A question for my fellow J.D.s out there

[Tofurkey]

Hi J.D.s,

I have yet another J.D. question for ya'll. As you may remember from my last J.D. thread, I graduated from law school and then immediately (the next week in fact) entered a post-bacc. I am almost done with that post-bacc now and will apply this June. My question to you--both successful applicants and those who have not applied yet--is:

how did you show your motivation for medicine and how did you go about expressing it to adcoms?

I have done lots of clinical volunteering, shadowing, and community service volunteering. I took all my pre-med reqs in one year (plus one summer) so I could show adcoms I can handle full-time science. I plan to work next year (starting in August) during my glide year (I apply this June) as a medical assistant or nurse's aide. I will never practice law and I hope adcoms appreciate this as well as the fact that I'm forsaking a legal job with the big bucks for a nurse's aide position that will probably pay minimum wage. But I am doing this because I love medicine and want to be exposed to it even if it means also bartending nights to pay the bills.

The thing is, I never worked as a lawyer and I never worked for pay in the medical field or volunteered, for that matter, BEFORE I made the decision during my 3L year to apply to medical school. But this decision wasn't just on a whim--I have doctors in the family and was pre-med (briefly, before chemistry scared me away) in college, so I knew what medicine was all about and once I realized I could hack the hard science I decided that nothing would stop me from pursuing this lifelong dream. I definitely am 100% committed and passionate to my new career.

What it comes down to is that I am concerned that the fact that I never practiced law (I had legal jobs during my law school summers though) AND never worked in the medical field BEFORE making the decision will come to bite me on the butt during the admissions process. SINCE making the decision, though, I've put 8 hours per week into my clinical experience, which, in my opinion, is a ton of time to confirm that this is the right choice. I am also doing clinical research and interacting with patients that way. As a side note, I never did one iota of research into what law school or the legal profession was like before blindly jumping into it as a clueless and directionless senior in college. An expensive mistake, I know, but as a 22-year-old, sometimes you just don't know what your true path is.

I could write a thesis on why law wasn't the right choice--but I feel I should stay away from that in the personal statement, etc. and instead focus on why medicine is the right choice--is that what you other J.D.'s are doing? I hated every second of law school and am actually quite bitter about having wasted three years of my life doing something I hated on a daily basis. I finished it out, though.

So to sum up, I can explain to adcoms a) why I went to law school (I was directionless and didn't know what else to do with myself) and b) when I changed my mind (after I explored all facets of the legal profession and found I hated them all--during my 3L year), but I'm not sure that I can address c) which is how they can know that I won't change careers from medicine or why this is the right choice if I haven't worked for pay in the field. I know that J.D.s often have a larger hurdle to cross than people coming from other professions, which sucks, but I really want to be prepared for all the questions that I keep getting and will continue to get.

If Juddson is reading this I'd love to get your input as well because I know you will be starting med school this fall as a JD.

Thanks in advance,

Tofurkey

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[juddson]

hi Tofurkey,

I'll have much to say. But I'm on full-time with the youngster this evening, and so won't be able to post anything indepth until he is off to bed.

Look for something this evening.

Judd

 

[juddson]

OK,

My situation was very similar to yours. I was premed in college and O-chem scared me off. It wasn't so much that i was scared of it, I just didn't have the motivation and the focus to do well in it. The fact is, I didn't have what I took to do well in any of the science classes when I was in undergrad.

At the end of my Junior year, I looked around and I said to myself "I have to skills. I have no prospects of getting any skills. What the hell am I going to do? I know, I'll go to law school." And that's what i did.

For me, the choice of lawschool was easy. It takes no prep. I'm a fairly smart guy (and did very well on the LSAT) and both fo my parents were lawyers. I made the wrong choice and went to law school.

I actually became excited about law for a while. I did mock trial in highschool and college and was good at it. It never hurts to have parents that are proud of you. I did well in law school and enjoyed it. But I did not enjoy practicing law. I respected the theory more than the practice, if you know what I mean.

It was after practicing for two years, and then switching firms twice that i decided to go back to post-bacc for prereqs. I worked my ass off in the classes and did a 4.0 in 38 hours of prereqs and upper level science courses. I did a little volunteering (babysitting at our children's hospital) and, importantly, shadowed for 4 months, once a week, in an internal medicine clinic (basically and urgent care clinic attached to one of our major teaching hospitals).

Like you, I debated whether to focus on not liking the law in my PS. I decided the opposite was a MUCH better idea. In my PS, I never denigrated law school, law theory or the practice of law. In fact, I made it a point in all my interviews to say that i do NOT regret for one moment going to law school or practicing law. I said that I'll be a better doctor for it, and more importantly, a better, more well rounded person for it. But i went farther, I also said that the irony of law school was this: It was responsible more than anything else in giving me the maturity and focus to do well in the things I needed to do well in to make medical school a possibility for me. I grew UP during law school. I learned how to read (with a capital "R"), and write, and FOCUS, and what it means to be introspective and, perhaps more importantly, circumspective (law school really does a good job with this last bit) and that all of these things made medical school a possibility for me.

So why medicine now? The answer is that while I don't regret law school, a career is a looooong time. And life is short. And there came a time that I realized that no matter how much I valued my legal education, it was a compromise for me. It was a path i took because I simply didn't have the maturity and focus to do what I should have done in the first place. And now I do. So, with in mind, the choice for me was whether I continued compromsing for the rest of my life, or do I take what I've learned and get back on track for what I had wanted to do from the very beginning.

This was the story I told adcoms, almost word for word.

"But what makes you think you will like medicine?" This is an important question, and you have to be able to answer it. Notice, though, that my approach set forth above blunts this a bit. I don't denegrate law (and I truly don't regret it), and so the question was NOT "You didn't like practicing law, what makes you think you'll like practicing medicine?" THAT's a tougher question to answer. Being honest about not hating the law takes some wind out of the question.

But it's still not fully answered. This is where a bit of candor helps the most. In each one of my interviews, I said "Look, I had the exact same concerns. Medical school is a long road, and expensive. I "needed" to make sure I was doing the right thing. So I made it a priority to shadow in an "in depth" way - to see what it was REALLY like to be in a medical setting. I spent one half day a week in the clinic for four months. I bought a Harrisons and read it when I could. I followed residents in the exam rooms, I did examinations (after the resident did), and I even consulted with the attending alongside the resident. I told the ADCOM's that i took in as much as I could, and made a pain of myself whenever I could get my nose in. But it was worth it.

I honestly discounted the value of volunteering in the hospital wards (I have a three year old - I know what it means to play with kids and bring people water) and focussed on the clinical exposure. I focussed the interviewers on the question of "did I know what I was getting into" and not "am I just the most compassionate guy you know, or what?" I'm a stay-at-home dad, so that helped with the second question without it becoming much of an issue. I'm telling you, the ADCOM's appreciated the candor more than anything else.

Let me tell you what else I made a point of discussing in my interviews. I ALWAYS started to talk about what I had learned about medicine during my clinical exposure that i did not know before. NEVER anything clinical of course (you'll look like an ass). I talked about the perils of trying to provide treatment to people without homes, or jobs, or money, etc. I talked about learning that interns know basically NOTHING, and that at this stage, being a good person and being thorough, and asking questions, and all those other things that the books can't teach you is more important that knowing where are the parts go. And, most importantly for me, I think, I talked about how interns and young residents are people too, just like you and me. 26 year olds still behave like 26 year-olds, no matter whether MD is after thier name. They still make fun of "gross" patients when in the preceptor room. They still bicker over who has to take the obese patient in room 13, etc. etc. I said that I learned from my clinical experience, more than perhaps anything else, that being a good doctor was as much about maturity and being a grown-up as it is about what you learn in Harrisons. Adcoms seemed to agree with this very much.

Some of this may not help you because I'm older than you (I'm 30 with a kid and married). You just need to be introspective and circumspective. Be candid. You'll do fine.

feel free to PM me.

Judd

 

[partial]

Just wanted to bump this to the top. I'm curious how everything worked out, as I am considering this path myself.

Does anyone know whether success in law school (high gpa) suggest to an adcomm that you have matured since college and offset a lower college gpa? Of course I'm assuming good grades in post-bacc science courses.

 

[Sharky]

I would help you but my initials are not J.D. Sorry.

 

[ptanpit1]

Not a J.D. but I like Juddson's reasoning.

Don't denigrate your former profession. My premed advisor always told us to stress the positive aspects of our application. One thing that stuck out in my mind: "If you're a complainer on that one big day, imagine what 4 years of you will be like!"

Besides, you don't have a lot of space in your PS. Why waste it? Also, your PS is an important springboard for your actual interview. Some interviewers I had would ask me direct questions about statements I made in my PS. Do you really want to bash law school in every interview?