 2012, 6 year program or something?

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Exactly. I finish this semester and I'm auto-enrolled for professional years

DoctorRx1986 said:

Cycloketocaine, wouldn't medicinal chemistry be even more interesting than organic chemistry? After all, i believe it is more applicable to the human body. So, why is it crap?

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I guess it depends on the school, but I love Med Chem!

If you understand why various parts of a structure are significant, you'll know more about the drug. I guess you could say that you'll know more than "it's for pain", "it's for anxiety", or "it's for infection". You'll know why it's believed that certain compounds do a better job.

For example:
Let's compare Oxycodone and Hydrocodone. After you analyze the structures, you should be able to notice that the only difference between Oxycodone and Hydrocodone is that Oxycodone has an additional OH (hydroxyl) group between the non-aromatic rings (hence, Oxycodone). OH groups increase activity --> Oxycodone is more active than Hydrocodone. The same goes for Codeine and Morphine. Morphine is more active than Codeine, because it has an additional OH group.




Hydrocodone




Morphine

Let's compare quinolones and fluroquinolones. Halocarbons are lipophilic --> they have better penetration through cellular membranes. The F (fluoride) group on Ciprofloxacin increase it's lipophilicity.
The nitrogen groups (heterocyclic ring) that are substituted on the aromatic ring increase the drugs' activity spectrum. The cyclic nitrogen group attached to the non-aromatic ring of Ciprofloxacin works the same way --> increases activity spectrum.
Therefore... Ciprofloxacin and Levofloxacin have increased activity --> "better" antibiotics.


Nalidixic Acid (quinolone)



Ciprofloxacin (fluroquinolone)


Levofloxacin (fluroquinolone)



I have to go study, so that's all for today's chemistry lesson.

PharmDstudent said:

I guess it depends on the school, but I love Med Chem!
The same goes for Codeine and Morphine. Morphine is more active than Codeine, because it has an additional OH group.

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Heh. I've never heard that before, med chem here was terrible and completely irrelevant, with med chem making up 0% of the national licensing exam.

P.S. Codeine isn't more active than Morphine because of a hydroxyl group; it's a prodrug for morphine so only a fraction of codeine becomes morphine.. hence you give larger doses.

Requiem said:

Heh. I've never heard that before, med chem here was terrible and completely irrelevant, with med chem making up 0% of the national licensing exam.

P.S. Codeine isn't more active than Morphine because of a hydroxyl group; it's a prodrug for morphine so only a fraction of codeine becomes morphine.. hence you give larger doses.

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10% of Codeine is metabolized to Morphine

I read somewhere that there were a few Med Chem questions on the Naplex. Let me try to find where they said that...

thread

crossurfingers said:

Also, I remember one or two med chem questions. That kind of freaked me out since everyone always said med chem wasn't on the exam.

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PharmDstudent said:

I guess it depends on the school, but I love Med Chem!

If you understand why various parts of a structure are significant, you'll know more about the drug. I guess you could say that you'll know more than "it's for pain", "it's for anxiety", or "it's for infection". You'll know why it's believed that certain compounds do a better job.

For example:
Let's compare Oxycodone and Hydrocodone. After you analyze the structures, you should be able to notice that the only difference between Oxycodone and Hydrocodone is that Oxycodone has an additional OH (hydroxyl) group between the non-aromatic rings (hence, Oxycodone). OH groups increase activity --> Oxycodone is more active than Hydrocodone. The same goes for Codeine and Morphine. Morphine is more active than Codeine, because it has an additional OH group.


Hydrocodone

Morphine

Let's compare quinolones and fluroquinolones. Halocarbons are lipophilic --> they have better penetration through cellular membranes. The F (fluoride) group on Ciprofloxacin increase it's lipophilicity.
The nitrogen groups (heterocyclic ring) that are substituted on the aromatic ring increase the drugs' activity spectrum. The cyclic nitrogen group attached to the non-aromatic ring of Ciprofloxacin works the same way --> increases activity spectrum.
Therefore... Ciprofloxacin and Levofloxacin have increased activity --> "better" antibiotics.

Nalidixic Acid (quinolone)

Ciprofloxacin (fluroquinolone)

Levofloxacin (fluorquinolone)

I have to go study, so that's all for today's chemistry lesson.

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I have to say, I understood that, now if only i could remember it

PharmDstudent said:

10% of Codeine is metabolized to Morphine

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Hence I said a fraction

PharmDstudent said:

I read somewhere that there were a few Med Chem questions on the Naplex. Let me try to find where they said that...

thread

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We don't write the NAPLEX in Canada.. it's the PEBC's + OSCE's.

Requiem said:

Hence I said a fraction

We don't write the NAPLEX in Canada.. it's the PEBC's + OSCE's.

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Are you trying to be cute?

I didn't want to bring up prodrug to someone who probably has no concept of what that means. For the sake of discussion though, you're 100% correct. Codeine is a prodrug of morphine, and 1/10th (a fraction ) of codeine is converted into morphine.

For anyone who's interested... this is a decent definition of a prodrug.

PharmDstudent said:

I guess it depends on the school, but I love Med Chem!

If you understand why various parts of a structure are significant, you'll know more about the drug. I guess you could say that you'll know more than "it's for pain", "it's for anxiety", or "it's for infection". You'll know why it's believed that certain compounds do a better job.

For example:
Let's compare Oxycodone and Hydrocodone. After you analyze the structures, you should be able to notice that the only difference between Oxycodone and Hydrocodone is that Oxycodone has an additional OH (hydroxyl) group between the non-aromatic rings (hence, Oxycodone). OH groups increase activity --> Oxycodone is more active than Hydrocodone. The same goes for Codeine and Morphine. Morphine is more active than Codeine, because it has an additional OH group.



.

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I just took my med chem final over that stuff. Can't say that I sad that it is over.

Med Chem at my school is useless and you can tell becuase the professors are too lazy to write new test questions (which is a God send in so many way)

firefighter9015 said:

I just took my med chem final over that stuff. Can't say that I sad that it is over.

Med Chem at my school is useless and you can tell becuase the professors are too lazy to write new test questions (which is a God send in so many way)

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My Med Chem exam is tomorrow morning. I just love going to school on a Saturday.

PharmDstudent said:

Are you trying to be cute?

I didn't want to bring up prodrug to someone who probably has no concept of what that means. For the sake of discussion though, you're 100% correct. Codeine is a prodrug of morphine, and 1/10th (a fraction ) of codeine is converted into morphine.

For anyone who's interested... this is a decent definition of a prodrug.

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Hahahha, fair enough.

PharmDstudent said:

The same goes for Codeine and Morphine. Morphine is more active than Codeine, because it has an additional OH group.

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I really like your lecture......So why is it that when you acetylate both hydroxyl groups on morphine you get something way more potent than morphine??

RX CARE said:

I really like your lecture......So why is it that when you acetylate both hydroxyl groups on morphine you get something way more potent than morphine??

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The acetylated groups on heroine make the structure more lipophilic. This allows the structure to cross the blood brain barrier more rapidly than morphine. If taken orally, our bodies will deactylate heroine into morphine. If the acetylated version of morphine (heroine) is injected, it will remain acetylated in the body, it will not be affected by deactylation metabolism (first-pass metabolism), and this will lead to a greater analgesic effect.