2012 APPIC Internship Application Thread

[futurepsydoc]

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These are two separate issues.

I think it would be a good thing if psychologists were only able to come from APA-acred. and APA-acred. internship because this would represent the minimum standard of training that was originally set for the field. Would this limit access to care...maybe, but probably not. I'd argue that mid-level providers are already encroaching into many areas of traditional practice for psychologists, so limiting psychologists would in effect accept the encroachment, but also allow for the focus on select areas in which to strongly protect.

As for the VA...as it stands, only APA-acred. programs & internship site folks can apply now, so there would be no difference. There is no shortage of applicants for spots, as many get a plethora of spots. There are admittedly some rural/less desirable positions that may go unfilled, but that would still be the case if there were more psychologists. This happens with psychiatry, nursing, and related health fields too.

Agreed +1

 

[4410]

These are two separate issues.

I think it would be a good thing if psychologists were only able to come from APA-acred. and APA-acred. internship because this would represent the minimum standard of training that was originally set for the field. Would this limit access to care...maybe, but probably not. I'd argue that mid-level providers are already encroaching into many areas of traditional practice for psychologists, so limiting psychologists would in effect accept the encroachment, but also allow for the focus on select areas in which to strongly protect.

As for the VA...as it stands, only APA-acred. programs & internship site folks can apply now, so there would be no difference. There is no shortage of applicants for spots, as many get a plethora of spots. There are admittedly some rural/less desirable positions that may go unfilled, but that would still be the case if there were more psychologists. This happens with psychiatry, nursing, and related health fields too.

State licensure is a seperate issue than APA accreditation as many State's do not require applicants to attend an APA accredited program. The program I am in is in the process of applying for the self and site visit for APA accreditation, but normally a program has to be in existence for four or five years before they apply for APA accreditation. This is not only for professional schools but also University based schools. There has to be a complete class who has gone through the program and matriculated through the program with graduation before a program my apply for the self and site APA study.

The VA system is a micro system of the whole society at large and may not represent the best training for students wanting a different focus than working with military soldiers, families, and veterans. Although I've heard of students completing a VA internship with an adult focus but then transitioning to a child/adolescent post doctoral emphasis during post doctoral training. I know some students actually enter active military as part of their internship with the VA but this is not altogether common for many who complete VA internships. It would seem that there would be some sort of alliegence or requirement to serve in the military if you are going to complete a VA internship rather than do a one year internship with the VA and then complete post doctoral internship in a mental health or private practice setting.

In a prior comment you mentioned some need for a Flexner report for clinical psychology. It is my understanding that psychiatrist in the USA are largely trained in foreign medical schools that may only have academic course work for two years or less but emphasizes clerkships, internships, and residency training that may take up to six to eight years to complete for those who make it through the first two years. Medical Students are weeded out quickly in those first two years if they can't pass certain courses or meet the requirements. Does psychology need to follow a similar model where each initial class of students is cut in half after the second year and only the highest performers are allowed to advance to the clerkships, internships, and residency training? I believe the training for MD is much different now than what Flexner indicated in his report many years ago, especially since many US MD's are foreign trained doctors.

 

[psychtime101]

One thing that makes me concerned in your post is a need for "non-APA programs" to fill the gaps for students with lower GPA, GRE, research experience etc. I agree for some people standardized tests are hard, or something happened in their undergraduate studies which resulted in lower scores, but i dont think that there is a need for these programs to fill the gaps. I have read many message boards on this sites with how to improve your chances of acceptance, etc. There is already some discrepancy in requirements in APA accredited programs, but APA is the minimum requirements and is necessary. I believe that as a field we should be putting out well trained and qualified researchers/clinicians and that starts with APA. Having worked with students with learning disabilities for many years, I know it is disheartening when the realization occurs that perhaps that dreaming of going into med school or some other field just isnt realistic with their abilities and skill set. I think the same should be true for psychology and doctoral training should be limited to really the best as unfortunate as that is. This field is not easy, and its not for everyone.
I am also unclear as to why you suggest that non accred. programs put out students who serve groups not covered by licensed, APA trained psychologists?
I am also a child/adolescent person and am not interested in the VA (though certainly appreciate those who are). I am from an APA program and had no difficulty finding enough child/adolescent sites to serve my research and clinical interest. I applied to internship this year and I can certainly understand how frustrating this process is, but I dont think having non accredited programs is the way to go.

 

[Quynh2007]

In a prior comment you mentioned some need for a Flexner report for clinical psychology. It is my understanding that psychiatrist in the USA are largely trained in foreign medical schools that may only have academic course work for two years or less but emphasizes clerkships, internships, and residency training that may take up to six to eight years to complete for those who make it through the first two years. Medical Students are weeded out quickly in those first two years if they can't pass certain courses or meet the requirements.

Your view on this is particularly uninformed. AAMC in 2007 did a long term study on this and found that the drop out rate due to academic reasons was lower than 4%.

 

[erg923]

State licensure is a seperate issue than APA accreditation as many State's do not require applicants to attend an APA accredited program. The program I am in is in the process of applying for the self and site visit for APA accreditation, but normally a program has to be in existence for four or five years before they apply for APA accreditation. This is not only for professional schools but also University based schools. There has to be a complete class who has gone through the program and matriculated through the program with graduation before a program my apply for the self and site APA study.

The VA system is a micro system of the whole society at large and may not represent the best training for students wanting a different focus than working with military soldiers, families, and veterans. Although I've heard of students completing a VA internship with an adult focus but then transitioning to a child/adolescent post doctoral emphasis during post doctoral training. I know some students actually enter active military as part of their internship with the VA but this is not altogether common for many who complete VA internships. It would seem that there would be some sort of alliegence or requirement to serve in the military if you are going to complete a VA internship rather than do a one year internship with the VA and then complete post doctoral internship in a mental health or private practice setting.

In a prior comment you mentioned some need for a Flexner report for clinical psychology. It is my understanding that psychiatrist in the USA are largely trained in foreign medical schools that may only have academic course work for two years or less but emphasizes clerkships, internships, and residency training that may take up to six to eight years to complete for those who make it through the first two years. Medical Students are weeded out quickly in those first two years if they can't pass certain courses or meet the requirements. Does psychology need to follow a similar model where each initial class of students is cut in half after the second year and only the highest performers are allowed to advance to the clerkships, internships, and residency training? I believe the training for MD is much different now than what Flexner indicated in his report many years ago, especially since many US MD's are foreign trained doctors.

I think you might wanna stop while your ahead here. You made your point, but the above is filled with so many errors and misconceptions I don't even know where to start. But let me quickly correct (for others in this process) that 1. VA training at the internship level focuses on the mental health of that population. Everything you see in a civilian settings will also be seen in veterans. Its only a limiting setting if you want to work with children...and maybe eating disorders. 2.) The VA is a civilian arm of US government and VA employees are civilian federal employees. They have no requirement to serve in the armed forces and being employed in the VA (or a VA internship) is NOT a door into entering military service. The US armed forces offers its own internship programs. VAs are not a part of it.

 

[ClinApp]

So, would anyone like to go back to talking about the painful waiting game and getting support from the rest of us on here suffering through the next 2 weeks of uncertainty about our futures? I have found myself doing a lot of second-guessing about my ranking choices this week. Naturally, I realize the die has been cast, but you can't always control emotional reactions with rational information. So, to try to stop myself from regretting my final list, I made a short list for each site of what the best features were if I matched there that I hope to refer to when I get my result. I didn't really have much helpful to write about not matching except to lay out my various options - Phase II, deciding whether to reapply, or simply finishing my dissertation and graduate with a non-clinical PhD.

Anyone else feeling some doubts about your rankings (not that it does us any good at this stage, of course) and found any helpful ways to deal with those feelings of potential regret as well as tolerating the not knowing for approximately 11.5 more days? Hope you all are holding it together!

 

[ndcm]

You are seriously confusing me. I understand your frustration with the internship process (I would guess several of us on this board have encountered a similar feeling at some point). However, I just don't understand what your frustration is with the VA? Especially if you mentioned this population is not even your focus? Finally, an accreditation system is important if we want to ensure we provide quality care.

Okay... I said my piece... is it February 24th yet?!! 🙂

 

[RoseRed2]

So, would anyone like to go back to talking about the painful waiting game and getting support from the rest of us on here suffering through the next 2 weeks of uncertainty about our futures? I have found myself doing a lot of second-guessing about my ranking choices this week. Naturally, I realize the die has been cast, but you can't always control emotional reactions with rational information. So, to try to stop myself from regretting my final list, I made a short list for each site of what the best features were if I matched there that I hope to refer to when I get my result. I didn't really have much helpful to write about not matching except to lay out my various options - Phase II, deciding whether to reapply, or simply finishing my dissertation and graduate with a non-clinical PhD.

Anyone else feeling some doubts about your rankings (not that it does us any good at this stage, of course) and found any helpful ways to deal with those feelings of potential regret as well as tolerating the not knowing for approximately 11.5 more days? Hope you all are holding it together!

I have had moments of thinking how I might have changed my rank list... but it hasn't been too bad. I have actually been really busy at work, so I have been trying to focus on that. It has been better for me not to think about it.

I have talked with my SO about how we are going to handle that morning and I decided I want to read the email. I have also caught up on some shows I haven't watched in six months, didn't even realize I was so many episodes behind! These few weeks for me are about self-care, and a lot of relaxing and not feeling bad at all about it! I have also seen more of my friends and family in the last few weeks than I have in the last six months, so that has been great as well.

And I really like your idea about listing some of the pros of each site. I would be happy with any of my sites, so I think I might try that as well if I find my mind worrying about things over these next 11 days!!

 

[ndcm]

Does anyone know how sites search for our Match # in the NMS database? The way my name appears on the NMS site is slightly different than my APPIC application (I could not fit my whole middle name in the NMS site, so it is only part of it). Do you think they would search by last name? My # is on my application, but just in case they search for it in other ways.

 

[psychRA]

I'm really not sure how to handle things on the morning of Match Day. Anyone up for sharing their plans?

1. Are you planning to be at your computer and ready to get the email the minute it arrives? I'm remembering how miserable it was to refresh my inbox every minutes while waiting to hear about interviews. Once I'm awake, I think ignoring my email is going to be difficult, so I'm thinking of trying to sleep late enough that morning (benadryl if necessary!) that the email definitely will have arrived by the time I get up.

2. Will you open the email yourself, or have someone read it for you?

3. Have you made other plans for that day? I'm lucky in that I was able to clear my schedule. My cohort has toyed with the idea of getting together, either to open our emails together or just to hang out after we've gotten the news. My husband has offered to stick around for part of the day.

The second two questions are hard for me because, while I'd be thrilled with any of my potential sites, I can't be sure that I'm going to match. If I could magically know that I would be matching somewhere, I would love to read the email w/ my husband, or spend the day celebrating with my friends.

 

[ClinApp]

I'm really not sure how to handle things on the morning of Match Day. Anyone up for sharing their plans?

1. Are you planning to be at your computer and ready to get the email the minute it arrives? I'm remembering how miserable it was to refresh my inbox every minutes while waiting to hear about interviews. Once I'm awake, I think ignoring my email is going to be difficult, so I'm thinking of trying to sleep late enough that morning (benadryl if necessary!) that the email definitely will have arrived by the time I get up.

2. Will you open the email yourself, or have someone read it for you?

3. Have you made other plans for that day? I'm lucky in that I was able to clear my schedule. My cohort has toyed with the idea of getting together, either to open our emails together or just to hang out after we've gotten the news. My husband has offered to stick around for part of the day.

The second two questions are hard for me because, while I'd be thrilled with any of my potential sites, I can't be sure that I'm going to match. If I could magically know that I would be matching somewhere, I would love to read the email w/ my husband, or spend the day celebrating with my friends.

I would not be able to stand reading it with anyone else in the room, it's just too important and personal a moment for me. I will need a few minutes at least to process the information myself, no matter the outcome, good, fair, or bad, it's just my style. I, too, plan to TRY to sleep in as late as possible so that I don't sit in front of the computer waiting and refreshing endlessly. I hope it will be possible; I suppose if I stay up late enough the night before, it will be 🙂

I hesitate to make plans with my cohort because if I don't match, I can't imagine wanting to meet up with them that day, but I do plan to post on facebook that I matched (if I did) and probably won't write anything if I didn't. I certainly would like to hear the good news on facebook from my cohort members if they matched, even if I don't, so I hope they feel the same. Does it seem tacky to post?

 

[ndcm]

I'm really not sure how to handle things on the morning of Match Day. Anyone up for sharing their plans?

1. Are you planning to be at your computer and ready to get the email the minute it arrives? I'm remembering how miserable it was to refresh my inbox every minutes while waiting to hear about interviews. Once I'm awake, I think ignoring my email is going to be difficult, so I'm thinking of trying to sleep late enough that morning (benadryl if necessary!) that the email definitely will have arrived by the time I get up.

Ah! I can't imagine being able to sleep in that day. Actually, I have a feeling it is going to be difficult to get any sleep that night at all! I also remember the misery of refreshing my inbox during interview time... but I can't lie, I will be sitting by my computer all morning and I am sure my heart will race every time I get something new in my inbox!

2. Will you open the email yourself, or have someone read it for you?

I will open it by myself, but I asked my boyfriend to take the morning off (thankfully he can). Since people have posted both what the rejection and positive response look like, I guess I have an idea of what my eyes are going to go right to. The question I am confused about- if I match, what do I do/who do I call first? Second? Third? If I don't match, I will probably just call my parents and honestly... cry for a little while. Then at some point, I'd be interested to find out how my friends made out!

3. Have you made other plans for that day? I'm lucky in that I was able to clear my schedule. My cohort has toyed with the idea of getting together, either to open our emails together or just to hang out after we've gotten the news. My husband has offered to stick around for part of the day.

I feel like I have put a ton of plans on hold until after match day. I have nothing too major that day, which is good.. but there were some things I could not clear (thankfully, they are not until the afternoon). I don't want to open up emails together because I want to be excited without feeling bad (at least in that moment), or be by myself for a little while i I don't match (that may sound selfish, but I am just being honest!!) Hopefully, my cohort will get together for match eve... and maybe again on the day of depending on results!!

The second two questions are hard for me because, while I'd be thrilled with any of my potential sites, I can't be sure that I'm going to match. If I could magically know that I would be matching somewhere, I would love to read the email w/ my husband, or spend the day celebrating with my friends.

🙂

 

[MsBella13]

1. Are you planning to be at your computer and ready to get the email the minute it arrives?

Hells no. I'm on the West coast, so I will not be up at 5am or whatever ridiculously early hour it's supposed to arrive. I'll get up as normal around 8-9am and will hopefully find good news 😀

2. Will you open the email yourself, or have someone read it for you?

Myself, because I live alone. Yay single grad students!

3. Have you made other plans for that day?

Nothing set in stone yet, but I was thinking of getting discounted movie tickets that my school sells to us and going to see Act of Valor with my boyfriend that night.

Good luck everyone and please take care of yourselves during the next 12 days!

 

[docma]

Does anyone know how sites search for our Match # in the NMS database? The way my name appears on the NMS site is slightly different than my APPIC application (I could not fit my whole middle name in the NMS site, so it is only part of it). Do you think they would search by last name? My # is on my application, but just in case they search for it in other ways.

The NMS site allows training sites to search for Match numbers by name (or even parts of a name) and is also careful to show you and warn you when 2 participants have similar names, so I don't think you need to worry. It is also possible to search an entire alphabetical list of participants if necessary. They will find you. Also, the entry of name (or number) also confirms the school so that further reduces chances for confusion at the time of data entry. The system does work (and WAY better than the chaotic do it all by phone system that preceded it..)

 

[moneyphd]

What activities are people focusing on to keep from thinking about the match?

1) I'm trying to work on papers, but keep checking listservs and career blogs. I'm addicted to Penelope Trunk's (non-psych) blog. Maybe that's more helpful right now anyway.

2) Woody Allen movies

3) Getting my health back after dozens of disgusting plane rides and gross hotel rooms

4) Sheet monster time (see 30 Rock)

I also have a plan to sit down the weekend after 2/24 and really map out a new 5-year plan. Having a plan (broken down by semester/quarter) has REALLY helped me to see the big picture and articulate goals, but this last year of uncertainty has made it hard to plan in steps.

 

[DrivenDoctoress]

Well...

I'm really not sure how to handle things on the morning of Match Day. Anyone up for sharing their plans?

1. Are you planning to be at your computer and ready to get the email the minute it arrives? I'm remembering how miserable it was to refresh my inbox every minutes while waiting to hear about interviews. Once I'm awake, I think ignoring my email is going to be difficult, so I'm thinking of trying to sleep late enough that morning (benadryl if necessary!) that the email definitely will have arrived by the time I get up.

I am planning to wake up at 6am, go to the gym or for a quick jog, come home and shower and take care of myself, then very ceremoniously make coffee and something light for breakfast, and sit down at the kitchen table with coffee and my lap top and begin checking my email at 7:30am central time. This will be hard for me to do because I am not a patient person, but I want to burn off the nervous energy (exercise) and try to feel like a normal well-adjusted (semi-well-adjusted?) person for another few moments before I turn my life upside down with whatever results my email holds.

2. Will you open the email yourself, or have someone read it for you?

I will open it myself. I like to try to face things calmly, head-on, and alone first so that I can just let myself have those moments to react however I need to on my own before I share with others. I will then tell the significant other, best friend, cohort mates, family, etc.

3. Have you made other plans for that day? I'm lucky in that I was able to clear my schedule. My cohort has toyed with the idea of getting together, either to open our emails together or just to hang out after we've gotten the news. My husband has offered to stick around for part of the day.

The honey has to work so unfortunately I can't spend it with him, but I'm hoping my best friend can clear her schedule for part of the day to either celebrate or mourn with me in whatever fashion feels right. Mimosas and a Dexter marathon sound pretty good for either a positive or negative result. 😛

I think after it's all said and done I will sit down and make a 'plan' or timeline like another member mentioned, to loosely organize the next few years of my life now that I'll know what they'll generally look like.

The second two questions are hard for me because, while I'd be thrilled with any of my potential sites, I can't be sure that I'm going to match. If I could magically know that I would be matching somewhere, I would love to read the email w/ my husband, or spend the day celebrating with my friends.

 

[Duck Duck Goose]

Maybe it's just me but I'm not stressed out about the wait or the match day process. I don't have a plan for getting the results, it's just another day and a small part of my life. If I match, great, if I don't, Phase II. Even last year, I wasn't especially stressed about it. I wonder if this suggests I'm burnt out or if it is a positive sign that I'm not overly wrapped up in it.

Good luck to everyone!

 

[DrivenDoctoress]

Maybe it's just me but I'm not stressed out about the wait or the match day process. I don't have a plan for getting the results, it's just another day and a small part of my life. If I match, great, if I don't, Phase II. Even last year, I wasn't especially stressed about it. I wonder if this suggests I'm burnt out or if it is a positive sign that I'm not overly wrapped up in it.

Good luck to everyone!

Yep, it's just you. 😛 Just kidding, it's probably a good thing to not feel consumed by this process. You're a veteran though, that probably helps! I go through phases of frantic panic and utter apathy. Haven't settled on just one yet.

 

[psychwanabe]

1. Are you planning to be at your computer and ready to get the email the minute it arrives?

Absolutely. I would never be able to sleep anyway and I know myself well enough to know that no distraction of any sort will work for more than a few minutes.

2. Will you open the email yourself, or have someone read it for you?

I've asked my hubby to be at the ready (he works from home) but to leave me alone until I'm ready to share with him. That will be instantly if I match to one of my top 4, within a minute or two if I match at any of the others, and after I start breathing again if I don't match.

3. Have you made other plans for that day?

If I match, I will check FB to see how other students in my program fared, and later I will go down to campus to do the traditional happy dance (i.e., go see all my favorite faculty and get hugs and congratulations) of the matched. Later that day I will want to CELEBRATE! That will involve my favorite people at a favorite restaurant.

If I don't match, I will cry, get consoled by my hubby, check FB to see how others fared, and look at Phase II stuff. Hopefully I will be able to successfully use that as a distraction and a way of working the problem. We'll see how well that works. 🙄

 

[psychwanabe]

What activities are people focusing on to keep from thinking about the match?

1. Working on my articles to try and publish my dissertation results. So far, I have printed out the requirements for submission to my first choice journal. Um, not making good headway on that one yet. 😳
2. Totally with you on getting back to a healthier lifestyle. Hitting the gym or working out in some other way 4-6 times per week, making menus, shopping healthy, cooking a lot.
3. Starting to study for the EPPP which I hope to take in May. I'm progressing on that about as well as #1....
4. Finally spending the amount of time I've needed to on my clients. I'm working a lot less right now and I actually have TIME to devote to research and session planning the way that I want to. It's amazing.
5. Spider solitare. That may or may not be what's slowing down 1 & 3. 🙄
6. Reading actual novels!
7. Catching up on favorite TV shows before my DVR gets completely full.

 

[ClinApp]

1. 
   Starting to study for the EPPP which I hope to take in May. I'm progressing on that about as well as #1....

I thought you had to wait until after internship to take the EPPP? I haven't spent much time investigating this yet, probably because I'm still very much working on my dissertation,

 

[fnip]

I have had moments of thinking how I might have changed my rank list... but it hasn't been too bad. I have actually been really busy at work, so I have been trying to focus on that. It has been better for me not to think about it.

I have talked with my SO about how we are going to handle that morning and I decided I want to read the email. I have also caught up on some shows I haven't watched in six months, didn't even realize I was so many episodes behind! These few weeks for me are about self-care, and a lot of relaxing and not feeling bad at all about it! I have also seen more of my friends and family in the last few weeks than I have in the last six months, so that has been great as well.

And I really like your idea about listing some of the pros of each site. I would be happy with any of my sites, so I think I might try that as well if I find my mind worrying about things over these next 11 days!!

I had some doubts after submitting my list. I even thought about calling APPIC and trying to change my list, don't know if that is even possible. It is hard to decide when there are so many unknown variables. I figure maybe if you have trouble deciding that means there are many places that would be a good fit.

 

[erg923]

I had some doubts after submitting my list. I even thought about calling APPIC and trying to change my list, don't know if that is even possible. It is hard to decide when there are so many unknown variables. I figure maybe if you have trouble deciding that means there are many places that would be a good fit.

My understanding is that the actual match it is already done (and is completed within a few days of the ranking deadline) and that the three week weight is really due to multiple checks for accuracey.

 

[Duck Duck Goose]

Yep, it's just you. 😛 Just kidding, it's probably a good thing to not feel consumed by this process. You're a veteran though, that probably helps! I go through phases of frantic panic and utter apathy. Haven't settled on just one yet.

It definitely helps to know what to expect in the way of process. I feel like they should pair each grad student up with an internship applicant each year, just so everyone can see what to expect. 😛 (This might help internship applicants keep things in perspective, too, since they're being observed.)

But for me there was no crying last year about the results or anything like that. No moping or special consolation dinners. For me, it's not a celebration of an accomplishment (like graduation or defending your dissertation) or mourning a lost opportunity (like not getting a job offer or getting into a certain school/program). The match will happen next year in pretty much the same way with pretty much the same positions. Getting an internship is one of the hoops we have to jump through in the circus of training in clinical psychology.

I know that matching or not impacts lives (um, like mine was on hold for a year) but I don't have the same emotional investment, it seems, in the outcome that others do.

In any case, good luck to everyone and I hope you all enjoy your match day plans or the day known elsewhere as February 24th.

 

[psychwanabe]

I thought you had to wait until after internship to take the EPPP? I haven't spent much time investigating this yet, probably because I'm still very much working on my dissertation,

I live very close to KY, which allows you to take it with a Masters.There's a good GradPsych article on this in the Sept. 2007 edition. You can find it online if you're interested. I've been strongly encouraged to take it now while everything is still fresh and since I'm defended, not teaching, and only have one clinical placement now I have some extra time this semester so I decided to take advantage.

 

[4410]

The APPIC Match has a number of checks and double checks until the emails are sent out. It takes time to set up the mass emails to some 4000 participants and to set up the Phase II process with avaliable programs in Match II. Our DCT has indicated to quickly call him as soon as we find out we have either match or not matched and some students actually find a site that day. My guess is some sites who did not match all of their slots and do not particpate in phase II and perfer to find interns through communication directly with DCT. Some sites begin earlier in June or July whereas most do not begin until September. It is my understanding that sites that begin early and do not fill all of their slots are more likely to try to find interns without going through phase II.

From reviewing this thread it is easy to become superstitious about this whole process. I had four interviews and three of the sites were set up in group format with a social element with ten to fifteen students interviewing in a round robin format where you talk with different psychologist every thirty minutes. In these three interviews, I did notice some students being offerred the business cards and some were asked to go to lunch as a group with some of the psychologists whereas others were not given business cards or asked about lunch. At one site, they had group discussion at the end of the day, and four applicants were asked to stay over for additional information. The other six of us were not asked to stay. These four applicants were from APA programs, albeit APA programs on probation and the DCT at the site somewhat shadowed or was more involved with these four applicants. It is my guess that we were already ranked before even coming in for the interview and staff had this knowledge so students with a higher rank were give more options or more interest/attention from the staff.

I had one phone interview that lasted about 15 minutes but they encouraged me to rank them as they indicated they had much interest in my application. I had one full day interview where I was the only person being interviewed on that day, and this was the most fulfilling interview. I received four business cards and had lunch with the staff and current interns. The DCT even called me once I got home to ask if I had any additional questions before ranking deadline date and indicated that I made a very favorable impression during my interview.

I know many on this thread had limited interviews but all it takes is one Match and although the phase I deadline is over, there will still be many options available in phase II and afterwards.

Eleven days and counting until results are revealed on February 24, 2012.

 

[ClinApp]

Your description of scrambling for spots on Match Day sounds like the old policy. My understanding is that programs who do not fill all their spots in Phase I have to offer those in Phase II, to provide an orderly next step for matching and circumvent the craziness that once was the clearinghouse.

Your interview experiences (except the solo one and phone interview) sound offensive. I did not go to any sites that treated applicants differently or offered applicants different perks (such as lunch or additional information). Those don't sound like very classy sites to me, so I hope you match at the ones that gave you the star treatment.

 

[ClinApp]

I live very close to KY, which allows you to take it with a Masters.There's a good GradPsych article on this in the Sept. 2007 edition. You can find it online if you're interested. I've been strongly encouraged to take it now while everything is still fresh and since I'm defended, not teaching, and only have one clinical placement now I have some extra time this semester so I decided to take advantage.

Thanks for the info, sounds like a great plan! I'm not sure exactly where I will be living after my PhD is complete, but the most likely states for me seem to require waiting until after internship. Good luck with the studying!

 

[moneyphd]

Our DCT has indicated to quickly call him as soon as we find out we have either match or not matched and some students actually find a site that day. My guess is some sites who did not match all of their slots and do not particpate in phase II and perfer to find interns through communication directly with DCT. Some sites begin earlier in June or July whereas most do not begin until September. It is my understanding that sites that begin early and do not fill all of their slots are more likely to try to find interns without going through phase II.

Does anyone know about the rules for what programs can do re:talking to DCTs outside of the APPIC Match process? I had thought this was not allowed, but I could definitely be wrong.

 

[4410]

I may be slightly exagerating the experiences I had in the group interview format. All the sites that I received interviews with are Non APA accredited sites and the three with the group interviews are new or newer sites. The phone interview and the full day interview were at sites that have been APPIC approved many years but they are not APA accredited.

My guess is that the process is much different in APA accredited sites and with sites that have a long history of being an internship site. I do not like group interviews but that is just me. I guess it is more efficient when you have 50-60 people to interview but it has it's limitations.

At one of the group interview sites, I already received an email that I would not be allowed to participate in the ranking with their program on the same day of the interview. I knew a number of students that participated in this interview and the six of us who left or were not asked to stay, three of them also received the same email. My guess is that the four they choose to stay were being included in the ranking group from that days interviews. I believe they interviewed groups on three other days, so they must have had 30 or more students that they interviewed and they chose four or five from each group to be involved with their ranking.

I am talking about my University DCT and not the sites DCT when asked to call or contact after finding about whether we match or don't match. I know there is a slient period and we are not allowed to talk to the site DCT during this silent period.

 

[4410]

I live very close to KY, which allows you to take it with a Masters.There's a good GradPsych article on this in the Sept. 2007 edition. You can find it online if you're interested. I've been strongly encouraged to take it now while everything is still fresh and since I'm defended, not teaching, and only have one clinical placement now I have some extra time this semester so I decided to take advantage.

The program that I am in recommends taking the EPPP and being licensed at the MS level. I took the EPPP in 2010 so I don't have to worry about that once I finish up my internship and I should be able to have provisional licensure as soon as I graduate.

Some programs are now requiring taking the EPPP or passing the EPPP before granting the doctoral degree and many States allow for taking the EPPP as part of the doctoral training. It is a mistake to wait until you have finished the doctoral degree as some get delayed and don't seek licensure for five or more years and they have to re learn the information from their graduate education.

 

[Duck Duck Goose]

Does anyone know about the rules for what programs can do re:talking to DCTs outside of the APPIC Match process? I had thought this was not allowed, but I could definitely be wrong.

If the site is APA accredited or an APPIC member, they have to abide by the match rules and DCTs are supposed to respect the rules and not lobby for their students. This was recently discussed on the internship listserv.

4410's statements are largely about sites that are not APA accredited and (probably) not APPIC members. They can do pretty much whatever they want. New internships can participate in the match for a year or two without needing to be an APPIC member or get accredited. Those sites need to comply with the match rules when participating in the match, though.

Sites that don't fill their positions in Phase I are obligated to offer the positions in Phase II, unless they lose funding or decide not to fill the position at all that year. A site that didn't fill a position in Phase I and then filled it "behind closed doors" and not in Phase II or the Clearinghouse (after Phase II) would face serious sanctions from APPIC.

 

[4410]

If the site is APA accredited or an APPIC member, they have to abide by the match rules and DCTs are supposed to respect the rules and not lobby for their students. This was recently discussed on the internship listserv.

4410's statements are largely about sites that are not APA accredited and (probably) not APPIC members. They can do pretty much whatever they want. New internships can participate in the match for a year or two without needing to be an APPIC member or get accredited. Those sites need to comply with the match rules when participating in the match, though.

Sites that don't fill their positions in Phase I are obligated to offer the positions in Phase II, unless they lose funding or decide not to fill the position at all that year. A site that didn't fill a position in Phase I and then filled it "behind closed doors" and not in Phase II or the Clearinghouse (after Phase II) would face serious sanctions from APPIC.

This is correct as none of my sites for interviews are APA accredited and only two were APPIC approved. They were using the match as non APA or non APPIC sites as they are new or newer sites. You have to have one or two internship groups before being eligible to apply for APA accredited or APPIC accredited. Being in a non APA accredited program currently, I would be very happy doing any type of internship and APA accreditation does not matter for me. I am not interested in working in any of the jobs that require APA accreditation graduate program or APA accredited internship. Geography was the main reason I attended the program that I attended as I have family and children and I am the primary wage earner. My children are now grown so I may move now to do an internship but during my doctoral studies I did not want for them to have to begin in a different school district during their middle school and high school years. I am a non-traditional student and most likely would not have been accepted in any APA accredited programs so I did not apply to these programs and really only applied to the one program, although I could have gone to a school psychology doctoral program nearby. Most school psychology doctoral program are NASP accredited rather than APA accredited. I have worked most of my professional career in school psychology but this really limits employment opportunities and school psychology jobs are not overly in abundance, especially during the past two year with the economy spiraling downward.

Sorry, if everyone is mad about my previous post...but I am coming from a different perspective than the majority of this forum. I am in my 50's with a long term career in school psychology with my main interest being to work in community mental health in underserved areas/populations or rural areas rather then getting wealthy. I had my experience as a small business owner for six years on the path to wealth at one time and discovered that money does not bring happiness but frequently additional headaches. Rarely does anybody in the mental health field reach a level of comfort or wealth and this should not be tied with why people are wanting to work in the helping profession.

Got to get back to work!! Good luck on Match Day!!

 

[jolio]

i'm also a non-trad student (pushing 40) and am in an APA accredited program. i don't believe age disqualifies you from even very competitive programs.

 

[erg923]

Rarely does anybody in the mental health field reach a level of comfort or wealth and this should not be tied with why people are wanting to work in the helping profession.

And its people with attitudes like yours that help maintain that salary supression. 🙄

If you are fine toiling in underpaid settings that don't value your work/profession as they should (or else they would pay more), that is fine and honorable, but dont put your altruism onto others. It does nothing but pepetuate the crazy notion that because you are in a "helping profession," you should't expect to make good profit from your work. FUBAR!

 

[Duck Duck Goose]

i'm also a non-trad student (pushing 40) and am in an APA accredited program. i don't believe age disqualifies you from even very competitive programs.

It's not age, it's the rest of life and additional responsibilities that tend to go along with age. Geographic restriction, for example, which 4410 mentioned, because of significant ties to a location.

 

[dharmapsy]

This is correct as none of my sites for interviews are APA accredited and only two were APPIC approved. They were using the match as non APA or non APPIC sites as they are new or newer sites. You have to have one or two internship groups before being eligible to apply for APA accredited or APPIC accredited. Being in a non APA accredited program currently, I would be very happy doing any type of internship and APA accreditation does not matter for me. I am not interested in working in any of the jobs that require APA accreditation graduate program or APA accredited internship. Geography was the main reason I attended the program that I attended as I have family and children and I am the primary wage earner. My children are now grown so I may move now to do an internship but during my doctoral studies I did not want for them to have to begin in a different school district during their middle school and high school years. I am a non-traditional student and most likely would not have been accepted in any APA accredited programs so I did not apply to these programs and really only applied to the one program, although I could have gone to a school psychology doctoral program nearby. Most school psychology doctoral program are NASP accredited rather than APA accredited. I have worked most of my professional career in school psychology but this really limits employment opportunities and school psychology jobs are not overly in abundance, especially during the past two year with the economy spiraling downward.

Sorry, if everyone is mad about my previous post...but I am coming from a different perspective than the majority of this forum. I am in my 50's with a long term career in school psychology with my main interest being to work in community mental health in underserved areas/populations or rural areas rather then getting wealthy. I had my experience as a small business owner for six years on the path to wealth at one time and discovered that money does not bring happiness but frequently additional headaches. Rarely does anybody in the mental health field reach a level of comfort or wealth and this should not be tied with why people are wanting to work in the helping profession.

Got to get back to work!! Good luck on Match Day!!

I am also a non-traditional student- grown children and grandchildren in school. I had no problem getting into an APA accredited program and actually feel that my life experiences gave me an advantage both in applying to and in completing my program.

 

[psychRA]

In these three interviews, I did notice some students being offerred the business cards and some were asked to go to lunch as a group with some of the psychologists whereas others were not given business cards or asked about lunch. At one site, they had group discussion at the end of the day, and four applicants were asked to stay over for additional information. The other six of us were not asked to stay.

Wow...that's completely disgusting. I wonder how those sites justified that kind of behavior to themselves? Maybe there's a perfectly reasonable explanation; if some applicants were interested in a specific track that required additional information, or had a slightly different process, it could be okay, but I would have made that abundantly clear to the other applicants. If not, though, that's inexcusable. Even if I found myself in the group of applicants "chosen" for special attention, I'd have some serious doubts about ranking a site where that kind of thing was allowed to happen. I hope you end up at a site that showed you some basic respect!

 

[4410]

I am also a non-traditional student- grown children and grandchildren in school. I had no problem getting into an APA accredited program and actually feel that my life experiences gave me an advantage both in applying to and in completing my program.

I was in my early 50's when I applied and the program I attend in 20 miles away from where I live. Most of the APA accredited programs where I live are in the southern part of the state or in a medical school and they are all PhD programs. I had no interest in a PhD program but much interest in a PsyD program. At the time this was the best option for me and although it is not APA accredited is is a high quality program and follows the APA doctoral level clinical training model. My guess is they will be APA accredited before I finish up in 2013.

 

[joetro]

So one of the sites I ranked just e-mailed to say that they were withdrawing from the Match. I guess this happens in "real life" too (i.e. law firms rescinding offers, pushing back start dates), but it would have been great to know this, you know, before applying/traveling/paying for hotels, food, airfare, etc.

10 more days!

 

[4410]

Wow...that's completely disgusting. I wonder how those sites justified that kind of behavior to themselves? Maybe there's a perfectly reasonable explanation; if some applicants were interested in a specific track that required additional information, or had a slightly different process, it could be okay, but I would have made that abundantly clear to the other applicants. If not, though, that's inexcusable. Even if I found myself in the group of applicants "chosen" for special attention, I'd have some serious doubts about ranking a site where that kind of thing was allowed to happen. I hope you end up at a site that showed you some basic respect!

It was a new site that did not get listed until late 2011. The psychologist were not well prepared for the whole process and I believe we were a pilot study group to help them learn and develop their interview days. They had two slots and my guess is they most likely went through the motions during the group interviews. I was not impressed and I do not believe I would have been happy in that setting.

I guess this whole process is far from perfect, as I had one site offer me an interview via email to rescind it the next day maintaining that the students selected for interviews and the students not selected for interviews list were accidentally switched. Another site sent me a rejection letter with a different student's name than mine on the rejection letter.

Two of the sites that I applied with did not send me email of whether I was selected or not selected for an interview. I sent emails but they never responded.

 

[RoseRed2]

So one of the sites I ranked just e-mailed to say that they were withdrawing from the Match. I guess this happens in "real life" too (i.e. law firms rescinding offers, pushing back start dates), but it would have been great to know this, you know, before applying/traveling/paying for hotels, food, airfare, etc.

10 more days!

That is horrible. I wish you success on match day, and to a site with secure funding!

Yes, just 10 more days!!

 

[buddhachick]

So one of the sites I ranked just e-mailed to say that they were withdrawing from the Match. I guess this happens in "real life" too (i.e. law firms rescinding offers, pushing back start dates), but it would have been great to know this, you know, before applying/traveling/paying for hotels, food, airfare, etc.

10 more days!

I got this too 🙁 super bummed

 

[DrivenDoctoress]

That's really unfortunate about sites dropping out. This whole process can be weird at times. :-/

Just 10 more days now until we have some clarity about our next year (or more) of life! Hang in there guys.

 

[4410]

So one of the sites I ranked just e-mailed to say that they were withdrawing from the Match. I guess this happens in "real life" too (i.e. law firms rescinding offers, pushing back start dates), but it would have been great to know this, you know, before applying/traveling/paying for hotels, food, airfare, etc.

10 more days!

They should have informed you last week before you did your ranking. I was emailed the night of the match that one site was not going to participate in phase I so to not include them in my rankings, but they were going to participate in phase II. They indicated that if I did not match in phase I that I could re-apply in phase II.Your site may have decided to cancel phase I as they did not have any good fits with the students they interviewed, so they were going to take their chances on phase II, since 25% or more of students do not match in phase I.

 

[Qwnpixie]

They should have informed you last week before you did your ranking. I was emailed the night of the match that one site was not going to participate in phase I so to not include them in my rankings, but they were going to participate in phase II. They indicated that if I did not match in phase I that I could re-apply in phase II.Your site may have decided to cancel phase I as they did not have any good fits with the students they interviewed, so they were going to take their chances on phase II, since 25% or more of students do not match in phase I.

That's crazy. I would be annoyed... but i suppose it kkeeps your from wasting your time...

 

[Qwnpixie]

And its people with attitudes like yours that help maintain that salary supression. 🙄

If you are fine toiling in underpaid settings that don't value your work/profession as they should (or else they would pay more), that is fine and honorable, but dont put your altruism onto others. It does nothing but pepetuate the crazy notion that because you are in a "helping profession," you should't expect to make good profit from your work. FUBAR!

THANK YOU!

This profession is what you make of it. If that's what you think, more power to you, but I know my self worth and I provide a service that is valuable and hard to come by. If we advocate for ourselves as professionals we can make of it whatever we want.



I teach chemistry- but I don't make chump change, I make close to 80 bucks and hour--- but i have colleagues who make under 20 an hour.





LIFE IS WHAT YOU MAKE OF IT!!!!


*sorry. It hit a nerve. I'm done now.

 

[MsBella13]

THANK YOU!

This profession is what you make of it. If that's what you think, more power to you, but I know my self worth and I provide a service that is valuable and hard to come by. If we advocate for ourselves as professionals we can make of it whatever we want.



I teach chemistry- but I don't make chump change, I make close to 80 bucks and hour--- but i have colleagues who make under 20 an hour.





LIFE IS WHAT YOU MAKE OF IT!!!!


*sorry. It hit a nerve. I'm done now.

👍

Agreed. Psychology IS a business (like everything else in this world), and shoot, I wanna help people AND get paid.

 

[4410]

And its people with attitudes like yours that help maintain that salary supression. 🙄

If you are fine toiling in underpaid settings that don't value your work/profession as they should (or else they would pay more), that is fine and honorable, but dont put your altruism onto others. It does nothing but pepetuate the crazy notion that because you are in a "helping profession," you should't expect to make good profit from your work. FUBAR!

I guess it depends on what your expectations are about salary. When I was working in school settings with 20 years experience I was making in the $80,000 range. Now when I first started working with a specialist degree in school psychology in the 1980's, I started out making around $24,000 per year. This being my first job in a school psychology position, I thought I was rich as I was in my middle 20's. I suspect that when I finish up this degree my salary will be in the range of $50,000 to $60,000. Psychology jobs salaries have increased substantially in the last 30 years. I used to work at a State Hospital at one time making around $18,000 per year and the doctoral level psychologist were making around $30,000 a year in the 70's. My supervisor made his money from the cattle business with an active cattle ranch and he was fairly weathy from this venture but he enjoyed working at the State Hospital as director of psychology. One of my previous principals recently retired in his 40's as his family property or ranch that he grew up on and inherited was recently discovered to have natural gas, so he is getting royalty checks monthly in excess of $20,000 per month for his inherited family farm land that was just sitting empty for a number of years as he moved to town to live near the school district he worked at. He does not live there now but they have natural gas well on his property and he has hit the jackpot.

Now at this point in my career, money is not the main reason why I work, whereas in my early development years of 20's and 30's money was more important. I guess my reasoning is that money matters change in perspective as one grows up and matures in their lifetime.

No reason to Hate on me just because I say money is not the main reason why I work. If it was I would have continued on with my private business that I owned in the 90's.

 

[erg923]

I guess it depends on what your expectations are about salary. When I was working in school settings with 20 years experience I was making in the $80,000 range. Now when I first started working with a specialist degree in school psychology in the 1980, I started out making around $24,000 per year. This being my first job, I thought I was rich as I was in my middle 20's. I suspect that when I finish up this degree my salary will be in the range of $50,000 to $60,000. Psychology jobs salaries have increased substantially in the last 30 years. I used to work at a State Hospital at one time making around $18,000 per year and the doctoral level psychologist were making around $30,000 a year in the 70's. My supervisor made his money from the cattle business with an active cattle ranch and he was fairly weathy from this venture but he enjoyed working at the State Hospital as director of psychology. One of my previous principals recently retired in his 40's as his family property or ranch that he grew up on and inherited was recently discovered to have natural gas, so he is getting royalty checks monthly in excess of $20,000 per month for his inherited family farm land that was just sitting empty for a number of years as he moved to town to live near the school district he worked at. He does not live there now but they have propane well on his property and he has hit the jackpot..

Inflation. Adjust. The Royal Road...