A good amount of FMGs in cardio fellowships

[infarct]

Maybe I'm way off, but didn't cards use to pay a ton before? Or is that after a few years of practice? I've seen a number of ads for cardiologists in the 500k + range, and my understanding is that they made 600-700k a few years in. Has this changed or is this how this is now?

there are positions where you can still make this....in memphis/idaho/nebraska etc.

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[Eurostar]

You know the idea that everyone on Wall street is just raking it up is way way off. It's incredibly hard to get to the top where the big dogs make the big bucks. I have several people I know that have gone on to Wall Street and not only is the job security awful and nonexistent, but they work far more than most of us, and many of them do not make the money you think they do.

Also the idea that everyone in medicine would just strike it rich on Wall Street is also fundamentally wrong wrong wrong. The skills, personality, etc that's required on Wall Street is very different from what it takes to be a good doctor.

The grass is not always greener.

Most of my friends work in business in NYC - investment banking, trading, hedge funds, etc. For the past 7 years they have been making money and I have been paying it. For the next 3-4 years I'll be making ~60-80k in fellowship as they are into their prime earning years of over 300k. Most of them are investing in houses or apartments and have near $1mil in assets. I love what I do and would do it again, but the grass is certainly greener on the other side as far as salaries are concerned.

As far as your last point that everyone in medicine would strike it rich on Wall Street... I didnt say that. There are hard workers and talented people who come from good pedigrees in every field. Honestly, there are probably more talented people in finance, hedge funds, trading than in the medical field. This is because thats where the money is. If we keep cutting physicians salaries with medical school continuing to cost >$250k, the brain drain will become even worse. Getting back to the title of this thread, soon there may be only FMGs and NPs/PAs doing the majority of the medical care.

 

[DrAwsome]

As a comparison, if people know what general cardiologists and EP cardiologists to Heme/Onc. It is a no brainer. Heme/onc offers 6-8 weeks of vacation a year. No overnight emergencies compared to cardiology for the same amount of money.

Interventinal cards make more money but lifestyle is brutal.

This precisely. Heme/onc has gone under the radar for a longggg time, but it's a hidden gem in my opinion. It's mostly a clinic type gig, with some hospital rounding on weekdays/ends which kinda sucks but still not bad, they don't have to go in generally at night, etc.

There is a great need in some places where you can get a very high starting salary, and some places even offer assitance during the last 1-2 years of training! Saw a posting the other day for 400k + 2k/mo for the last 2 years of training for people in OK!!! Not bad!

I think interventional cards/cards in general has taken a huge hit lately, before they used to make a ton.

I think things have changed a lot in recent years. As always, people will likely seek after GI/Heme onc, those will be super competitive for a few years, then cards will have a huge need, which will make it competitive and lucrative, so people will go there. Like always, gotta get the specialty at the right pendular cycle!

 

[DrVanNostran]

This precisely. Heme/onc has gone under the radar for a longggg time, but it's a hidden gem in my opinion. It's mostly a clinic type gig, with some hospital rounding on weekdays/ends which kinda sucks but still not bad, they don't have to go in generally at night, etc.

There is a great need in some places where you can get a very high starting salary, and some places even offer assitance during the last 1-2 years of training! Saw a posting the other day for 400k + 2k/mo for the last 2 years of training for people in OK!!! Not bad!

I think interventional cards/cards in general has taken a huge hit lately, before they used to make a ton.

I think things have changed a lot in recent years. As always, people will likely seek after GI/Heme onc, those will be super competitive for a few years, then cards will have a huge need, which will make it competitive and lucrative, so people will go there. Like always, gotta get the specialty at the right pendular cycle!

Heme Onc is definitely becoming more competitive. H/O has some of the widest ranges of salaries you can find. Academics they probably start at 150-160s and clinical varies significantly with geography. But the SE has some great opportunities. I wonder how long the ride will last though.

P.S. Thanks for your PM. I will get back to you soon. My head is still spinning lol.

 

[asprin81]

Heme Onc is definitely becoming more competitive. H/O has some of the widest ranges of salaries you can find. Academics they probably start at 150-160s and clinical varies significantly with geography. But the SE has some great opportunities. I wonder how long the ride will last though.

P.S. Thanks for your PM. I will get back to you soon. My head is still spinning lol.

I am interviewing for non academic Hemonc jobs this year. Starting salaries offers (200k New Jersy/New York City to 500k Ohio/TN/OK) are almost same as cardiology and slightly less than GI with better lifestyle than both cardiology and GI

 

[intcards]

Cardiologist have a much higher earning potential than oncologists. That's not to say that all cardiologists will make more than all oncologists but the ceiling is higher. The reason is that you generate revenue by doing "stuff" not by seeing patients in the office. Cardiologists have more avenues to generate income: caths +/- PCI, peripheral vascular interventions, structural interventions, echo, stress echo, stress nuclear, holters, carotid/lower extremity duplex, abi + pvr, cardiac CT, ecp, evlt, etc.

 

[asprin81]

Cardiologist have a much higher earning potential than oncologists. That's not to say that all cardiologists will make more than all oncologists but the ceiling is higher. The reason is that you generate revenue by doing "stuff" not by seeing patients in the office. Cardiologists have more avenues to generate income: caths +/- PCI, peripheral vascular interventions, structural interventions, echo, stress echo, stress nuclear, holters, carotid/lower extremity duplex, abi + pvr, cardiac CT, ecp, evlt, etc.

Agree that cardiology have more procedures, but most oncologist revenue (dont come from seeing patients) rather come from chair time (with 20 people getting Chemo, IVF,neulasta,zometa,venofer,epo, in oncology office with 20 chair from 9am to 10am and each chair pay 100$/hr for oncology office with totalling 2000$/hr).......buy and selling chemo was big revenue for oncologist and some used to make 2 million plus before laws changed (similarly cath with stent doctor fee went from 6000 dollar to 325 dollar)...........No emergencies overnight are big plus in oncology and most pts cane come to oncology office after being diagnosed with cancer while in-pt

 

[DrVanNostran]

Agree that cardiology have more procedures, but most oncologist revenue (dont come from seeing patients) rather come from chair time (with 20 people getting Chemo, IVF,neulasta,zometa,venofer,epo, in oncology office with 20 chair from 9am to 10am and each chair pay 100$/hr for oncology office with totalling 2000$/hr).......buy and selling chemo was big revenue for oncologist and some used to make 2 million plus before laws changed (similarly cath with stent doctor fee went from 6000 dollar to 325 dollar)...........No emergencies overnight are big plus in oncology and most pts cane come to oncology office after being diagnosed with cancer while in-pt

This is what is under the microscope. I wonder how this all shakes out.

 

[ArcGurren]

Most of my friends work in business in NYC - investment banking, trading, hedge funds, etc. For the past 7 years they have been making money and I have been paying it. For the next 3-4 years I'll be making ~60-80k in fellowship as they are into their prime earning years of over 300k. Most of them are investing in houses or apartments and have near $1mil in assets. I love what I do and would do it again, but the grass is certainly greener on the other side as far as salaries are concerned.

As far as your last point that everyone in medicine would strike it rich on Wall Street... I didnt say that. There are hard workers and talented people who come from good pedigrees in every field. Honestly, there are probably more talented people in finance, hedge funds, trading than in the medical field. This is because thats where the money is. If we keep cutting physicians salaries with medical school continuing to cost >$250k, the brain drain will become even worse. Getting back to the title of this thread, soon there may be only FMGs and NPs/PAs doing the majority of the medical care.

For every person that you know who has struck it rich on wall street there are 10 who have bombed horribly. the fact that you know a lot of rich people on WS does not make it a representative sample.

 

[dozitgetchahi]

+1

And even those who bomb work horrendously awful hours. Wall Street can keep it.