MDACC had 195 applicants according to their rejection email. So at least 195, and I imagine a good amount of people realized that applying to MDACC was probably a waste of 25 bucks, lol
2013-2014 Interview Gossip/Chit-Chat
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But if we get an interview off of a wait-list (official or otherwise), it's pretty safe to assume we're not high on their list, right? I wonder if going to an interview received off a wait-list is a good use of money/time?
I agree. I did not apply to every program, and I would guess there are others who also did not apply to every program.
It's interesting that 12 more people applied to MDACC than MSKCC, I would have expected the applicant pools to be very similar for those two.
Anyways - anyone know the number of residency slots for this cycle?
Anyways - anyone know the number of residency slots for this cycle?
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I figured the same thing but then end up matching somewhere where I was in that position
Honestly, once you get the interview you're good. You have to remember that the only thing that separates you being their "second" choice and their first choice is nearly nothing. Who looked at the application that day? Geography? Topics of research? The person who wrote the LOR? At this stage, its not that they didn't invite you because they thought you weren't good enough, its just that the person who got the first invite for whatever reason caught their eye.
Now, that said, some places have a more firm ranking pre-interview and so you may come in at a slight disadvantage, but it is many peoples opinions that you can make up for lost ground on interview day. So take the interview if its somewhere you think you'd be happy!!
Like someone else said, you'd be surprised how many people turn down top tier interviews, myself included. It wasn't because I thought they weren't good, it was just logistics pure and simple. I know a lot of people who were forced to choose between 2-3 great programs all on the same day. So while waiting by the phone for these programs isn't the best idea, don't be surprised if there is some movement over the next few weeks as people finalize their schedules for December and January.
Ha! I was part of the 195 who applied to MDACC and the 183 who applied to MSKCC who knew they were wasting their money. I guess I'm not such a MedStud after all....
Here's a question - has anyone gotten a rejection letter from a program a few days or weeks after other people did?
That would let us know that after the initial rejections went out, they either offered some more spots or had all their slots solidified and then sent out rejections
That would let us know that after the initial rejections went out, they either offered some more spots or had all their slots solidified and then sent out rejections
That happened to me with one program so far; the rejection came about 5 days after it was first posted in the rejection thread. I also had an offer show up 2 days after the first offers were posted for a program.
Same here.
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Does anybody else feel with more rejections coming out lately we may see the final wave of invites of people from the 'waitlist' soon? Not too many programs left to send their first wave.
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I hope there's a legitimate 2nd wave. Feels like things are nearing the end. Kind of stopped abruptly (for me at least). I'm hoping for a few more invites but I don't know if there's a low likelihood of that happening.
It got really quiet pretty abruptly for me as well with only one invite in the past 2 weeks. I'm waiting to hear from a handful of programs and I'm almost afraid to check the message boards to find out yet another program sent invites...just not to me. I also wonder how many programs left on my unknown list have actually already sent invites and that info just hasn't been posted to the interview invite thread. I'm hopeful for a couple more but it may be wishful thinking.
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I think we need Sheldor to chime in and make us feel better
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I got an interview from a program that had already sent out invites a few days back, so hopefully that will be the case for others.
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They offered me 2 interview dates - 1 that had already been posted and 1 more that wasn't posted in the invite thread. There are now a total of 4 per the thread, but only 2 of those were offered to me.
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Alright, so I went back into my email to see how many interviews I received after 11/15/12. It looks like I received 5 after that date as best I can tell.
This confirmed my feelings in that there really was no second wave, but rather a slow trickle. I could have gotten a few more that e-mailed me directly as my search include that stupid no replay@eras one.
All that to say its not over! But after that big initial wave you won't really have days where you get 2 at a time regularly. In all likelihood from this point on you may pick up another 2-5. However, don't freak out! As long as you have over 11 you have the magic number. I know the number 15 is thrown around a lot, but if you look at actual data its closer to 9 if I remember correctly and you have a near 100% chance of matching. (Granted that data is old, but I'm thinking over all Rad Onc is less competitive today than it was 2-3 years ago)
Hope that helps!
This confirmed my feelings in that there really was no second wave, but rather a slow trickle. I could have gotten a few more that e-mailed me directly as my search include that stupid no replay@eras one.
All that to say its not over! But after that big initial wave you won't really have days where you get 2 at a time regularly. In all likelihood from this point on you may pick up another 2-5. However, don't freak out! As long as you have over 11 you have the magic number. I know the number 15 is thrown around a lot, but if you look at actual data its closer to 9 if I remember correctly and you have a near 100% chance of matching. (Granted that data is old, but I'm thinking over all Rad Onc is less competitive today than it was 2-3 years ago)
Hope that helps!
I suspect there are a handful of people out there holding onto several interview slots for the same dates with the hopes that someone else will drop or want to switch... or at least it seems that way from the interview swap thread. I had three offers for the same date. One was from one of my top choices... the other was an interview already scheduled and the third was a recent offer at a place I was interested in but not terribly excited about. Its incredible how fast people pounce on these offers. I replied two hours after the invite went out and I was the LAST person to reply... so I got stuck with that date. I considered holding the interview I already had scheduled in the hopes that someone would drop or switch... but the other date was one of those that doesn't have conflicts with other schools so I figured it was a snowball's chance in hell. So I went ahead and cancelled that interview and rejected the other offer. I would have felt bad holding the slots and I have been told by our director that it is poor form/viewed negatively to cancel at the last minute (and very bad if you don't show up at all!). I would like to go into academics so I didn't want to piss anyone off. I'm fairly satisfied with my lineup right now so I guess that is easy for me to say. If I wasn't satisfied I would have definitely held the three slots and crossed my fingers... so I think there is definitely the chance for last minute offers as people are forced to let go.
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Can anybody tell me the dress code for pre interview dinners? I feel like they're going to be pretty casual but I don't want to be the only one who's underdressed
I went on my first interview and it was pretty casual. I prefer to wear a shirt a dress pants though (no tie).
FYI, it looks like there may be more invites going out this week as people are canceling. I received several invites today and yesterday for programs that had been posted a while ago. Unfortunately they all seem to be for December 13th, haha.
Truth.
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I already posted this on the interview swap thread but I'm desperate at this point!
I have South Carolina for 12/6 and I need to swap for 1/9. I know this is a long shot but I don't have many interviews so I figured I'll give it a try.
I’ll also pay for flight, change fees, and accommodations!
I have South Carolina for 12/6 and I need to swap for 1/9. I know this is a long shot but I don't have many interviews so I figured I'll give it a try.
I’ll also pay for flight, change fees, and accommodations!
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This might have been addressed before, but I may have to miss a pre-interview dinner or two because of scheduling. How much does this affect your standing (even though they say it doesn't)? I certainly know I'm missing out on valuable information that you can't get from the interview.
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I can't decide if it's foolish or ingenious of all of these programs to offer interviews on the same handful of dates.
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I bet they didn't mean to. They definitely should have thought about it some more before everyone scheduling on 12/13 and 12/16.
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It's a bit ridiculous. I bet almost everyone has had to cancel at least one interview on 12/6 or 12/13 due to scheduling conflicts!
I've had to cancel three so far. Its painful!
I've had to cancel three so far. Its painful!
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On the one hand, it selects out people who (prior to interview) would prefer the other program offering on that date, so they only interview people who are most likely to rank them high. On the other hand, they miss out on the opportunity to make a good impression to sway those people to rank them higher. Either way, super lame. Super. Lame.
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True... But you're right... Still super lame!
I was thinking this too. It helps them because they know we apply everywhere.
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Not at all. Don't even worry about it. If you can go, then go, but if you can't, it's really not worth stressing over.
I would honestly just recommend that you wear what you'll be comfortable in. Most people tended to opt for something slightly nicer than blue jeans (khakis for men, nice pants or a casual skirt for women). But if it won't freak you out to be the most casual person there, I don't think it would actually hurt your standing at all to wear jeans. If you know where the dinner is going to be beforehand, you can always google it to check out its level of fanciness.
I've also had to cancel 2 interviews due to conflicts. 12/6 and 12/13 seems to be popular this year. If programs are sending out invites in late November they should at least have interview dates in Jan. It is so painful to cancel interviews especially if you don't have enough scheduled.
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This much thought does not go into it. Generally, the programs think about what dates work for them to interview, and invite on those days. It does bother me even as a resident how this all works for medical students (the cost, the process, etc), but it's a sellers market. The programs do what's generally convenient for them. The only way it ever changes is if a program doesn't fill.
Some programs still haven't sent out interviews. It will be interesting to see their dates. In general, this whole process has been rather random. If you pick the right dates early on your less likely to have to turn down potential interviews.
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Yeah, at one of my aways I asked the PC how they pick interview dates. She goes "Oh well Wednesdays aren't that busy for me so I chose day X but the chair wanted to go on vacation that day so we went with day Y."
They really don't care what other programs do...they don't have to! ha
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What do you guys think is the closest to an interview that it is okay to cancel? These stupid dates are all the same and now that there are second waves of invites coming out it's really starting to make things complicated. I was thinking 2 weeks is probably closest.
Out of curiosity, does any one have a rough idea of where people usually match in their rank list? I was told that the match tries to have everyone land within their top 3-4 but didn't know if this was true of rad Onc
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l
I think it depends on how many interviews you have. If you have 9-11 matching in your top 4 is realistic. If you have 5, I doubt that will be true.
My impression is that if you are a reasonably competitive applicant and are interviewing at places you are reasonably competitive to match at you should match within your top 4-5. I actually haven't even met someone yet that has ranked lower than their 4 or 5th choice. Has anyone met people that have ranked much lower than that? (like 8th or 12th???) I'm sure it happens... I just haven't met them.
I was talking to an intern who matched into Rad Onc during one of my transitional year interviews:
Me: So how many places did you apply to and how many interviews did you go on?
Intern: I applied to every program and interviewed at 31 programs. I basically depleted my life savings... but I wanted to be sure that I matched.
Me: And what choice on your list did you match at?
Intern: Number 2.
LOL!
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Yes I have met someone who matched at their 12th.
Results and Data gives the percentage of applicants for all medical students (i.e. not broken down by specialty) here: http://b83c73bcf0e7ca356c80-e8560f4...ontent/uploads/2013/08/resultsanddata2013.pdf see table 15 and figure 7. In case you wonder where programs get their number of interviewees per position from, see table 17.
If you look at Charting Outcomes (http://b83c73bcf0e7ca356c80-e8560f4...tent/uploads/2013/08/chartingoutcomes2011.pdf) page 255 at the end of the file in the radiation oncology section, you will find the probability of matching based on number of ranks. This appears to be real data fitted to a logarithmic function, but there is a slightly increased chance of matching as you go from 10-11 ranks or 12-13 ranks, etc. Based on this, there is very likely several people a year who match to the absolute bottom of their 8-15 program rank list.
In any case, the question every year is how many places should you interview at to be sure of matching. Based on the above data, if you rank 9 programs, your chances of matching are over 90%, 11 over 95%. You can never be assured of matching, but once you get past 12-15 programs, you can't schedule them all anyway and your chances approach 100%. Interviewing at 31 programs seems impossible for scheduling purposes. In any case, it does seem reasonable to go on 9+ interviews, given the overall importance of the situation.
Where things really get tricky is when discussing transitional years. The NRMP stopped publishing data on TYs years ago. So for that, it's anyone's guess. My advice is to assume the good TYs are just as competitive as radiation oncology. Interviewing at 15 rad onc and 16 TY programs is then within reason.
@Neuronix: Awesome info... thanks for posting.
The intern I was talking with knew someone the year before who had a 256 Step 1, was AOA, and went unmatched. So that is why he was so aggressive. I agree that 31 would be near impossible to schedule (he said he got offers all the way into January though, so still hope out there for some). I have 8 scheduled and have already had to turn down 3 offers. I actually have had worse luck with prelim years... only 5 interviews so far. I guess I could SOAP into Surgery somewhere if I have to (ugh....).
The intern I was talking with knew someone the year before who had a 256 Step 1, was AOA, and went unmatched. So that is why he was so aggressive. I agree that 31 would be near impossible to schedule (he said he got offers all the way into January though, so still hope out there for some). I have 8 scheduled and have already had to turn down 3 offers. I actually have had worse luck with prelim years... only 5 interviews so far. I guess I could SOAP into Surgery somewhere if I have to (ugh....).
I kind of put my foot in my mouth in another thread about this topic, but my opinion is that as soon as you know you can't attend an interview, then you should cancel it (i.e., be sure you can move your interviews around before accepting an interview on a conflicting date). I was concerned reading about people holding interviews and trying to pay people to swap dates. I agree with you about two weeks minimum notice. Anything less would probably make it difficult to arrange for someone else to interview and more expensive for that person to travel. Thanks for being considerate and asking this question!
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Ditto. I think I was double booked for about 24 hours... then realized there was no way I would be able to attend both and had to drop one. I did a month in advance... I think two weeks might be ok but anything less you aren't giving the program or the potential applicant sufficient notice. If you have 4 interviews scheduled and two of them are double booked I can see how someone might wait till the last minute... otherwise you are just screwing other people over.
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Ugh I can't even fathom the idea of going on 16 prelim interviews.
I always wonder about the outliers. They can't all be terrible people with terrible personalities that were only made apparent on interview day. Did he perhaps interview at a lot of places with a lot of internal applicants? Or that interview 20+ people for one spot?
Anyone run into weather troubles? I have a back-to-back interview, running a tight schedule and worried about inclement weather coming in and making me late or miss my interview at my number 1. I hate this process.
