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DeterminedDoc

DeterminedDoc

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My GPA: 2.7

Fourth year (five years of UG totally so I have 1.5 years left).

Grades this sem:

Biostats: W

Pharmacology: F

Macroeconomics: F

Intermediate Microeconomics: F

Cell Bio: C-

Microbio: C-

Time to get that McDonlad's app filled out. Im officially at the point of no return.
 
I sincerely hope for your sake that your GPA is a 2.7 AFTER factoring in your grades for this semester.
 
Why are you taking six classes (and why two macroeconomics classes?) when you're already struggling? if you want to bring your GPA up you take fewer classes and try to nail them.
 
Whatyousay said:
I sincerely hope for your sake that your GPA is a 2.7 AFTER factoring in your grades for this semester.
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My GPA was 2.7 before.


Did you have a major life crisis this semester?
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No. I was just depressed, I wasn't on any SSRIs since they didn't work for me in the past. I resorted to drugs because I was an idiot. I can't even look at myself in the mirror anymore.

God help me.
 
OP started a sob story thread a few weeks ago. Check it out whenever you are having a good day you want to ruin.

OP: Seriously, look at all the great responses to your previous thread. To summarize: address your depression, don't overextend yourself, establish an upward trend, take advantage of DO grade replacement, and STOP POUTING. Good luck!
 
DeterminedDoc said:
My GPA was 2.7 before.




No. I was just depressed, I wasn't on any SSRIs since they didn't work for me in the past. I resorted to drugs because I was an idiot. I can't even look at myself in the mirror anymore.

God help me.
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Ouch. It looks like getting into med school is the least of your troubles. Please seek some professional help and get your life back in order ASAP. Remember DO schools do allow for grade replacement and you can always take a postbac to bring up your GPA or do an SMP.....and a high MCAT score could ofset the GPA a little provided you finish strong......but right now you need to get things straightened out in your personal life.
 
If you were depressed, you may look into getting a medical withdrawal for the semester. Eating 3 F's is going to be really, really tough on your med school chances and will basically cost you another semester anyway if you want to go to a DO school.
 
You're crashing and burning. At some point you're gonna have to confide in somebody other than anonymous internet people. Do you have any support network?
 
dreamweaver1988 said:
OP started a sob story thread a few weeks ago. Check it out whenever you are having a good day you want to ruin.

OP: Seriously, look at all the great responses to your previous thread. To summarize: address your depression, don't overextend yourself, establish an upward trend, take advantage of DO grade replacement, and STOP POUTING. Good luck!
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You obviously don't know what depression is or how difficult it can be to just "stop pouting". Ive seen counselors, shrinks, been on ssris and when that didn't work I resorted to stupidly extreme measure like an idiot. If you think it's annoying then dont respond. I'm sure your pointless comments are needed elsewhere.

@ milkman: how can I withdraw if the semester is over?

So even if I cure cancer I'll never be good enough for MD schools in my life right? I mean I'm aware that I'm even not even good enough for DO or Carrib schools since, as my grades show that I'm really nothing more than a failure, but I'm asking genrally?

In that case you should jst move this to the DO forum.
 
You might want to consider seeing if your university allows retroactive withdrawals, i.e transforms all your classes into W's this semester. Also genuinely consider taking a semester or year off to get some help with the depression and drug abuse.
 
@ milkman: how can I withdraw if the semester is over?
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I'm honestly not sure, but I know several people who've done it for one reason or another. The majority of them cited medical issues. Of course, you'll likely have to go get professional help and work with the administration some to make that happen, assuming it's a possibility, but it's at least worth checking out.

Failing that, you can retake the classes you got F's in and apply to DO schools since they'll only consider the most recent (i.e., retaken) grades.
 
dreamweaver1988 said:
OP started a sob story thread a few weeks ago. Check it out whenever you are having a good day you want to ruin.

OP: Seriously, look at all the great responses to your previous thread. To summarize: address your depression, don't overextend yourself, establish an upward trend, take advantage of DO grade replacement, and STOP POUTING. Good luck!
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QFT. It's not the end of the world, but you gotta get your life together.

And please, less classes.

You aren't a failure. Had a bud in your shoes and he bounced right back. Took less classes, took the classes over, and BAM he's in DO school.
 
serenade said:
You might want to consider seeing if your university allows retroactive withdrawals, i.e transforms all your classes into W's this semester. Also genuinely consider taking a semester or year off to get some help with the depression and drug abuse.
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The ultimate question becomes - how do I live with myself?

How does anyone live with themselves for screwing up so hard for no logical reason other than being a complete chod?

My GPA is ruined. I don't think I can get into ANY type of school with those grades. People who fail 3 classes generally aren't very successful.

I have destroyed myself. Thus the question becomes, how do I live with myself?
 
I think that it would be best for you to at least get checked out by a professional before we start to worry about what's next.

Really, the best thing you could do here is go DO and use the 3 semesters you have left to retake your failed classes. Also, lighten the load a little! Six classes is a lot on anyone's plate, and there's no need to scramble like this(especially if the emotional/mental strain has been with you ever since starting college, as it appears to have been by the other thread that you have started).

If nothing else, remember that one is never stuck, or past a point of no return. As long as they're willing to take it by the horns and do something about it, something can be done.

I hope this helps! I can't really give you chances of admission or anything, since I'm only in high school...

But I wish you luck. =)
 
mipp0 said:
QFT. It's not the end of the world, but you gotta get your life together.

And please, less classes.

You aren't a failure. Had a bud in your shoes and he bounced right back. Took less classes, took the classes over, and BAM he's in DO school.
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Perhaps you should look at my grades again. I am a failure, and its in writing.

Even if I manage to turn things around 100%, give it my all and get shining scores and ECs from here on out, the fact is I'll never be good enough to be an MD anymore. And before you start with the whole "MD vs DO" thing - no. Thats not at all what I'm implying. I am in no way, shape, or form, close to competitive for DO schools. People who fail classes aren't competitive for anything in life and I am in NO position right now to be downplaying DOs.

The thing is, even if I do all that, my only option at this point even in my best case scenario is limited solely to DO schools now (before this sem I at least had a shot at some low ranked MD schools and was going to apply to both). Im clearly very successful.
 
DeterminedDoc said:
Perhaps you should look at my grades again. I am a failure, and its in writing.

Even if I manage to turn things around 100%, give it my all and get shining scores and ECs from here on out, the fact is I'll never be good enough to be an MD anymore. And before you start with the whole "MD vs DO" thing - no. Thats not at all what I'm implying. I am in no way, shape, or form, close to competitive for DO schools. People who fail classes aren't competitive for anything in life and I am in NO position right now to be downplaying DOs.

The thing is, even if I do all that, my only option at this point even in my best case scenario is limited solely to DO schools now (before this sem I at least had a shot at some low ranked MD schools and was going to apply to both). Im clearly very successful.
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You know, I'm no psychologist or psychiatrist, but I think the main problem here is that you bring up the past in a way like it has already carved out your future.

It's not even a matter of MD or DO, or where you're going to go, but this mentality that you're sporting around isn't going to let you get anywhere.

Did you screw up? Yeah, but we all do, we're human.

What's past is past and what's done is done, OP. But you don't have to let the past be your present. You need to get off your knees and do something about it.

Inspire yourself! Why medicine? If you got a passion and direction, the rest can fall into place.
 
DeterminedDoc said:
Perhaps you should look at my grades again. I am a failure, and its in writing.

Even if I manage to turn things around 100%, give it my all and get shining scores and ECs from here on out, the fact is I'll never be good enough to be an MD anymore. And before you start with the whole "MD vs DO" thing - no. Thats not at all what I'm implying. I am in no way, shape, or form, close to competitive for DO schools. People who fail classes aren't competitive for anything in life and I am in NO position right now to be downplaying DOs.

The thing is, even if I do all that, my only option at this point even in my best case scenario is limited solely to DO schools now (before this sem I at least had a shot at some low ranked MD schools and was going to apply to both). Im clearly very successful.
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You already know DO vs. MD doesn't matter, as you said. You are right, that you are not competitive for either right now.
Where you are wrong, is where you say "I am a failure." Many people have setbacks, issues, crises, etc. That doesn't mean all their dreams are finished or their hope is gone.
First, talk to a professional. I know you did it before, but you need to do it again, a) because you need to find someone who can help you get through your depression and b) so they can write a recommendation to your school for retroactive withdrawal of your classes. That is the next thing you need to do, talk to the dean about what you need to do to have those classes all turned into W's.
Whether or not that happens, you obviously can't take any classes until you are in a better place mentally. So don't, don't try to take any classes until everything is together.
Calculate out exactly what classes you will need to take, and how many, to be competitive for DO schools, and how many and what classes for MD schools. Hopefully you will be at a 2.7, but even if lower there is still some number of classes you can take and get your GPA up past the auto-cut offs.
Compare those options with moving to Texas, establishing residency, waiting ten years and taking advantage of the Fresh Start program, which will wipe out your old record.
No matter what way you go, it is only over for you if you decide pursuing it is not worth it. If it is worth it to you, it is not over.

Again, you obviously need help getting through this, so that is your first step, seek the help you need.
 
OP, a lot of people, including myself, tried helping you in your last thread, but you got worse and worse and finally your thread was closed for implying self-harm. I strongly encourage you to stop posting about this and instead be proactive about looking for help. There's no answer here that will ever be satisfying to you.

I don't say these things lightly. I want you to hear it because someone needs to say it to you: You effectively have 0% chance for US-MD, DO, or Caribbean if you don't have your depression problems worked out (or in the works) before you attempt going further into your medical school goal.

Now you have your answer (again).
 
I recommend you go visit a counselor and explain the kinds of thoughts and feelings you've been having recently. Then, if you feel up for the challenge, work with folks in your school's academic advising and academic support offices to see what behaviors you can change to perform at your full potential. There is a light at the end of the tunnel and, by writing a very heartfelt additional information letter, you may be able to earn a spot in both DO and MD schools. Best of luck. 🙂
 
theseeker4 said:
You already know DO vs. MD doesn't matter, as you said. You are right, that you are not competitive for either right now.
Where you are wrong, is where you say "I am a failure." Many people have setbacks, issues, crises, etc. That doesn't mean all their dreams are finished or their hope is gone.
First, talk to a professional. I know you did it before, but you need to do it again, a) because you need to find someone who can help you get through your depression and b) so they can write a recommendation to your school for retroactive withdrawal of your classes. That is the next thing you need to do, talk to the dean about what you need to do to have those classes all turned into W's.
Whether or not that happens, you obviously can't take any classes until you are in a better place mentally. So don't, don't try to take any classes until everything is together.
Calculate out exactly what classes you will need to take, and how many, to be competitive for DO schools, and how many and what classes for MD schools. Hopefully you will be at a 2.7, but even if lower there is still some number of classes you can take and get your GPA up past the auto-cut offs.
Compare those options with moving to Texas, establishing residency, waiting ten years and taking advantage of the Fresh Start program, which will wipe out your old record.
No matter what way you go, it is only over for you if you decide pursuing it is not worth it. If it is worth it to you, it is not over.

Again, you obviously need help getting through this, so that is your first step, seek the help you need.
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I said I wasn't even competitive enough for DO schools and I mentioned in my earlier thread that people have their reasons for going MD or DO. That said, I didn't say there wasn't a difference, if they were truly the same, the standard for admission would be the same, but at this stage that's a moot point.

The bigger question is whats my reason for going DO? As I mentioned earlier, Ive never met a DO in my life nor do I have a preference of OMT to Allo, I go to school in Canada where DOs are virtually non-existent since that degree is pretty much restricted to the States, all the doctors who I've met, worked with, and look upto have all been MDs.


Whats my reason for applying DO other than the fact that its pretty much my only option at this point?

Waiting ten years isn't something Im going to do. Its just not worth it.

Did you screw up? Yeah, but we all do, we're human.

What's past is past and what's done is done, OP. But you don't have to let the past be your present. You need to get off your knees and do something about it.

Where you are wrong, is where you say "I am a failure." Many people have setbacks, issues, crises, etc. That doesn't mean all their dreams are finished or their hope is gone.
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Thanks for being positive - thats hard for me to come by right now. I know the past doesn't determine my future, but successful people learn from their mistakes and make sure that it doesn't happen again. This isn't my first semester of college. Even before this semester - with 3 years of college, my GPA was only a 2.7.

Instead of working hard, going to class, meeting with my profs, what did I do? Got depressed, smoked a lot of weed, did other drugs, and FAILED three classes. College is expensive, and I've wasted my family's hard earned money. How exactly am I not a failure? How exactly am I supposed to forgive myself for this?

Looking at my grades, my future is pretty much in ashes at this point. Its not the past, that's determining my future - its very much the present that is.
 
TriagePreMed said:
OP, a lot of people, including myself, tried helping you in your last thread, but you got worse and worse and finally your thread was closed for implying self-harm. I strongly encourage you to stop posting about this and instead be proactive about looking for help. There's no answer here that will ever be satisfying to you.

I don't say these things lightly. I want you to hear it because someone needs to say it to you: You effectively have 0% chance for US-MD, DO, or Caribbean if you don't have your depression problems worked out (or in the works) before you attempt going further into your medical school goal.

Now you have your answer (again).
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QTF. OP, think about one day being able to say "I used to be depressed, but I dealt with it and now I'm a physician." Think about the unique insight you would have when helping a patient get through depression. Think about the chance to be a role model for a high school or college student who hopes to to be a physician but is depressed. DON'T think about the past and dwell on your mistakes. I used to wake up every day and hate myself for bombing the Chem II final and ending up with a high B in the class (tragic story, I know😉). Tony Horton (P90X founder) speaks the truth: "Do your best and forget the rest."
 
I don't know what your experience is with any sort of counseling services, but for me and the people I know who have taken advantage of them, its usually been the BEST decision they've made.

You absolutely NEED. NEED. NEEEEEEED to take time off. You're trying to take on more than you can chew, and its just making you more depressed. Seriously, take off a year and do something fun/relaxing/theraputic/etc. People who've taken time off for personal reasons usually come back ready and more prepared than ever to do epicly in school.
 
dreamweaver1988 said:
QTF. OP, think about one day being able to say "I used to be depressed, but I dealt with it and now I'm a physician." Think about the unique insight you would have when helping a patient get through depression. Think about the chance to be a role model for a high school or college student who hopes to to be a physician but is depressed. DON'T think about the past and dwell on your mistakes. I used to wake up every day and hate myself for bombing the Chem II final and ending up with a high B in the class (tragic story, I know😉). Tony Horton (P90X founder) speaks the truth: "Do your best and forget the rest."
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Wow. You and I clearly face the same difficulties since you got a high B in Chem II. I'll do my best to pray for you, hows that?

But in all seriousness I'm not getting into med school because I'm a South Asian with such crap grades. Look at the AMCAS data for Asians - you have to be pretty amazing as an ORM in medicine. Im pretty sure I'm the only South Asian pre-med in my entire race to have such low grades. I have to deal with family pressure and cultural pressure on top of my crap grades. If you have a GPA below 3.5 being South Asian sucks. Why would they admit me when they could admit the 1 billion other South Asian pre-meds with prefect grades and scores?
 
this thread is so tl;dr (in case the original poster is not internet literate: that means i'm posting without reading any of it)

I'm south asian, graduated college with a 2.5, got into med school with a 2.9 (3.9 post-bacc) and a 4.0 SMP.

It's been done with worse numbers than yours numerous times on SDN. If you want it, go get it.
 
Yeah well. I'm a white male who very nearly flunked out due to depression. SSRIs helped. A girlfriend helped (yes, I know what you're thinking about your prospects right now.) A job helped. Changing majors helped.

Another thing to keep in mind is maybe addressing the root cause of your depression, if it's not completely random and biological in origin. For me, I was caught up in my parents' relationship troubles, and I finally told them how I felt about it. It felt like jumping off a cliff at the time but it was definitely for the best.

It does take years to get over this kind of thing, and to be completely honest, the moment I opened my acceptance letter was the first time in six years that I didn't have a cloud of guilt, shame, and failure following me around. But you have to do something on your own first. People have given you plenty of ideas to get started. What do you have to lose?
 
thewubear said:
this thread is so tl;dr (in case the original poster is not internet literate: That means i'm posting without reading any of it)

i'm south asian, graduated college with a 2.5, got into med school with a 2.9 (3.9 post-bacc) and a 4.0 smp.

It's been done with worse numbers than yours numerous times on sdn. If you want it, go get it.
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+1
 
I know there are many on here that freak out over 1 C, or say they're failing when they end up with an A in a class. This is a community that's online of a small percentage of a small percentage of a small percentage. Just focus on what you gotta do.

And to those who might not understand and just say, "why don't you just do it???" Well, it's only a matter of motivation. But most of the time, depressed/addicted/whatever people just lose it; no real reason.

How about this? Don't look so far ahead in the future. Just focus on now. And that will limit you from comparing yourself to other people to come to the conclusion that you are a failure. In reality, no, you're not; I don't think it's right for anyone to be called a failure since it's all just because of mistakes in decision we choose that determine the outcome.

Start by addressing this past semester. Try to cite medical issues and just wipe out this semester's record from your transcript. Each school has its own policy. The next step is to see the verdict. Either you can or you can't eradicate it from your transcript, meanwhile sign up for two or three courses. I'm not clinically depressed so I can't say what you feel or what's going on in your head, but I did get my stuff together and turned things around. And, I've helped two diagnosed friends address and handle their schedules (not really get over it though). I've volunteered in a free clinic to talk to patients, not as a psychologist but just as someone they can vent to. The ultimate common goal I've learned is for you to concern yourself over the immediate future. Track time by hour if you have to and not by days or weeks. if you have only yourself with no family, then try to keep up with each day, and keep a note of the far future; it's good to have your future in mind, but just focus on now!
 
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OP opened a thread complaining about his problems and that thread was shut down. He just wants to complain but refuse to take any serious action to repair anything.

Previous thread was this one:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=872353

If OP needs help, he needs to seek professional help, not people from SDN, since his problems sound very serious.
 
scarshapedstar said:
Yeah well. I'm a white male who very nearly flunked out due to depression. SSRIs helped. A girlfriend helped (yes, I know what you're thinking about your prospects right now.) A job helped. Changing majors helped.

Another thing to keep in mind is maybe addressing the root cause of your depression, if it's not completely random and biological in origin. For me, I was caught up in my parents' relationship troubles, and I finally told them how I felt about it. It felt like jumping off a cliff at the time but it was definitely for the best.

It does take years to get over this kind of thing, and to be completely honest, the moment I opened my acceptance letter was the first time in six years that I didn't have a cloud of guilt, shame, and failure following me around. But you have to do something on your own first. People have given you plenty of ideas to get started. What do you have to lose?
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Uh not really. I mean honestly I've never had one in the past 21 years of my life so I see no reason why that would change in the future. Even if I do get into med school ill probably be one of those guys thats never been in a relationship lol.

How about this? Don't look so far ahead in the future. Just focus on now. And that will limit you from comparing yourself to other people to come to the conclusion that you are a failure. In reality, no, you're not; I don't think it's right for anyone to be called a failure since it's all just because of mistakes in decision we choose that determine the outcome.
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When you make bad decisions, you end up with a bad outcome. The choice to make that decision was yours - therefore it is your fault - hence the definition of failure.

Ive already reduced my course load for next semester, but I have three F's on my transcript now. Is there even a point anymore? Thats going to be like a nuclear strike when adcoms see it.


It's been done with worse numbers than yours numerous times on sdn. If you want it, go get it.
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What do you mean by "worse"? If you factor in the grades this semester, my GPA is less than a 2.0. Are you sure?
 
DeterminedDoc said:
Wow. You and I clearly face the same difficulties since you got a high B in Chem II. I'll do my best to pray for you, hows that?
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Lol! I didn't want it to come out like that. The point is that every day I would think about mistakes and missed opportunities. I eventually had to move on. I hope you can address your depression and do the same. Good luck!
 
OP, it will probably save everyone time and headache if you just tell us what you want to hear. Everyone is saying you can bounce back and to get professional help, which you are clearly disregarding. So help us help you.

Why be a DO? Because you will be a fully licensed physician. Pretty good reason for me. And DO schools are offering incentives to canadian students (MSUCOM is one that comes to mind) to increase the DO presence in Canada. All sorts of win. And with DO grade replacement, your motivation can be that you can still be a doctor. MD is basically out of reach, but you will still be a doctor and make the same money/have the same benefits. Again, all sorts of win.

And the best part is, you can do it all and still be south asian. Looks to me like better days are coming!
 
Pay very careful attention:
You are NOT going tobe a doctor until you do these two things:
1)Go see a psychiatrist and get your depression treated.
2) When he gives you the OK, start re-taking your poor grade classes and get Bs or As in them...OR

Go to a post-bac program.

I've been through major depressive episodes in my life, so I know what you're going through. I had better luck with Celexa vs Paxil.

good luck.

DeterminedDoc said:
Wow. You and I clearly face the same difficulties since you got a high B in Chem II. I'll do my best to pray for you, hows that?

But in all seriousness I'm not getting into med school because I'm a South Asian with such crap grades. Look at the AMCAS data for Asians - you have to be pretty amazing as an ORM in medicine. Im pretty sure I'm the only South Asian pre-med in my entire race to have such low grades. I have to deal with family pressure and cultural pressure on top of my crap grades. If you have a GPA below 3.5 being South Asian sucks. Why would they admit me when they could admit the 1 billion other South Asian pre-meds with prefect grades and scores?
Click to expand...
 
Why be a DO? Because you will be a fully licensed physician.
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So are MDs. That isn't really a reason. If you meant:

Because you will be a physician and that is the only option for you now since you screwed yourself so much that you will never be good enough to be an MD in this lifetime, then yes, I agree with you.

Im so proud of myself man.

And DO schools are offering incentives to canadian students (MSUCOM is one that comes to mind) to increase the DO presence in Canada.
Click to expand...

I go to school at UBC and work at one of the biggest hospitals in Vancouver. There isn't a single DO there so it looks like their doing a pretty bad job.

All sorts of win. And with DO grade replacement, your motivation can be that you can still be a doctor. MD is basically out of reach, but you will still be a doctor and make the same money/have the same benefits. Again, all sorts of win.
Click to expand...

Its not really a "win" if its my only option available. That's pretty much take it or leave it. The docs (MDs) that I've talked too tell me that while there is no difference in the job between the degrees, DOs are more limited in terms of getting a good residency and have a harder specializing compared to MDs, I heard that this was true for oncology which is what I am interested in.

I applaud someone who WANTS to be a DO. They would probably be happier than someone who went that route because that was the only way he could be a doctor. Im not even sure what I'm supposed to say on the DO application if I've never met or worked with a DO in my life. And no, I'm not moving back to the states and leaving school just for that. Thats not a solution.

And the best part is, you can do it all and still be south asian. Looks to me like better days are coming!
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Yea you know what? If you aren't desi you would never understand. The mentality and culture is completely different. Its not easy repeatedly failing when success is expected at a young age. Ive never met a south asian DO, all our family friends and relatives are MDs. Guess ill be the one to start the new mother****ing trend in my family.

Better days are coming? Ive failed three classes. Whoopdeefreakingdoo, the better days are clearly coming. My future is now brighter than ever

Ultimately beggars can't be choosers, and failures can't even be beggars. I'll learn to accept that as who I am in due time, especially that its now in writing. I guess ill go back to school, get some help for this depression thats ripped my life apart and try to redo classes like a complete chode. I doubt my parents will pay for college anymore so ill have to find a way to support myself (maybe McDs seeing as to how I may end up there anyway). Ill try for DO and see what happens. Its not like I can do anything else anymore anyway.

MD is basically out of reach,
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+1 👍
 
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DeterminedDoc said:
So are MDs. That isn't really a reason. If you meant:

Because you will be a physician and that is the only option for you now since you screwed yourself so much that you will never be good enough to be an MD in this lifetime, then yes, I agree with you.

Im so proud of myself man.



I go to school at UBC and work at one of the biggest hospitals in Vancouver. There isn't a single DO there so it looks like their doing a pretty bad job.



Its not really a "win" if its my only option available. That's pretty much take it or leave it. The docs (MDs) that I've talked too tell me that while there is no difference in the job between the degrees, DOs are more limited in terms of getting a good residency and have a harder specializing compared to MDs, I heard that this was true for oncology which is what I am interested in.

I applaud someone who WANTS to be a DO. They would probably be happier than someone who went that route because that was the only way he could be a doctor. Im not even sure what I'm supposed to say on the DO application if I've never met or worked with a DO in my life. And no, I'm not moving back to the states and leaving school just for that. Thats not a solution.



Yea you know what? If you aren't desi you would never understand. The mentality and culture is completely different. Its not easy repeatedly failing when success is expected at a young age. Ive never met a south asian DO, all our family friends and relatives are MDs. Guess ill be the one to start the new mother****ing trend in my family.

Better days are coming? Ive failed three classes. Whoopdeefreakingdoo, the better days are clearly coming. My future is now brighter than ever

Ultimately beggars can't be choosers, and failures can't even be beggars. I'll learn to accept that as who I am in due time, especially that its now in writing. I guess ill go back to school, get some help for this depression thats ripped my life apart and try to redo classes like a complete chode. I doubt my parents will pay for college anymore so ill have to find a way to support myself (maybe McDs seeing as to how I may end up there anyway). Ill try for DO and see what happens. Its not like I can do anything else anymore anyway.



+1 👍
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This entire post is "poor pitiful me." When I was younger I just wanted to eat whatever and no one stopped me, so I got big. And as an adult, I am still big. I think of all the times I. Said I was going to lose weight and if I just did it even one of those times I would be skinny now. And being that I am not, can either talk about how I am a fatass failure and give up or I can finally do what I wish I did years ago. So I did the second option. And I wish I was losing 10 lbs a week, but it isn't realistic so I am happy with 2 lbs.

I also had 3 kids in the process. I could blame my life and say my med school dream is ruined, or I can try to go to a med school that allows them to live happilly as well.

I am a truck driver and made way good money driving over the road. I wanted to attend classes so I took a night job and another part time job to make up for the drastic drop in pay sleeping 4 hours a night, working 70 hours a week and taking 20 credits.

I say this because everyone makes decisions that we need to deal with. Everyone has mistakes or issues we wish we handled differently, but it isn't going to change anything. You want to be a doctor. You can talk about how there are no DOs in Canada and how ruined your chances are and never become a doctor, or you can be realistic and still achieve your dream. Yes you want to be an MD, I get that, but do you want to be an MD more than you want to be a doctor? If yes, find something else that makes you happy. If no, make the best of DO school. Make the best of your situation.

I still don't understand. You aren't in a completely unsalvageable situation and you can still be a doctor. You wouldn't be the first person that went to DO school because they straight up couldn't get into MD school. So your letters are different. You are doing the same surgical procedures, treatments, order writing, etc. for the exact same money. In the exact same hospital. What a nightmare!

How bad do you want it? It seems you want validation that you are a failure, which I won't do because you aren't. You can completely turn around, do awesome in med school and end in the exact same position. And DO schools just started trying to increase DO appearance, so it is unrealistic to think it is going to be done instantly.

EDIT: Tl,dr- you are being unrealistic. I truly hope you get some help and stop living a life that is based on what people think and start living for you.
 
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I also had 3 kids in the process. I could blame my life and say my med school dream is ruined, or I can try to go to a med school that allows them to live happilly as well.

I am a truck driver and made way good money driving over the road. I wanted to attend classes so I took a night job and another part time job to make up for the drastic drop in pay sleeping 4 hours a night, working 70 hours a week and taking 20 credits.
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Thats truly a great story. However its a completely different situation. I am not a non-trad with a family to think about. Im just a college screw-up and if I had been a better human being, I would still have a chance at MD schools. Your story is impressive, but its not something I can relate too. I should have woken up and I should have realized what I had to do instead of being the dumb@$$ I am.


I say this because everyone makes decisions that we need to deal with. Everyone has mistakes or issues we wish we handled differently, but it isn't going to change anything. You want to be a doctor. You can talk about how there are no DOs in Canada and how ruined your chances are and never become a doctor, or you can be realistic and still achieve your dream. Yes you want to be an MD, I get that, but do you want to be an MD more than you want to be a doctor? If yes, find something else that makes you happy. If no, make the best of DO school. Make the best of your situation.
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It kills me to know that if I want to be an MD, I just can't. Its not about the fact that I have to apply DO that makes me so bummed out. Its the knowledge that even in the best case scenario, if the heavens open up, I will never be good enough for MD schools in this lifetime. I love myself so much right now.

I still don't understand.
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You aren't South Asian. You never would understand. Its a different culture, mentality, and expectation all together. How many south asian DOs do you know? How many south asian pre-meds end up as DOs that you know of? They don't- its a cultural norm to go MD. Obviously i just suck too much for that now, so i guess ill be at the outside looking in.

You wouldn't be the first person that went to DO school because they straight up couldn't get into MD school.
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Yea because that's something to be very proud of and a reason to go to a DO school right there.....come on man.

So your letters are different. You are doing the same surgical procedures, treatments, order writing, etc. for the exact same money. In the exact same hospital. What a nightmare!
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Touched upon this earlier. Though the jobs may be similar:

Its not really a "win" if its my only option available. That's pretty much take it or leave it. The docs (MDs) that I've talked too tell me that while there is no difference in the job between the degrees, DOs are more limited in terms of getting a good residency and have a harder specializing compared to MDs, I heard that this was true for oncology which is what I am interested in.
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How bad do you want it? It seems you want validation that you are a failure, which I won't do because you aren't.
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I don't need validation from anyone that I'm a failure. Its in writing now:

Grades this sem:

Biostats: W

Pharmacology: F

Macroeconomics: F

Intermediate Microeconomics: F

Cell Bio: C-

Microbio: C-
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You call that a success?


EDIT: Tl,dr- you are being unrealistic. I truly hope you get some help and stop living a life that is based on what people think and start living for you.
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Thanks, its not what other people think. Its about what I can do. Do I deserve to be with the brightest people who were successful through their life without screwing up this much and go to an MD school? Or will the story of my life be the little Indian kid who screwed up in life and had to spend years redeeming himself and become a DO?

Everyone on here is trying to give you positive feedback and help you overcome your gpa and personal issues, and all you do is respond with some bull**** self-pity.

Let me try another method.

Kill yourself, you're worthless. Better?
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This post is worthless.
 
DeterminedDoc said:
Thats truly a great story. However its a completely different situation. I am not a non-trad with a family to think about. Im just a college screw-up and if I had been a better human being, I would still have a chance at MD schools. Your story is impressive, but its not something I can relate too. I should have woken up and I should have realized what I had to do instead of being the dumb@$$ I am.




It kills me to know that if I want to be an MD, I just can't. Its not about the fact that I have to apply DO that makes me so bummed out. Its the knowledge that even in the best case scenario, if the heavens open up, I will never be good enough for MD schools in this lifetime. I love myself so much right now.



You aren't South Asian. You never would understand. Its a different culture, mentality, and expectation all together. How many south asian DOs do you know? How many south asian pre-meds end up as DOs that you know of? They don't- its a cultural norm to go MD. Obviously i just suck too much for that now, so i guess ill be at the outside looking in.



Yea because that's something to be very proud of and a reason to go to a DO school right there.....come on man.



Touched upon this earlier. Though the jobs may be similar:





I don't need validation from anyone that I'm a failure. Its in writing now:



You call that a success?




Thanks, its not what other people think. Its about what I can do. Do I deserve to be with the brightest people who were successful through their life without screwing up this much and go to an MD school? Or will the story of my life be the little Indian kid who screwed up in life and had to spend years redeeming himself and become a DO?



This post is worthless.
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Honestly, you need to stop impeding yourself. I can't make that any clearer than I am right now.

It's not about culture, either. Why does it matter to you that there are South Asian MDs? Why dwell on it? Both MD and DO are equals, and just because there's different letters behind your name doesn't make one more respected than the other in most people's eyes. Do you honestly think that when you're a DO, your parents are going to belittle you? "Oh, yes, he's a physician, but he's a DO. He brings much shame to the family..." What kind of bull**** is that?

If I was you, I'd go DO. And I don't attribute that choice to being a white girl in the suburbs. That choice just makes more sense and still gets you what you want in much less time.

Also, about the classes. Yes, we know, you failed classes. So what? Everyone messes up, everyone stumbles. But it doesn't matter how much you stumble if you got the stones to get up again and keep your eyes on the prize.

You could still do MD, but it would literally take years of GPA repair(or a very competitive SMP program). DO is just far more reasonable.

OP, I can't make you believe in yourself. I can't make you give a damn about your other opportunities.

Get some help, and just start working towards something. Give yourself a purpose. Coasting will only screw up your situation more.
 
A lot of good advice has been given to you and you choose to continue wallowing in your 3-6 months of self-perpetuated misery.

You say that you want to be a doctor? A DO degree will allow you to be a doctor doing the same things any MD does. You make it sound like you value the letters next to your name on a hospital badge more than you care about the work you'll be doing. That should be a red flag, regardless of whatever cultural norms you were raised in.

Fix your depression, your attitude and go from there. Getting cranky on an online forum isn't forward progress. It almost seems like trolling due to the extremes of resistance you're putting up.
 
Honestly, you need to stop impeding yourself. I can't make that any clearer than I am right now.
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Easier said than done. Why don't you try being a complete screw up and $hitting on your dreams by doing drugs? Then we can talk about this.

It's not about culture, either. Why does it matter to you that there are South Asian MDs? Why dwell on it? Both MD and DO are equals, and just because there's different letters behind your name doesn't make one more respected than the other in most people's eyes. Do you honestly think that when you're a DO, your parents are going to belittle you? "Oh, yes, he's a physician, but he's a DO. He brings much shame to the family..." What kind of bull**** is that?
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Its not about the letters, its about the opportunities that come with the letters, and the people your with. Why don't I deserve to have that? Wait a minute.....the answer is the theme of my life. Because I'm a screw up. Also most of the MD = DO people are either MD students or MDs themselves. Coming from them its actually meaningless. Like I said earlier, its like having a BMW versus a Honda. Sure they are both cars, and they do the same exact thing, but one car has inherently more worth and value than the other car, no matter how much the BMW owner tells me that they are the same. They aren't, and to the BMW owner, it makes no difference in the end because he doesn't have to drive a Honda.

Your a white girl in the suburbs. You know nothing about my culture and how different a mentality it is from what your used too. Thats exactly what they would do. To you it may seem like bull, to me I can understand where they are coming from and why they would feel that way. I doubt that they would continue paying for college once they find out about my grades anyway. So I have to figure out how ill pay for the rest of college, grad school, post-bacs, SMPs, and med school by myself.


Also, about the classes. Yes, we know, you failed classes. So what? Everyone messes up, everyone stumbles. But it doesn't matter how much you stumble if you got the stones to get up again and keep your eyes on the prize.
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No one messes up for this long a time without learning. I should have been a different person, I should have made my classes the center of my life last semester. Did I do that? No. I did drugs instead. How exactly does that not matter?


You could still do MD, but it would literally take years of GPA repair(or a very competitive SMP program). DO is just far more reasonable.
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How many years? What would I have to do?

Getting cranky on an online forum isn't forward progress. It almost seems like trolling due to the extremes of resistance you're putting up.
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Im not trying to troll at all. What the hell exactly am I supposed to put on my DO application?

"Yea I want to be a doctor, but I've never met or worked with a DO in my life. All the doctors that I have worked with and look upto have been MDs but I suck too much in this life to go to an MD school. Please let me in."

Since I forgot how EVERYONE at DO schools are just a bunch of MD rejects, I shouldn't have a problem getting in......oh wait nvm. It doesn't work like that at all.
 
DeterminedDoc said:
Easier said than done. Why don't you try being a complete screw up and $hitting on your dreams by doing drugs? Then we can talk about this.

Its not about the letters, its about the opportunities that come with the letters, and the people your with. Why don't I deserve to have that? Wait a minute.....the answer is the theme of my life. Because I'm a screw up. Also most of the MD = DO people are either MD students or MDs themselves. Coming from them its actually meaningless. Like I said earlier, its like having a BMW versus a Honda. Sure they are both cars, and they do the same exact thing, but one car has inherently more worth and value than the other car, no matter how much the BMW owner tells me that they are the same. They aren't, and to the BMW owner, it makes no difference in the end because he doesn't have to drive a Honda.

Your a white girl in the suburbs. You know nothing about my culture and how different a mentality it is from what your used too. Thats exactly what they would do. To you it may seem like bull, to me I can understand where they are coming from and why they would feel that way. I doubt that they would continue paying for college once they find out about my grades anyway. So I have to figure out how ill pay for the rest of college, grad school, post-bacs, SMPs, and med school by myself.

No one messes up for this long a time without learning. I should have been a different person, I should have made my classes the center of my life last semester. Did I do that? No. I did drugs instead. How exactly does that not matter?

How many years? What would I have to do?

Im not trying to troll at all. What the hell exactly am I supposed to put on my DO application?

"Yea I want to be a doctor, but I've never met or worked with a DO in my life. All the doctors that I have worked with and look up to have been MDs but I suck too much in this life to go to an MD school. Please let me in."

Since I forgot how EVERYONE at DO schools are just a bunch of MD rejects, I shouldn't have a problem getting in......oh wait nvm. It doesn't work like that at all.
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All I'm trying to say is this:

You can't change your past. But you don't have to have to allow your past to screw over your future.

As for how many years, it would probably be around 2-3 years of recovery with a SMP, depending on how hard you screwed the rest of your classes. I'd be able to plug and chug if I had the numbers in front of me, but I can't say anything definitively right now.

It's another rule of life that you can't appease everyone. If being a physician is your passion, you can shrug off the hard times your family gives you. (Another question... Why did you choose medicine? Remember your reasons why and maybe the oncoming struggle will at least lighten up a little.)

Let's run with the analogy you gave. I would think that it would be more like getting your first car then comparing brands. The brand doesn't matter, it's the thrill of being able to drive. Although, it does come with its fair share of costs and responsibilities, nothing else could compare to the sensation of driving.

If you went with popular opinion and went for DO school, you would be expected to shadow a DO just like how you would be expected to shadow a MD if you went to a MD school. It's plenty feasible and you'd still be a physician.
 
I don't know anymore if this guy is trolling or not. When he says MD is like BMW and DO like a Honda, I think that's where this thread has reached its maximum, and I can no longer stand listening to his hypocrisy when he says he thinks DO is equal. Someone please put this thread out of misery by locking it.

OP - You've heard ALL the answers across the spectrum from "stop whining!" to "get help and then worry about this." For your own sake, move on.
 
You can't change your past. But you don't have to have to allow your past to screw over your future.
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Thats some pretty groundbreaking insight. I didn't know that I couldn't change my past, see I was under the impression that time travel was possible. Thanks for clarifying that.


It's another rule of life that you can't appease everyone. If being a physician is your passion, you can shrug off the hard times your family gives you. (Another question... Why did you choose medicine? Remember your reasons why and maybe the oncoming struggle will at least lighten up a little.)
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You weren't kidding when you said you were a white girl in the suburbs. Its pretty naive for you think that I can just "shrug off" family difficulties. Like I said before, if you aren't South Asian then you wouldn't understand. And I can't exactly "shrug off" having no money and funding my education on my own. Not everyone has a good suburb life.


Let's run with the analogy you gave. I would think that it would be more like getting your first car then comparing brands. The brand doesn't matter, it's the thrill of being able to drive. Although, it does come with its fair share of costs and responsibilities, nothing else could compare to the sensation of driving.
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Brands do make a difference. The thrill of driving a BMW is more than a Honda and the thrill of driving a Ferrari is greater than either of those. Ultimately they are all cars and do the same exact thing, its just the level of value thats associated with those brands.


If you went with popular opinion and went for DO school, you would be expected to shadow a DO just like how you would be expected to shadow a MD if you went to a MD school. It's plenty feasible and you'd still be a physician.
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I study in Vancouver, there are no DOs at the hospital I work at. Tough luck for me I guess.

I don't know anymore if this guy is trolling or not. When he says MD is like BMW and DO like a Honda, I think that's where this thread has reached its maximum, and I can no longer stand listening to his hypocrisy when he says he thinks DO is equal.
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Tell me how this is a bad comparison? I do agree that MDs and DOs do the same exact thing, just like a BMW and a Honda. Ultimately both cars get you from point A to B. However the MD degree has more value than a DO degree which isn't wrong for me to say. That is common knowledge.

Your right, close this thread. Its run its course.

The only way I can find peace is if I go back and redo college. Since I can't do that, I'm not sure what else to do anymore.

I can't live under a shadow of guilt, regret, and sorrow anymore. That is no way to live life. Whatever. Im done with this. Either i'll figure something out and end up as a doctor, or ill just find some dead-end career for failures and continue doing that till I eventually die one day.
 
Look the bottom line is you let these bad grades happen and they aren't going away. You can choose to give up and be depressed, or you can make the best of your situation and use DO's grade replacement policy. Which sounds better to you?

Before you say anything, I don't know what its like to be a screw up like you, and I don't intend to ever find out. I've been fortunate enough to realize I'm responsible for my own well being and my happiness is something only I can make happen. You need to see its up to you to get the help you need, try harder in school, and accomplish the goals that you want to accomplish. Or you could complain, live a **** life, and eventually die.
 
DeterminedDoc said:
Tell me how this is a bad comparison? I do agree that MDs and DOs do the same exact thing, just like a BMW and a Honda. Ultimately both cars get you from point A to B. However the MD degree has more value than a DO degree which isn't wrong for me to say. That is common knowledge.
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Just for fun I googled differences between the 2: http://www.differencebetween.net/object/difference-between-honda-accord-and-bmw-5-series/

As you see, in terms of performance, warranty, and luxury, the BMW out-performs the Honda. Can you make a valid comparison with D.O.? They both function equally, the both have the same rights, they both earn the same, they both can do ACGME training. A side from a sub-set of MD's that went to top 20 schools, the opportunities, career-wise, are identical.

At the end, both training produce the same thing. Heck, I'd even throw in Caribbean being equal at the end of training (and they have an MD). At the end of the day, the differences between MD/DO/CaribMD are that as the school's perceived prestige lowers, one has to work that much harder to get up there, but this doesn't mean that there is a glass ceiling. A Honda can never become a BMW.

So the right comparisons are: BMW vs. Infiniti. One has the get-go name brand performance for a long time, whereas the other is still considered luxury but just comes with some stigma for it being Nissan-produced. However, if you look over time, the Infiniti has gained great ground and respect.
 
Massive self pity with opposition to every suggestion coupled with comparing degrees to cars... I've really seen it all on good ol' SDN
 
Honestly, if you're that depressed you really need to take some time off from school. Go see your financial aid/admission office and see what they suggest.

Right now, if you decide to continue with school, I can confidently say your chances at either MD or DO is hovering around 0%.

Depression sucks REALLY bad, but you shouldn't let it get in the way of your future. Please just take some time off (I'm talking an extended period of time maybe 2-3 years). Figure out everything you need to, then come back and start ALL OVER. If you pull that off, you still have a great chance at DO schools.

EDIT: Apparently your parents aren't allowing it. In that case graduate, find a job, then if you still want to be a doctor go back and repeat those classes while paying for your own education.

EDIT EDIT: The analogy between MD and DOs makes no sense. BMWs are better than Hondas in a purely technical manner. One is actually BETTER than the other in regards to how cars perform. So no, they don't both do "the same thing." A better analogy would be Mac vs. PC.
 
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