3 year med school

[Adison]

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Hi,

Does anyone know any medical school, apart from Texas Tech and PCOM, that will offer the 3 year medical degree?

Thanks for your help.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

LECOM - But you're required to specialize in Family Med, Internal Med, or Pediatrics.

 

[MB333999]

McMaster in Ontario Canada

 

[Bacchus]

PCOM isn't 3 years.

 

[Mithril]

.

 

[hownowmauvecow]

Why do you want to do a 3 year plan over a 4 year plan? Will one year make that big of a difference? (Not trying to be snarky, I am just curious)

 

[nabeel76]

Hi,

Does anyone know any medical school, apart from Texas Tech and PCOM, that will offer the 3 year medical degree?

Thanks for your help.

What I never knew that this was possible anywhere. Is Texas Tech an MD granting school or DO? Also I am assuming that they still cover just as much info as the 4 year schools so would the three years be more intense?

 

[mulberry]

What, is it a tri-semester school with classes going into the summer?

some international schools that run a tri-semester curriculum finish basic sciences in 16 months.

 

[deleted357625]

I would def take a 3 yr track over and 4 yr school. Hmm i always thought about this, but never knew there were any schools that did it.

Also, i just found that Lake Erie College of Osteopathic medicine offers a 3 yr
But, yea the 3 yr tracks tend to lean only if you want to get into primary care etc

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

What I never knew that this was possible anywhere. Is Texas Tech an MD granting school or DO? Also I am assuming that they still cover just as much info as the 4 year schools so would the three years be more intense?

They are programs designed to minimize debt for PCP's. They have the regular 2 years of academics and then do 1 year of primary care rotations. If you're completely bent on Primary career i.e Pediatrics, IM, or FM then it's a probably a great idea.

 

[deleted357625]

They are programs designed to minimize debt for PCP's. They have the regular 2 years of academics and then do 1 year of primary care rotations. If you're completely bent on Primary career i.e Pediatrics, IM, or FM then it's a probably a great idea.

So the 3 yr tracks mainly revolve around the specialties? Do you think they might change it in the future so that some schools will offer 3 yr tracks for any specialty?

 

[mulberry]

So the 3 yr tracks mainly revolve around the specialties? Do you think they might change it in the future so that some schools will offer 3 yr tracks for any specialty?

Not in the US. Extremely doubtful.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

So the 3 yr tracks mainly revolve around the specialties? Do you think they might change it in the future so that some schools will offer 3 yr tracks for any specialty?

Seeing as the way they cut out a year is by removing all non-primary care rotations. I would find it unlikely.

 

[deleted357625]

Seeing as the way they cut out a year is by removing specialty rotations. I would assume no.

I was getting all excited and shizz, but oh well.

 

[mulberry]

Seeing as the way they cut out a year is by removing specialty rotations. I would assume no.

Is this factual evidence or are you just assuming they dont have to rotate their cores/electives in specialties?! I disagree but I could be wrong.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Is this factual evidence or are you just assuming they dont have to rotate their cores/electives in specialties?! I disagree but I could be wrong.

Well this is what the LECOM 3 year program does and I assume the North Texas program is the same. I mean they aren't going to cut out the first 2 years as they need time for Comlex/usmle. So their only choice is to remove time for the 3rd and 4th years.

 

[hownowmauvecow]

What I never knew that this was possible anywhere. Is Texas Tech an MD granting school or DO? Also I am assuming that they still cover just as much info as the 4 year schools so would the three years be more intense?

Texas Tech Lubbock and Texas Tech El Paso are both MD granting schools (I wasn't sure which one you were referring to). I am not sure if this is applicable to the 3 year program or not but public medical schools in Texas have a state mandated policy of only having 10% of OSS in their classes. So if you are not a resident, you will generally have to have pretty decent stats to get into an instate school (though for tech you might be able to get away with slight lower stats than you would at say UT Southwestern).

 

[Adison]

Thanks everyone 🙂

But I just wanted to know if there are any universities in the US and in Canada, apart from Texas Tech, University of Calgary, MacMaster and LECOM that will offer a 3 year medical degree in the future?

Also do you know if the degree in medicine at the University of Calgary is a recognised degree?

 

[Mithril]

.

 

[mvenus929]

Well this is what the LECOM 3 year program does and I assume the North Texas program is the same. I mean they aren't going to cut out the first 2 years as they need time for Comlex/usmle. So their only choice is to remove time for the 3rd and 4th years.

Just for the record, my school (which does not offer a 3 year degree) does basic sciences in 18 months. If we cut down the summer break to one week instead of 7, we could even take our boards at the end of December and start clinicals in January. It won't happen (at least, not anytime soon), but it is possible.

 

[TexasPhysician]

I believe Texas Tech is the first MD school to offer this in the US. The catch - mandatory PCP residency. You are not eligible for anything else.

 

[gettheleadout]

The bottom line here is if you want to go to school in the U.S. and aren't set on primary care, accept that it will take 4 years of school and know that it will be better for you anyway.

 

[ruiner]

There used to be lots of accelerated schools (maybe not lots, but they were around). Loyola was one. The ortho who wrote Hot lights, cold steel (might have the name transposed hah, been awhile) did it. don't expect them to make a giant return.

 

[Mithril]

.

 

[taylormade2006]

University of MN has a flexible program where you can go anywhere from 3.5 - 6 years for an MD and pay the same price as 4 year students.

http://www.meded.umn.edu/flexmd/index.php

 

[MilkmanAl]

So the 3 yr tracks mainly revolve around the specialties? Do you think they might change it in the future so that some schools will offer 3 yr tracks for any specialty?

In a sense, Duke already sort of has a 3 year program (one year of basic science and 2 clinical years), but they require you to spend a year doing research. Realistically, there isn't any reason that schools couldn't dispose with the BS and cram all the basic sciences into one year. Thanks to the "I had to do it, so you do too" inertia of medical education, it'll never happen, but it's certainly nice to know that it's at least possible. I'd sure like to save a year of studying if I could.

 

[meanderthal]

Texas Tech @ Lubbock has the F-MAT program and you must rank their Family Practice (I think) residency first.

http://www.ttuhsc.edu/newsevents/2010/march/fmat.aspx

 

[mitchlucker]

In a sense, Duke already sort of has a 3 year program (one year of basic science and 2 clinical years), but they require you to spend a year doing research. Realistically, there isn't any reason that schools couldn't dispose with the BS and cram all the basic sciences into one year. Thanks to the "I had to do it, so you do too" inertia of medical education, it'll never happen, but it's certainly nice to know that it's at least possible. I'd sure like to save a year of studying if I could.

I don't understand it at all. Undergrad should be ~2 years. Too many useless classes.

I can't speak from a Med school standpoint, but it seems like it could all be shortened.

No reason people have to be ~26-28 when they're finishing med school ... could easily be 24-26 and save some time ... I think it would produce better physicians honestly.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I don't understand it at all. Undergrad should be ~2 years. Too many useless classes.

I can't speak from a Med school standpoint, but it seems like it could all be shortened.

No reason people have to be ~26-28 when they're finishing med school ... could easily be 24-26 and save some time ... I think it would produce better physicians honestly.

What makes you assume that?
You see undergrad as a train spot along the way to medical school. I see undergrad as the time when you make yourself and develop while having the greatest time of your life. Sure you'll take 'useless' classes but you'll have fun and think of things you've never probably thought about. This is versus going to medical just after 2 years and never having the time to actually socialize or have fun. In my opinion it'll produce some socially awkward and depressed physicians.

 

[circulus vitios]

Thanks to the "I had to do it, so you do too" inertia of medical education, it'll never happen, but it's certainly nice to know that it's at least possible.

Don't you just love that reasoning? "The world is full of this kind of dumb smart-alec who doesn't understand anything."

 

[WingedOx]

I don't understand it at all. Undergrad should be ~2 years. Too many useless classes.

I can't speak from a Med school standpoint, but it seems like it could all be shortened.

No reason people have to be ~26-28 when they're finishing med school ... could easily be 24-26 and save some time ... I think it would produce better physicians honestly.

you sound like a Chinese mother.... (see other thread)

 

[mitchlucker]

What makes you assume that?
You see undergrad as a train spot along the way to medical school. I see undergrad as the time when you make yourself and develop while having the greatest time of your life. Sure you'll take 'useless' classes but you'll have fun and think of things you've never probably thought about. This is versus going to medical just after 2 years and never having the time to actually socialize or have fun. In my opinion it'll produce some socially awkward and depressed physicians.

Maybe with people who are socially inept to begin with?

I'm not saying ULTRA condense the 4 years into 2, just make it 2 years period.

I think you misunderstood or I wasn't clear enough, but the system should be more like Pharmacy, where you can enter a 6 year program.

I just don't like the prospect of having to obtain a bachelors first, when it will be useless when you have a doctorate. I think we should just cut out some of that and fast-forward to the penultimate goal.

Life doesn't end once you complete undergrad.

What makes me say it would produce better physicians is because it would allow people to get out into the field faster with really the same knowledge. Younger people with spongier brains in their residency. Younger people not having to worry about loans and debt from school.

And I don't know why I sounded like a Chinese mother...I'm not telling anyone to do things they don't want to, I'm just saying you should be able to more quickly pursue the things you do with less roadblocks...(not that these are always a bad thing, but I'm sure we can all see when a pointless one comes up...)

 

[WingedOx]

Maybe with people who are socially inept to begin with?

I'm not saying ULTRA condense the 4 years into 2, just make it 2 years period.

I think you misunderstood or I wasn't clear enough, but the system should be more like Pharmacy, where you can enter a 6 year program.

I just don't like the prospect of having to obtain a bachelors first, when it will be useless when you have a doctorate. I think we should just cut out some of that and fast-forward to the penultimate goal.

Life doesn't end once you complete undergrad.

What makes me say it would produce better physicians is because it would allow people to get out into the field faster with really the same knowledge. Younger people with spongier brains in their residency. Younger people not having to worry about loans and debt from school.

And I don't know why I sounded like a Chinese mother...I'm not telling anyone to do things they don't want to, I'm just saying you should be able to more quickly pursue the things you do with less roadblocks...(not that these are always a bad thing, but I'm sure we can all see when a pointless one comes up...)

well I was going to write "you sound asian" but I figured such a response would bring out the ban-hammer. Our American system of education requires a bachelor's degree because it is assumed that an applicant is an adult before he ever sets foot in a med school. Those roadblocks are there for a reason. I don't want people entering medical school until they've fully examined their decision, and proven their academic maturity in acquiring their degree. Assuming one never has a gap year, they graduate at age 25-26. Not sure how old you are, but when I started college that seemed to be really old... now it really seems young.

 

[mitchlucker]

well I was going to write "you sound asian" but I figured such a response would bring out the ban-hammer. Our American system of education requires a bachelor's degree because it is assumed that an applicant is an adult before he ever sets foot in a med school. Those roadblocks are there for a reason. I don't want people entering medical school until they've fully examined their decision, and proven their academic maturity in acquiring their degree. Assuming one never has a gap year, they graduate at age 25-26. Not sure how old you are, but when I started college that seemed to be really old... now it really seems young.

I'm 21 now with a BS in Biology and I'm not Asian haha. You have a point with the maturity factor, I know medicine is what I want to do but I'm not ready for the commitment just yet. But what I was getting at was that if someone is ready I don't see the point in making them stay the extra years as an UG.

It's like being in a relationship, and you could see yourself marrying the person you're with, it's just your personal goals and peripheral life are in the way so you have to postpone it.

Do I think that postponing is a bad thing? Yes and no. Just like the BS or BA before med school is...there are pros and cons...I just don't see why if there is an options for some 6 year professional programs there shouldn't be ones for others.

Do we not expect other professions to have the same maturity about their decisions?

 

[Mithril]

.

 

[Kevin Baker]

I just don't like the prospect of having to obtain a bachelors first, when it will be useless when you have a doctorate. I think we should just cut out some of that and fast-forward to the penultimate goal.

Life doesn't end once you complete undergrad.

What makes me say it would produce better physicians is because it would allow people to get out into the field faster with really the same knowledge. Younger people with spongier brains in their residency. Younger people not having to worry about loans and debt from school.

I understand your argument but I think you're missing the point of undergrad if you think that the experience is useless for those with a doctorate.

I can only speak for myself but, undergrad was partly about finding my academic interests, sampling a bit from every field (gosh darn GEs), partly about putting myself out there and getting involved in some awesome clubs, making some awesome memories and some embarrassing mistakes, and developing as a person, while seeing how all this academia fits into the real world. It's really cool when you get to a point and see how grey the world is: How history and politics and literature and philosophy and social science and physical science aren't these mutually exclusive fields but are all aspects of the same inter-disciplinary and inter-related thing... the human experience.

I think it's almost criminal how many pre-meds, right now, aren't required to take these GE classes, or don't take them seriously, as we get stuck with a bunch of bean counters who are experts in their little specialty but can't see the big picture, or empathize with other viewpoints. 6 year programs would only exacerbate our shortage of humanistic physicians. And if this argument seems a bit bohemian to you (it seems that way typing it out 🙂, look at how we handle rotations in med school. You can have a lifelong dream to be a dermatologist, but you still have to rotate through the other specialties and gain some general competence in all these other fields, as the medical establishment has decided long ago that every doctor should have some generalist training.

Granted, there are pros and cons of any system, as you state, but there is no shortage of applicants. Better to increase the quality of the incoming student body and force some ambitious 20 year old to take a few extra classes.

 

[mvenus929]

My school had an alumni weekend back in the fall, and during one of the events, there was a discussion about how medical education should be done. Also, there have been discussions at my school (or so I hear) about changing the requirements for admission.

Some people argue that you don't need, and shouldn't take, science courses prior to coming to medical school, because you learn all the science you need to know in the first two years. Others argue that you don't need four years in medical school and should spend more time in a residency type situation.

I say the rest with the following in mind: I graduated from college at 20, and thought I was enormously mature for my age. And I was... I was a second parent for all intents and purposes, and had to grow up much faster than my peers, so I never felt entirely comfortable with people my own age.

If we were to change the structure of medical education, I could agree that you don't need to spend four years in college to become a good doctor. But, I'd also agree that in general, 20 is too young to start medical school, at least the way we have things structured now. Rather, I think that everyone should be forced to work full time either before college or between college and a graduate degree. That would most certainly force people to grow up and realize what working in the real world is like, and make them appreciate school even more. I know I do.

 

[circulus vitios]

Is maturity another word for your new personality after having your soul crushed by the real world? I took a year off after high school to work. The only difference between me at 17 years old and me at 21 years old is my contempt and bitterness for the "real world."

 

[HumbleMD]

Hi,

Does anyone know any medical school, apart from Texas Tech and PCOM, that will offer the 3 year medical degree?

Thanks for your help.

None that are worth applying to.

 

[Adison]

Thanks everyone 🙂