Oh dear God

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I guess, to reiterate, all I can say is that if your goal is to be a physician, you can still be one. I can't pretend to understand how your family dynamic works(and personally, I'd be out of there ASAP if those were my parents if they would gripe about something as silly as the difference between a MD and a DO).

Why medicine, if I may ask? You didn't answer that in your previous posts. Is there something in particular that you're interested in that you think would be harder to do as a DO?

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A lot of people have given you good advice, OP. My advice is to take a break and DO NOT take any classes this semester. Get you're problems taken care of, and then come back to school with a light course load, say 2-3 classes to get in the groove of things. You can keep beating yourself about getting bad grades, but I know people in worse situations, WAY worse then where you're at.

In the grand scheme of things, life sucks a lot. Go talk to counselors and get help. Repeatedly telling yourself that you screwed up your life isn't going to help your situation. You messed up this semester. Big deal. There are members on here that had worked there way from sub-2.5 GPA's, and have now been accepted to medical schools.

Talk to someone and try to break down everything you did wrong this past semester, so that you don't repeat those mistakes, including your drug use. You can keep making threads and lament on how horrible things are, and allow everyone on SDN to give you their $.02. It all comes down to your actions from here on out. Handle it. :thumbup:
 
Curing cancer is hard whether you sign your name DO or MD. What's really important to you?
 
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Seriously.. if you can't handle undergrad at all what makes you think you can handle medical school. The point of the degree, whether it be MD or DO, is to help people and if you can't help yourself than you are looking at the wrong career. If you are trying to prove something to yourself rather than make a difference I don't think you will enjoy working in this career.

With that said..if you reallly want it then get off SDN and start making a difference in your own life and show that you can turn it around. Posting on these forums in hope of a solution for your emotional/personal problems doesn't work to well from what I have seen. Only you know what you need to do and when you figure that out and turn things around THEN come back here and ask for advice on the next step.
 
EDIT: Apparently your parents aren't allowing it. In that case graduate, find a job, then if you still want to be a doctor go back and repeat those classes while paying for your own education.

Thats not feasible for me.

I guess, to reiterate, all I can say is

You know what? Im good. Shouldn't you be studying for the SATs or something?


As you see, in terms of performance, warranty, and luxury, the BMW out-performs the Honda. Can you make a valid comparison with D.O.? They both function equally, the both have the same rights, they both earn the same, they both can do ACGME training. A side from a sub-set of MD's that went to top 20 schools, the opportunities, career-wise, are identical.

Is there something in particular that you're interested in that you think would be harder to do as a DO?

Not according to the MDs I've talked too. Specializing as a DO is more difficult and most of the good residencies are given to US MDs unless your an exceptional DO student. You basically have to work much harder to receive the same opportunities you would as an MD. So no - not exactly the same. Very similar maybe - but not exactly the same.

Before you say anything, I don't know what its like to be a screw up like you, and I don't intend to ever find out. I've been fortunate enough to realize I'm responsible for my own well being and my happiness is something only I can make happen.

If you've never been a screw up, then you don't know how painful it is to live as one. Therefore your opinion carries no meaning whatsoever. Run along now, the mayor of IgnoranceVille is making you an honorary citizen.


Curing cancer is hard whether you sign your name DO or MD. What's really important to you?


Look the bottom line is you let these bad grades happen and they aren't going away. You can choose to give up and be depressed, or you can make the best of your situation and use DO's grade replacement policy. Which sounds better to you?

The point of the degree, whether it be MD or DO, is to help people and if you can't help yourself than you are looking at the wrong career. If you are trying to prove something to yourself rather than make a difference I don't think you will enjoy working in this career.


At the end, both training produce the same thing. Heck, I'd even throw in Caribbean being equal at the end of training (and they have an MD). At the end of the day, the differences between MD/DO/CaribMD are that as the school's perceived prestige lowers, one has to work that much harder to get up there, but this doesn't mean that there is a glass ceiling. A Honda can never become a BMW.

Dear God in heaven. Look at all these people jumping on the "why don't you go DO? take advantage of the grade replacement policy. its exactly the same....blah blah".

No $hit I have to take advantage of the grade replacement policy because that is my only motherf****ing option besides Caribbean to be a god damn doctor. So stop acting like I actually have a choice in the matter and can still go MD. Missing out on being an MD is my punishment that I will have to live with for being a screw up in college for the rest of my life, so don't make it seem like DO is the "best" option for me when in reality it is pretty much my only one.

If I had been a better human being, I may have been able to go MD, sadly not in this lifetime.

No one else answered my earlier question either:

WTF would I write on my DO application when I have never worked with or even met one in my life? There are no DOs in the hospital I work at in Vancouver. I would basically say:

Hi! I want to be a doctor and would LOVE to go to your school as a DO student because I have never worked with or even met a DO in my life. All the doctors that I have looked upto and learned from have been MDs but Im too much of a screw up in this lifetime to get into an MD school, so please let me in! When is the interview date?

Im sure ill be set and that they would want me for what is clearly a very strong reason to go to their school.

And if anyone there has very high GPAs, applied to MD schools, or are in MD schools, your opinions don't matter. You can't have the better degree and say that its ok to go for the second best degree. Ok, I agree that the car analogy was flawed, but if I were to bring up laptops, its like saying my new Mac is the same as your Dell, when in reality I end up with the better computer. Your opinion is basically meaningless.

Add my stupid South Asian culture on top of this just makes it even worse. I hate being Indian so much, its nice if your smart and successful but it completely sucks when your a ****** and a failure. Now I have to explain to my folks wtf a DO degree is and tell them why I can't be an MD just like our family friends, relatives, and the other 1 billion of us from that stupid @$$ country. Woohoo.

And after my parents tell me that they aren't paying for any of my education anymore, I have to figure out how I am going to finance the rest of college, post-bac programs, masters degree, SMP, and finally med school all by myself. Your right guys, thanks. I have every reason to be positive, happy, and motivated.

Yea I guess this should be the last thing said. This thread is getting repetitive. Lock this up.
 
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AGAIN. You say you want to be an oncologist. I do too. It took me 4 years to recover from my 2.85 undergrad gpa. I had plenty of time to kick myself, and believe me, I did. But I also would have crawled over a mile of broken glass to be a doctor. I still would.

Who cares about the degree. If you think that people in the future will die without your contributions to the field, stop wallowing and start crawling. If you think they'll do just fine, well, the world can breathe a sigh of relief.
 
I had a really impassioned response typed out, but there's really nothing more to say. Seriously OP, get off SDN and do something about your wellness and your attitude.

Alternatively, STOP TROLLING.
 
Who cares about the degree. If you think that people in the future will die without your contributions to the field, stop wallowing and start crawling. If you think they'll do just fine, well, the world can breathe a sigh of relief.

This was already touched upon:

Dear God in heaven. Look at all these people jumping on the "why don't you go DO? take advantage of the grade replacement policy. its exactly the same....blah blah".

No $hit I have to take advantage of the grade replacement policy because that is my only motherf****ing option besides Caribbean to be a god damn doctor. So stop acting like I actually have a choice in the matter and can still go MD. Missing out on being an MD is my punishment that I will have to live with for being a screw up in college for the rest of my life, so don't make it seem like DO is the "best" option for me when in reality it is pretty much my only one.

If I had been a better human being, I may have been able to go MD, sadly not in this lifetime.

So to say "who cares about the degree?" is superfluous and patronizing. I don't have the luxury of caring anymore. Beggars can't be choosers, and failures can't be beggars.

I had a really impassioned response typed out, but there's really nothing more to say. Seriously OP, get off SDN and do something about your wellness and your attitude.

Alternatively, STOP TROLLING.

Oh sorry. Am I not supposed to be freaking out over failing three classes? My bad, ill just get right back up and pretend like the world didn't end even though the apocalypse is happening outside my house. I think I see some zombies heading this way......but no your right, as long as I fix my "attitude" they won't eat me alive. Man, people and their comments lol. Seriously don't sit there with your high B in chem 2 and act like you know what your talking about. You have no idea how much it kills me inside to exist right now after this semester.


AGAIN. You say you want to be an oncologist. I do too. It took me 4 years to recover from my 2.85 undergrad gpa. I had plenty of time to kick myself, and believe me, I did. But I also would have crawled over a mile of broken glass to be a doctor. I still would.

Thats pretty impressive. Are you an MD student btw? Because if you are then your opinion on this topic doesn't matter. You have already reached the pinnacle of success, and you can't tell me its the same exact thing as the next best option.
 
OP you're twisted devotion to MD as a sign of the "pinnacle of success" along with your consistent self-pity aren't healthy and you should really consider all the advice these people are giving.

In all seriousness, take a break from school and get some sort of help, you need to calm down and refocus yourself. After that find some way to retake the science classes you failed or got a C or less and ace them until your gpa is at or above a 3.0. After that study hard for the MCAT and do well, you should now be able to get into a SMP. Do extremely well in that and you have a *chance* of getting in somewhere. Damage control is gonna take at least a few years for sure but you're gonna have to be in the right state of mind or else you'll never get in anywhere.

Also Merry Christmas
 
OP you're twisted devotion to MD as a sign of the "pinnacle of success" along with your consistent self-pity aren't healthy and you should really consider all the advice these people are giving.

I am. Ive reduced my course load for next sem, will continue meeting with my counselor, maybe start back up on SSRIs and give it another go. Will also try to sincerely and severely reduce my drug use till I stop all together.

Ive accepted that I just suck too hard to be an MD and that I will never be considered at any US MD school in this lifetime, leaving DO as the only other option.

So yes, Ive followed all the advice given.

In all seriousness, take a break from school and get some sort of help,

My dad is a heart patient and has high BP. Its very possible that seeing my grades will induce a heart attack in him so I maybe taking a break for a long time if that happens.

Even if that doesn't happen I can't take a break from school now due to my financial situation. And when my parents cut off funding for school and for me after seeing my grades, Ill have to work alongside going to school.

Yep. Its a Merry f***ing Christmas.
 
If you've never been a screw up, then you don't know how painful it is to live as one. Therefore your opinion carries no meaning whatsoever. Run along now, the mayor of IgnoranceVille is making you an honorary citizen.
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You didn't read the rest of the post. You are in fact the ignorant one, as you haven't realized your fate is in your own hands. You can change everything about your "terrible life" (Oh no, I was born into a rich Indian family and have all my needs completely meet! What shall I do!) My cat has more will power than you. Reading through this thread, I don't think I've ever seen or read about a more pathetic person than you. If you're not a troll, then I am sad to say you are probably going to die an unfulfilling and unaccomplished life all because you can't get up and do anything about it. Enjoy :)
 
What is your current GPA right now and exactly how many credits have you taken? It should be a simple calculation to see how much time you'd need to get your GPA to a 3.0. If reasonable, you could work your way there and get into a SMP given you get a great MCAT score
 
No other advice can be given..All posts are just trolling. please close this thread!!
 
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You didn't read the rest of the post. You are in fact the ignorant one, as you haven't realized your fate is in your own hands. You can change everything about your "terrible life" (Oh no, I was born into a rich Indian family and have all my needs completely meet! What shall I do!)

hahahaha what other advice did you give beyond "your fate is in your own hands?" No $hit Sherlock. Thanks for the revelation. That isn't the issue here and it seems like you missed the entire point of this thread. Congratulations, you've now been elected the new mayor of IgnoranceVille :thumbup:


My cat has more will power than you. Reading through this thread, I don't think I've ever seen or read about a more pathetic person than you. If you're not a troll, then I am sad to say you are probably going to die an unfulfilling and unaccomplished life all because you can't get up and do anything about it. Enjoy

Well since your cat is the only friend you have, your right, it probably does. As for the rest of your post man it just makes me :laugh: because you admitted you've never failed as hard. So you can never understand how painful it is and how difficult it can be to move on. But continue sitting there with your 3.9 and 45 MCAT acting like you know the hardships of life and what its like to lose yourself to drugs. Please go be a d-bag somewhere else.


What is your current GPA right now and exactly how many credits have you taken? It should be a simple calculation to see how much time you'd need to get your GPA to a 3.0. If reasonable, you could work your way there and get into a SMP given you get a great MCAT score

Factoring the grades this semester. My GPA is a 2.45 after 106 credits with 260 quality points.

GOD!!!! F*CK F*CK F*CK!!!!!! AAAAHRGHEAHAHAHEHAARRGHGH

Sorry. I just hate myself. Excuse me, I have to go look at myself in the mirror really quick and then vomit like a waterfall.
 
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One more thing before the thread gets closed.

OP- you talk about the really good residencies being out of reach for DO students. Unfortunately they are also out of reach for 90% of MD students. That is why they are competitive. They are out of reach just the same. And why do you think that you will get to med school and all of a sudden becoome top 10%? You obviously think that because you keep bringing it up. I can't speak for the country, but I don know that University of Iowa is a great med school that takes many MANY DO residents every year. Why not just accept that you will likely be average, like 90% of the rest of us.
 
One more thing before the thread gets closed.

OP- you talk about the really good residencies being out of reach for DO students. Unfortunately they are also out of reach for 90% of MD students. That is why they are competitive. They are out of reach just the same. And why do you think that you will get to med school and all of a sudden becoome top 10%? You obviously think that because you keep bringing it up. I can't speak for the country, but I don know that University of Iowa is a great med school that takes many MANY DO residents every year. Why not just accept that you will likely be average, like 90% of the rest of us.

No one has answered any of my questions beyond "go DO, grade replacement, you can still be a doc, DO is the path for you! Be Happy! Go frolic in the f***ing meadow." Im not getting into a DO school man:


WTF would I write on my DO application when I have never worked with or even met one in my life? There are no DOs in the hospital I work at in Vancouver. I would basically say:

Hi! I want to be a doctor and would LOVE to go to your school as a DO student because I have never worked with or even met a DO in my life. All the doctors that I have looked upto and learned from have been MDs but Im too much of a screw up in this lifetime to get into an MD school, so please let me in! When is the interview date?

Im sure ill be set and that they would want me for what is clearly a very strong reason to go to their school.

And as for your post. I got my info from a licensed doctor. Im pretty sure an MD would know more about that than you man. And Im not saying that I would ever become the top 10%, I meant that if I got into a DO school, I would have to be in the top 10% to land a a residency for 90% of MDs. Obviously I can't do this, since as my grades, and my GPA show, I am VERY below average in my pathetic f***ed up excuse for a life.
 
hahahaha what other advice did you give beyond "your fate is in your own hands?" No $hit Sherlock. Thanks for the revelation. That isn't the issue here and it seems like you missed the entire point of this thread. Congratulations, you've now been elected the new mayor of IgnoranceVille :thumbup:




Well since your cat is the only friend you have, your right, it probably does. As for the rest of your post man it just makes me :laugh: because you admitted you've never failed as hard. So you can never understand how painful it is and how difficult it can be to move on. But continue sitting there with your 3.9 and 45 MCAT acting like you know the hardships of life and what its like to lose yourself to drugs. Please go be a d-bag somewhere else.

You say you know that your life is in your own hands, but you obviously don't. Why else would YOU let yourself be such a loser? And why else would YOU not be willing to do anything about it but cry like a child? I've had non-academic problems in my past such as being too skinny, but I made the necessary changes to fix them. I guess you're just too weak of a person for that. Honestly I don't know why I'm even trying with you. Have fun being disappointed with the life you've led while you're on your death bed.:thumbdown:
 
You say you know that your life is in your own hands, but you obviously don't. Why else would YOU let yourself be such a loser? And why else would YOU not be willing to do anything about it but cry like a child? I've had non-academic problems in my past such as being too skinny, but I made the necessary changes to fix them. I guess you're just too weak of a person for that. Honestly I don't know why I'm even trying with you. Have fun being disappointed with the life you've led while you're on your death bed.:thumbdown:

Boy oh boy did you have it bad. How did you ever make it through that clearly difficult ordeal? Thats amazing and it definitely gives you the right to criticize and be judgmental about people who have actual problems. Good job sir :thumbup:
 
The ultimate question becomes - how do I live with myself?

How does anyone live with themselves for screwing up so hard for no logical reason other than being a complete chod?

My GPA is ruined. I don't think I can get into ANY type of school with those grades. People who fail 3 classes generally aren't very successful.

I have destroyed myself. Thus the question becomes, how do I live with myself?

This isn't thinking that will allow for success. Plain and simple, you need to see a psychologist to help you restructure the way you deal with things like this.

I failed one class three times. I had a few C's and even a D or two. I'm in medical school now, even if it is a "lowly DO school". I'm doing pretty well, since I've mostly overcome what kept me from doing what I was capable of during undergrad (in my case, it was chiefly working too much, as well as lacking a bit in work ethic).

I can't speak for Canada, since I've never lived there, but you don't have to be anywhere near the top 10% to compete in allopathic residencies, unless you're shooting for Derm or Plastics, in which case you're probably screwed (though you'd probably be screwed as an MD grad anyways). It's tougher, but if you're not gunning for the hypercompetitive specialties, you can probably get in somewhere. If you don't have the grades to get into an allopathic program to begin with, it's unlikely you'd be able to get into one of those programs even if the allopathic school did accept you. Canada is probably worse for DOs, but I don't believe it's as bad as you've been lead to believe.

Do a little research, and you can fake it into an osteopathic program if your application is otherwise competitive. My DO LOR was obtained after 3-4 hours of shadowing, and I had multiple acceptances and the luxury of turning down interview offers. The DO letter is not a requirement at most places. You'd give the cookie cutter "I want to be a doctor, and I appreciate the more patient centered approach that osteopathic medicine brings to the table, as well as the ability to have the added tool of OMT."

You've dug yourself a hole, but it can be overcome if you work hard enough. You'll need to get your negative, catastrophizing way of dealing with the world turned around, as well as accepting that you may fall short of your cultural expectations in order to do that, though. I'd suggest dealing with these problems before you enroll for another semester and make your situation worse.
 
This isn't thinking that will allow for success. Plain and simple, you need to see a psychologist to help you restructure the way you deal with things like this.

I failed one class three times. I had a few C's and even a D or two. I'm in medical school now, even if it is a "lowly DO school". I'm doing pretty well, since I've mostly overcome what kept me from doing what I was capable of during undergrad (in my case, it was chiefly working too much, as well as lacking a bit in work ethic).

I can't speak for Canada, since I've never lived there, but you don't have to be anywhere near the top 10% to compete in allopathic residencies, unless you're shooting for Derm or Plastics, in which case you're probably screwed (though you'd probably be screwed as an MD grad anyways). It's tougher, but if you're not gunning for the hypercompetitive specialties, you can probably get in somewhere. If you don't have the grades to get into an allopathic program to begin with, it's unlikely you'd be able to get into one of those programs even if the allopathic school did accept you. Canada is probably worse for DOs, but I don't believe it's as bad as you've been lead to believe.

Do a little research, and you can fake it into an osteopathic program if your application is otherwise competitive. My DO LOR was obtained after 3-4 hours of shadowing, and I had multiple acceptances and the luxury of turning down interview offers. The DO letter is not a requirement at most places. You'd give the cookie cutter "I want to be a doctor, and I appreciate the more patient centered approach that osteopathic medicine brings to the table, as well as the ability to have the added tool of OMT."

You've dug yourself a hole, but it can be overcome if you work hard enough. You'll need to get your negative, catastrophizing way of dealing with the world turned around, as well as accepting that you may fall short of your cultural expectations in order to do that, though. I'd suggest dealing with these problems before you enroll for another semester and make your situation worse.

Whoa whoa buddy hang on there. People who have a 2.45 gpa cannot call any school lowly. If I apply to DO schools now, my application would be used as toilet paper so no, I have no right anymore to call anything lowly but myself with that GPA.

I keep beating myself up because if I had been smarter I could be so much more than a depressed drug addict with three failed classes.

If I had been a better human being, then I could have gone MD. My ****** self will not be that lucky in this lifetime.

F*** my culture. Being indian a ****** and a failure is the worst thing ever. I hate India. Ill go to a DO school in a few years and become the president of the Indian reject club. I've failed my cultural expectations too so this is my way of making up for it. Good bye MD. It's time for a brown DO.

Excuse me while I go look at myself and vomit some more. It's hard to live with so much self hatred. If any you guys hate yourselves as much as me, how do you guys cope? I've been doing way less drugs but have started smoking a lot of cigarettes instead :(
 
Before I say anything…why are you attacking the people that are trying to help you?... Instead of shooting everything down, you should try to consider everything people say.

I feel like the only reason you're going to medical school is because of cultural pressures (I'm probably wrong..but thats just what it seems like from your posts) and if you cared that much about cultural pressures then you wouldn't have done drugs in the first place...you cant just pick and chose what you care about. I'm sure you care a lot about how your parents feel because thats how we are raised...we're supposed to pretty much do what they say, but make sure you do things for yourself. Do you even want to become a doctor or do you just want nice cars? (You mentioned cars a lot in your posts)

Everything that youve do so far was for yourself..no one made you do drugs? you chose to do it and now this is the price you pay. I'm indian and I did the same stuff as you in high school (drugs, partied, etc) and then when it was time to apply to colleges I was depressed because i knew i would never get into the same schools as my friends...and then I watched all my friends get into amazing schools while i got into a mediocre school. I even told my parents I didn't want to go to med school at one point..just to make myself feel better..i lowered my expectations for myself so that I could make myself feel better about myself and justify what I did… you could only imagine how that went. I got all of the same lectures that I'm sure you've gotten …"Ohh what am I going to say to our relatives" .."how am I going to show my face" but surprisingly I took everything they said and realized that as much as it would make them happy..it would actually help me more in the future so when I started going to college I was determined to turn my life around. I started doing all the stuff normal premeds did and fell in love with research (designing methods for finding new antibiotics) and that's when I decided that I wanted to do something with medicine.

The thing is you've gotta take responsibility and realize what has happened and MOVE FORWARD. Do something that makes you feel better about yourself and makes your parents happy since you care about that a lot. Here is something my mom said to me after I told her I didn't want to be a doctor "I don't care what you do, but whatever you decide to do…make sure you become the best at it." Honestly, I think your parents will be happy as long as you're happy and doing something with your life and if they are pressuring you this much you should probably talk to them about all of this stuff so that they know what they are doing to you and im sure you will feel a lot better once you open up to them. If you still want to do Md after you talk to them, do a masters, take a year off work and then apply for masters and then medical school…there is always something you can do and if it is medicine that you truly want to do …then you shouldn't have a problem with spending more time to get in.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/Careers/11/03/cb.nodegree/index.html
 
It's really hard to read through this thread because I've also had major depression that made me think I was a failure in life because my GPA was not good. I can empathize with you in that respect. So before even talking about medical school and grades, what you first have to do is this:

GO SEE A PSYCHIATRIST AGAIN!

SSRI's aren't the only type of antidepressants. For most people, it takes more than once to find the best antidepressant -- and it usually takes several weeks to feel the effects. Depression CAN be overcome.

I really hope you get better.
 
Since you're not listening to anyone else's fantastic advice, I've decided to add my own. I've included a link to an application you should fill out (http://corp.7-eleven.com/Careers/CareerOpportunitiesHV/tabid/259/Default.aspx). It fits you and your personality perfectly. It's also culturally appropriate. I'd say apply to McDonald's to flip burgers but I sure wouldn't want you to make my burger and I definitely know I wouldn't want to work with anybody who's obsessed with his woe-is-me life.

P.S. You might want to practice the phrase, "Thank you. Come again."
 
"Shouldn't you be studying for the SATs or something?"

I take it in January, and I'm a senior so it shouldn't be too terrible(considering that most take it in their junior year). I got moved around too much to take it sophomore/junior year. In fact, this is my first year since freshman year that I've been in the same state. xD

I appreciate the concern and I do really hope that you turn your situation around.

PS: Rough-number calculation makes me think you got a year and a half or two years of 4.0 for a 3.1(presumed 14 hour semester). But my numbers could be off. Either way, I think that you got the common sense to make the right choice for you. =)
 
This needs to be voted as the top troll thread of the year.
 
Since you're not listening to anyone else's fantastic advice,

Read the thread again you ******. I am. I am going to try to back on meds, reduce my course load next semester, will probably do a post-bac after I graduate, am going to retake the classes I failed, and have accepted that I won't be an MD in this life. Pretty much the advice given here - oh and be "positive and happy" with a smile on my face.


I'd say apply to McDonald's to flip burgers but I sure wouldn't want you to make my burger and I definitely know I wouldn't want to work with anybody who's obsessed with his woe-is-me life.

Yea your right, I would definitely poison your burgers.

I appreciate the concern and I do really hope that you turn your situation around.

I was being sarcastic but its ok, your innocent. Your calculations are wrong. My GPA right now is a 2.45 with 106 credits. Thats not possible.

I feel like the only reason you're going to medical school is because of cultural pressures (I'm probably wrong..but thats just what it seems like from your posts)

No, I like medicine and I have my reasons for liking it. I just suck.

Everything that youve do so far was for yourself..no one made you do drugs? you chose to do it and now this is the price you pay.

Really? Gee I didn't know that. I think already mentioned how much of a failure I was in every other post I made in case you missed it.

I took everything they said and realized that as much as it would make them happy..it would actually help me more in the future so when I started going to college I was determined to turn my life around. I started doing all the stuff normal premeds did and fell in love with research (designing methods for finding new antibiotics) and that's when I decided that I wanted to do something with medicine.

You screwed up in high school. That doesn't even matter. Im a motherf*cking third year that has been in college for a while. I had a 2.7 GPA BEFORE this semester. I should have worked SO hard and things would have been different. I was irresponsible, and a ****** and did drugs instead. Im 21, I should have been more mature than this. I should have been better than this. But I wasn't. How the hell am I supposed to forgive myself for that? How the hell do you just MOVE FORWARD? It kills me inside. I am caught in hell and I don't know how to find peace anymore. I don't know how to stop hating myself for getting to this position.

Honestly, I think your parents will be happy as long as you're happy and doing something with your life and if they are pressuring you this much you should probably talk to them about all of this stuff so that they know what they are doing to you and im sure you will feel a lot better once you open up to them. If you still want to do Md after you talk to them, do a masters, take a year off work and then apply for masters and then medical school…there is always something you can do and if it is medicine that you truly want to do …then you shouldn't have a problem with spending more time to get in.

My parents aren't pressurizing me to be a doctor, this is my decision which I have now royally screwed up. They have given me everything, and all I have given them is a giant failure which is my existence. It sucks having a low GPA and being Indian man. I hate it. I wish I had white parents sometimes. My dad is a heart patient, I don't know whats going to happen to him when he sees that I've FAILED three classes. If anything does happen to him, then I will never be able to forgive myself at all.

My GPA is a 2.45 after 106 credits. My chances at ANY US MD school in this lifetime is effectively 0. That's what you get for being a f*ck up. I will now have to go DO since that is the only available option for a f*** up like me and that is going to be interesting to be the one Indian DO in the family - hell the one Indian DO in our whole freaking city. Even though a part of me will always hate myself for missing out on MD, I will learn to accept myself in that light. As I have repeated many times:

If I had been a better human being overall in this life, I could have gone MD. I guess I'll never be good enough to be alongside those people who realized early on what it took to be successful.


This needs to be voted as the top troll thread of the year.

Thanks dickwad.
 
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R I will now have to go DO since that is the only available option for a f*** up like me and that is going to be interesting to be the one Indian DO in the family - hell the one Indian DO in our whole freaking city. Even though a part of me will always hate myself for missing out on MD, I will learn to accept myself in that light. As I have repeated many times
People don't often mention this, but the truth is that you probably don't have a chance for D.O. school in your lifetime either. How many retakes do you think will take just for you to be at the average (3.5) GPA for D.O. school? What do you think an ADCOM will think when he sees you had to basically take every class twice to get a decent GPA? And by the time you apply, the average will be even higher. The truth is that getting into D.O. school threshold is NOT drastically lower than MD.

And seriously, your elitism is starting to piss me off. Only 10% of people in the US get to have a graduate degree. Of the entire population, probably less than 1% can claim to have gone to medical school (be it Carib, DO, or US-MD), and of all of them, they usually have higher GPA's, EC, and other things than any graduate programs. So your "problem" is even more ridiculous than any other other first world problem. Or maybe I should have made this argument in comparison to your culture/country where people have real problems like lack of food or clean whatever. Maybe then you'd be grateful of having the privilege of being able to be a "failure" with a 2.5 GPA.
 
People don't often mention this, but the truth is that you probably don't have a chance for D.O. school in your lifetime either. How many retakes do you think will take just for you to be at the average (3.5) GPA for D.O. school? What do you think an ADCOM will think when he sees you had to basically take every class twice to get a decent GPA? And by the time you apply, the average will be even higher. The truth is that getting into D.O. school threshold is NOT drastically lower than MD.

And seriously, your elitism is starting to piss me off. Only 10% of people in the US get to have a graduate degree. Of the entire population, probably less than 1% can claim to have gone to medical school (be it Carib, DO, or US-MD), and of all of them, they usually have higher GPA's, EC, and other things than any graduate programs. So your "problem" is even more ridiculous than any other other first world problem. Or maybe I should have made this argument in comparison to your culture/country where people have real problems like lack of food or clean whatever. Maybe then you'd be grateful of having the privilege of being able to be a "failure" with a 2.5 GPA.

agree with this.

and to answer your question about what your app would say, are that socially awkward that you can't fake it? go to the osteopathic website, read everything you can, say you love the philosophy and want to make a better appearance in Canada. Also, you aren't going to apply now, and you know you would need years of gpa repair, make an effort to learn about DOs. You seem to not want to do anything at all unless it is handed to you.

but i agree with triage. I can't believe i have let you troll me this much,
 
but i agree with triage. I can't believe i have let you troll me this much,
This sounds a bit too Freudian even for my palate, but I think we keep getting duped into returning to this thread because we can relate to that time when we had to gather our pieces and glue ourselves back together. In fact, underdogs from SDN that don't post regularly for WAMC have come to put in their 2 cents.

But I gotta say that when your self-worth becomes dependent on some job title or other material thing, there have to be darker demons than those that readily meet the eye. If by any chance whatsoever is true that the OP is not trolling, I hope he finds help ASAP.
 
Factoring the grades this semester. My GPA is a 2.45 after 106 credits with 260 quality points.

I'm going to continue to bite (for better or worse). Doing some quick math I found that if you can manage to get 60 credits (4 semesters) of straight A's your GPA would be at a 3.01, which along with a great MCAT score would put you in the running for a SMP, which providing you kill that as well, might give you a good shot at getting into an allopathic school somewhere. Retakes of any failing or C or lower classes could count towards the 60 credits. That being said, getting nothing but A's for that long will be a challenge, as well as getting a good MCAT score as well as succeeding in an SMP, but being that you seem so desperate I'm just laying out what would be ahead of you. So it IS possible at this point for you but if you continue with this state of mind you'll get nowhere.
 
Boy oh boy did you have it bad. How did you ever make it through that clearly difficult ordeal? Thats amazing and it definitely gives you the right to criticize and be judgmental about people who have actual problems. Good job sir :thumbup:

People commit suicide over body image issues ******. And you have no actual problems lol, you're just a bitch :thumbdown:
 
Thats not feasible for me.

Why? You can't get a job? Trust me, plenty of us are financing our own education and it IS possible to work and do well in school. Alternatively, you shouldn't even be working/going to school at the same time in your condition. As others have said, take a leave of absence, work for 2-3 years, save up some money, THEN go back to school. Also see if you can be considered as an independent student for financial aid reasons.

Not according to the MDs I've talked too. Specializing as a DO is more difficult and most of the good residencies are given to US MDs unless your an exceptional DO student. You basically have to work much harder to receive the same opportunities you would as an MD. So no - not exactly the same. Very similar maybe - but not exactly the same.

The MDs you talked to don't seem to understand how the residency match works for DOs, which would make perfect sense as there probably aren't too many DOs up there. Yes, matching into an MD residency as a DO is harder. However, DOs have their OWN residencies that MDs cannot apply to. In fact, they have a lot of these covering all the same various specialties that MD residencies cover (except forensic pathology I think).

WTF would I write on my DO application when I have never worked with or even met one in my life? There are no DOs in the hospital I work at in Vancouver. I would basically say:

Hi! I want to be a doctor and would LOVE to go to your school as a DO student because I have never worked with or even met a DO in my life. All the doctors that I have looked upto and learned from have been MDs but Im too much of a screw up in this lifetime to get into an MD school, so please let me in! When is the interview date?

I don't think EVERY DO school has a DO shadowing requirement (someone else already told you this, in your insult barrage you just didn't reply to their answer). I think a lot just have a physician shadowing requirement. You could always...you know just call and ask...

And if anyone there has very high GPAs, applied to MD schools, or are in MD schools, your opinions don't matter. You can't have the better degree and say that its ok to go for the second best degree. Ok, I agree that the car analogy was flawed, but if I were to bring up laptops, its like saying my new Mac is the same as your Dell, when in reality I end up with the better computer. Your opinion is basically meaningless.

Nope, your analogy is still flawed. You're now comparing two different COMPUTER brands. I was comparing two different operating systems. Your computer analogy now has the same problem as your car analogy. What kind of dell? what kind of Mac? In truth, when comparing the two OPERATING SYSTEMS (OSX vs W7) both do the same things with some subtle differences. Neither is superior (despite what commercials tell you) they just handle differently and so some people prefer one over the other.

Add my stupid South Asian culture on top of this just makes it even worse. I hate being Indian so much, its nice if your smart and successful but it completely sucks when your a ****** and a failure. Now I have to explain to my folks wtf a DO degree is and tell them why I can't be an MD just like our family friends, relatives, and the other 1 billion of us from that stupid @$$ country. Woohoo.

Honestly, if you just want to slap an MD next to your name because you don't want to disappoint your family, you should find a different career. Sounds like this is for the best.

Would your parents be more disappointed if you were a DO or if you weren't a physician at all?

Seriously though, you REALLY need to go see a psychiatrist. Quitting drugs won't help as much as you think, you need to address the reason you were taking drugs in the first place. Lashing out at everyone here, who despite what now seems to be borderline trolling continue to help you, shows that you still need a lot of help.
 
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People don't often mention this, but the truth is that you probably don't have a chance for D.O. school in your lifetime either. How many retakes do you think will take just for you to be at the average (3.5) GPA for D.O. school? What do you think an ADCOM will think when he sees you had to basically take every class twice to get a decent GPA? And by the time you apply, the average will be even higher. The truth is that getting into D.O. school threshold is NOT drastically lower than MD.

I know right? The MCAT average for DO schools is only a few points (i.e. only a few questions) below that of MD schools, and the average GPA for DO schools is still above the average GPA of undergraduates at most universities.
 
Originally Posted by TriagePreMed View Post
People don't often mention this, but the truth is that you probably don't have a chance for D.O. school in your lifetime either. How many retakes do you think will take just for you to be at the average (3.5) GPA for D.O. school? What do you think an ADCOM will think when he sees you had to basically take every class twice to get a decent GPA? And by the time you apply, the average will be even higher. The truth is that getting into D.O. school threshold is NOT drastically lower than MD.

Thank you. I was thinking the same thing. DO is a remote possibility at this point too. I can't imagine any school(SMP included) wanting to get involved with this mess.
 
God no please don't say that. I can still be a doctor. That is all I want to do, I'm not switching careers because I was too stupid to get into med school. I can't live like that. I would rather die in that case.

Yes, I am too much of a failure to become an MD in this lifetime and I am coming to peace with that.

But I can still go DO of I take advantage of the grade replacement policy. I'm not retaking every class twice. I'll retake the classes I failed and try to not let my last semesters performance come in the way of my future semesters. I will try to do as best as I can in the 1.5 years I have left and will probably go for a post-bac program after and take as many classes as I need too till my GPA is high enough for DO. If I somehow manage to do well enough on the MCAT, then maybe I could go SMP but I think I'll suck too much for it anyway.

In terms of ECs I'll continue working at my hospital and will try for a masters degree after my post bac. After that I want to research in public health abroad. I wanted to do a Fulbright, but my grades will keep me out of anything that prestigious right? Even if I have a good proposal and have established contacts? The country I want to do in is india (not because I like the country, I hate it, but it's one of the best places to do research in public health) but its very competitive......

@Lucius:

Lol yea because MDs want to go for DO residencies in the first place right? Lol come on man, it's a one way road. People with the better degrees will get the better residencies so that's not really an argument. And OSX is better than W7 in terms performance, security, and has a greater range of functioning and it's also much more user friendly. That is common knowledge, not my opinion.


Yes I will be the laughing stock of my family as the Indian pre med who went DO. Yes I will be the oldest Indian premed to be starting med school at like 25 or 26. I don't care anymore, I just want to be a doctor and I just want to be happy. I hate Indian culture, and everything about being Indian anyway. India can burn in hell as far as I'm concerned.
 
You have serious issues. Get yourself some professional counseling. It's counterproductive to alienate the good people on here who reached out and offered you sincere advice.
 
Thank you. I was thinking the same thing. DO is a remote possibility at this point too. I can't imagine any school(SMP included) wanting to get involved with this mess.

So you're suggesting that I give up on med school all together because of a low number? You think that's a reason to quit? That's shameful and weak. No. I am going DO even if it means I have to crawl over glass. I've been through too much to just quit now.

And yes, I am getting professional help when I return to school and I have followed the advice given here. Everything from dropping my course load, to getting back on meds, and retaking my classes.

So in terms of my plan of action, what else would I have to do? I understand that I will have to "fake" a reason to apply DO, but if I do manage to get in, would I still need to keep "faking" a reason for residency and beyond? I hope my career isn't based from "faking" that is all......
 
God no please don't say that. I can still be a doctor. That is all I want to do, I'm not switching careers because I was too stupid to get into med school. I can't live like that. I would rather die in that case.

Yes, I am too much of a failure to become an MD in this lifetime and I am coming to peace with that.

But I can still go DO of I take advantage of the grade replacement policy. I'm not retaking every class twice. I'll retake the classes I failed and try to not let my last semesters performance come in the way of my future semesters. I will try to do as best as I can in the 1.5 years I have left and will probably go for a post-bac program after and take as many classes as I need too till my GPA is high enough for DO. If I somehow manage to do well enough on the MCAT, then maybe I could go SMP but I think I'll suck too much for it anyway.

In terms of ECs I'll continue working at my hospital and will try for a masters degree after my post bac. After that I want to research in public health abroad. I wanted to do a Fulbright, but my grades will keep me out of anything that prestigious right? Even if I have a good proposal and have established contacts? The country I want to do in is india (not because I like the country, I hate it, but it's one of the best places to do research in public health) but its very competitive......

@Lucius:

Lol yea because MDs want to go for DO residencies in the first place right? Lol come on man, it's a one way road. People with the better degrees will get the better residencies so that's not really an argument. And OSX is better than W7 in terms performance, security, and has a greater range of functioning and it's also much more user friendly. That is common knowledge, not my opinion.


Yes I will be the laughing stock of my family as the Indian pre med who went DO. Yes I will be the oldest Indian premed to be starting med school at like 25 or 26. I don't care anymore, I just want to be a doctor and I just want to be happy. I hate Indian culture, and everything about being Indian anyway. India can burn in hell as far as I'm concerned.

That sounds like a great plan so far :)

As for the Md/DO residency thing, you bet your ass they would. Someone who actually wants to be a general surgeon would apply to every program they think they have a shot at. You think they'd do a second choice specialty just to go to an MD affiliated hospital? Lawl

Ill let the OS thing slide since those sounded like OSX generic fanbot comments ;) if you're not an engineer or gamer it makes sense to want the "hip" one, but you'd see what I mean if you ever tried to compile code on OSX :p like I said both are equal, depending on your preferences both have strong points.
 
That sounds like a great plan so far :)

As for the Md/DO residency thing, you bet your ass they would. Someone who actually wants to be a general surgeon would apply to every program they think they have a shot at. You think they'd do a second choice specialty just to go to an MD affiliated hospital? Lawl

Ill let the OS thing slide since those sounded like OSX generic fanbot comments ;) if you're not an engineer or gamer it makes sense to want the "hip" one, but you'd see what I mean if you ever tried to compile code on OSX :p like I said both are equal, depending on your preferences both have strong points.

Yea I think if I can get my mind back together and get help, I'll try to do the best I can with what classes I have left. I'll probably do a summer session to redo the courses that I dropped and failed if they are offered.

I figure if I can show a strong grade trend, do well in my post bac and study really hard to rock the MCAT along with some nice and unique ECs, that should at least get me an interview at a DO school.

Its just been very hard to not keep beating myself up over this past semester. At least if i had an illness i could explain why, but failing cause of doing drugs? Im just having a hard time still getting over that. I shouldve been better than that and i let myself and my family down and I'm going through a pack of cigarettes a day now :(. I never thought in my life I would get to this desperate and pathetic of a position, I hope in the end im a stronger man for it.

Anything else you would suggest? Also what about my Fulbright question? Is that something worth looking into or is it out my league as well now (don't worry lol I've accepted that most things are, I mean my gpa is a 2.45)?

It makes sense for DOs to want MD residencies, but I'm not too sure why MDs would apply to DO ones lol, it doesn't make sense to me.

And even though I am apple junkie, that can be verified by almost any leading pc magazine or tech specialist- I know because my old roommate was a computer genius. So I guess your analogy really merges with mine lol.

And the comments about India were a little extreme I think. Yea my family will be disappointed in me, and perhaps they always will be, but I can't afford to care anymore. I have to live my life even if it means accepting that I will never be good enough for an MD like how it is in my family. Their Indian, therefore ******ed.
 
Yea I think if I can get my mind back together and get help, I'll try to do the best I can with what classes I have left. I'll probably do a summer session to redo the courses that I dropped and failed if they are offered.

I figure if I can show a strong grade trend, do well in my post bac and study really hard to rock the MCAT along with some nice and unique ECs, that should at least get me an interview at a DO school.

Its just been very hard to not keep beating myself up over this past semester. At least if i had an illness i could explain why, but failing cause of doing drugs? Im just having a hard time still getting over that. I shouldve been better than that and i let myself and my family down and I'm going through a pack of cigarettes a day now :(. I never thought in my life I would get to this desperate and pathetic of a position, I hope in the end im a stronger man for it.

Anything else you would suggest? Also what about my Fulbright question? Is that something worth looking into or is it out my league as well now (don't worry lol I've accepted that most things are, I mean my gpa is a 2.45)?

It makes sense for DOs to want MD residencies, but I'm not too sure why MDs would apply to DO ones lol, it doesn't make sense to me.

And even though I am apple junkie, that can be verified by almost any leading pc magazine or tech specialist- I know because my old roommate was a computer genius. So I guess your analogy really merges with mine lol.

And the comments about India were a little extreme I think. Yea my family will be disappointed in me, and perhaps they always will be, but I can't afford to care anymore. I have to live my life even if it means accepting that I will never be good enough for an MD like how it is in my family. Their Indian, therefore ******ed.

If you do REALLY well on the postbac and MCAT, you might even have a chance at a few MD schools. As for DO schools, with the grade replacement policy (just the Ds and Fs, not everything. Maybe even just the science classes that you got Ds and Fs in), your GPA might actually get to a competitive level. The most important thing when interviewing at DO schools is not letting them think that you believe the degree is inferior to an MD. I have a few friends who interviewed at DO schools at that seemed to be the big thing they looked for ("Why a physician?" followed by "why a DO?").

You don't need a physical illness necessarily. Somethings don't even have to be commented on. If you suddenly turn your grades around they'll realize that the Fs and Ds you got at first might not be an accurate representation of who you are, and there was obviously something wrong initially. If you want, you can always say it was due to personal problems and leave it at that. They'd probably get what you mean. A lot of people go through this (this forum is full of posts like this).

I don't know much about Fulbright, so maybe you should make a separate post about that in pre-allo.

As for your parents, as long as YOU'RE happy you'll do well in life. Eventually, as you do better and better they'll get over it as well. You being miserable and constantly doing worse and worse won't do them any favors though, that's for sure.
 
Yea it's a pity you weren't one of them.

Lol. If this isn't a troll I really would like to see what you are like as a person. Are you as big a failure in the rest of your life as you are with basic introductory classes? I don't think I would want someone like you as a doctor (I would fear for my life), and I sincerely hope you continue down your road of failure. Remember, society will always need someone to dig the ditches!
 
I understand that I will have to "fake" a reason to apply DO, but if I do manage to get in, would I still need to keep "faking" a reason for residency and beyond? I hope my career isn't based from "faking" that is all......

This isn't that big of a deal. On SDN, there are people that will $h!t on you all day if are applying to DO schools without having some sort of vision at birth or have a "destiny" to become a DO.

I am applying to DO and MD schools now. I don't really put too much weight on the philosophy or mission of a particular medical program. I am doing it to one day become a doctor because that is what I want to do with my life. So if you want to do that also, then you aren't faking it.

If you look at any schools philosophy, they are always VERY general so you can always somehow fit your mission with theirs.
 
This isn't that big of a deal. On SDN, there are people that will $h!t on you all day if are applying to DO schools without having some sort of vision at birth or have a "destiny" to become a DO.

I am applying to DO and MD schools now. I don't really put too much weight on the philosophy or mission of a particular medical program. I am doing it to one day become a doctor because that is what I want to do with my life. So if you want to do that also, then you aren't faking it.

If you look at any schools philosophy, they are always VERY general so you can always somehow fit your mission with theirs.
I usually am one of the critics for going to D.O. school for the wrong reasons, but that gets misinterpreted too. I don't believe that having a "preference" for M.D. needs to shadow "true" reasons to be a D.O. I can completely understand wanting to have more options in terms of residency, not having to take an additional test (COMLEX), and wanting to avoid people's ignorant about title. However, if you end up "having to go" to D.O. school because you didn't get M.D. admissions, don't do it if you think that D.O. is somehow not fulfilling to your dreams or your beliefs of what is and isn't a physician. Personally, I'd have no trouble being a DO as being an MD, although if posed with the possibility of avoiding downsides, I would seriously contemplate the idea.
 
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