Adequate # of programs to apply to?

[hemoccult]

Advertisement - Members don't see this ad

I was just curious, after having read through many of the "veterans of the match" postings, how many programs would you recommend as a "safe" (interpret safe as you desire) number of programs to apply to for general surgery.*

I don't intend on using the shotgun approach, but would like to hear some opinions on number of programs, decent mix of community and academic programs, and any other advice or recommendations from those with great insight.

*Truly, if you only apply to top tier schools with less than adequate credentials, you could apply to every top program and receive the most medial of all digits from each one in return. I guess my question above would apply to your above average applicant looking to match at an appropriate program.

Thanks in advance for any advice...or humorous posts that may follow.

🙄

 

[Skylizard]

I only interviewed at 2 programs this year and matched into an arguably strong community program. I did however apply to 15 programs. You need to have an honest appreciation of where you stand (board scores, honors/grades, and +/- research). Then you need to decide what you want to do and where you want to train. If you are a "strong applicant" and only want to do community general surgery, you can get away with under 10 applications at a broad range in caliber of community programs. However, in general, most people do from 15-20 applications. They use the old, "a few fantasy sites, a few more difficult sites, and alot of guaranteed sites" approach. Ultimately, you need to have a serious introspective session and figure out just where you stand.

 

[Pilot Doc]

I just finished a GS/GS couple match. We applied to 30 and got interviews from almost all. Way more than we needed. I would probably apply to that many again just to have the wide range of options. Even in our situation, though, 20 would have been quite adequate.

No idea how well that advice will apply this year.

 

[droliver]

I usually recommend about 15-20 applications to my students & say interview at as many places as you do from a financial, travel logistic, & mental sanity standpoint (the more you go on the more you get mentally exhausted by it)

 

[vuillaume]

It's hard to give advice on this because I suspect the General Surgery match will be a moving target. We all know that applications reached a low ebb a couple of years ago, but I guess this year there were more applicants, and who knows if next year there will be even more (perhaps with the work-hours restrictions). For all we know there may actually be fewer due to some sociological trend we're too puny to comprehend.

Anyway, as always, it depends. I think the best sources for helping you out will be the surgery faculty at your medical school. Only they know what kind of student you are, and know what sort of personality you have.

It will help if you know what you want; whether it's academic or community; a cosmopolitan setting or not. All of these choices influence your odds.

We'd need more data to help you make an informed choice; but your advisory dean, and the residency director of your institution's surgery program do.

I know people that interviewed at fewer than six and people who interviewed at more than twenty. I don't think this range, in abstract, is informative.

 

[hemoccult]

A Large thanks to the above posts as it has helped me garner more information regarding this great process they call "the match."

Thanks again.

 

[gatorAKM]

A graduating friend of mine interviewed at 8 and ranked half of them and is going to his first choice university program in the South. He's a friend and is an above average student.

Seemed like a low number to me, but it worked out well for him. The general consensus I have heard is interview at 10-12, rank about 9-10.

 

[shirya]

I'm FMG from not bad foreign school, foreign surgical experience and below average Step1/2 scores. applied to 84 programs in 3 speciality. Was invited for 6 interviews, rank them all and matched on my 2nd choise.

 

[Skylizard]

Originally posted by shirya
I'm FMG from a not so bad foreign school, foreign surgical experience and below average Step1/2 scores. applied to 84 programs in 3 specialties. Was invited for 6 interviews, ranked them all and matched on my 2nd choice.

shhh. Don't say that so loud, you might give apma77 some more ammunition😉

 

[fourthyear]

I agree with planning to rank at least 10 programs in a range of competetiveness (some far-off hopes, some more "sure things"), but you'll need to interview at 12-15 to find 10 you really, really like b/c some places you think you'll love, you'll realize aren't for you when you see them closer up on interview day. Trying to do more than 15 interviews is logistically very dificult, and very emotionally tiring, so I wouldn't recommend that at all!

Applying to more than 30 is probably unneccessary and very expensive!

My personal stats - solid student, but bottom-half-of the class, passed boards, but under 200 on both step1 and 2, good recs. Applied to 30, got 23 interview offers, went to 13, ranked 10, matched at #5.

 

[Celiac Plexus]

I used the 1/3,1/3,1/3 strategy.

10 upper tier, 10 middle tier, 10 lower tier apps. Was 4/10 for upper tiers, 6/10 for middle tier, and 7/10 for lower tier. Went to 12 interviews, ranked 9, matched at #3.

I was middle third of my class for the first 2 years (actually just above the median), and then got bumped to the upper third after 3rd year. I was not AOA, scored slightly above average on step I, and did not take step II until after I was finished interviewing (modestly above the average).

My advice is to use the 1/3 formula, and depending on the strength of your app, adjust the number of apps accordingly. If you have a better app than mine, then you might apply to less than 30 programs, a worse app, apply to slightly more. If you use this formula then you maximize your chances to get an appropriate number of interviews... which I would say is around 10 to ensure that you get a spot somewhere. I felt that 12 interviews was really taxing in terms of travel expense, and fatigue, and scheduling headaches. But considering I found 3 of the programs to be undesirable, that still left me with 9 ranks.

Also, talk to your PD or chairman to help you generate a list of programs. The top tier programs are generally easy to identify, but the middle ranks may be harder to determine. My chairman actually used the term "upper middle tier". He also turned me on to some programs that met my specific career interests. If you work with them, and share your career goals then they can help you to tailor your list to those programs that are a good fit for you, regardless of what tier they might fall in.

Peace, and good luck!