Academic medicine & School ranking

[fizzle]

This is probably a much-discussed topic, but I haven't seen much about it besides several mentions, so please bear with me.

Although everyone here stresses fit over ranking, it also seems that no one denies that med school ranking DOES matter, even if just somewhat, if we plan for a career in academic medicine. That said, I'm kind of curious of the extent to this because I am considering such a path...I've received an interview to a top 40, but I'm wondering how much of a difference this will make over a top 20 or so.

I know that one of the favorite things to say is to ignore rankings, but the reality of who actually gets into academic medicine (many of the "big names" in medical research) seems to go against this, and I can't help but feel that ranking also plays a large part of the "fit" that everyone mentions. Any comments?

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[ADeadLois]

Everyone chooses a med school for different reasons. There are no right or wrong criteria, as everyone has different expectations, priorities and goals.

That being said, the general consensus among most here is that you should choose a med school based on what it affords for the next 4 years of life, not what lies beyond, as every opportunity in medicine is available to you regardless of where you attend medical school.

Yes, schools that have more research prowess than others, as indicated by US News Rankings, if we take these rankings as indicators of excellence in academic medicine (which in of itself is already a stretch). While this is certainly an important criteria, don't delude yourself into thinking that just because you have this advantage in this area that the school is the right place for you. It's not worth going to a place you don't like simply because it's higher ranked.

 

[enigma85]

This is probably a much-discussed topic, but I haven't seen much about it besides several mentions, so please bear with me.

Although everyone here stresses fit over ranking, it also seems that no one denies that med school ranking DOES matter, even if just somewhat, if we plan for a career in academic medicine. That said, I'm kind of curious of the extent to this because I am considering such a path...I've received an interview to a top 40, but I'm wondering how much of a difference this will make over a top 20 or so.

I know that one of the favorite things to say is to ignore rankings, but the reality of who actually gets into academic medicine (many of the "big names" in medical research) seems to go against this, and I can't help but feel that ranking also plays a large part of the "fit" that everyone mentions. Any comments?

Going to a school that is not known for its research will not preclude you from a career in academic medicine. There is a shortage of "physician-scientists" and, if you demonstrate your desire and aptitude for research by doing research as a med student and making connections in the field, you should be fine.

The top research schools attract students who are more interested and perhaps more suited for academic medicine than most other schools, therefore many of the "big names" in medical research attended the top research schools. But there are plenty of leaders in academic medicine who attended schools that are not heavy on research.

The most distinguished biomedical scientists in the US are probably the HHMI investigators. A brief look at the MDs on the site shows graduates of Temple, SUNY upstate, NYU, Tufts, AECOM, GW, Iowa, Wisconsin, Jefferson, Univ of Hawaii, and Meharry alongside the typical research-focused schools.

 

[154241]

i dunno... i feel like the connections you are bound to make at some of the big name schools will give you an advantage. not saying this is impossible to do at the lesser-known places, but it will require more legwork on your part. personally, i'm trying to pick a school with lots of faculty/activity in areas i'm interested in because i'm going to need some mentoring before i figure out what i'm going to do with my life. i think the added cost of going to one of these places over my state school will be justified, because there's no guarantee i'd be able to make my own way at the state school. this is why i hated those "where do you see yourself in 10 years" questions....

 

[fizzle]

Everyone chooses a med school for different reasons. There are no right or wrong criteria, as everyone has different expectations, priorities and goals.

That being said, the general consensus among most here is that you should choose a med school based on what it affords for the next 4 years of life, not what lies beyond, as every opportunity in medicine is available to you regardless of where you attend medical school.

Yes, schools that have more research prowess than others, as indicated by US News Rankings, if we take these rankings as indicators of excellence in academic medicine (which in of itself is already a stretch). While this is certainly an important criteria, don't delude yourself into thinking that just because you have this advantage in this area that the school is the right place for you. It's not worth going to a place you don't like simply because it's higher ranked.

We're going under the assumption that all else is the same; I wouldn't choose a higher ranked school that I didn't like. If I didn't like the school, I wouldn't have applied there in the first place. With that assumption in place, doesn't the fact that I am considering academic medicine automatically make research-oriented (aka "higher ranked") schools a better fit for me? This is the single point that I have concerns about; I'm just worried that my medical school choices will affect my career decisions down the line.

 

[notdeadyet]

Although everyone here stresses fit over ranking, it also seems that no one denies that med school ranking DOES matter, even if just somewhat, if we plan for a career in academic medicine.

Are you going MD/Ph.D.? If so, I'd pay closer attention to the research budget and reputation of a particular school.

But when you say "academic medicine" if you mean teaching or doing basic research at a medical school at the MD level, I wouldn't worry about it as much. Doctors from most every school are on faculty around the country at top medical schools.

Folks get worried because so many of the top, big names came from Harvard and whatnot. This isn't so much indicative of the medical school as the individual. Harvard's name didn't create these great careers for the people; Harvard attracts people who go on to these great careers. Make sense? Put one of these kids at a "lesser school" and they'd still be setting the world on fire.

 

[nogolfinsnow]

I used to tech in a lab at UCSF. The MDs doing research in the lab were from Cornell (that was the PI, so it was a few years ago), UCLA, Rush, Einstein, Maryland, Columbia, and Beijing. I think that's a pretty good array of schools all ending up at a top notch research institution.

 

[ADeadLois]

We're going under the assumption that all else is the same; I wouldn't choose a higher ranked school that I didn't like. If I didn't like the school, I wouldn't have applied there in the first place. With that assumption in place, doesn't the fact that I am considering academic medicine automatically make research-oriented (aka "higher ranked") schools a better fit for me? This is the single point that I have concerns about; I'm just worried that my medical school choices will affect my career decisions down the line.

Any medical school will afford you research opportunities if you really want to do it. Plus, you really aren't limited to your own medical school for research opportunities during summers and your clinical years.

 

[nick_carraway]

I forgot who the mentor is in the academic medicine forum, but he wrote once that every school needs its faculty. You'll find a career in academic medicine at nearly every school. The fact that people often stay on as attendings where they completed their residency (assuming they didn't move off somewhere else for a fellowship) also means that your med school doesn't matter so much as where you went for residency.

And no, your med school prestige has little influence on where you'll go for residency.

 

[LizzyM]

One thing I've noticed among physicians in academic medicine: many on the faculty of a top private medical school themselves went to public medical schools, or married money. Either of those routes makes it easier to go into academic medicine. The graduates of the top private medical schools end up in so much debt that many can't see the economic feasibility of academic medicine when compared to private practice.

 

[AlexMorph]

One thing I've noticed among physicians in academic medicine: many on the faculty of a top private medical school themselves went to public medical schools, or married money. Either of those routes makes it easier to go into academic medicine. The graduates of the top private medical schools end up in so much debt that many can't see the economic feasibility of academic medicine when compared to private practice.

interesting observation...

i always knew i needed to find myself a rich woman

 

[nick_carraway]

One thing I've noticed among physicians in academic medicine: many on the faculty of a top private medical school themselves went to public medical schools, or married money. Either of those routes makes it easier to go into academic medicine. The graduates of the top private medical schools end up in so much debt that many can't see the economic feasibility of academic medicine when compared to private practice.

Wow. Funny how all these variables come into play downstream.