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sb247 said:
if you are genuinely curious about some of us, voluntarily abstained until marriage


Sexual habits change risks and treatment indicators. I don’t judge your quality as a human based sex life but I 100% might see my treatment recommendations change based on sex life. You might be emotionally conflating those two very different situations

As a newer doctor, I will state my understanding of my role has been impacted by the knowledge/experience it took to be a doctor. You will likely experience the same if you are willing to process other views
i think it’s fair to point out that we can be wrong at any point in training and being a med student doesn’t automatically make us wrong

It does, however coincidentally, happen to be right now that the one primarily arguing sex life (or other decision making/habits) doesn’t impact treatment is wrong.....and they happen to be a med student. They are wrong because they are wrong. Being only a med student might contribute to why they don’t know enough to not be wrong however

But you are right that appeal to authority is probably the wrong approach
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Do you do the same with gun ownership?
 
sb247 said:
Sexual habits change risks and treatment indicators. I don’t judge your quality as a human based sex life but I 100% might see my treatment recommendations change based on sex life. You might be emotionally conflating those two very different situations
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Nowhere did I advocate for not asking about sexual habits in an interview. I completely agree that it is clinically relevant information. The problem I had was with judging patients based on how they respond to your questions when you take a sexual history. I did not conflate the two, but thanks for the patronizing response nonetheless.
 
OrthoTraumaMD said:
That was exactly my point as to why I called them out on their inexperience.


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You may consider me inexperienced. However, I wrote the entire curriculum at my medical school on taking a sexual history. I go to a top 50 medical school and I was more qualified to write the curriculum than any of the faculty were despite being "only a med student".

This is not an issue of experience. It's an issue of prejudice. And having an M.D. after your name doesn't excuse you from being called out on yours.
 
as someone who uses grindr and scruff, pretty sure my torso pics get the job done just fine, don't really need a white coat to get a date or get laid.

atomi said:
Pretty stupid for highly educated medical professionals to be using hookup apps in the first place. You are purposely seeking an encounter with people who have a long history of causual sex encounters with strangers.

Pretty surefire way to get genital herpes by focusing on the 25% segment of the population that has it.

Also seems to run a higher risk of hooking up with a psycho. Heard too many stories about hookup apps resulting in psycho stalkers.

As a med student you’re a quality individual. Do yourself a favor and find a high quality partner who doesn’t sleep around, vet him/her through traditional dating, and get STI tested before you have sex. Despite what you see on tv and social media, it’s what most of us do. But we’re boring and that doesn’t generate stories.
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I'll +1 this for being STUPIDDDDDDDD. Sex shaming. I hope not everybody else is drinking that Hetero-normative conservative traditional monogamous koolaid.
 
OrthoTraumaMD said:
Agree completely. The whole “women are shallow and only go for looks” is a very limited POV, unfortunately shared by many men, mostly in the MRA arena. Looks are certainly important but by far not the main thing— and anyhow, a “6” can go to an “8” with good grooming, clothes, demeanor etc. If you have a crappy personality however, nothing will help you.


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Women are much less shallow than men about looks. They can be very shallow about certain things (sorry short guys), but confidence and personality can make up for most things.

(As long as you are not broke.)
 
Austinj said:
Nowhere did I advocate for not asking about sexual habits in an interview. I completely agree that it is clinically relevant information. The problem I had was with judging patients based on how they respond to your questions when you take a sexual history. I did not conflate the two, but thanks for the patronizing response nonetheless.
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You’re welcome. I’ll point out that your posting doesn’t really relay the nuance that you think it does, but you can do with that what you want
 
Austinj said:
You may consider me inexperienced. However, I wrote the entire curriculum at my medical school on taking a sexual history. I go to a top 50 medical school and I was more qualified to write the curriculum than any of the faculty were despite being "only a med student".

This is not an issue of experience. It's an issue of prejudice. And having an M.D. after your name doesn't excuse you from being called out on yours.
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It is unlikely that both of those statements are true. A great school should have someone more qualified than students to write curriculum
 
Austinj said:
You may consider me inexperienced. However, I wrote the entire curriculum at my medical school on taking a sexual history. I go to a top 50 medical school and I was more qualified to write the curriculum than any of the faculty were despite being "only a med student".

This is not an issue of experience. It's an issue of prejudice. And having an M.D. after your name doesn't excuse you from being called out on yours.
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Is top 50 something we’re bragging about now?
Cool.
 
OrthoTraumaMD said:
Hahahahahaha. Because writing a curriculum on sexual history (you keep mentioning this like you deserve a medal for it or something, lol) makes you suddenly qualified to comment on judgment of patients or calling someone prejudiced. The main cornerstone of your argument is completely irrelevant to the discussion, which is that a med student should not be arguing with an attending about how and when to judge patients. You’re probably the type of idiot who calls people “literally Hitler” and “Nazi” left and right because they don’t agree with you. Oh my goodness. The fact that you consider yourself more qualified than ANY faculty member for ANYTHING tells me all I need to know about your arrogance and entitlement. Just wow. I’m glad I unblocked you long enough to read this, now I don’t feel bad about making my judgment of you at all. The only thing worse than ignorance is arrogant ignorance.
And by the way, I don’t even know what grinder is or how it differs from tinder or fish for hoes, I don’t go on those sites and never will.
I find it amusing how you’re so anti-hierarchy but bragging about how you go to a top 50 med school. Well if you’re gonna go that route you’re about 45 behind me, so take a seat honey.


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Damn.

Just in case you were curious, Grindr is Tinder for gay men.
 
W19 said:
I guess you might be correct since this profession attracts a bunch of weirdos, but my experience has been different so far. I have had 2 female nurses that have said to my co-residents they would not mind to go out with me. And another one that gave me her friend phone # who is still waiting for my call. The daughter of one of my patients gave me her phone # without asking her. Of course, these people are not Jessica Alba, but they aren't bad looking either. Did not get these offers when I was a med student...
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So you're getting interest from people in your own league, why's that really a surprise? You don't get those offers as a med student cause you're in a positive where you're actually viewed in an unattractive way given how low your status is.
atomi said:
You've got some points, but I'm sorry, no, it's not that much about looks in real life, where women are far less shallow about looks when choosing a partner. On Tinder moreso for sure, as it is really that most attractive men that are driving everything based on published data. The bottom 80% of men are competing for the bottom 20% of women, whereas the top 80% of women are competing for the top 20% of men, or something like that. There is no shortage of short, average looking, non-white guys on the internet (ahem, reddit) complaining that a minority of tall white men are stealing all of the available women (that they believe they are entitled to) for dates and hookups.

I am a tall, facially attractive, physically fit, white, baby blue eyed, well dressed, well traveled, reasonably wealthy male with an MD behind my name. And you know what, I can count on one hand the number of times in my entire life that a random woman has approached me to hit on me and try and take me home (ok maybe two hands if you want to count less obvious flirting). I'm quiet and introverted, very private, never talk about myself, not that confident in new social settings, suck at small talk, and I've failed many times even with far less attractive women (oddly enough I seemed to fail the most with women less attractive than me when I was younger). Sometimes they would be interested at first, then I wouldn't say the right thing and scare them away. Meanwhile I watched my friends who were short and less attractive (even outright fat), poor, but very confident and naturally charismatic consistently get enormous amounts of female attention. Once I started to develop more self-confidence, I watched things change dramatically for me. I think a lot of young guys have this noxious idea (which permeates the nether reaches of reddit and which your comments are reminding me of) that all women are these shallow creatures and that if only they were tall and white with a square chin and a trust fund that suddenly women everywhere would be swooning over them. And it's absolute total BS. If you are talking about hooking up with strangers at a bar, then yes, women will choose the most attractive, confident, and successful appearing male for a one night stand and ignore everything else because the meat market is just a subconscious insecure affirmation of one's value. But this is a small minority of women that are doing this sort of thing and is basically the same as hookup apps. For finding a longterm partner in real life, it's much less about attractiveness and more about other qualities. I wouldn't lose any sleep over the fact that the hot girl on Tinder swiped right on a different guy or the hot girl at the bar went home with a more attractive guy. You don't want that girl, trust me. I had one of those girls, and she almost ruined my life.

If you are a woman using Tinder looking for anything other than a one night stand, you're an idiot because the only guys you are going to swipe right on are most likely swiping right on most girls on the site and having very frequent one night stands. Herpes and a broken heart/soul, here you come. Hopefully not a baby from a man that will never talk to you again. If you are an attractive man using Tinder looking for a relationship, you likely will get somebody who has been taken through the ringer so to speak by the pick up artists on the app and get to enjoy all the baggage that comes with that. So yes, you are right that facial attractiveness matters the most, but you're kidding yourself if you think this is all that matters. Even being attractive you still probably won't do well and adding other superficial things to broadcast your status will help because the reality is that it's an empty superficial platform that people use to reaffirm their own value (this hot unemployed plumber wants to hook up with me huh, oh wait this hot rich doctor wants to hook up with me also...)

Bottom line, Tinder and other hookup apps suck and are a new low for our society. Like all other social media disasters of the current age, they make us feel horrible about ourselves, isolate us, celebrate superficial image, create vapid and meaningless fake relationships foregoing real relationships, and oh of course they totally mine every little last bit of your personal data as possible to sell to the highest bidder and use it to invade your life, steal your money, and control/influence what you buy and who you vote for.

On one hand, I miss being young due to the excitement and novelty of it all. On the other, I couldn't imagine having to be a part of the hell that modern dating has become. Again, glad I am out of the scene now and hope I never have to go back.
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Uh okay. I never said it's all that matters. I said that it's the most important factor.
atomi said:
I'll also add that you are outright wrong about this. Male residents and young attendings have extremely high value in the hospital. There is no shortage of single mother nurses, many extremely attractive that would absolutely kill to marry a physician. Going back to my story above about counting outright advances on one hand, one of those fingers counts a time that an attractive nurse grabbed my crotch and made it clear what she wanted me to do to her in no uncertain terms. However, I think that was mostly due to my status as a physician, not my appearance. I have heard many other stories like this. Have a friend who was a new attending covering the floors. Fat, not very attractive. Married and everyone knew it. Very young attractive nurse got his phone number and would not stop sending him nude photos. Watched another average resident make out and go home with not one, but two attractive therapists from a work event.

I am sorry that you are placing such a high value on facial attractiveness. While nurses going after doctors for money/status is also pretty superficial, my point is that your claim that you need to be "top 20% attractiveness in real life to do well" is completely false. It's the whole package, and if you want a good partner, then just focus on being the best you can be with all that God gave you and don't let that stuff out of your control drag you down, because nothing's more unattractive than that self-pity.
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And I've seen those same nurses cheat on the physician spouse with a blue collar guy who's very hot. If you're dating at your own level of looks, you have nothing to worry about. If you're shoot above, it's veryy likely there's something up with her.
I've had well over 10,000 tinder matches up until I stopped using it and have been with women both casual & serious since I was a young teen. Clubs, bars, events, sports, school, dozens of cities.. you name it. I'm not just repeating reddit nonsense.

Your approach is once you score, it's game over. But if your goal looks like a fluke, it probably was.
OrthoTraumaMD said:
Agree completely. The whole “women are shallow and only go for looks” is a very limited POV, unfortunately shared by many men, mostly in the MRA arena. Looks are certainly important but by far not the main thing— and anyhow, a “6” can go to an “8” with good grooming, clothes, demeanor etc. If you have a crappy personality however, nothing will help you.


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A 6 is someone who is above average. An 8 is approaching model tier. Also, most guys aren't 6s to begin with.
VA Hopeful Dr said:
Yeah I've never understood this mindset. Every girl I ever dated (including my wife) says that they started liking me because of something I did (self-effacing humor being the most common) more than anything I was.
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Try asking girls you aren't dating if they care about looks the most. Pretty much 10/10 times the answer is a strong yes. If you ask them what they look for, you won't get the same answer because they're being politically correct and bypassing their looks requirement.
 
MedicineZ0Z said:
So you're getting interest from people in your own league, why's that really a surprise? You don't get those offers as a med student cause you're in a positive where you're actually viewed in an unattractive way given how low your status is.
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We weren't talking about model-type females here since there aren't that many out there. My point was if you are an average looking physician or resident, you will find plenty average looking females at the hospital who would not mind dating you. You don't need to go on these dating websites to get some action. Then again, I don't think it's a good idea for someone to date co-workers
 
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Glad I’m married lol

Def didn’t find my gem on Grindr lmao
 
W19 said:
We weren't talking about model-type females here since there aren't that many out there. My point was if you are an average looking physician or resident, you will find plenty average looking females at the hospital who would not mind dating you. You don't need to go on these dating websites to get some action. Then again, I don't think it's not a good idea for someone to date co-workers
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Yep very true.

I'm mostly talking about the (very widely believed) premed/early med student fantasy that MD = instantly dating models.
 
OrthoTraumaMD said:
OK, I will revise my statement to say that somebody can jump at least two, if not more, of these so-called “points” with grooming, demeanor, exercise/weight loss, the right attire, etc. My husband is a perfect example. He was “frumpy” when I met him—for lord’s sake, he had a combover at 24. Once I put him in Gucci and Boss, had him get a different haircut, etc, girls are all over him when he travels. He himself tells me that’s never happened before. Fortunately he kept the thing that attracted me to him—a sweet and loyal personality. But now he brags to me about how he’s “hot” lol. So it is possible from someone to move up in “points” significantly.
And it doesn’t stop there. In my culture, women who don’t do what I did above, as in “better” their man, are looked down upon as bad wives/girlfriends. If a dude is wearing ill-fitting clothes, or not properly groomed, it means he doesn’t have a woman who cares about him. On the other hand, if a dude looks sharp, it is assumed that a woman has had a hand in “improving” him.


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Well if you're somewhat attractive to begin with, you'll be more attractive once you dress/groom better. If you're not attractive at all to begin with, you won't be attractive despite the grooming. Either way, no amount of that stuff makes someone model tier unless their starting point is being a slob.
 
W19 said:
I guess you might be correct since this profession attracts a bunch of weirdos, but my experience has been different so far. I have had 2 female nurses that have said to my co-residents they would not mind to go out with me. And another one that gave me her friend phone # who is still waiting for my call. The daughter of one of my patients gave me her phone # without asking her. Of course, these people are not Jessica Alba, but they aren't bad looking either. Did not get these offers when I was a med student...
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aging yourself with that jessica alba reference. haha
 
puahate said:
I dont care. I need all the help I can get. White coat pic on Tinder is a must for me.
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White coats are for NPs and pharmacists.

Real men wear lead.

Dalu44HXUAA2RPG.jpg
 
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OrthoTraumaMD said:
OK, I will revise my statement to say that somebody can jump at least two, if not more, of these so-called “points” with grooming, demeanor, exercise/weight loss, the right attire, etc. My husband is a perfect example. He was “frumpy” when I met him—for lord’s sake, he had a combover at 24. Once I put him in Gucci and Boss, had him get a different haircut, etc, girls are all over him when he travels. He himself tells me that’s never happened before. Fortunately he kept the thing that attracted me to him—a sweet and loyal personality. But now he brags to me about how he’s “hot” lol. So it is possible from someone to move up in “points” significantly.
And it doesn’t stop there. In my culture, women who don’t do what I did above, as in “better” their man, are looked down upon as bad wives/girlfriends. If a dude is wearing ill-fitting clothes, or not properly groomed, it means he doesn’t have a woman who cares about him. On the other hand, if a dude looks sharp, it is assumed that a woman has had a hand in “improving” him.


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So is it okay for a man to “improve” the woman?😉
 
OrthoTraumaMD said:
Sure, if she needs it. Our loved ones are supposed to make us better people, I sincerely believe that. I’m just saying that in my culture it’s an actual thing specific to women. (But to an extent, men “improve” the woman by increasing her wealth...gifting her pretty jewelry and clothes, vacations etc.)


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Pretty sure if a man bought his wife a treadmill he would be sleeping on it
 
atomi said:
Pretty stupid for highly educated medical professionals to be using hookup apps in the first place. You are purposely seeking an encounter with people who have a long history of causual sex encounters with strangers.

Pretty surefire way to get genital herpes by focusing on the 25% segment of the population that has it.

Also seems to run a higher risk of hooking up with a psycho. Heard too many stories about hookup apps resulting in psycho stalkers.

As a med student you’re a quality individual. Do yourself a favor and find a high quality partner who doesn’t sleep around, vet him/her through traditional dating, and get STI tested before you have sex. Despite what you see on tv and social media, it’s what most of us do. But we’re boring and that doesn’t generate stories.
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Not really. We aren’t that special of a group to be honest. There are lots of current docs who are on tinder and have 15-20 peeps to smash a month
 
puahate said:
I feel like most women just have to get dolled up and go out and they might find a nice guy.
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Not a "nice guy" and not for more than a night. A plain woman is not valued in our society. Men don't care if she is smart, makes a lot of money, has a great career. Read SDN, you will see plenty of stories.
 
OrthoTraumaMD said:
For a brief time maybe...but not long term. Takes a lot more than that. Know from long experience and many single friends.


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Yes with women the money and status probably won't help. If you are ugly and a male it can do something (I suppose, this is all conjecture). For women I can't imagine it works the same way.
 
raiderette said:
Not a "nice guy" and not for more than a night. A plain woman is not valued in our society. Men don't care if she is smart, makes a lot of money, has a great career. Read SDN, you will see plenty of stories.
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I will agree with you, but I think what is misunderstood is the fact that men arent always attracted by those things. I think most men are neutral if a woman is really smart, wealthy, or has a great career. I find that most guys just want a woman that is supportive and acceptancing of him, everything else is just the cherry on top.
 
mrbreakfast said:
In my experience, people typically go with their residency interview headshots as one of their pics.

Everyone I've ever seen try to leverage being a medical student in the dating scene failed hard. Men apparently come across as arrogant, women apparently as intimidating.
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Your friends probably have more issues than using a headshot on a dating app. With the success rate I’ve had, you’d be crazy to not use it. It works, actually works quite well
 
puahate said:
I will agree with you, but I think what is misunderstood is the fact that men arent always attracted by those things. I think most men are neutral if a woman is really smart, wealthy, or has a great career. I find that most guys just want a woman that is supportive and acceptancing of him, everything else is just the cherry on top.
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So not seeing the qualities of the person, just focusing on what the woman can do for the man. Neutral to skills, confidence, achievement. Well ugly and plain don't make men feel better about themselves.
 
raiderette said:
So not seeing the qualities of the person, just focusing on what the woman can do for the man. Neutral to skills, confidence, achievement. Well ugly and plain don't make men feel better about themselves.
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I feel like you are not seeing it from the guys perspective though. I think women that are hardworking are great. At the same time I am not married to the idea that a woman MUST be in a high status job. Most guys are fine with a woman who is in an average job and doing well.

Obviously personality is something that is individual. You might mesh well with certain personalities compared to others.

In general though a lot of men are raised and taught to be self-sufficient and stoic. In general just having a partner that is receptive and accepting of them is a big plus.

Mind you there are still a lot of men that are into power women. I'm sure you see lots of doctor couples.
 
Katniss Everdeen said:
Hi Everybody!

I've been using SDN since my pre-med days, but this is my first time posting. I was wondering what people though about using a pic from your white-coat ceremony or just any pic of you in your white coat to get strictly casual dates on dating apps (tinder, grinder, HUD, bumble...etc.). Is it unprofessional? Will my school care? Has anybody done it before and does it work???

If there are already existing threads about this, please let me know!

Thank You!
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I always got the vibe that Grindr was for casual and tinder was for serious (But I guess for straights, tinder is their grindr)
 
KnuxNole said:
Not really. We aren’t that special of a group to be honest. There are lots of current docs who are on tinder and have 15-20 peeps to smash a month
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Don't you think you are exaggerating a bit ?
 
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