The Loneliness of the Med Student

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JustSomePreMed

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I'm an M2 who's struggling with what I'm sure at least a few people have struggled with on here: loneliness and isolation.

I remember feeling this a bit last year, particularly during the winter while studying biochem and all that boring stuff. But this year it struck much earlier, and I've been having trouble with it.

I do well in school, but I also find that going to class is a huge waste of time for me, so I don't go. I only attend the mandatory small group activities we have most mornings. Then I feel like most of my time otherwise is spent studying and studying and studying. M2 has more information, so there seems like even less time to do anything but studying (I do try to work out fairly regularly so I don't turn into a slob).

Part of it is isolation from my other classmates I guess. Part of it is having no girlfriend (my girlfriend and I broke up in the Fall of last year . . . then I dated a girl this summer that I turned out to not really like at all, so I dumped her). I've never been one to use women as a crutch, but maybe that's part of my problem. But then again, I can't seem to find the time to go out and meet women outside of med school anyway.

It's gotten me real down lately, and the fact that it's still only October has me concerned, since it seems like it'll only get worse as Step I approaches.

Any advice?
 
Schedule some time into your week to have fun. Obviously it most likely won't be more than once a week, and even that only on non-test weeks, but you need time to relax and escape stress.

I just also wanted to point out that as you get older and have more responsibilities, your social life will diminish in comparison with college. This has actually struck me quite painfully in college, because studying alone in my room tends to make me lonely, as well, but it needs to be done.

Just live by the "work hard, play hard" mantra.
 
Don't study at home, if you're always at home you feel like a worthless p.o.s. who never does anything (at least I do). Try to go to one lecture a day so you actually see some people, then just study at school or a coffee shop on campus.
 
Hanging out with people takes time away from studying. You can't really get around that. Arrange your priorities accordingly.

And no, "group studying" does not count towards either hanging out or studying, as far as I'm concerned.
 
I hear you totally!! Felt exactly the same way.

my advice would be to find 1 other med student female (i am assuming you are male) study partner who is intelligent and motivated so you could push each other. (I've found that studying with another male study partner is not as productive since egos always get in the way)

like others said, go out at least once in 2 weeks.

call your friends and family to talk to them every once in a while.

study in the library, or be part of a study group, that mets every once in a while.
 
I was quite lonely during the first two years as well. There's often nothing you can do about it, since, even if you squeeze your priorities and summon the motivation to go out, your classmates will be busy studying or totally immersed in the indisposable facets of their personal lives (significant other from college, extracurriculars, etc.). Further, everyone was so focused on their work that any friendships I DID manage to establish felt pretty superficial...much more like acquaintances, with more important things on their minds.

I think you'll find that, in complete contrast, during third-year you'll be REALLY close to the group of people you happen to rotate with. I went from having nobody (literally, nobody, and my live-in girlfriend broke up with me and left during my second year as well) to having at least 7 or 8 GOOD friends that I feel quite close to.

I honestly think that suffering through the first two years in relative isolation is a necessary part of getting through med school. It's why approximately half of any given class is on SSRIs. Just stick it out, and trust that it will get better.
 
My friends and I definitely have similar feelings, so you're definitely not alone. I know that people suggest taking time to do fun stuff, but realistically that's just not always possible. I find that eating lunch with friends/classmates really helps. Also, studying with people REALLY helps ease the boredom (granted, I mean studying with people once you've really got the material down, so you all aren't wasting time). Lately I've been making up stories/mnemonics with my friends to help remember things from class. This sound silly, but it's actually fun and breaks up the monotony!
 
I feel you on the loneliness. I just got divorced, moved away from my home town, and I feel like I dont have anything in common with my classmates. On top of that, I study all the time and barely pass the exams. It sucks. But I tell myself every day that it's worth it, because I know it is. Four years is a short time.

I agree with the suggestion that you should try to study in a public place. It helps to be around people, and sometimes you will end up having very superficial interactions that are better than none at all.

Also, people will like you more if you seem happy. I'm always pissed or depressed and I'm pretty sure my classmates pick up on that (either consciously or subconsciously), so I've been trying to at least pretend that I'm a happy person. It seems to work.
 
Some say "Loneliness is the poverty of self; solitude is the richness of self"
Others say, "You are lonely when you have so much to give but no one to give to."

I think loneliness n sadness are inseparable so I'm going to adress both these issues here.

Trust me, I've been there, I know what loneliness, sadness, depression means n I've come out of that all by myself. If you want to get over your loneliness, just try to look at the glass half full n not half empty. Now I feel that dependence upon other people for happiness is a sign of weakness. Instead I try to find happiness within me.

People tend to ovef look something that loneliness gives you, it gives you time and solitude. When I broke up with my gf, I found that I have all the time in the world to do everything (that might not be the case with evryone else). So what I am saying is, devote that time to take care of yourself.

The best thing you can do is -
Take up a hobby (a serious one) - it can be anything. It can be something you had always wanted to do but never got around doing either because of time constraints or other reasons. It can be music, painting, story books, world cinema, star gazing, photography, cooking... u name it. Basically i'd suggest "whatever helps" but just ask yourself that what u r taking up is it something nice, something beautiful... judge with ur own morality n rationality n b true to urself, n u'll never be wrong. I believe following one's own heart is the toughest n one of the most beautiful things that one can do. (I know u've heard these words many times over, so u might readily want to discard them. But trust me, I've REALISED these in my life, all by myself & after being through a lot, so u can pretty much bet that these have atleast some credibility)

For me it was music - When i was passing through this phase of real loneliness and depression during my 2nd year, I took up the guitar n my life has never been the same again. Music is the most beautiful thing in the world. I started out with rock, blues then went into world music, n now am into indian classical (IMO the greatest form of music in the universe), western classical, fusion jazz/rock, pop jazz.

I'll never forget something my chemistry teacher told me in 11th grade - Good things will never come to you, you'll have to go towards them.
I have realised this during every step in my life.

Finally work hard to achieve your goals, take a break sometimes, relax, have a drink/some good food, go to a movie (all by urself) or just sit in a park or by a river or lake and try to enjoy your solitude. Trust me u'll become addicted to it.

Just remember - Expectations are the source of all sadness (just imagine the last time u were sad n u'll realise tht it was bcuz u were expecting something to happen or someone to do something n it didnt happen). U might need to let go of even the basic expectations from life. If you dont expect then u cannot be sad, there's a saying "A thousand men can't undress a naked man." However the one and only person you can expect something from is yourself, thts because u dont have any control over actions of other people or other things, but only over ur own.

If you c, I don't post much on SDN, thats because most of the times I don't have anything to say n I'm not one of those who speak just cuz they have to say something, rather I speak when I have something to say. I have given a lot of thought to these concepts of loneliness, sadness, happiness, solitude, thats y i cud write so much.

I'll be most glad if it helps someone else to even the smallest extent.

Take care 🙂
 
I think you have some good points. Overall, I give you a 👍. Ignore those people who are going to try to tear you down.

 
Thank you for posting about your situation. You sounded like you were telling my story, so at least you know from mine and others responses that you are not alone. I am in a class of 150 and don't really have anything in common with even 1 other person. I'm not really big on lectures either and I hate large groups. I do interact with classmates but on more of a superficial level. Truthfully, I am more of an introvert so I don't mind being on my own, but I sometimes feel sad when I see others with their groups of friends. Anyways, I look at 3rd year as the light at the end of the tunnel since we will be working in smaller groups and should have less of the sense of 'being lonely in a large crowd'. Take care and stay off the SSRIs if you can, everyone!
 
I haven't become real close to any of my classmates. I have many people I'm friendly with, but not really any close friends that I hang out with. (In my case this is partially by design since I have a family and choose to limit med school social interaction to in-school time). However, I think even if I wanted to make some close friends it might be tough since, by-and-large, social groups seem to have cemented, and from what I hear it can be kinda tough to break in. So honestly, if your school is anything like mine, you may find it hard to make friends there at this point.

Therefore my advice is this: Join an interest group based on something you like to do. If you like the outdoors, find a hiking club. If you like art, start taking evening art classes. If you are religious, find a church with a good college group. Most of the people in these groups won't be nearly as busy as med students, and will have the time to be your friend (assuming you make the time to be theirs!). My experience has been that interest groups tend to be very welcoming, and if you go to a few you are bound to make some friends. Plus it's nice to have friends that aren't always stressed out at the same time you are. Honestly, I generally think my classmates are great people, but I'm happy that I've made the decision to have my close friendships outside of medical school. Just my two cents.

Good luck, I'm sorry you feel lonely, and I hope that you'll find some great friends or a super-hot, rich, smart woman who can't keep her hands off of you.
 
Sometimes you just gotta get big. Like not, not big in the sense of weight
You know what I mean like gaining weight... like, COLOSSAL - lil wayne

Believe it or not, hes right. Nobody became a giant unless they grew into one. I feel you on the issue at hand, but this is the struggle of modernity. We do not have to farm our land and toil in our communities so we have extra time to brew our sorrow. I suggest you get busy as hell in some way to get out of the funk.
 
serenmoon said:
I am in a class of 150 and don't really have anything in common with even 1 other person. I'm not really big on lectures either and I hate large groups. I do interact with classmates but on more of a superficial level. Truthfully, I am more of an introvert so I don't mind being on my own, but I sometimes feel sad when I see others with their groups of friends. Anyways, I look at 3rd year as the light at the end of the tunnel since we will be working in smaller groups and should have less of the sense of 'being lonely in a large crowd'. Take care and stay off the SSRIs if you can, everyone!
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Exactly my situation. I am on the older side (maybe right in the middle age-wise) in my class and have little in common with my classmates. I am social at school but haven't formed any friendships that extend outside of school. Out of the handful of close friends I still have in my life, a few got married and therefore we don't talk as much anymore, and the others are in law/politics/things completely non-medically related in places far away from me.

I am also an introvert who likes being alone, so I definitely am not one who would get on SSRIs at any point, but I think a big side effect has been weight gain for me. Without a car or friends to go hiking/outside activities with, I just sit around and study/watch TV shows on my computer sitting on my couch (I hate gyms, and I maintained healthy weight in other cities I lived in that favor a healthy, outside lifestyle with lots of parks in walking distance and such, which I definitely don't have in my current living situation). I hate the fact I'm gaining weight, but I just let it go knowing that school comes first and hope that once I get on the wards and out of my apartment/couch, things will be back to normal. (And it is one reason I wanna get the hell out of the Midwest when I'm done with school, I've definitely noticed the times I've lived in the East Coast or abroad I've been healthiest).

getting off my blabbering and to the OP, I echo other people's suggestions, especially to enjoy being alone. I love the freedom of being alone (granted, I've never had a boyfriend, so I've never experienced the other side, but sometimes I even prefer going places by myself to going with friends/family); I can go to a crappy chick flick on my own and sob with a bunch of strangers who won't ever laugh at me for liking a cheesy chick flick, enjoy going to concerts for music that only I'm into, etc, etc.
 
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You wanna talk about school sucking? I just turned down a girl inviting me over explicitly for sex (well, and a movie first) because I'm way behind on studying and have an exam coming up very soon.


Seriously. It's days like this that I absolutely hate medical school.
 
GuyWhoDoesStuff said:
You wanna talk about school sucking? I just turned down a girl inviting me over explicitly for sex (well, and a movie first) because I'm way behind on studying and have an exam coming up very soon.


Seriously. It's days like this that I absolutely hate medical school.
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Damn dude. Maybe it's me but I would've thrown caution to the wind.
 
Get a dog. I'm serious. I was a home-schooler throughout my second year, and there were days when my dog kept my sanity. No matter how crazy you feel as you study, seeing a German Shepherd sitting in front of you with a tennis ball in her mouth with an expression that says "why do you stare at those papers all day?" would put life back into perspective for me. Just a 5 or 10 minute break to go into the back yard to throw the tennis ball for the dog was a huge help - a little fresh air, a little running, and somebody who loved me unconditionally.

I had to pay a little extra rent because I got a cheap house in a bad neighborhood rather than an apartment in order to have room for a big dog, but it was worth every penny.
 
GuyWhoDoesStuff said:
You wanna talk about school sucking? I just turned down a girl inviting me over explicitly for sex (well, and a movie first) because I'm way behind on studying and have an exam coming up very soon.


Seriously. It's days like this that I absolutely hate medical school.
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Dude WTF is wrong with you?!?!?!?? I swear to god if I had half that kind of good fortune I'd take over the world.
 
Go to a gym outside of campus or something. Meet people away from med school.

I personally think all the kids in my class are good people, but really I'm not too sure I want to spend all my free time with medical students. LOL. I spend a lot of time at home rather than at school as well, and if I wanted new friends I think I'd do it outside of med school. JM.02

P.S. Don't bother getting a girlfriend IMHO--if you do, be selective and set the rules from day 1 about how much time you can spend with her. But, again, I'd reommend you just yank your meat for a few years and maybe have some one-nighters. I don't think medical school is a great time to have someone trying to eat up all of your time.
 
FatPigeon
It's why approximately half of any given class is on SSRIs.
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Are you freaggin Serious? What the heck!! I was on SSRIs a few years ago and reading that just scares that ****zle out of me...:wow::scared:
 
When you think you're lonely and isolated, reflect on my experience:

Moved to Germany, spent 15 months (roughly half in language courses), being insulted daily by the instructors because I'm American (Germans seem to have a huge hard on for Americans). Then in med school, understanding the material in another language fully, but being unable to actually answer questions when called in class (though the exams are quite understandable), and being treated like a dumb foreigner by xenophobic students who want nothing to do with foreigners, to the point when told in lectures by the professors that they MUST work with the foreigners in labs, nearly 300 students in the hall protested. The school is forcing integration due to rampant xenophobia that exists in the population at large, and exists within the student body.

The hysterical part is I am the only one in my classes getting great scores on the tests, even though they're in German, and at least 20% of the material is in English, and they don't have the ability to understand because Germans live in a vacuum and think everyone outside of Germany has to speak German and they hate English. So, the fellow students regardless treat us like we're stupid, and have had zero understanding for us in the beginning, while they can't understand most of what is being taught.

So your experience isn't so bad, as I'm isolated by my skin color, and the fact that I'm American in a country that is viciously anti-American, to the point where the instructors, instead of being more open to the world, regurgitate Stasi propaganda all these years later, and the news pretty much lies about the state of the US.

Oh, not to forget the massive problem with Nazism that Germany is covering up.
 
slight365 said:
When you think you're lonely and isolated, reflect on my experience:

Moved to Germany, spent 15 months (roughly half in language courses)...
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Makes you take the "world opinion of the US" a whole lot less seriously, huh?
 
tncekm said:
Makes you take the "world opinion of the US" a whole lot less seriously, huh?
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Well, what I learned is that the US is an easy scapegoat for governments around the world to blame their problems on, such as Germany. The people here are like sheep and believe that the social and economic problems that have persisted for two decades in some cases are due to the US. The politicians are playing into this, including Merkel, who chases cameras, such as with the Opel nonsense, then pretends to be Obama's best friend and a champion of the American people, but overseas. She's done nothing but badmouth the US, and has helped fuel the violent radicalization of of Anti-Americanism and xenophobia in Germany.

You should see the news here. This country has so many problems of their own, and they are so on the US's dick, 24/7, that people, and I'm not joking, know more about what's happening in the US than they do about Germany's politics.

On top of that, I have Germans, notably instructors who are xenophobic, but in language schools, or all places, having no problems with telling me how the US is, while overlooking their own scandals and problems.

Regardless, I got a warm, fuzzy feeling when the 300 or so students in my lecture hall protested when they were told they are required to have a foreigner in their group if there are any in their classes.

That's isolation.
 
slight365 said:
Well, what I learned is that the US is an easy scapegoat for governments around the world to blame their problems on, such as Germany.
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Yup... I don't understand how so many people fail to see this. It's no different than the human nature for the poor to hate the rich. It's the "big bad rich person has taken advantage of you" syndrome. The only problem I have is that so many in the US are concerned with what the rest of the world thinks of us without realizing we'll be hated as long as we're on top. The minute we get knocked off the top of the hill, people will like us a lot more.

The people here are like sheep
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Not "too" different from the US, it's just that our politicians hard on different topics.

Overall, thanks for the super interesting posts. And, I'm sorry about your situation!
 
JustSomePreMed said:
I'm an M2 who's struggling with what I'm sure at least a few people have struggled with on here: loneliness and isolation.

I remember feeling this a bit last year, particularly during the winter while studying biochem and all that boring stuff. But this year it struck much earlier, and I've been having trouble with it.

I do well in school, but I also find that going to class is a huge waste of time for me, so I don't go. I only attend the mandatory small group activities we have most mornings. Then I feel like most of my time otherwise is spent studying and studying and studying. M2 has more information, so there seems like even less time to do anything but studying (I do try to work out fairly regularly so I don't turn into a slob).

Part of it is isolation from my other classmates I guess. Part of it is having no girlfriend (my girlfriend and I broke up in the Fall of last year . . . then I dated a girl this summer that I turned out to not really like at all, so I dumped her). I've never been one to use women as a crutch, but maybe that's part of my problem. But then again, I can't seem to find the time to go out and meet women outside of med school anyway.

It's gotten me real down lately, and the fact that it's still only October has me concerned, since it seems like it'll only get worse as Step I approaches.

Any advice?
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What you need is something to look forward to outside of your studies. Find someone to have sex with, get a dog, play video games (play NCAA football and try to recruit the best players you possibly can and try to get a full season without giving up a touchdown...or perfect that Peyton passing skills in the NFL game) or just do some of your studies where you find people.
 
tncekm said:
Yup... I don't understand how so many people fail to see this. It's no different than the human nature for the poor to hate the rich. It's the "big bad rich person has taken advantage of you" syndrome. The only problem I have is that so many in the US are concerned with what the rest of the world thinks of us without realizing we'll be hated as long as we're on top. The minute we get knocked off the top of the hill, people will like us a lot more.

Not "too" different from the US, it's just that our politicians hard on different topics.

Overall, thanks for the super interesting posts. And, I'm sorry about your situation!
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On the plus side, the school is really treating us well, and trying to actively take part in figuring out our needs in real-time, and also they seem to recognize racism and xenophobia in Germany, and are working on forcing people to integrate, despite protests and the isolation of foreign students. And it still amuses me how they are weak in English, and I am more bilingual than they are, due to the relationships of French, German, English, and Latin.

Now about the first point- I try to stay away from this, but only after I left did I see how much higher the quality of life is in the US. Germans visit and they trash the US, but I came here expecting a sophisticated, technologically advanced society, and I hear American tourists fall in love, but they never go too far outside the tourist areas. The reality is very different. The reality of the people is extraordinarily different, and in fact, hypocritical.

We think in the US our media is controlled. It seems like the government can't control the media enough like Germany. Germany suppresses bad stories and scandals and throws up more stories about the US instead.

And I hate saying it, but yes, they are jealous, and they have been defeated, and they have a lot of resentment. They are even actively revising history- since denying the holocaust is illegal, they deny such things as how the US rebuilt Germany after the war. They are taught that they themselves rebuilt west Germany. I was pretty astounded to read such a thing, and then actually hear it from my gf, who is German. They don't know much about the US's role in reunifying Germany, and they don't know much about such things as the Berlin Airlift. It's quite puzzling. Then under the crust of the society, you have those who were former informers for the Stasi in East Germany, who reported their own family members to the party for arrest. Now that is declassified and this is the underbelly of what Germans don't want to talk about- how many were informers and sold out their families and put them in prison. On top of that, Germany allowed Nazis to become politicians after WWII, and in kind, they allowed former East Germany politicians to become politicians in a reunified, democratic Germany, which also includes the Chancellor.

This is a ****ed up country.
 
slight365 said:
On the plus side, the school is really treating us well, and trying to actively take part in figuring out our needs in real-time, and also they seem to recognize racism and xenophobia in Germany, and are working on forcing people to integrate, despite protests and the isolation of foreign students. And it still amuses me how they are weak in English, and I am more bilingual than they are, due to the relationships of French, German, English, and Latin.

Now about the first point- I try to stay away from this, but only after I left did I see how much higher the quality of life is in the US. Germans visit and they trash the US, but I came here expecting a sophisticated, technologically advanced society, and I hear American tourists fall in love, but they never go too far outside the tourist areas. The reality is very different. The reality of the people is extraordinarily different, and in fact, hypocritical.

We think in the US our media is controlled. It seems like the government can't control the media enough like Germany. Germany suppresses bad stories and scandals and throws up more stories about the US instead.

And I hate saying it, but yes, they are jealous, and they have been defeated, and they have a lot of resentment. They are even actively revising history- since denying the holocaust is illegal, they deny such things as how the US rebuilt Germany after the war. They are taught that they themselves rebuilt west Germany. I was pretty astounded to read such a thing, and then actually hear it from my gf, who is German. They don't know much about the US's role in reunifying Germany, and they don't know much about such things as the Berlin Airlift. It's quite puzzling. Then under the crust of the society, you have those who were former informers for the Stasi in East Germany, who reported their own family members to the party for arrest. Now that is declassified and this is the underbelly of what Germans don't want to talk about- how many were informers and sold out their families and put them in prison. On top of that, Germany allowed Nazis to become politicians after WWII, and in kind, they allowed former East Germany politicians to become politicians in a reunified, democratic Germany, which also includes the Chancellor.

This is a ****ed up country.
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I don't really want to get into this, but you're clearly looking at Germany from the perspective of a foreign visitor, when you say that.

A foreign immigrant to the U.S. makes many of these same observations. (And yes, I can say that through firsthand observations). Many are shocked by the huge gap between rich and poor. (If you're shocked upon wandering outside the "tourist" regions of Germany, I take it you've never explored the "shady" areas of your own city? What is the crime rate, I wonder?)

Many find themselves on the butt end of racism and ignorance. Many find it is not nearly as easy to find a job in this "land of opportunity" as they had been led to believe (again, see racism). Many who had been professionals or first-class artists (musicians, performers, what have you) in their home countries find themselves doing menial labor jobs or working in positions far beneath their education/training/capacity. I know this 'cuz I've seen my dad who was a math professor scrub dishes at a fast food restaurant.

Not saying Germany is great while US is evil... But let's not kid ourselves and feed ourselves pretty stories about "how lucky we are" in the US and how much better foreigners have it in the US as compared to foreigners visiting other countries.

Oh that almost makes me laugh. Clearly you guys have not had the experience of being a foreigner in the US. Seeing a country from the perspective of a foreign visitor (any country) yields a quite different picture than the view a native typically has.
 
unsung said:
I don't really want to get into this, but you're clearly looking at Germany from the perspective of a foreign visitor, when you say that.

A foreign immigrant to the U.S. makes many of these same observations. (And yes, I can say that through firsthand observations). Many are shocked by the huge gap between rich and poor. (If you're shocked upon wandering outside the "tourist" regions of Germany, I take it you've never explored the "shady" areas of your own city? What is the crime rate, I wonder?)

Many find themselves on the butt end of racism and ignorance. Many find it is not nearly as easy to find a job in this "land of opportunity" as they had been led to believe (again, see racism). Many who had been professionals or first-class artists (musicians, performers, what have you) in their home countries find themselves doing menial labor jobs or working in positions far beneath their education/training/capacity. I know this 'cuz I've seen my dad who was a math professor scrub dishes at a fast food restaurant.

Not saying Germany is great while US is evil... But let's not kid ourselves and feed ourselves pretty stories about "how lucky we are" in the US and how much better foreigners have it in the US as compared to foreigners visiting other countries.

Oh that almost makes me laugh. Clearly you guys have not had the experience of being a foreigner in the US. Seeing a country from the perspective of a foreign visitor (any country) yields a quite different picture than the view a native typically has.
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It's a false assumption to think I haven't extensively toured my home city, to find the good and bad parts. I know them all well, and have grown up in some of the bad parts.

Your assumptions are completely outlandish, as I was a dark-skinned foreigner in the US as well! I wasn't born there, and in fact, I've been to at least one more country, so pipe down with the bull**** of not being a ****ing foreigner in the US. I was even more of a foreigner after 9/11 because my skin is brown, and it still doesn't ****ing compare to the idea that in Germany a foreigner can't go out during at least 8 days a year (the foreign affairs offices send out emergency letters about this!).

What you're trying to do is trying to equate what is going on in a former nazi, isolated, and extremely proud and protective country with what you're equipped of equating it to, which doesn't work. The case simply doesn't hold.

As far as education goes, my parents were educated overseas, and came to the US to start business, which they did quite well in. Only later did they settle into careers, which due to freer mobility in the US that doesn't exist in Germany, they were able to attain positions in business they didn't have the formal schooling for, using on the job to get them and move up. Such mobility is not possible in Germany because the structures are highly regulated, and get this- there is no minimum wage here, which is why 20-25% choose to stay on welfare in the eastern parts (because Germany won't even recognize the degrees of many in the DDR, and only this year were salaries equal to west Germany). The list goes on and on, but don't assume I'm some prick white, born in the USA *******. I got my citizenship AFTER I moved out, and only learned to appreciate it more and the quality of life there when I saw what it's really like here, and that is exactly one of the parts of an international experience I needed.

Oh, and the food sucks here.
 
Aaaaand another thread has been killed by tangential bickering.
 
yeah I don't wanna get into this either but I've spent a lot of time visiting family in Munich and Oberoesterreich and always had wonderful experiences. The most friendly, honest, genuine people; beautiful, clean cities; great food, awesome snowboarding in the winter, just a wonderful place to live. I get by on my German but it was never a problem because almost everyone under 40 y/o spoke English. I wanna go back!!!
 
coldweatherblue said:
yeah I don't wanna get into this either but I've spent a lot of time visiting family in Munich and Oberoesterreich and always had wonderful experiences. The most friendly, honest, genuine people; beautiful, clean cities; great food, awesome snowboarding in the winter, just a wonderful place to live. I get by on my German but it was never a problem because almost everyone under 40 y/o spoke English. I wanna go back!!!
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That's nice, but it still doesn't negate what is here. I posted some links back, hidden in the German media, in this thread:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=622437

Go read through.

Oh yeah, part of the reason why Germany is now under a threat of another terror attack (the first was the failed train bombing between Hamm and Koln) is due to the so called "headscarf martyr"- a woman murdered in a Dresden courthouse, while there was plenty of time for officers, or even anyone that cared to respond. When an officer finally responded, they automatically thought the husband was the murderer and shot him. Both were highly educated, and the woman was unable to find a job in Germany. Regardless, Germany is trying to hide the fact that the murderer saluted Germany's NPD-Nazi party, along with hailing Hitler, and no one in the court did anything in this massive amount of time he took to get out. On top of that, he's German, but the media keeps calling him Russian and even changed his name from "Axel" to "Alex". Priceless.

Regardless, like I said, the school is very supportive of the foreigners, but it's a warning sign in itself when they have to be so pushy, to the point where they mandated that German students must work with foreign students.

And it's pretty typical, and what people complain about in germany- the people speaking English. They're even trying to reverse the anglicization of the German language, but the main thing is they complain that Americans go in and immediately expect people to start speaking English. I know, because they are surprised to hear me speak German.
 
let's get back to the topic of lonely med students plz!!!
don't really care for US-German relations when I have to give up football in order to study anatomy
 
AlexMorph said:
let's get back to the topic of lonely med students plz!!!
don't really care for US-German relations when I have to give up football in order to study anatomy
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Then you're not reading close enough. The OP spoke of a situation, and in my eyes, while I will not negate how they feel, it certainly can feel much, much worse, and it was an attempt to show a different perspective of true isolation and other realities.
 
slight365 said:
Then you're not reading close enough. The OP spoke of a situation, and in my eyes, while I will not negate how they feel, it certainly can feel much, much worse, and it was an attempt to show a different perspective of true isolation and other realities.
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that's fine, but you don't have to give us a lengthy report of anti-american sentiment in germany
 
AlexMorph said:
that's fine, but you don't have to give us a lengthy report of anti-american sentiment in germany
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I can, as it is the reality I live in, related to the OP's post, and a reflection of my own experience in medical school in Germany, isolated by the students due to being a foreigner. I had to give a background of my observations, as the isolation is societal and the school is spending massive amounts of money, though in futility, to fight xenophobia in the school.
 
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AlexMorph said:
that's fine, but you don't have to give us a lengthy report of anti-american sentiment in germany
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Nor does he have to refrain from doing so.
 
tncekm said:
Nor does he have to refrain from doing so.
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I agree. His experience of loneliness in a foreign country is certainly valid, however it doesn't make the claims of lonely US med students any less so. And no Slight365, reflecting on your experience will not make any of us feel any less lonely and isolated. I'm sure we will all get through this tough patch though. 🙂
 
coldweatherblue said:
yeah I don't wanna get into this either but I've spent a lot of time visiting family in Munich and Oberoesterreich and always had wonderful experiences. The most friendly, honest, genuine people; beautiful, clean cities; great food, awesome snowboarding in the winter, just a wonderful place to live. I get by on my German but it was never a problem because almost everyone under 40 y/o spoke English. I wanna go back!!!
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I know I'm encouraging thread hijacking, but as a South Asian (who I guess could also be mistaken for Middle Eastern) who has been to Munich, I can see both sides. It's a beautiful city, and very lively, I happened to be there during the city's birthday and stepped out of the train station into huge jugs of beer (haha); however, on a tour I did there were some people wearing black armbands in the center of the city, and (being the only non-white person on the tour), the tour guide purposely told me to kind of 'hide' within the group, and informed me they were basically neo-Nazis. There's definitely still some racial issues there. I had similar issues in one of my favorite cities I've visited, Krakow, Poland (got some strange looks from people, apparently not a big tourist spot for non-Europeans, which made me love it even more). Btw, I don't speak a word of German (well, maybe a few words of German since I spent 3 months in Austria, but this was all two years ago) or Polish and I got by fine in both cities.
 
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slight365 said:
I can, as it is the reality I live in, related to the OP's post, and a reflection of my own experience in medical school in Germany, isolated by the students due to being a foreigner. I had to give a background of my observations, as the isolation is societal and the school is spending massive amounts of money, though in futility, to fight xenophobia in the school.
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You can !tch about Germany all you want. I'm not saying anything about Germany. Just observing that being a foreigner in ANY country has its share of problems with racism, discrimination, isolation, and other difficulties. You might argue that Europeans may be more xenophobic in some ways or that racism (degree, direction) varies by country... and this is all obviously true. But none of that discounts America's own huge problems in the same vein. It's just not manifested the same way as in other countries. Again, I'm just pointing out the obvious. And no, having Obama as president didn't somehow miraculously cure all these problems.

I guess the "oh how lucky we are to be American" thing just struck me the wrong way. So it sounds like your parents constitute American "success stories" in that they successfully assimilated and adapted. Well, plenty of people aren't necessarily able to do so... it's just that their stories, of course, aren't being broadcast by anyone. Yet these "American non-success stories" of hardship aren't exactly rare, despite being unpopular.

So from that perspective, I just got a little sick of the "let's pat ourselves on the back" because we're American business.

Anyway, this thread has nothing to do with any of that crap. As I said, I have no desire to get into this topic. So you want to support the OP by saying "I'm lonely too". Fine. Let's get back on topic. No need to get all political in the midst of trying to provide some empathy.
 
unsung said:
And no, having Obama as president didn't somehow miraculously cure all these problems.
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No, it's just proof that the problems of racism and "evil whitey keeping minorities down" are waaaaaaaaaaaay overstated. For Obama to have better support than his predecessory, Kerry, among whites in all states but 3 speaks volumes to the lack of racism in the vast majority of Americans.
 
Sweet merciful ****.

I leave for a bit and this is what happens to my thread? We've got people arguing about Obama? Seriously?
 
JustSomePreMed said:
Sweet merciful ****.

I leave for a bit and this is what happens to my thread? We've got people arguing about Obama? Seriously?
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Ya, lol. Med school isolation --> German racism --> Obama... who'da thunk it?
 
Don't make your studies boring.Otherwise it will be a problem for you.Its better make your studies interesting.Adjust some time for have fun with your friends.Do some extra circular activities.
 
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mark467s said:
Don't make your studies boring.Otherwise it will be a problem for you.Its better make your studies interesting.Adjust some time for have fun with your friends.Do some extra circular activities.
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Those are all great talking points, but it's not as if I haven't already thought "gee, it'd be nice if I could adjust to have time with my friends." In fact, reflecting on that very fact is one of the reasons I started this thread in the first place.

It's actually being able to DO those things that is difficult. And with the threat of Step I looming over my head (I realize it's still 8 months away or so), I've started to worry about that (I'm interested in a few pretty competitive fields). So even more of the "crap, I should be studying something right now" feeling going on all the time.
 
I'm an MS1 who generally doesn't go to class. I avoid lonliness by studying in groups. Not that BS group study where you all half-ass going over things together. The kind where you all just hang-out in a room doing your own thing. Every once in awhile some conversation and joking breaks out and the rest of your time you study as normal but with some company. It has worked well for me...
 
.
 
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doc MD said:
Wow. Talk about timing. I just broke up w/ my gf and loneliness hit me fast. I'm older than most of my classmates and cannot relate at all, especially the parties and drinking. This has left me quite sad that I've even ask my own parents to just start hooking me up w/ people. Anyway, I starting to spend my time at panera and starbucks. Granted I am not talking to people there, but the conversational sounds are a depression relief. I do still talk to my other friends, but all are farther away and actually have lives (gf or married), plus I am talking to my family which helps sometimes. Also, I am realizing that I am surround by young 21-23yo med females, so....the world is my ice cream, I just need to get a spoon.
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Personally, my Dr. Phil advice would be just to focus on yourself for a while. Be strong, be independent! :laugh: If you're "looking" I'd say you're more likely to find someone who kinda sucks, and you'll just settle to ease the loneliness but may end up being more miserable b/c you're always having to deal with annoying crap.
 
tncekm said:
If you're "looking" I'd say you're more likely to find someone who kinda sucks, and you'll just settle to ease the loneliness but may end up being more miserable b/c you're always having to deal with annoying crap.
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I have to disagree with this, especially if that 'looking' is in reference to a girlfriend. I don't know about you, but not many girls ask me out on dates. When I ask them out, however, I usually get a "yes." I have fun getting to know several different girls and if something clicks I pursue that. It's pretty much standard for finding a girlfriend (I think), and it's a whole lot more fun/productive than sitting around waiting for the magic of detached apathy to bring girls clawing at your door.

If the looking is in reference to friends, same kind of thing. Who is likely to find friends they enjoy more, the person who goes and does things with many different people at different opportunities and then gradually moves toward spending the most time with those he or she likes the most, or the person who sits around waiting for the magic of inaction to bring a good group of friends?

I will not dispute that if you try too hard (look desperate) it turns people away, but I think you can find a healthy balance between putting yourself out there and not seeming needy.
 
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