10k/mo minimum in set expenses new reality

[finalpsychyear]

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This is what new grads are facing these days. The house was median cost of 500k but at today's 30 year interest rates. The med school loans were around 215k with 10 year payback. Assumes only a married couple. No food/travel/gym/personal expenses added. Am i missing something or is this fairly accurate esp when student loans, car loans, and mortagage all happen to be going on at the same time?


The Updated MCOL Fixed Cost Budget
Integrating the exact employee-share premium alongside your professional expenses, asset protections, and medical school loans establishes the true structural baseline:

Expense Category [1]	Itemized Monthly Cost
Housing (Median MCOL Mortgage PITI)	$3,650
Home Maintenance Allocation (1% annual buffer)	$350
Vehicle Loans (RAV4 Hybrid & Honda CR-V)	$1,155
Auto & Home Insurance Bundle	$170
Utilities (Electric, Gas, Water, Trash)	$395
Communication (Internet, Streaming, TV)	$155
Subdivision Lawn Care & Landscaping	$270
Medical School Student Loans (Standard Repayment)	$2,850
Own-Occupation Specialty Disability Insurance	$550
Term Life Insurance ($2M–$3M Policy)	$110
Personal Umbrella Liability Insurance ($3M)	$50
Employee Share Health Premium (Deducted from Pay)	$571
Total Mandatory Base Lifestyle Cost	$10,276

 

[aneftp]

Sounds about right

But when new (newer board certified ) grads are doing anesthesia locums and taking in at minimum 60k a month. Sometimes up to 150k a month Does 10k a month in expenses matter?

Younger doc I helped along in this journey. Recently turned 33. Kid been hitting 100k consistently a month. I got him in on this lucrative 30k locums weekend gig starting next month also. He may go for 200k a month soon. He’s got way more energy than me.

I’m like damn boy. And he showed me his original 450k student loan. (He made some good investments choices) also sold a house he got in residency for profit.

All student loans paid off in less than 3 years out of residency. Zero balance. So even 450k student loans can be paid off in less than 3 years. And he’s traveling like crazy. Europe 3x last year. Vietnam’s Thailand. Maldives. Australian in the fall. And he’s married. (Prenup of course) spouse made 25k last year.

So kids. Go make that cash. Go live your life.

10k average expenses is nothing. It’s a rounding error.

 

[UscGhost]

Pretty accurate. Housing costs will vary widely depending on location though.

Buying a house is generally less worthwhile than rent plus investing these days

Try to avoid car payments.

But 120k living expenses is fine if you are earning 500k income

 

[ucladoc2b]

If you are a new attending and only paying $3500 month for housing, you have a deal. That bill could easily be $8000 more.

 

[anonperson]

This is what new grads are facing these days. The house was median cost of 500k but at today's 30 year interest rates. The med school loans were around 215k with 10 year payback. Assumes only a married couple. No food/travel/gym/personal expenses added. Am i missing something or is this fairly accurate esp when student loans, car loans, and mortagage all happen to be going on at the same time?


The Updated MCOL Fixed Cost Budget
Integrating the exact employee-share premium alongside your professional expenses, asset protections, and medical school loans establishes the true structural baseline:

Expense Category [1]	Itemized Monthly Cost
Housing (Median MCOL Mortgage PITI)	$3,650
Home Maintenance Allocation (1% annual buffer)	$350
Vehicle Loans (RAV4 Hybrid & Honda CR-V)	$1,155
Auto & Home Insurance Bundle	$170
Utilities (Electric, Gas, Water, Trash)	$395
Communication (Internet, Streaming, TV)	$155
Subdivision Lawn Care & Landscaping	$270
Medical School Student Loans (Standard Repayment)	$2,850
Own-Occupation Specialty Disability Insurance	$550
Term Life Insurance ($2M–$3M Policy)	$110
Personal Umbrella Liability Insurance ($3M)	$50
Employee Share Health Premium (Deducted from Pay)	$571
Total Mandatory Base Lifestyle Cost	$10,276

This budget is pretty reasonable. I don't have student loans but this tracks my monthly budget pretty closely.

Stuff is expensive nowadays. Couple that with the insurance needs physicians have and it adds up quick.

Looking at this further reinforces my plan to try to completely eliminate any school/education debt. That's an extra $20k to $30k/ year they would be able to save.

Unless you have an extremely low interest rate/no interest rate on your car loan, any physician should just pay for the car in full and be done with it

 

[cittykat]

This is what new grads are facing these days. The house was median cost of 500k but at today's 30 year interest rates. The med school loans were around 215k with 10 year payback. Assumes only a married couple. No food/travel/gym/personal expenses added. Am i missing something or is this fairly accurate esp when student loans, car loans, and mortagage all happen to be going on at the same time?


The Updated MCOL Fixed Cost Budget
Integrating the exact employee-share premium alongside your professional expenses, asset protections, and medical school loans establishes the true structural baseline:

Expense Category [1]	Itemized Monthly Cost
Housing (Median MCOL Mortgage PITI)	$3,650
Home Maintenance Allocation (1% annual buffer)	$350
Vehicle Loans (RAV4 Hybrid & Honda CR-V)	$1,155
Auto & Home Insurance Bundle	$170
Utilities (Electric, Gas, Water, Trash)	$395
Communication (Internet, Streaming, TV)	$155
Subdivision Lawn Care & Landscaping	$270
Medical School Student Loans (Standard Repayment)	$2,850
Own-Occupation Specialty Disability Insurance	$550
Term Life Insurance ($2M–$3M Policy)	$110
Personal Umbrella Liability Insurance ($3M)	$50
Employee Share Health Premium (Deducted from Pay)	$571
Total Mandatory Base Lifestyle Cost	$10,276

Trump’s America!! 😂

 

[Lab Lover]

Trump’s America!! 😂

Nah. Boomer gift to the next generation.

 

[aneftp]

Since Obama really loosen the student loan forgiveness rules (it was originally intended for real public service like peace corps, Veterans hospital work) instead of fake non profit 501c paying doctors especially specialists 1 plus million a year.

Many docs (particularly those in lower paying fields) are being employed to get the 501c loan forgiveness so the loans aren’t a big factor

 

[NukHopkins]

Renting is the way to go for the time being at least, probably for the rest of my life. I still plan to buy at some point but I would rather be saving and liquid now than shoveling money into a house.

 

[ucladoc2b]

Since Obama really loosen the student loan forgiveness rules (it was originally intended for real public service like peace corps, Veterans hospital work) instead of fake non profit 501c paying doctors especially specialists 1 plus million a year.

Many docs (particularly those in lower paying fields) are being employed to get the 501c loan forgiveness so the loans aren’t a big factor

PSLF was a GW Bush-signed program. It hasn’t changed.

At one point, student loan reform had bipartisan support.

 

[aneftp]

PSLF was a GW Bush-signed program. It hasn’t changed.

At one point, student loan reform had bipartisan support.

It has changed. The rules are fast and loose under democratic presidents. And Biden basically tried to give free cash away before the courts stopped him on these loans.

 

[aneftp]

Dept. of Ed. restricts PSLF eligibility for physicians in facilities providing gender-affirming care or other federally prohibited activities

The U.S. Department of Education has finalized a rule that will disqualify physicians working in...

www.cmadocs.org

That was last year. And I agree with Trump

These public student loan forgiveness should follow strict guidelines

But people making more than 400% of poverty really shouldn’t be eligible for student loan forgiveness in my opinion. It’s so weird in that the govt has all these laws in place with income restrictions and who’s eligible but make no income restriction on a spine surgeon making 3 million dollars a year for a state institution. And yes some spine docs make that much for the state.

 

[finalpsychyear]

Sounds about right

But when new (newer board certified ) grads are doing anesthesia locums and taking in at minimum 60k a month. Sometimes up to 150k a month Does 10k a month in expenses matter?

Younger doc I helped along in this journey. Recently turned 33. Kid been hitting 100k consistently a month. I got him in on this lucrative 30k locums weekend gig starting next month also. He may go for 200k a month soon. He’s got way more energy than me.

I’m like damn boy. And he showed me his original 450k student loan. (He made some good investments choices) also sold a house he got in residency for profit.

All student loans paid off in less than 3 years out of residency. Zero balance. So even 450k student loans can be paid off in less than 3 years. And he’s traveling like crazy. Europe 3x last year. Vietnam’s Thailand. Maldives. Australian in the fall. And he’s married. (Prenup of course) spouse made 25k last year.

So kids. Go make that cash. Go live your life.

10k average expenses is nothing. It’s a rounding error.

Thats the way to do it. i dont know if everyone is ready to do locums fresh out. I would say the majority still do w-2 obviously for many comfort reasons. the 10k/mo didnt even include travel, vacations, food, gas etc. Also i didnt include kids in that. i lived in aparment first 4 years cost between 1300-1750 this was pre covid. again im in the midwest not low cost area but close to mcol area.

No doctors near me are buying houses less than 850-900k bc thats the lowest price in the neighborhood and its not even the best schools but still very good. you want best schools ur house is 1m min. You guys all have sub 3% housing loans. a 950k house at 2.5% is a 4500 payment vs a 6500 payment at 6.5%. I dont think my budget is that realistic bc 3600 is a fairly tale price for a house even in a mcol area.

My point to all this is that first 5-7 years as an attending usually correlates to a very expensive time in life when school loans, mortagage, car, and child care really all hit at the same time. Sure you can work extra which many do but i do feel for those that making 500k ish are wondering why its so hard to save/invest esp if they have families and solo income. The 10k is likely closer to 15k at least till cars/loans get paid. Its kinda lucky if you can have a 4-5 year delay before u get married/kids and earn attending money but thats easier said then done usually.

 

[MirrorTodd]

Thats the way to do it. i dont know if everyone is ready to do locums fresh out. I would say the majority still do w-2 obviously for many comfort reasons. the 10k/mo didnt even include travel, vacations, food, gas etc. Also i didnt include kids in that. i lived in aparment first 4 years cost between 1300-1750 this was pre covid. again im in the midwest not low cost area but close to mcol area.

No doctors near me are buying houses less than 850-900k bc thats the lowest price in the neighborhood and its not even the best schools but still very good. you want best schools ur house is 1m min. You guys all have sub 3% housing loans. a 950k house at 2.5% is a 4500 payment vs a 6500 payment at 6.5%. I dont think my budget is that realistic bc 3600 is a fairly tale price for a house even in a mcol area.

My point to all this is that first 5-7 years as an attending usually correlates to a very expensive time in life when school loans, mortagage, car, and child care really all hit at the same time. Sure you can work extra which many do but i do feel for those that making 500k ish are wondering why its so hard to save/invest esp if they have families and solo income. The 10k is likely closer to 15k at least till cars/loans get paid. Its kinda lucky if you can have a 4-5 year delay before u get married/kids and earn attending money but thats easier said then done usually.

Effing A...1000% this. Graduated 2021, 2nd kid on the way, moved for a way better job IMO, but housing is expensive (almost a mil for ours), health insurance is like 30% of our mortgage currently with a HDHP, cars, loans, nanny. On top of a wife who thinks I can just spend more time at home sacrificing pay all while our expenses keep rising. The reality of our situation is hitting me hard and I'm 43 now so I can't be shooting off to work 100hr/week locums gigs.

 

[cittykat]

Its kinda lucky if you can have a 4-5 year delay before u get married/kids and earn attending money but thats easier said then done usually.

Then you have to pay for IVF and deal with all the drama that comes with that. I know as many couples with IVF kids as not. Even if you don’t wait you might need IVF. Tradeoffs.

 

[abolt18]

This is what new grads are facing these days. The house was median cost of 500k but at today's 30 year interest rates. The med school loans were around 215k with 10 year payback. Assumes only a married couple. No food/travel/gym/personal expenses added. Am i missing something or is this fairly accurate esp when student loans, car loans, and mortagage all happen to be going on at the same time?


The Updated MCOL Fixed Cost Budget
Integrating the exact employee-share premium alongside your professional expenses, asset protections, and medical school loans establishes the true structural baseline:

Expense Category [1]	Itemized Monthly Cost
Housing (Median MCOL Mortgage PITI)	$3,650
Home Maintenance Allocation (1% annual buffer)	$350
Vehicle Loans (RAV4 Hybrid & Honda CR-V)	$1,155
Auto & Home Insurance Bundle	$170
Utilities (Electric, Gas, Water, Trash)	$395
Communication (Internet, Streaming, TV)	$155
Subdivision Lawn Care & Landscaping	$270
Medical School Student Loans (Standard Repayment)	$2,850
Own-Occupation Specialty Disability Insurance	$550
Term Life Insurance ($2M–$3M Policy)	$110
Personal Umbrella Liability Insurance ($3M)	$50
Employee Share Health Premium (Deducted from Pay)	$571
Total Mandatory Base Lifestyle Cost	$10,276

Feels totally reasonable. However, I could easily drop that spend by $1155/month by buying a couple cheap used cars for cash. Also, mowing your own lawn is easy, economical, and often enjoyable!

 

[coolforschool]

Effing A...1000% this. Graduated 2021, 2nd kid on the way, moved for a way better job IMO, but housing is expensive (almost a mil for ours), health insurance is like 30% of our mortgage currently with a HDHP, cars, loans, nanny. On top of a wife who thinks I can just spend more time at home sacrificing pay all while our expenses keep rising. The reality of our situation is hitting me hard and I'm 43 now so I can't be shooting off to work 100hr/week locums gigs.

A lot to consider, especially if you want to be present at home with the wife and kids, unlike some people on this forum.

I find it laughable that the general advice on here is to “take advantage of the market,” do locums for $450/hr by sleeping in call rooms and refusing nothing less than $400/hr home pager call (from the hotel room) and $500/hr callback rate in podunk Florida.

You’re dumb if you’re a wage slave W-2 employee taking less than 800k/10 weeks PTO in a city with more than two grocery stores.

We’re in a HCOL, big metro area, and our expenses are not small. That being said, we sacrifice some income for home life. Like some have said on this forum, you can have most things but not everything.

 

[finalpsychyear]

Then you have to pay for IVF and deal with all the drama that comes with that. I know as many couples with IVF kids as not. Even if you don’t wait you might need IVF. Tradeoffs.

Isn't ivf 20-25k per cycle? Your right more and more early to mid 30s women are getting it. From a purely financial perspective having kids in mid to late 30s even with ivf is a huge advantage to financial milestones. However, your right tradeoffs like less energy and bouncing back from bad sleep are way more difficult not to mention your pushing late 50s till they are in college.

 

[cittykat]

Isn't ivf 20-25k per cycle? Your right more and more early to mid 30s women are getting it. From a purely financial perspective having kids in mid to late 30s even with ivf is a huge advantage to financial milestones. However, your right tradeoffs like less energy and bouncing back from bad sleep are way more difficult not to mention your pushing late 50s till they are in college.

Also non-financial costs like disruptive medications, procedures, and emotional roller coaster.

 

[eyeeye_captain]

Funnily enough, I used to pay $10k monthly for my practice loan on its own, so consider yourselves lucky.

Even if you didn’t have the student loan component of that budget, depending on where you live, childcare may not be far off from that number even with just one.

$10k is definitely doable, I think we sit around there for what’s listed in that budget. Depending on vacations or house/car problems we still probably stay under $13k, which to us having dirt poor grandparents still sounds insane, even with inflation being what it’s been.

 

[aneftp]

My sister and brother too cheap so they save $50 a month on streaming tv services leeching off me with their budget. No ads hbo, showtime, no ads Disney , no ads peacock, no ads paramount plus espn unlimited now they called me asking for my xfinity password to steam Fox one sports. Ha ha They got tired of trying to steam peacock in Spanish watching the games the first two days (nbc only holds the Spanish speaking rights)

The struggle is real.

So people can cut corners to make ends meet.

 

[james775]

I never really feel bad for young doctors because they constantly choose to make their lives harder. This coming from someone 2 years out of fellowship.

I have tried to get my coresidents to join my group. 250k more a year with 6 more weeks of vacations. Less sick patients and less hours. Can’t get a single one to join because they want to live in a major city. Physicians are one of the only jobs that sacrifice significant amount of money based on location. Most people move to jobs that pay them more.

Enough physicians are happy with their pay that they stay. To then sit and complain about expenses when missing the most fundamental choice is foolish.

 

[aneftp]

I never really feel bad for young doctors because they constantly choose to make their lives harder. This coming from someone 2 years out of fellowship.

I have tried to get my coresidents to join my group. 250k more a year with 6 more weeks of vacations. Less sick patients and less hours. Can’t get a single one to join because they want to live in a major city. Physicians are one of the only jobs that sacrifice significant amount of money based on location. Most people move to jobs that pay them more.

Enough physicians are happy with their pay that they stay. To then sit and complain about expenses when missing the most fundamental choice is foolish.

You can live in a major city like LA and Dallas and make 7 figures in anesthesia and can have it all. And still have 12 plus weeks off.

People don’t want to take calls. That’s the real issue.

I got almost 3 million people in the metro where I live. It’s not “ big “ but I’m doing ok. I call it a mid population area.

So I don’t know what your definition of big city is.

 

[finalpsychyear]

Funnily enough, I used to pay $10k monthly for my practice loan on its own, so consider yourselves lucky.

Even if you didn’t have the student loan component of that budget, depending on where you live, childcare may not be far off from that number even with just one.

$10k is definitely doable, I think we sit around there for what’s listed in that budget. Depending on vacations or house/car problems we still probably stay under $13k, which to us having dirt poor grandparents still sounds insane, even with inflation being what it’s been.

in midwest friends of mine in this stage with kids, nannies, daycare but have those 3% mortaages are pretty much all around the 180-200k/yr mark assuming they dont have loans.

 

[finalpsychyear]

My sister and brother too cheap so they save $50 a month on streaming tv services leeching off me with their budget. No ads hbo, showtime, no ads Disney , no ads peacock, no ads paramount plus espn unlimited now they called me asking for my xfinity password to steam Fox one sports. Ha ha They got tired of trying to steam peacock in Spanish watching the games the first two days (nbc only holds the Spanish speaking rights)

The struggle is real.

So people can cut corners to make ends meet.

I hope this is not your 20m+ sister who refuses to fly anything but coach on long duration flights. If it is then i see people like that with lots of money but the mental wiring is permanently locked in the save at any cost mode. They really miss out on a lot of experiences and leave tons of money for others to enjoy sadly.

 

[UscGhost]

I never really feel bad for young doctors because they constantly choose to make their lives harder. This coming from someone 2 years out of fellowship.

I have tried to get my coresidents to join my group. 250k more a year with 6 more weeks of vacations. Less sick patients and less hours. Can’t get a single one to join because they want to live in a major city. Physicians are one of the only jobs that sacrifice significant amount of money based on location. Most people move to jobs that pay them more.

Enough physicians are happy with their pay that they stay. To then sit and complain about expenses when missing the most fundamental choice is foolish.

Nothing wrong with sacrificing income to live where you want to as long as you handle your other expenses appropriately.

For physicians, and most Americans, the main issue is lack of budget control. Give them more money and they just spend it.

 

[aneftp]

I hope this is not your 20m+ sister who refuses to fly anything but coach on long duration flights. If it is then i see people like that with lots of money but the mental wiring is permanently locked in the save at any cost mode. They really miss out on a lot of experiences and leave tons of money for others to enjoy sadly.

She travels. She enjoys her time off!

She just won’t pay for what she doesn’t think is worth it. She’s 110 pounds and 5 foot 2 ish. She doesn’t take up a lot of space.

But yes. I really don’t know why work at all at this stage.

But it’s similar to 68 yo doc original buyout partner. He’s still feisty and demanding open 1099 shifts fighting with a 37 yo doc who wanted the the open shift first and he demanded it or he wouldn’t cover the other open shifts lol. And dude just sold 8 million in real estate with no mortgage and has 10-12 million in Nvidia stock.

Some people are just wired differently. But he also enjoys his time off golfing and tennis. He’s over in uk next week trying to Wimbledon tickets in the query. Than the British open golf championship. He’s “part time” locums and disclosed to me he made 600k 1099 and didn’t mean to ha ha

Is this work ethic? He does his own cases and takes calls. So he’s not one of those lazy paper pushing anesthesiologist.

 

[cittykat]

She travels. She enjoys her time off!

She just won’t pay for what she doesn’t think is worth it. She’s 110 pounds and 5 foot 2 ish. She doesn’t take up a lot of space.

But yes. I really don’t know why work at all at this stage.

But it’s similar to 68 yo doc original buyout partner. He’s still feisty and demanding open 1099 shifts fighting with a 37 yo doc who wanted the the open shift first and he demanded it or he wouldn’t cover the other open shifts lol. And dude just sold 8 million in real estate with no mortgage and has 10-12 million in Nvidia stock.

Some people are just wired differently. But he also enjoys his time off golfing and tennis. He’s over in uk next week trying to Wimbledon tickets in the query. Than the British open golf championship. He’s “part time” locums and disclosed to me he made 600k 1099 and didn’t mean to ha ha

Is this work ethic? He does his own cases and takes calls. So he’s not one of those lazy paper pushing anesthesiologist.

5 years ago I had an insular glioma resection by a then 70yo neurosurgeon. He is still working and miraculously so am I. If you’re doing something good just keep doing it.

 

[ucladoc2b]

Dept. of Ed. restricts PSLF eligibility for physicians in facilities providing gender-affirming care or other federally prohibited activities

The U.S. Department of Education has finalized a rule that will disqualify physicians working in...

www.cmadocs.org

That was last year. And I agree with Trump

These public student loan forgiveness should follow strict guidelines

But people making more than 400% of poverty really shouldn’t be eligible for student loan forgiveness in my opinion. It’s so weird in that the govt has all these laws in place with income restrictions and who’s eligible but make no income restriction on a spine surgeon making 3 million dollars a year for a state institution. And yes some spine docs make that much for the state.

Won’t survive legal challenges most likely (especially since both aren’t actually illegal).

 

[aneftp]

Won’t survive legal challenges most likely (especially since both aren’t actually illegal).

What I’m saying is sitting presidents and yes that included Biden tweaking the rules on the fly and Biden’s directing the dept of education to forgive student loans was the same thing Trump is doing. Only Trump is doing the opposite

The student loan forgiveness program is subject to interpretation and that’s why many were denied because some non profits weren’t really non profits only classified as 501c but not doing true 501c work. Biden tried to give them free loan forgiveness

And yes I have a big problem with loan forgiveness. And many Americans have problems with loan forgiveness especially rich docs who can afford to pay it off with their salary potential.

The way the original intent of the law was for lowly paid govt workers to stay in govt jobs like teaching and even for the Va at lower salary. Not for barely non profits (and let’s get real here). A big hospital system like advent health in Florida is just as bad as for profit HCA. Advent paying some employed doctors millions and qualifying for student loan forgiveness is a joke.

 

[ucladoc2b]

I

What I’m saying is sitting presidents and yes that included Biden tweaking the rules on the fly and Biden’s directing the dept of education to forgive student loans was the same thing Trump is doing. Only Trump is doing the opposite

The student loan forgiveness program is subject to interpretation and that’s why many were denied because some non profits weren’t really non profits only classified as 501c but not doing true 501c work. Biden tried to give them free loan forgiveness

And yes I have a big problem with loan forgiveness. And many Americans have problems with loan forgiveness especially rich docs who can afford to pay it off with their salary potential.

The way the original intent of the law was for lowly paid govt workers to stay in govt jobs like teaching and even for the Va at lower salary. Not for barely non profits (and let’s get real here). A big hospital system like advent health in Florida is just as bad as for profit HCA. Advent paying some employed doctors millions and qualifying for student loan forgiveness is a joke.

It’s explicitly in the statute with specific exclusions. He can’t pick and choose what true “501c work” is.

If you want to do that, you’ll have to take up a non profit designation with the IRS and likely the courts.

 

[james775]

What I’m saying is sitting presidents and yes that included Biden tweaking the rules on the fly and Biden’s directing the dept of education to forgive student loans was the same thing Trump is doing. Only Trump is doing the opposite

The student loan forgiveness program is subject to interpretation and that’s why many were denied because some non profits weren’t really non profits only classified as 501c but not doing true 501c work. Biden tried to give them free loan forgiveness

And yes I have a big problem with loan forgiveness. And many Americans have problems with loan forgiveness especially rich docs who can afford to pay it off with their salary potential.

The way the original intent of the law was for lowly paid govt workers to stay in govt jobs like teaching and even for the Va at lower salary. Not for barely non profits (and let’s get real here). A big hospital system like advent health in Florida is just as bad as for profit HCA. Advent paying some employed doctors millions and qualifying for student loan forgiveness is a joke.

Not to make this into another political post like we have on this site. Many Americans having a problem with something doesn’t automatically disqualify the spending lol. Many Americans have a problem with the defense spending but that never decreases. In fact they are requesting an extra 234 billion this coming year. Meanwhile pslf costs 10-15 billion per year.

I’d rather see my tax dollars actually going to benefit citizens rather than some arbitrary defense spending which the average citizen isn’t seeing any benefit.

 

[aneftp]

I


It’s explicitly in the statute with specific exclusions. He can’t pick and choose what true “501c work” is.

If you want to do that, you’ll have to take up a non profit designation with the IRS and likely the courts.

“2021–2022 (Overhaul and Waivers): The Department of Education introduced "Limited PSLF Waivers". These historical changes allowed previously non-qualifying payments (like those made on FFEL or Perkins loans) to count and permitted past periods of forbearance/deferment to be credited toward the required 120 payments”

Guess who was president in 2021??

You guess it. Biden.
The laws get tweaked by different presidents

And each president can enact their own interpretation of the law like Trump has. And the dept of education makes the determination which employer qualifies for loan forgiveness.

Biden was like my golden doddle. He lets home robbers go right through and loot my house.

Trump is like my crna friend German Shephard. He makes it harder for loan forgiveness.

The full safest employer is the federal govt for loan forgiveness. All other 501c are subject to interpretation by the dept of education.

https://www.ed.gov/media/document/fact-sheet-restoring-public-service-loan-forgiveness-its-statutory-purpose-october-30-2025-112456.pdf

 

[anonperson]

Effing A...1000% this. Graduated 2021, 2nd kid on the way, moved for a way better job IMO, but housing is expensive (almost a mil for ours), health insurance is like 30% of our mortgage currently with a HDHP, cars, loans, nanny. On top of a wife who thinks I can just spend more time at home sacrificing pay all while our expenses keep rising. The reality of our situation is hitting me hard and I'm 43 now so I can't be shooting off to work 100hr/week locums gigs.

Nanny?

Your wife working too or she stay at home?

 

[ucladoc2b]

“2021–2022 (Overhaul and Waivers): The Department of Education introduced "Limited PSLF Waivers". These historical changes allowed previously non-qualifying payments (like those made on FFEL or Perkins loans) to count and permitted past periods of forbearance/deferment to be credited toward the required 120 payments”

Guess who was president in 2021??

You guess it. Biden.
The laws get tweaked by different presidents

And each president can enact their own interpretation of the law like Trump has. And the dept of education makes the determination which employer qualifies for loan forgiveness.

Biden was like my golden doddle. He lets home robbers go right through and loot my house.

Trump is like my crna friend German Shephard. He makes it harder for loan forgiveness.

The full safest employer is the federal govt for loan forgiveness. All other 501c are subject to interpretation by the dept of education.

https://www.ed.gov/media/document/fact-sheet-restoring-public-service-loan-forgiveness-its-statutory-purpose-october-30-2025-112456.pdf

That’s because they were going to be sued owing to borrower mishandling by contracted federal loan servicers.

As far as qualifying employment, that’s mostly unchanged as it would require revoking an organization’s non-profit status. This hasn’t changed.

 

[finalpsychyear]

Effing A...1000% this. Graduated 2021, 2nd kid on the way, moved for a way better job IMO, but housing is expensive (almost a mil for ours), health insurance is like 30% of our mortgage currently with a HDHP, cars, loans, nanny. On top of a wife who thinks I can just spend more time at home sacrificing pay all while our expenses keep rising. The reality of our situation is hitting me hard and I'm 43 now so I can't be shooting off to work 100hr/week locums gigs.

Not sure when you got that house im guessing higher than 3% ish rock bottom rates. Have a buddy and he is spending somewhere in the 15-20k range monthly or 240k a year primarily because of nanny, mortgage, car/school loans the big 3. At least its temporary but likely the most expensive part of the journey.

 

[amyl]

You can live in a major city like LA and Dallas and make 7 figures in anesthesia and can have it all. And still have 12 plus weeks off.

People don’t want to take calls. That’s the real issue.

I got almost 3 million people in the metro where I live. It’s not “ big “ but I’m doing ok. I call it a mid population area.

So I don’t know what your definition of big city is.

That’s not possible in dallas. Maybe your one friend who’s schmoozed the ortho guys can do it but he’s the only one. A few of my old partners made 7 figures but they killed themselves and took 6-7 weeks of vacation.

 

[coolforschool]

You can live in a major city like LA and Dallas and make 7 figures in anesthesia and can have it all. And still have 12 plus weeks off.

People don’t want to take calls. That’s the real issue.

I got almost 3 million people in the metro where I live. It’s not “ big “ but I’m doing ok. I call it a mid population area.

So I don’t know what your definition of big city is.

That’s not possible in dallas. Maybe your one friend who’s schmoozed the ortho guys can do it but he’s the only one. A few of my old partners made 7 figures but they killed themselves and took 6-7 weeks of vacation.

Lol. I have good friends in most of the popular major cities including DFW. The only ones making seven figures spend their lives in the hospital and use their vacation time to recover (barely) before doing it all over again. They all appear older than stated age, and they wish their monthly expenses were only 10-15k. Happy wife, happy life?

 

[aneftp]

Lol. I have good friends in most of the popular major cities including DFW. The only ones making seven figures spend their lives in the hospital and use their vacation time to recover (barely) before doing it all over again. They all appear older than stated age, and they wish their monthly expenses were only 10-15k. Happy wife, happy life?

Maybe we have same genetics but we look 10 years younger. We are both 52 now. We ain’t working hard bruh. It’s June? I’m on 9 weeks off already for the year. He’s had 7 weeks off already. And the year is barely half over.

The secret to life is to have one spouse. Never get two spouses to keep you younger.

People need to work smarter. Not harder like I keep telling people. I learn this a few years ago from my 2 million dollar a year brothers from another mother.

I always thought they worked hard for their money but they don’t. That’s who I learned from.

The brothers are out hunting in Africa right now on a 70k trip.

 

[coolforschool]

Maybe we have same genetics but we look 10 years younger. We are both 52 now. We ain’t working hard bruh. It’s June? I’m on 9 weeks off already for the year. He’s had 7 weeks off already. And the year is barely half over.

The secret to life is to have one spouse. Never get two spouses to keep you younger.

People need to work smarter. Not harder like I keep telling people. I learn this a few years ago from my 2 million dollar a year brothers from another mother.

I always thought they worked hard for their money but they don’t. That’s who I learned from.

The brothers are out hunting in Africa right now on a 70k trip.

I don’t know about your situation, but a lot of families I know would not be okay with their significant others being away from the home 80% of the time.

A lot of millennial fathers, myself included, want to come home to our wives and kids on most days, not be away from them for 3 weeks at a time (or more). That’s the tradeoff that you’re not addressing. It may not be important for you, but it is to some of us (and our spouses). Fortunately, my wife still likes me, so she’d rather me be at home on most days and make a modest mid-six figures than live out of hotel rooms a thousand miles away making seven figures. Go figure.

I have a lot of friends on the locums circuit making seven figures a year. They’re not any more happy than us lowly six figure folk, other than when they occasionally glance at one more comma on their YTD paystub as they wait for their Uber Eats order to hotel room #1099.

All that is to say to each their own.

 

[sloh]

Then you have to pay for IVF and deal with all the drama that comes with that. I know as many couples with IVF kids as not. Even if you don’t wait you might need IVF. Tradeoffs.

This hustle hard first 4-5 years can work out quite well for men though. Marry younger once you’ve built that nest egg

 

[finalpsychyear]

This hustle hard first 4-5 years can work out quite well for men though. Marry younger once you’ve built that nest egg

This is the cheat code. Also 4d move if u set up a trust or keep it all separated pre marriage. Your spoils can grow and never be split in divorceb just no funding it post marriage.

 

[aneftp]

I don’t know about your situation, but a lot of families I know would not be okay with their significant others being away from the home 80% of the time.

A lot of millennial fathers, myself included, want to come home to our wives and kids on most days, not be away from them for 3 weeks at a time (or more). That’s the tradeoff that you’re not addressing. It may not be important for you, but it is to some of us (and our spouses). Fortunately, my wife still likes me, so she’d rather me be at home on most days and make a modest mid-six figures than live out of hotel rooms a thousand miles away making seven figures. Go figure.

I have a lot of friends on the locums circuit making seven figures a year. They’re not any more happy than us lowly six figure folk, other than when they occasionally glance at one more comma on their YTD paystub as they wait for their Uber Eats order to hotel room #1099.

All that is to say to each their own.

We are home. No one said about traveling and doing 1099 work. My locums assignments are 7 miles/28 miles, 39 miles and 49 miles miles away from me

I would hardly call it travel lol. So the furthest I’m away is 50 minutes currently.

My buddy Dallas area primary locums gig is 18 min from his house

And I agree I don’t think it’s worth it to me to travel to Virginia/missouri for $500/hr.

I’m ok making primarily $375–425/hr and sleeping in my own bed on call at night. And having dinner with my family.

The last time I flew out of town for a 1099 locums assignment was before the stock market crash of 2008. My furthest locums assignment has been 2 hr away since the kids born.

 

[Burned_Out]

You may be overinsuring yourself on that budget. Why get umbrella insurance when you don’t have much in assets for creditors to claim. You can drop comprehensive car insurance if you buy a used car where the replacement value cost is less than the cost of this insurance. Term life insurance doesn’t make sense if you don’t have kids. You have to look at your home insurance to see if it’s reasonable.

When I started out, I just bought disability, liability only car and health insurance.

 

[cittykat]

You may be overinsuring yourself on that budget. Why get umbrella insurance when you don’t have much in assets for creditors to claim. You can drop comprehensive car insurance if you buy a used car where the replacement value cost is less than the cost of this insurance. Term life insurance doesn’t make sense if you don’t have kids. You have to look at your home insurance to see if it’s reasonable.

When I started out, I just bought disability, liability only car and health insurance.

Even if you have minimal current assets, umbrella helps protect your future earnings.

 

[aneftp]

You may be overinsuring yourself on that budget. Why get umbrella insurance when you don’t have much in assets for creditors to claim. You can drop comprehensive car insurance if you buy a used car where the replacement value cost is less than the cost of this insurance. Term life insurance doesn’t make sense if you don’t have kids. You have to look at your home insurance to see if it’s reasonable.

When I started out, I just bought disability, liability only car and health insurance.

You need umbrella cause they can hit u with oj Simpson 33 million civil lawsuit even declaring bankruptcy won’t couldn’t help him. Now he kept his sociial security and 401k and nfl pension. But he couldn’t keep his other assets. And couldn’t declared bk to discharge his civil judgment

Cause some states like Florida allow for deficiency judgment to be renewed forever

it gets complicated especially with your earning potential.

 

[Burned_Out]

I was told starting out that umbrella insurance just makes the plaintiffs greedier and seek more $ in court. It may not protect your assets at all if they just ask for more. Just like most malpractice awards awarded are to the limits of your policy.

The insurance may help offset the cost of an attorney.

I had an umbrella policy through GEICO but cancelled it because they kept jacking the rates even with no claims made. Also realized they had so many exclusions to the policy it was almost pointless to buy it. For example, they told me I had to exhaust my home, auto, malpractice coverages before I could use the umbrella protections.

 

[aneftp]

I was told starting out that umbrella insurance just makes the plaintiffs greedier and seek more $ in court. It may not protect your assets at all if they just ask for more. Just like most malpractice awards awarded are to the limits of your policy.

The insurance may help offset the cost of an attorney.

I had an umbrella policy through GEICO but cancelled it because they kept jacking the rates even with no claims made. Also realized they had so many exclusions to the policy it was almost pointless to buy it. For example, they told me I had to exhaust my home, auto, malpractice coverages before I could use the umbrella protections.

If u have a kid driving. U better have something.

 

[Burned_Out]

If u have a kid driving. U better have something.

I will have them setup their own LLC which owns the vehicle,

 

[aneftp]

I will have them setup their own LLC which owns the vehicle,

Doesn’t work that way. Tort liability

I also consulted attorney.

There is a marital loophole to divorce the lower earning spouse and put the kid under the ex spouse name and the car under the ex spouse name.

That works for college financial aide also