A non ACGME fellowship? Can be real?

[DrAmir0078]

Hi SDN Anesthesiologists,
I hope you are doing well, it has been a while since I have posted here, I had been busy with my board graduation thesis completion, had premature boy twins on November 1st, and moving to another teaching center in Baghdad, and beside lots of headaches!

I was discussing with a colleague an hour ago, and he said "why you don't apply for a fellowship in the US, since you are American citizen?" - I didn't know if there is a way !

Then I started searching online and found some programs those are non ACGME fellowships !
Are such programs real? Non ECFMG or USMLEs required?
Do I need - literally - to be Einstein to get accepted, or work hard on myself to be Einstein minded? lol 😀

If it is true and as an American myself, have to ask direct question, but again as a desperate dreamer Iraqi guy have a tanker load of questions? Which one come first!

I am open to answers, yet I don't mind if I got depressed or disappointed too; life is pretty whatsoever here ! - being sarcastic !

I found these links, with quick searches and I believe there are plenty too and I believe they are pretty competitive - technically my IQ won't go beyond 100, but I can promise you to make it 101 if there is 1% hope to get from the hell-heaven like here. Please try not to underestimate 1% - it means a lot to me even if it is a white lie (I accept the challenge to uplifting my feelings in such hell)!

Let me show you these links:

Non ACGME | UCSF Dept of Anesthesia

anesthesia.ucsf.edu

About the Program | Graduate Medical Education

Regional anesthesia training is a subspecialty focused on the perioperative management of patients receiving neuraxial or peripheral neural blockade for anesthesia or analgesia. This fellowship program will ensure the ongoing development of regional anesthesia as a defined subspecialty. Research...

gme.medicine.uiowa.edu

Regional Pain Anesthesiology

University of Colorado School of Medicine Anschutz Medical Campus Department of Anesthesiology Fellowships Regional Pain Anesthesiology

medschool.cuanschutz.edu

Pediatric Regional Anesthesia Fellowship

The Pediatric Regional Anesthesia Fellowship is offered to current anesthesia trainees and practitioners to provide further training in delivering safe, effective and successful pediatric regional anesthesia.

www.nationwidechildrens.org

What do you think?

Sincerely,
Amir

P. S. Excuse my ignorance !

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[NICMAN]

Beware, academic departments are addicted to cheap labor (resident and fellow). A lot of these “fellowships” are simply a way they can trick people to work for $250,000 less than they are worth.

 

[DrAmir0078]

Beware, academic departments are addicted to cheap labor (resident and fellow). A lot of these “fellowships” are simply a way they can trick people to work for $250,000 less than they are worth.

Thank you for answering. Honestly, myself - it is not how much they pay, it is how much I can learn in a clean oriented environment. Comparison between here and there with a p value < 0.05 towards there !
Such a desperate need for true learning !

 

[JiPo]

I don’t know the logistics but I have seen a foreign medical graduate that has been practicing as an attending in his country doing a nonaccredited fellowship in the US. So i assume it is possible.

I would be VERY wary though. Non-accredited means there is no standard or protection. They can promise you that you will be doing big and educational cases, and once you get here, just abuse you as cheap labor in cases with minimal learning.

The fellowship you are looking for should have a track record of people pursuing the fellowship on a regular basis with structured didactics. You should definitely ask if you can talk to recent graduates of the fellowship.

I would not recommend a non-acgme fellowship where they get a fellow every 2-3 years. That alone is a red flag to me. There must be a reason why no one does that particular fellowship.

You are a nice guy and I appreciate your posts. I am afraid that you may get taken advantage of, so I recommend a very through research into it if you are considering a US non-accredited fellowship.

 

[JiPo]

I should also add that some mon-accredited fellowships are “super” fellowship where they want you to have completed a fellowship before (ex. Pediatric hearts)

 

[DrAmir0078]

I should also add that some mon-accredited fellowships are “super” fellowship where they want you to have completed a fellowship before (ex. Pediatric hearts)

Thanks for the advice of your both comments.
I have no connections to ask - only virtually here with great people, and this thread - hoping - would bring up thoughts.
I don't mind working long hours, less compensated and if in a State that would offer post fellowship positions too, it is great opportunity especially if I immersed myself into researches later.
I will work hard to get graduated from here first, and as they say "the drowning man hangs to a straw" - it is simply a Hope!

 

[deleted697127]

Disagree with above. Regional being the most common non-acgme fellowship, but others include trauma, liver, neuro, echo. Utah’s echo fellowship is uniquely awesome although likely competitive and unclear endgame post fellowship. Some would argue regional has benefits to being unaccredited that i won’t get into in this post. Plenty of posts about it in the past on this forum.

It happens outside of anesthesia as well. I have seen several foreign medical grad fellows stay on after fellowship for permanent positions. Often times, they are only allowed to work for one specific hospital. It’s definitely a real thing and happens at prestigious programs. May be a reason to choose wisely before taking a position if your goal is staying as some of the prestigious institutions pay do not tend to pay well.

 

[IMGASMD]

Disagree with above. Regional being the most common non-acgme fellowship, but others include trauma, liver, neuro, echo. Utah’s echo fellowship is uniquely awesome although likely competitive and unclear endgame post fellowship. Some would argue regional has benefits to being unaccredited that i won’t get into in this post. Plenty of posts about it in the past on this forum.

It happens outside of anesthesia as well. I have seen several foreign medical grad fellows stay on after fellowship for permanent positions. Often times, they are only allowed to work for one specific hospital. It’s definitely a real thing and happens at prestigious programs. May be a reason to choose wisely before taking a position if your goal is staying as some of the prestigious institutions pay do not tend to pay well.

You’d have to take account that some of these foreign doctors, just want to get out. People don’t like to say it out loud, but they just want to get out of their country and stay in the US regardless the means. Even if they make 100K as the institutional slave, it IS still much more than what they make at home.

There has been threads here about some of the “fellowships” without residency, and they’re institution bound. They’re not allowed to work anywhere else, but they can become faculty somehow….. I think it’s f-ed up, but to each their own.

 

[DrAmir0078]

Disagree with above. Regional being the most common non-acgme fellowship, but others include trauma, liver, neuro, echo. Utah’s echo fellowship is uniquely awesome although likely competitive and unclear endgame post fellowship. Some would argue regional has benefits to being unaccredited that i won’t get into in this post. Plenty of posts about it in the past on this forum.

It happens outside of anesthesia as well. I have seen several foreign medical grad fellows stay on after fellowship for permanent positions. Often times, they are only allowed to work for one specific hospital. It’s definitely a real thing and happens at prestigious programs. May be a reason to choose wisely before taking a position if your goal is staying as some of the prestigious institutions pay do not tend to pay well.

Thanks for the answer... Interesting fields to practice, if I am that lucky, I'll go for 5 fellowship each one is different : Anesthesiology, Ob, truama, echo, regional and finally Global Anesthesiology 😀
Those like 5 to 6 years practice, and you can imagine how many knowledge I can get and would ended up with something...
Impulsive thoughts and a bit dramatic, but as long as I can find myself!

 

[coffeebythelake]

We've had a fair number of foreign medical graduates do nonaccredited fellowships at the hospital. Some of them end up finding work and staying in the USA afterwards. Some do a series of fellowships one after another. There is a good deal of uncertainty but if you don't have any other reasonable shot and you really want to practice in America this might be one way.

 

[nimbus]

Thanks for the advice of your both comments.
I have no connections to ask - only virtually here with great people, and this thread - hoping - would bring up thoughts.
I don't mind working long hours, less compensated and if in a State that would offer post fellowship positions too, it is great opportunity especially if I immersed myself into researches later.
I will work hard to get graduated from here first, and as they say "the drowning man hangs to a straw" - it is simply a Hope!

It can be a good opportunity to transition back to the United States. I know people who were fully trained abroad, then did clinical fellowship or research fellowship followed by repeat residency, then became board certified.

 

[DrAmir0078]

You’d have to take account that some of these foreign doctors, just want to get out. People don’t like to say it out loud, but they just want to get out of their country and stay in the US regardless the means. Even if they make 100K as the institutional slave, it IS still much more than what they make at home.

There has been threads here about some of the “fellowships” without residency, and they’re institution bound. They’re not allowed to work anywhere else, but they can become faculty somehow….. I think it’s f-ed up, but to each their own.

Yes, it is true, everybody seek his dream somewhere, fleeing their Countries aren't a funny thing neither! Politics brings headache !

 

[DrAmir0078]

We've had a fair number of foreign medical graduates do nonaccredited fellowships at the hospital. Some of them end up finding work and staying in the USA afterwards. Some do a series of fellowships one after another. There is a good deal of uncertainty but if you don't have any other reasonable shot and you really want to practice in America this might be one way.

It is promising!
Thanks for the info Dr. Coffeebythelake ... Who knows, one day I can practice with science !

 

[DrAmir0078]

It can be a good opportunity to transition back to the United States. I know people who were fully trained abroad, then did clinical fellowship or research fellowship followed by repeat residency, then became board certified.

Yes Dr. Nimbus, I can't wait to think bold about it in a year from now.

 

[Sleeplessbordernights]

Tbh I would love to do a fellowship in USA and then comeback to my country, I’m not interested in staying in USA to work or live, just the training

 

[nimbus]

Tbh I would love to do a fellowship in USA and then comeback to my country, I’m not interested in staying in USA to work or live, just the training

I have seen many examples of this too.

 

[vector2]

I think there's a few non-ACGME thoracic anesthesia fellowships floating around as well

 

[Sleeplessbordernights]

I have seen many examples of this too.

I would love to know more about that, the logistics seems difficult

 

[nimbus]

I would love to know more about that, the logistics seems difficult

Research and clinical fellows from Germany, New Zealand, Japan, China, and Brazil spent time training in the US. Some ended up staying in US and some returned to home country.

 

[Sleeplessbordernights]

Research and clinical fellows from Germany, New Zealand, Japan, China, and Brazil spent time training in the US. Some ended up staying in US and some returned to home country.

I ‘d love to Train in USA and return to my country but that seems something reserved for súperstars

 

[coffeebythelake]

I ‘d love to Train in USA and return to my country but that seems something reserved for súperstars

I can tell you that is categorically false. Even big name programs are hurting to fill some of their fellowship spots and will take internationals without much competition. J1 visa pretty easy.

 

[DrAmir0078]

From my understanding, it is possible !
An Iraqi Board graduate, and a US citizen with hopefully mediocre resume and training over the years to get accepted?
Honestly, I don't mind doing one fellowship and another one, so I can guarantee good experience and to stay in my second Home USA and with great deal to work on enhancing future practice in my Home Country Iraq.
I am optimistic!
Stay Optimistic???

 

[JiPo]

Disagree with above. Regional being the most common non-acgme fellowship, but others include trauma, liver, neuro, echo. Utah’s echo fellowship is uniquely awesome although likely competitive and unclear endgame post fellowship. Some would argue regional has benefits to being unaccredited that i won’t get into in this post. Plenty of posts about it in the past on this forum.

It happens outside of anesthesia as well. I have seen several foreign medical grad fellows stay on after fellowship for permanent positions. Often times, they are only allowed to work for one specific hospital. It’s definitely a real thing and happens at prestigious programs. May be a reason to choose wisely before taking a position if your goal is staying as some of the prestigious institutions pay do not tend to pay well.

The fellowship you are looking for should have a track record of people pursuing the fellowship on a regular basis with structured didactics. You should definitely ask if you can talk to recent graduates of the fellowship.

All of those legitimate non-acgme fellowships have what I wrote above. If fellowships dont offer structured didactics with fellows actually getting educational cases, they are just looking for cheap labor.

 

[Planktonmd]

If your goal is to stay and practice anesthesiology in the U.S. for the rest of your career, then you should pass the USMLE and apply for a residency program and become board certified. Also USMLE is required to become licensed to practice medicine in all states.
That non accredited fellowship thing is not going to get you where you want unless your goal is to work for a few years, gain experience, and return to Iraq.

 

[coffeebythelake]

If your goal is to stay and practice anesthesiology in the U.S. for the rest of your career, then you should pass the USMLE and apply for a residency program and become board certified. Also USMLE is required to become licensed to practice medicine in all states.
That non accredited fellowship thing is not going to get you where you want unless your goal is to work for a few years, gain experience, and return to Iraq.

I've seen some international medical grads Start by doing fellowships and when they have their foot in the door they are applying for residencies. Gettjng into a residency program is actually more difficult to do. I know it's convoluted.

I've also heard of some IMGs do a series of fellowships one after another. In certain states the accumulated years can count towards being able to work in an academic setting without actually doing a residency. (Arkansas being one state I believe). Amir, do some due diligence and look this up. I know of 2 IMGs that have stayed in USA without doing a residency and this is the path they took

 

[DrAmir0078]

If your goal is to stay and practice anesthesiology in the U.S. for the rest of your career, then you should pass the USMLE and apply for a residency program and become board certified. Also USMLE is required to become licensed to practice medicine in all states.
That non accredited fellowship thing is not going to get you where you want unless your goal is to work for a few years, gain experience, and return to Iraq.

Thanks Dr. Planktonmd,
Sounds like a great idea, few years of experience in the US means a lot and surely going back to Iraq - it would open another opportunities (not only in Iraq or the gulf region) and I like teaching. The whole idea is to get a strong background of practice, knowing what is the best. Honestly, I am not wasting my time for leisure, but for science which is worth it.
You know Sir, there is EDIAC path (once I can get it, I can practice in UK or Europe) - if I am organized and that lucky will ended up with more opportunities in my Country.

 

[DrAmir0078]

I've seen some international medical grads Start by doing fellowships and when they have their foot in the door they are applying for residencies. Gettjng into a residency program is actually more difficult to do. I know it's convoluted.

I've also heard of some IMGs do a series of fellowships one after another. In certain states the accumulated years can count towards being able to work in an academic setting without actually doing a residency. (Arkansas being one state I believe). Amir, do some due diligence and look this up. I know of 2 IMGs that have stayed in USA without doing a residency and this is the path they took

Thank you Dr. Coffeebythelake for the encouragement, I will try my best to think bold, it is not only words to write, it is devotion. You have seen me all here, and I have a long story to tell from Iraq post war to USA years and back home, and the bottom line is I need to do "change".

 

[deleted697127]

I've seen some international medical grads Start by doing fellowships and when they have their foot in the door they are applying for residencies. Gettjng into a residency program is actually more difficult to do. I know it's convoluted.

I've also heard of some IMGs do a series of fellowships one after another. In certain states the accumulated years can count towards being able to work in an academic setting without actually doing a residency. (Arkansas being one state I believe). Amir, do some due diligence and look this up. I know of 2 IMGs that have stayed in USA without doing a residency and this is the path they took

Same. Some of you guys act like people are only out to screw you. These programs can be mutually beneficial for all parties involved. They don’t have to be abusive. I’ve seen several people use their research and connections to create international speaking/teaching roles and institutional partnerships. Some of the big programs are very much into having a global impact. Some of the leaders of our field are in fact, international grads themselves. If you have balls, you can network and make sh*% happen.

 

[DrAmir0078]

Same. Some of you guys act like people are only out to screw you. These programs can be mutually beneficial for all parties involved. They don’t have to be abusive. I’ve seen several people use their research and connections to create international speaking/teaching roles and institutional partnerships. Some of the big programs are very much into having a global impact. Some of the leaders of our field are in fact, international grads themselves. If you have balls, you can network and make sh*% happen.

"connections" = miracles these days !

 

[nimbus]

Same. Some of you guys act like people are only out to screw you. These programs can be mutually beneficial for all parties involved. They don’t have to be abusive. I’ve seen several people use their research and connections to create international speaking/teaching roles and institutional partnerships. Some of the big programs are very much into having a global impact. Some of the leaders of our field are in fact, international grads themselves. If you have balls, you can network and make sh*% happen.

I think of an echo guru in Seattle who fits exactly that description.

 

[vector2]

I think of an echo guru in Seattle who fits exactly that description.

Oxorn? Aren't Canadian IMGs treated differently?

 

[deleted697127]

Oxorn? Aren't Canadian IMGs treated differently?

I don’t think so. Canadians who train here get put through the ringer going back to Canada.

 

[deleted697127]

"connections" = miracles these days !

You are the connection my friend. If you can make it to some conferences, I’m sure you can find someone interested in coming out to Iraq for a week to shadow in the Or and give guest lectures. People are interested in this. International opportunities for residents at least were a hot topic on interview day back in the day when I was interviewing. Unclear how COVID has changed things because I’ve been out of the academic game for a while, but people are only getting more accepting of DOs and IMGs.

 

[vector2]

I don’t think so. Canadians who train here get put through the ringer going back to Canada.

No I meant aren't Canadians who went to med school and trained in Canada and then do some fellowship here exempt from some of the rigmarole that other IMGs have to go through (like all the USMLEs etc)?

 

[DrAmir0078]

You are the connection my friend. If you can make it to some conferences, I’m sure you can find someone interested in coming out to Iraq for a week to shadow in the Or and give guest lectures. People are interested in this. International opportunities for residents at least were a hot topic on interview day back in the day when I was interviewing. Unclear how COVID has changed things because I’ve been out of the academic game for a while, but people are only getting more accepting of DOs and IMGs.

Me, myself a connection !
That is a potential - promising - I didn't think of it, I am a very tiny guy, and thanks for your trust in me. But honestly - I have written here my cases, my views about working in limited resources - I have learnt a lot from you all, I built a bridge of mutual respect, I feel safe here and I don't know if that can be another potential. I keep trying and trying - and I would love to host you in my Country, but do you know when? Once I am on my feet... I said it up - I need to pursue "Change" in the practice of Anesthesia in my Country, yet we are doing great things, but I feel there are more to be done.
Thank you.

 

[Justice4all]

It is a starting point if you would like to practice in the US. 1-2 years as a international fellow and apply for US residency with support of staff, usually better than going without USCE

 

[nimbus]

Oxorn? Aren't Canadian IMGs treated differently?

Mackensen

 

[DrAmir0078]

It is a starting point if you would like to practice in the US. 1-2 years as a international fellow and apply for US residency with support of staff, usually better than going without USCE

That is promising too... Isn't far from reality!
Thanks

 

[DrAmir0078]

So an update,
I am encouraging a genius Iraqi and Arabic Board graduate a friend of mine Class 2019 - 2020 and he passed first MCQs FRCA (primary) to think bold and to apply for non ACGME fellowship.
He is one of the kind smart Anesthesiologist / Intensivist I personally knew and he was taught at Baghdad Medical City Complex (The prestigious Medical City in Iraq - like Boston General in its rigorous training) - he is on the top 10 of his class in the Arabic Board residency program and also at the same time passed the Iraqi Board residency program all exams.
If he could make it, that would be awesome !
He also wants to pass oral viva FRCA too and I am blindly sure he can do it with ease, he is very ambitious. I am so proud of him. He will be a great asset.

 

[IlDestriero]

There are definitely programs available at many well known institutions to train foreign grads. Some stay on as staff for a period of time, and then go home. I don’t know the details involved in that but I’ve worked with them in the past. For someone trying to get licensed in the USA and ultimately retrain here that might be a great option to get your foot in the door, get connected with a big name program, and pass the USMLE while getting paid. But that’s a long and hard road.
If you want to get training and experience here and go back to Iraq or wherever, that’s even easier. Perhaps you are “abused” with lower income, but you get invaluable experience that could be transformative back at home. I feel like the future in Iraq could be much brighter than say Afghanistan.
As for hosting lecturers, workshops, etc. in your hospital that’s also very possible, but from my experience the issue is often what percent of the potential learners are fluent in English. It’s easy to find people to come abroad to lecture in English or Spanish, other than that it’s going to be a challenge. One prominent colleague of mine gave a lecture in Japan to a nearly empty room because the attendees didn’t want to hear a lecture in English. We were going to do a workshop there and cancelled it. Safety fears are real as well, but one of the surgeons I work with has been all over Iraq and Iran, Pakistan, etc. for many years, though he is well connected in the region there.
If you are an American citizen, it might be easier for you than you think to come over to train because that’s not a hurdle for you to overcome, and obviously your English is strong.

 

[DrAmir0078]

There are definitely programs available at many well known institutions to train foreign grads. Some stay on as staff for a period of time, and then go home. I don’t know the details involved in that but I’ve worked with them in the past. For someone trying to get licensed in the USA and ultimately retrain here that might be a great option to get your foot in the door, get connected with a big name program, and pass the USMLE while getting paid. But that’s a long and hard road.
If you want to get training and experience here and go back to Iraq or wherever, that’s even easier. Perhaps you are “abused” with lower income, but you get invaluable experience that could be transformative back at home. I feel like the future in Iraq could be much brighter than say Afghanistan.
As for hosting lecturers, workshops, etc. in your hospital that’s also very possible, but from my experience the issue is often what percent of the potential learners are fluent in English. It’s easy to find people to come abroad to lecture in English or Spanish, other than that it’s going to be a challenge. One prominent colleague of mine gave a lecture in Japan to a nearly empty room because the attendees didn’t want to hear a lecture in English. We were going to do a workshop there and cancelled it. Safety fears are real as well, but one of the surgeons I work with has been all over Iraq and Iran, Pakistan, etc. for many years, though he is well connected in the region there.
If you are an American citizen, it might be easier for you than you think to come over to train because that’s not a hurdle for you to overcome, and obviously your English is strong.

Me and all my close friends are eager to learn and get the full picture; we work in a limited resources and we save lives. In Iraq, all our Medical schools are English curriculum based and we are simply upper intermediate fluency and can pass English exams as well like OET, and like myself when one day back in 2014 when I applied for a master degree in health informatics (dropped off in the first semester), I got 89/120 in toefl (My master requires 79)with one month preparation only, although ECFMG doesn't require toefl anymore from Countries like Iraq.
The whole idea is to get well trained, it is priceless to get an opportunity in the US, and we are aware of the low income, but that eagerness to learn overweight!
Yes, USMLEs path is a long journey, but it is worth it, and sometimes hard to get matched especially when you are a graduate years ago (me in 2002) despite being a US citizen!
We are looking for a 'Change' and as you said Iraq might have a brighter future, and yet we have dedicated Professors, but we want to put on footprint in a way of "Change", we are good-hearted people, humble, love to learn and grow to teach for the sake of this field's love to save lives. We believe in Anesthesia as we believe in our ability.
Thank you so much.

 

[Mehd School]

If your goal is to stay and practice anesthesiology in the U.S. for the rest of your career, then you should pass the USMLE and apply for a residency program and become board certified. Also USMLE is required to become licensed to practice medicine in all states.
That non accredited fellowship thing is not going to get you where you want unless your goal is to work for a few years, gain experience, and return to Iraq.

Can't believe it took this far for someone to comment. I'm not sure what your intention is by doing the fellowship because in one post you stated its just for the education but another comment said maybe you'd be able to find a spot after fellowship. You cannot practice medicine in the US unless you completed a residency program here (except for a very limited number of specialities, anesthesia not being one of them). We have a resident in my program that's from the middle east who was a consultant anesthesiologist in her home country for 20 years. She moved here because a family member has a unique disease and the world expert is at my hospital.

 

[DrAmir0078]

Can't believe it took this far for someone to comment. I'm not sure what your intention is by doing the fellowship because in one post you stated its just for the education but another comment said maybe you'd be able to find a spot after fellowship. You cannot practice medicine in the US unless you completed a residency program here (except for a very limited number of specialities, anesthesia not being one of them). We have a resident in my program that's from the middle east who was a consultant anesthesiologist in her home country for 20 years. She moved here because a family member has a unique disease and the world expert is at my hospital.

Yes, you right? at the beginning I was questioning its reality and then questioned a possibility to stay, did I make a sin !
Lots of comments over here and I am getting the info. What's wrong with getting the education and go back home or to stay if I proved myself - and regardless of being an American citizen, dreams has no taxes and it is an avenue here to express my thoughts whatsoever buddy, I hope you are not in a position to hire and fire just by seeing my intentions whatsoever buddy!
I am not taking a position or compete with others, there are regulations and what information I am getting and what dreams I am mapping, it is personal and try not to judge.
If US path is not a way, EDIAC is very possible and can work in UK too, we are eager to work in clean field. Is it clear?
Thanks

 

[Mehd School]

What's wrong with getting the education and go back home or to stay if I proved myself

This is my point. You can't stay, unless by stay you mean do residency all over again. No matter how much you prove yourself, you aren't eligible for an unrestricted US medical license and aren't eligible for ABA board certification.

But there is absolutely nothing wrong with getting this education and going elsewhere. Or getting this education and painfully going through residency again in the US.

 

[DrAmir0078]

This is my point. You can't stay, unless by stay you mean do residency all over again. No matter how much you prove yourself, you aren't eligible for an unrestricted US medical license and aren't eligible for ABA board certification.

But there is absolutely nothing wrong with getting this education and going elsewhere. Or getting this education and painfully going through residency again in the US.

OK, nothing wrong to get this education, that sounds fantastic.
Let me first get this opportunity, then will speak about next level - if any !
Thanks for your opinion - it is highly appreciated.

 

[Sleeplessbordernights]

There are definitely programs available at many well known institutions to train foreign grads. Some stay on as staff for a period of time, and then go home. I don’t know the details involved in that but I’ve worked with them in the past. For someone trying to get licensed in the USA and ultimately retrain here that might be a great option to get your foot in the door, get connected with a big name program, and pass the USMLE while getting paid. But that’s a long and hard road.
If you want to get training and experience here and go back to Iraq or wherever, that’s even easier. Perhaps you are “abused” with lower income, but you get invaluable experience that could be transformative back at home. I feel like the future in Iraq could be much brighter than say Afghanistan.
As for hosting lecturers, workshops, etc. in your hospital that’s also very possible, but from my experience the issue is often what percent of the potential learners are fluent in English. It’s easy to find people to come abroad to lecture in English or Spanish, other than that it’s going to be a challenge. One prominent colleague of mine gave a lecture in Japan to a nearly empty room because the attendees didn’t want to hear a lecture in English. We were going to do a workshop there and cancelled it. Safety fears are real as well, but one of the surgeons I work with has been all over Iraq and Iran, Pakistan, etc. for many years, though he is well connected in the region there.
If you are an American citizen, it might be easier for you than you think to come over to train because that’s not a hurdle for you to overcome, and obviously your English is strong.

Im imteresting in the second part, get training then go back, but im nit totally sufre about the logístics or even where to ask

 

[AnotherGasMan]

This is my point. You can't stay, unless by stay you mean do residency all over again. No matter how much you prove yourself, you aren't eligible for an unrestricted US medical license and aren't eligible for ABA board certification.

Not strictly true.

See "Alternate Entry Pathway" ALTERNATE ENTRY PATHWAY
It's a non-residency based pathway to staying in the USA.

There are also some states (board registration is state by state) that do not require the USMLE in order to stay and work.

 

[Drwine]

For physicians coming from certain countries the non accredited fellowships are the modern equivalent of Schindler's pot factory in WW2.

 

[nimbus]

For physicians coming from certain countries the non accredited fellowships are the modern equivalent of Schindler's pot factory in WW2.

For example,

Mohiuddin, Muhammad | University of Maryland School of Medicine

www.medschool.umaryland.edu

 

[cardanescrit]

Just sharing some details that I know about this topic.

There are multiple options depending on your personal goals and the level/extent of your prior training/experience with regards to foreign trained anesthesiologists doing a fellowship in USA. (This info may apply to many other specialties too)

Various options include - 1. fellowship training/going back to home country.
2. Fellowship training and staying back as faculty in a specific institution without board certification ( obviously with risks of being underpaid and restricted mobility if you want to switch institutions or jobs)
3. Fellowship training and going through ABA alternate entry path to get board certification - like a poster mentioned above. After board certification , you can possibly have equivalent mobility as someone who went through residency here in US atleast in academic settings but I would imagine it would be much more difficult in private practice settings.
4. Fellowship training and going back to residency and getting board certification - obviously fellowship training can give enough USCE for anyone to match into residency. This might be the best option if you intend to practice in US and have excellent job opportunities both in academics/PP and want the mobility to move to any state.
5. If you know you want to do residency again, going through with that as the first option instead of doing a fellowship.
6. In some rare instances, if you are a highly experienced person (typically highly qualified , well renowned in the field) , you maybe able to work as a faculty directly in US, especially at certain academic places, without any further training.
Obviously , your interests and goals might change as you go through the process and you may wanna switch from one to another - like you maybe interested in just a fellowship and going back to your country, but later switch to planning on staying in the US and may wanna do a residency here !

In addition to non acgme accredited fellowships, it is possible to do even ACGME accredited fellowships as a foreign trained anesthesiologist. But again it depends on your prior experience and the field you are interested in. Please search for "common program requirements" in the ACGME website for the specific anesthesiology fellowship you are interested in and look into the clause mentioning "exceptionally qualified international graduates" for details. That being said, as the name suggests, it would be highly competitive to get an exception to match and it is a lot of work for the programs to take someone like that in an ACGME accredited spot, but still possible if you can prove your worth! It might be virtually impossible to get into highly competitive acgme accredited fellowships ( CT, pain etc) at any place! It maybe possible to get into less competitive ones like OB/regional/peds/critical care at a decent place! Again depends on your interests.

Whether accredited or non-accredited , most if not all of the clinical programs would want you to complete USMLE steps and get ECFMG certified. Again, as people have mentioned before, be wary of some non-accredited programs where you are just a cheap labor to fill a spot. Still some people may want to do it just to get a foot in the system !
If you are interested in research fellowships, you maybe able to do it without USMLE or ECFMG certification.

It is an ever changing scenario, and you can gather more information by doing a detailed online research of ABA , ACGME and individual program websites and by emailing the programs. All the best !