3.85 GPA/35 MCAT, 26 applied, 0 acceptances

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ZiplockFresh

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I hope one of you guys can help me out. I am a traditional applicant applying to medical school with:

3.85 Cumulative GPA
3.85 Science GPA
35 MCAT

My application is good, personal statement has been read by everyone I know, letters of recommendation are all from people I've known for years, and (most) of my interviewers really seemed to like me. Although some seemed uninterested, most of my interviews have been great. I applied a little late (finished all apps and secondaries by Mid Sept). But I am literally getting waitlisted everywhere and getting zero acceptances. And I also got waitlisted at my state school, which I am extremely competitive at.

My point is... I am going to have to reapply in the next cycle (Side question: Is it harder for reapplicants to get in medical school in comparison to first time applicants??)
 
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When were you complete? It sounds like they just might not have gotten around to you yet.

edit: never mind. says right there.
 
ZiplockFresh said:
I hope one of you guys can help me out. I am applying to medical school with:

3.85 Cumulative GPA
3.85 Science GPA
35 MCAT (12-PS 10-V 13-BS)
TONS of important quality research and leadership positions

I have applied to 26 schools, and received about 12 interviews, including Pritzker, Duke, UVA, Case, NYU, etc. But all I have been receiving so far is waitlist after waitlist after waitlist.

My application is good, personal statement has been read by everyone I know, letters of recommendation are all from people I've known for years, and (most) of my interviewers really seemed to like me. Although some seemed uninterested, most of my interviews have been great. I applied a little late (finished all apps and secondaries by Mid Sept). But I am literally getting waitlisted everywhere and getting zero acceptances. And I also got waitlisted at my state school, which I am extremely competitive at.

My point is... I am going to have to reapply in the next cycle (Side question: Is it harder for reapplicants to get in medical school in comparison to first time applicants??)

However, I think a glaring flaw in my application is that I only have ONE clinical experience listed on my AMCAS. I volunteered at a hospital for maybe 2 months (at the time). Usually people have a lot more clinical experience than this right? Do you guys think this could be the flaw in my application? And can I fix this in the next couple of months before I reapply? Because I seriously cannot figure out why I am not getting accepted anywhere, even at schools I am highly competitive at.

Please someone enlighten me on what could possibly be wrong with my application. Does anyone have any idea why I'm not going to make it this cycle? Thanks for the help in advance.
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Damn, the general trend is 1 acceptance for every 3 interviews. What EC's do you have apart from the hospital thing? If your current application landed you 12 interviews I wouldnt view your clinical experience as a weakness...might wanna boost it if you need to reapply though.

Honestly if you dont get 1 acceptance somebody up there is angry. ETF is that a joke?
 
I'd start working on clinical experience ASAP and let the schools you're waitlisted at know that you're in the process of getting more clinical experience.
 
i dont think you should worry just yet, even if you dont recieve any outward acceptances you will get something on one of the waitlists im sure of it. most ppl on waitlist(depending where you are on it of course) get it JUST RELAX!
 
When I see that many interviews without any acceptances, it raises a red flag.

I would suggest doing some mock interviews with an objective interviewer. Does your school offer something like that? You want some harsh, honest criticism of your interviewing technique. It might not be as good as you think.

Your clinical experience is a little on the low side, it couldn't hurt to update all your schools (waitlist and pre-interview) with letters detailing what clinical experience you've had throughout the application period.

If it does come down to a re-application. Be sure to get all your materials in early. You want your file to be on top of everyone's desk for review rather than getting buried at the bottom of a pile for review. The latter does tend to lead to more waitlists as rolling admissions classes fill up early.
 
I believe that this thread will ultimately be found as the cause of a number of SDN premed heart attacks.
 
A Plan B is usually a good idea, but definitely don't lose hope yet. I know NYU doesn't even notify us of decisions until March, and waitlists (depending on the school) aren't nearly as dire as you might think. For example, I heard some schools take almost 25% of the class from off waitlist, so June/July might be a little hectic for you, but you'll probably get a seat somewhere!

Best of luck with this cycle, and if it doesn't pan out, I"m sure you'll hit the ground running next cycle! Your stats look awesome, and clinical experience is something you can certainly catch up on. So if that's the only hole, I'd say you definitely have a great shot next cycle (and you still have a decent number of shots this cycle!)
 
If you've already had 12 interviews, my guess is that your app is not the problem. Something, don't know what, must be missing from your interview, and I have absolutely no idea what the adcoms look for in an interview, but my guess is that if your getting this many interviews, and your stats are great, you on paper is fine. Something must be missing from you at the interview, and with no knowledge of what they look for or how you acted in the interview, I can't say what is missing.
 
It seems like there isn't anything glaringly wrong with you, but as others have said maybe it's your interviewing skills.

it seems that you're not inept or "bad", but not necessarily as convincing as you could be, which is evidenced by your waitlists and lack of post interview rejections.

it's all about selling yourself. if you don't show your confidence and extol your virtues, then it will be hard for your interviewer to do so at the committee.

also, interviewers tend to veer off on unrelated topics. it's your job to get the interviewer back on track and interject comments about yourself.
 
Exactly how many waitlists do you have? And at what schools? Some schools do get a ton of movement from the waitlist, so if you have a decent number of waitlists you may very well get accepted off of one. Don't freak out until about June, but I would start some plan B activities now.

I agree that you probably don't interview as well as you think. If you don't seem very enthusiastic at the interview, it may be easy for them to waitlist you since your stats are so high, as they may very well just assume that you'll get in elsewhere and not matriculate there. Try to set up some mock interviews with people who don't know you. You may get some good feedback that could be useful if you get more interviews this season.
 
Your application sounds solid to me. Like others have said above, the fact that you are getting so many interviews is telling of the adequacy of your application despite what your perception of your clinical experience is. Its not really the amount or time you spend in clinical experiences, but rather what you can say about them. Maybe this is the missing piece during your interviews? I feel like your experiences are fine, but you should be passionate about them, and it will show when you describe them during interviews. I personally would probably continue the volunteering at the hospital and wait until you hear in March from most of your schools. At that point, you could probably send some updates to schools that have waitlisted you. I don't think it would be useful to send anything if a decision hasn't been made on your application.
 
Hey, I totally understand how you feel, I'm getting a TON of waitlists too. I think a lot of them were a product of bad interviews... but there were some of those schools where I thought that I had amazing interviews. It really sucks and I'm very sorry that you're having such a hard time. I'll echo what other people are saying: something might have happened in the interview. I hesitate to think that you did something really bad- remember, a waitlist is different from a rejection! If a school found a major flaw in an interview, they would reject you. If they've waitlisted you, then they still think that you're a strong candidate. Maybe you didn't persuade those schools that you were a good fit (I'm guessing that may have been my problem at a couple of my interviews). Maybe you just got really, really unlucky with some very competitive schools. Don't give up! Think back to the interviews and figure out which schools you truly loved. Send those select schools (not all 12!) information to keep them updated about your application and show your fervent interest. Try finding a volunteer/shadowing opportunity soon- if you can show that you've been expanding your clinical opportunities, they might consider you a stronger applicant.

Oh, and you still have a very viable chance at Duke and NYU (and any other non-rolling schools). With non-rolling schools, the date that you submitted your application doesn't make a big difference in your post-interview decision. Good luck with the infernal wait!
 
There's no way it's your lack of clinical background that's hurting you. If it was that, you'd simply not have any interviews. The fact that you are interviewing means that up to the point of the interview, the schools are interested in you. It's after the interview that they no longer feel an urgent desire to have you attend their school.

Something is wrong with your interviewing skills.
 
Jolie's point about selling yourself is important. Also wanted to add that those schools you've mentioned are pretty good schools...your stats are great, but probably not too far above the average for those particular schools. This may be why you're being waitlisted for now.

Don't despair. I would definitely add something new (like the clinical experience listed above) to your app and let the schools know about it with a letter of interest, etc. Try to draw positive attention to your application over the next few months so they'll pull you off the waitlist into an acceptance.

If you have any interviews remaining, be SURE to do what Jolie and the other posters said and examine your skills. Jolie is right about keeping the interview focused. You MUST find opportunities to tout your strengths without sounding arrogant and express direct interest in THAT school without sounding desperate or corny. Have points you would like to make in the interview ready in your mind so you can interject them at appropriate times, and let the interviewer know that you would make great contributions to the school for blah blah blah reasons.

Good luck. I think you definitely have a great chance of getting in this year. Keep your eye on the ball!:luck::luck::luck:
 
Have you applied to any 'lower tiered' private schools? Also, what state are you from? I know a girl who had excellent stats too but was waitlisted at six out of seven of her schools because the six were all name brand/top tiered schools. If you live in a state with a difficult public school, you essentially have no 'backup' school for your excellent grades to fall back on. Also, as other stated, try to do a mock interview with someone and see what they think of your presentation.

Your application is not an issue since you got all these interviews. I feel strongly that something in your presentation during the interview must have set off flags for people to waitlist you. Were you not coming as too cocky? Too aggressive? Perhaps you came off of as a gunner or someone who went into medicine for the wrong reasons.

At my school's mock interview, my interviewers (all professors who presumably have shepherded thousands of students through the process) were quite incensed that anyone would go into medicine for non-altruist reasons. However unrealistic it is to say that "I love medicine and want to work for Doctors Without Borders after I graduate", it seems to impress adcoms much more than saying "I like the financial security that medicine brings".
 
Jolie South said:
also, interviewers tend to veer off on unrelated topics. it's your job to get the interviewer back on track and interject comments about yourself.
Click to expand...

So, so, so, so true.

My first interviewer immediately started talking about the most random thing without pausing. It took me several minutes to realize that he wasn't going to stop and that I would have to interrupt to put in my two-cents. Eventually, we started talking more about me but it took a lot of wasted time for me to realize that I needed to steer the conversation.
 
It is January, people! Relax. If you were good enough on paper to interview then it isn't a glaring deficiency in your experiences. You weren't horrible enough in person to reject so it isn't as if your interview went badly. You are just in the middle. Once the 4.0/40 people sort themselves out (they have 5 or 6 offers and can attend only one school) the schools will know how many more seats they have to offer to the "second string". I suspect that you will convert one of those 12 interviews to an acceptance by May 1.
 
1) 2 months of clinical experience isn't a flaw, it's what killed your application.

2) Your app would probably be great for MD/PhD, but not for MD. Again, clinical experience is more emphasized.

3) I'd be interested to see your list of schools. If they were all top 20s or so, then I'd say you'd probably had it coming.
 
oh man!! i really hope you hear good news!! you have interviews at great places..i myself was wondering the same thing--so far i have been invited for 11 interviews and have completed 5...have only heard back from two (waitlist) and don't expect to hear from the others until at least the end of this week...its just it was so amazing for me to even get interviews at all (below avg gpa) id really hate to have shot my chances just because im not a good interviewer =(
 
My $0.02:
1st post ...
Either that, or I'd say prep. more for interviews.

Good luck
 
Have you asked for feedback anywhere yet? I've only heard of this happening if someone's rejected, but some schools will tell you what their reasoning was.

Here's my first thought - you want to be a doctor, but you've never shadowed one?

Listen to Lizzy - she knows better than the rest of us. I would update schools with some clinical experience (that actually occurred) and see where the cards fall.
 
Are you an over-privileged white male?
 
I think the thing that is dragging you down is your lack of clinical experiences... 2 months is definitely not enough for an MD program. I would try to beef that up significantly before you apply next cycle or you might experience the same thing.
 
were you the stinky kid in school?
 
I'm with LizzyM. Give it a few months to let the genetically altered superhuman applicants decide on where to go and then see where us mere mortals lie. 😉
 
Don't give up on this year yet.
Do you have any more interviews? If so, find someone to practice your interviewing skills with. You may also want to write out some outlines to general questions you may be asked (like why you want to be a doc, etc).

That being said, 2 months of hospital volunteering is not enough time to make a determination of whether or not you even want to be a doc. You need to get a lot of time dealing with sick patients and see if you like it. You have good academic stats which demonstrate that you can do well academically, but not enough grounding to determine if medicine is for you. If you are currently volunteering, send an update to the schools and tell them what you are up to. If you are not volunteering, get a position ASAP and send an update in a few months.

Hopefully you will get in somewhere in this cycle. If not, it's not the end of the world, even though it might seem so. A year working would be a good thing. I spent a dozen years working before I went back to school. I'm glad I did. If you get all rejections this year, try to get feedback from each school and correct your weaknesses. See if you need better LORs,personal statement etc. for the individual schools, make sure you state why you want to go to THEIR school. Be very specific, even if you need to exagerate a little. State how you like their curriculum, their hospital, their patient population etc. Keep working on yourself and you will get in, even if it's not this year.

Good luck.
 
There is a special place for what's left of my heart for people like Lizzy. 👍
 
TheRealMD said:
1) 2 months of clinical experience isn't a flaw, it's what killed your application.

2) Your app would probably be great for MD/PhD, but not for MD. Again, clinical experience is more emphasized.

3) I'd be interested to see your list of schools. If they were all top 20s or so, then I'd say you'd probably had it coming.
Click to expand...

I second this...
 
Thewrongstuff said:
There is a special place for what's left of my heart for people like Lizzy. 👍
Click to expand...
Let's not get carried away, people.

She did make a post earlier today reminding us that many pre-meds will take more than one cycle to get into med school and that a lot of us will never be accepted at all.

In my opinion, this heartening post only served to soothe nerves that her previous post rattled.
 
EM_Rebuilder said:
I second this...
Click to expand...

😀

koko_eats said:
Let's not get carried away, people.

She did make a post earlier today reminding us that many pre-meds will take more than one cycle to get into med school and that a lot of us will never be accepted at all.

In my opinion, this heartening post only served to soothe nerves that her previous post rattled.
Click to expand...

Glossied up or not, it's the truth. There are people that just sit on their butts with multiple acceptances until May 15th when AAMC makes them pick one or financial aid offers come out.
 
Volunteering for 2 months? How many hours does that equate to? No physician shadowing either? I don't think you have had enough healthcare experience, tbh. I'm with TheRealMD on this one.
 
If you have been getting a bunch of waitlists, there's a chance you could get in later in the cycle.
 
Aesculapius said:
If you have been getting a bunch of waitlists, there's a chance you could get in later in the cycle.
Click to expand...

What he said, definitely.

(Completely OT, but I also have this man's rod on my class ring which is reason in itself to quote him.)
 
I think you guys are going crazy over the 2 months thing. If that killed his application then he wouldnt have been invited to those interviews in the first place

A 1/2 application to interview ratio is GODLIKE to begin with.
 
Thewrongstuff said:
I think you guys are going crazy over the 2 months thing. If that killed his application then he wouldnt have been invited to those interviews in the first place

A 1/2 application to interview ratio is GODLIKE to begin with.
Click to expand...

Agree. Although more clinical exp can't hurt you (so you should still be volunteering right now so you can mention that in your LOIs.)

Even though you are a self-proclaimed people person, this isn't enough to get you past most interviews (or so I've heard). You've got to know how to act at an interview to put your best foot forward, and to convey qualities that interviewers will catch on to as evidence of your potential as a physician. If you've gotten that many interviews, and mostly wait lists, especially at your state school, you need to change something about how you are approaching your interviews.

Alternatively, one of your LORs might really suck. You should check with your letter writers to find out. Good luck.
 
Thewrongstuff said:
I think you guys are going crazy over the 2 months thing. If that killed his application then he wouldnt have been invited to those interviews in the first place

A 1/2 application to interview ratio is GODLIKE to begin with.
Click to expand...

It's not that having only 2 months of volunteering that killed him but all of the questions derived from the experiences that you would have gotten during X period of time. Suffice to say, you will know a lot more about medicine if you stick around for a whole year or more rather than just 2 months. His stats got him his interviews, but his answers probably weren't satisfactory enough to land acceptances.
 
TheRealMD said:
It's not that having only 2 months of volunteering that killed him but all of the questions derived from the experiences that you would have gotten during X period of time. Suffice to say, you will know a lot more about medicine if you stick around for a whole year or more rather than just 2 months. His stats got him his interviews, but his answers probably weren't satisfactory enough to land acceptances.
Click to expand...

One can argue then, that past point x, for this case 2 months, it is not about the amount of volunteering but the quality of volunteering which dictates how well you can convey a positive clinical experience notion to adcom. Cliffnotes=We go round back to his interview skills and his ability to sell himself (and hopefully do it ethically and truthfully).

I've got 150 hours done of useless volunteering at my local hospital, all that while being lazy during a 2.5 month period. I think there was a thread on here that basically summed up enough as being around 200 hours.

If he was close enough to the patients "to smell them" like lizzy says over a 2 month period then I'll be damned if his interview skills aren't the reason. And then again there's always that statistical anomaly nobody can explain.
 
As others have pointed out, its not the time you spend volunteering but rather what you get out of it and how you convey that to schools through your secondary essays, personal statement, and interviews.
 
Obviously the problem here is the interview. Having received 12 interviews, it is safe to say the application is stellar.

A point to remember when interviewing...

YOU ARE SELLING YOURSELF TO THE SCHOOL!

Thus, treat this like a sales pitch.... but how?

1) Find out what the school wants. If it's a big research institution, don't go on and on about your clinical experience and how much you want to go into private practice. If it's a school hell bent on producing PCP's, don't tell them about your never ending desire to go into ophtho.
This usually entails hours mulling over websites and reading mission statements. Also, e mail a 1st year student or two to get a sense of what the school wants.

2) Make yourself into what the school wants. NOTE: this does NOT mean lie. You WILL be discovered if you lie. However, you can choose what to say and what not to say. If you want to go into Cards, don't hesitate to just say "Internal Medicine." Every Cardiologist has to do general medicine anyway, and chances are you'll change your mind. When one interviews at a school that has an emphasis on urban under-served, feel free to "play up" growing up in an inner city, or emphasize that soup kitchen you worked in. Again, don't lie, but know what to emphasize and what to leave out.

... I wouldn't be surprised to hear that the OP is interviewing at a bunch of top programs, telling them how much s/he wants to do Dermatology, and wearing bright green suits.
 
koko_eats said:
So, so, so, so true.

My first interviewer immediately started talking about the most random thing without pausing. It took me several minutes to realize that he wasn't going to stop and that I would have to interrupt to put in my two-cents. Eventually, we started talking more about me but it took a lot of wasted time for me to realize that I needed to steer the conversation.
Click to expand...
at one of my interviews the guy just wanted to talk about his kids and their travels and spouses and educations and jobs. he was interrupting me to talk about them. i didnt really mind though. he kept apologizing to me for interrupting me and talking about his family. it was weird. super super nice guy. it wasnt like an interview. this was nice since my first interview of the day was nothing but a bombardment of ethical dilemma questions.
 
ZiplockFresh said:
I hope one of you guys can help me out. I am a traditional applicant applying to medical school with:

3.85 Cumulative GPA
3.85 Science GPA
35 MCAT (12-PS 10-V 13-BS)
TONS of important quality research and leadership positions

I have applied to 26 schools, and received about 12 interviews, including Pritzker, Duke, UVA, Case, NYU, etc. But all I have been receiving so far is waitlist after waitlist after waitlist.

My application is good, personal statement has been read by everyone I know, letters of recommendation are all from people I've known for years, and (most) of my interviewers really seemed to like me. Although some seemed uninterested, most of my interviews have been great. I applied a little late (finished all apps and secondaries by Mid Sept). But I am literally getting waitlisted everywhere and getting zero acceptances. And I also got waitlisted at my state school, which I am extremely competitive at.

My point is... I am going to have to reapply in the next cycle (Side question: Is it harder for reapplicants to get in medical school in comparison to first time applicants??)

However, I think a glaring flaw in my application is that I only have ONE clinical experience listed on my AMCAS. I volunteered at a hospital for maybe 2 months (at the time). Usually people have a lot more clinical experience than this right? Do you guys think this could be the flaw in my application? And can I fix this in the next couple of months before I reapply? Because I seriously cannot figure out why I am not getting accepted anywhere, even at schools I am highly competitive at.

Please someone enlighten me on what could possibly be wrong with my application. Does anyone have any idea why I'm not going to make it this cycle? I'm at a dead end. Thanks for the help in advance.

Oh by the way EDIT::

I don't think I'm "socially disabled" either. I am an MCAT Instructor for Kaplan Test Prep, and furthermore, many of my extracurriculars require me to frequently speak in front of large crowds. I love people. I know that's corny. 😀
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You have too many baller schools. Be honest what interviews have you actually gone on? And lastly, are you humble at all? The cockiest people are probably the easiest to see from a mile away. Do a reality check on yourself. I am being real because I am sure you want a real answer.
 
One other thing has come to mind:

some schools may be waitlisting you because they don't want to waste an acceptance letter on you because you are "too good" and likely to go to a more highly ranked school. (Schools are judged on how many offers it takes to fill the class.) So, one lower ranked school puts you on a waitlist thinking, "no sense making him an offer; he's likely to go to Harvard anyway". (Other schools find this a dumb strategy and make offers to the best, even if they seem likely to matriculate elsewhere provided the applicant appeared sincerely interested on interview day.)

If you don't have an offer by May 1, you need to start making regular contact with schools that are open to that type of thing, expressing your continued interest and a willingness to matriculate if an offer is made.
 
Like Jolie said, you could be affable and have lots of friends, but when it comes to crunch time in your interview, you might not be convincing enough for them to accept you. Flubbing the interview doesn't necessarily mean you're a social reject. They are most definitely looking for other factors as well.
 
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