advice/insights for international student applying US MD school

[padoo]

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Hi, a friend is going to undergrad at my state school and he is applying to medical school this cycle. I'm sure his stats is very competitive for MD schools. However, he is considered international because he does not have green card.

Does anyone have personal experience or know anyone on the same boat. Maybe a story of international applicants who got accepted somewhere, and maybe the approximate stats? My friend is a hard worker and being international is one of his biggest obstacle, so any advice would be awesome, thanks so much!!!!

 

[Ischemic]

Damn near impossible but he might be the lucky few.

 

[padoo]

wow, when it comes to this, no opinions at all?!?!?

please? 🙁

 

[knightstale4]

Check out this website. Very helpful for international students. However, it is going to be an uphill battle. Your friend should be prepared for that.

http://www2.fiu.edu/~preprofc/International_Students_School_Policies.htm

 

[gte770m]

wow, when it comes to this, no opinions at all?!?!?

please? 🙁

I am an international student who has been accepted this cycle. It is really tough (I heard from someone that avg acceptance rate for int'ls overall is less than 1%, but not sure what the source of that number is), but there are definitely schools that will seriously consider int'ls even among state schools. Most of the top-rated private schools will look at him the same as US nationals or PRs. It took me two tries, and I have had three interviews during that time with 1 rejection (Duke), 1 wait list (UMN) and 1 acceptance (IU) post-interview. I applied to <10 schools in the first try and 15 the second time around.

My stats weren't that great as far as overall GPA goes <3.5, but BCPM was >3.7 and MCAT was >35 first time and 34 the second time, so I think that helped as far as stats go. I did have two years of military service experience in which I worked mainly on humanitarian relief efforts, and even got a recommendation from a US Army general + awards from US Dept. of the Army, so I think that probably helped as a unique experience on my resume.

Regarding the acceptance from IU, I actually lived in Indiana for a few years while my family lived there, and my dad received his Ph. D. from IU, so I think the state/school-ties helped.

UMN was fair to int'ls as well, I think. I had no state-ties there, and was invited for interview. They accept 3-5 int'ls every year.

Duke is kind of unpredictable as to who will get invited for an interview. It seems you have a lot of interviewees with "sub-par" stats, but post-interview acceptance rates are really low, so... I think Duke definitely doesn't discriminate based on visa status. I totally blew the interview (my very first interview ever and I hadn't even looked at usual questions), but even if I hadn't, I think it would have been a miracle to get accepted there.

It's tough even as a US national or PR, and maybe almost a miracle for an int'l to get accepted at a US medical school. It does happen, however, and if your friend truly has his heart set on it, then why not try?

 

[gte770m]

wow, when it comes to this, no opinions at all?!?!?

please? 🙁

Another thing about int'ls is that if one is accepted, then it will be a huge burden financially. No government/school financial aid in almost all cases, and only private loans with a US-national co-signer will be available. Depending on the country he is from, he may be able to get loans back in his own country, but probably not enough to cover the cost for all 4 years.

For me personally, I am basically paying for all four years with family funds (basically my parents), but if your family is unable to help you - in most cases, I would think that is the situation considering $240k in 4 yrs is what it is going to cost me - you need to work that out somehow.

 

[bonsaitree1]

Does being Canadian count as international? If so, I was a Canadian applicant and successful too. PM me if you want more details I guess.

 

[padoo]

thanks! those are all really great information/experience/website, and is very helpful since there's not much info about there about internationals.

To gte770m, congrats for your acceptance, wow! this information will be very encouraging and helpful to my friend.

PS- i think Canadian is international, unless you have green card! PM sent 😀

If anyone have anything more to add, please do! I'll keep checking the thread 🙂 Thank youuuuuuuuuuuuuu!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[miborovsky]

Does being Canadian count as international? If so, I was a Canadian applicant and successful too. PM me if you want more details I guess.

Some schools accept Canadian applicants but not other foreign nationalities. Others treat them the same. So whether being Canadian counts as international varies on a school-to-school basis.

 

[nicolemeooow]

I am an international student who has been accepted this cycle. It is really tough (I heard from someone that avg acceptance rate for int'ls overall is less than 1%, but not sure what the source of that number is), but there are definitely schools that will seriously consider int'ls even among state schools. Most of the top-rated private schools will look at him the same as US nationals or PRs. It took me two tries, and I have had three interviews during that time with 1 rejection (Duke), 1 wait list (UMN) and 1 acceptance (IU) post-interview. I applied to <10 schools in the first try and 15 the second time around.

My stats weren't that great as far as overall GPA goes <3.5, but BCPM was >3.7 and MCAT was >35 first time and 34 the second time, so I think that helped as far as stats go. I did have two years of military service experience in which I worked mainly on humanitarian relief efforts, and even got a recommendation from a US Army general + awards from US Dept. of the Army, so I think that probably helped as a unique experience on my resume.

Regarding the acceptance from IU, I actually lived in Indiana for a few years while my family lived there, and my dad received his Ph. D. from IU, so I think the state/school-ties helped.

UMN was fair to int'ls as well, I think. I had no state-ties there, and was invited for interview. They accept 3-5 int'ls every year.

Duke is kind of unpredictable as to who will get invited for an interview. It seems you have a lot of interviewees with "sub-par" stats, but post-interview acceptance rates are really low, so... I think Duke definitely doesn't discriminate based on visa status. I totally blew the interview (my very first interview ever and I hadn't even looked at usual questions), but even if I hadn't, I think it would have been a miracle to get accepted there.

It's tough even as a US national or PR, and maybe almost a miracle for an int'l to get accepted at a US medical school. It does happen, however, and if your friend truly has his heart set on it, then why not try?

How could u serve in the military while being an international student?

 

[gte770m]

How could u serve in the military while being an international student?

I didn't serve in the US military. I served in a combined force, my main role being a translator. Half the staff from my own country and the other half from the US forces.

 

[runawayclock]

Some schools accept Canadian applicants but not other foreign nationalities. Others treat them the same. So whether being Canadian counts as international varies on a school-to-school basis.

MOST public schools will not accept any student without permanent residency, green cards or existing visas.

It seems like most privates *will* consider internationals. At a lot of privates, Canadians are treated as US citizens for the application process, but are expected to usually pay the entire year's tuition up front (some places it's 2 years tuition, or 4). As a canadian, you would not qualify for federal aid (correct me if i'm wrong!) but you are eligible for usually merit-based scholarships and at a few places, need-based aid. It really is on a school-by-school basis. Columbia seemed to interview quite a few Canadians, whereas Tufts will only consider non-US permanent residents/citizens under "extraordinary circumstances".

 

[nicolemeooow]

I didn't serve in the US military. I served in a combined force, my main role being a translator. Half the staff from my own country and the other half from the US forces.

oh i see. i thought u had the asylee/refugee status. i heard they r counted as residents tho

 

[Catalystik]

How could u serve in the military while being an international student?

Internationals are allowed to enlist in the US armed forces. From a family member who served with many of them, I understand this provides an expedited path to a greencard/US citizenship (don't recall which).

 

[miborovsky]

MOST public schools will not accept any student without permanent residency, green cards or existing visas.

It seems like most privates *will* consider internationals.

In theory.

My application list was about 50:50 public/private, both top and mid tiers. Of the interviews I got, every single one was at a public school. 🙄

I don't claim to be able to provide a satisfactory hypothesis based on my anecdotal observation, but it's interesting to note. Maybe private schools say that they accept international applicants, just to extract more $$$ from more applicants, hah. 😛

 

[chiz2kul]

International here. About done w 1st year. Its def hard but def not impossible - dont let the nay sayers (o soo many of them) get to you. You're just gonna have to work twice as hard and be ready to shell out some serious dough.

PM me for more details. Mostly private schools accept int students, though a lot of public schools do accept too.

No federal aid at all - so you'll have to go for institutional/need based aid or private loans or loans from back home etc etc

UMN, Indiana, Dartmouth Yale Baylor are all some great schools that accept internationals. Do your research.

Most importantly - dont be discouraged. You're gonna have lots of pple on here and wherever try to shut you down and tell you thats its near impossible. You have to figure out how to filter constructive advice from the bs coming from haters. 😀

Best wishes. PM me if you have any specific q's.

 

[nicolemeooow]

Internationals are allowed to enlist in the US armed forces. From a family member who served with many of them, I understand this provides an expedited path to a greencard/US citizenship (don't recall which).

not if ur holding any form of visas. the exception only extends to asylee/refugee/greencard holders. it helps u obtain citizenship faster. Otherwise we'd see thousands of people trying to get greencard by joining the army.

 

[runawayclock]

In theory.

My application list was about 50:50 public/private, both top and mid tiers. Of the interviews I got, every single one was at a public school. 🙄

I don't claim to be able to provide a satisfactory hypothesis based on my anecdotal observation, but it's interesting to note. Maybe private schools say that they accept international applicants, just to extract more $$$ from more applicants, hah. 😛

ORLY. Would you mind listing which ones? (preferably on the east coast )

 

[miborovsky]

ORLY. Would you mind listing which ones? (preferably on the east coast )

I've already addressed runawayclock through PM, but for everyone else: I'm not gonna advertise my list publicly, for privacy reasons, but YARLY. PM for more info.

 

[Quaero]

Another thing about int'ls is that if one is accepted, then it will be a huge burden financially. No government/school financial aid in almost all cases, and only private loans with a US-national co-signer will be available. Depending on the country he is from, he may be able to get loans back in his own country, but probably not enough to cover the cost for all 4 years.

For me personally, I am basically paying for all four years with family funds (basically my parents), but if your family is unable to help you - in most cases, I would think that is the situation considering $240k in 4 yrs is what it is going to cost me - you need to work that out somehow.

Do most schools require you to have an account at the beginning of the year proving that you have enough money for the whole four years? 🙁🙁🙁

 

[gte770m]

Do most schools require you to have an account at the beginning of the year proving that you have enough money for the whole four years? 🙁🙁🙁

It depends on the school. Some schools will require you to have expenses for all four years in an escrow account, and disburse the money to you according to a set schedule (eg. Duke). Some require two-year expenses instead of four (can't remember which school does this but I do distinctly remember there was a school that did that). Some just require that you have enough to cover the expense for the first year and show that your sponsor or you have the earning power to cover the expenses for the subsequent years (through loans or regular income).

That last part is the minimum, though. You will have to prove that you can pay for your education. I heard some private school give out scholarships even to int'ls, though.

 

[miborovsky]

It depends on the school. Some schools will require you to have expenses for all four years in an escrow account, and disburse the money to you according to a set schedule (eg. Duke). Some require two-year expenses instead of four (can't remember which school does this but I do distinctly remember there was a school that did that). Some just require that you have enough to cover the expense for the first year and show that your sponsor or you have the earning power to cover the expenses for the subsequent years (through loans or regular income).

That last part is the minimum, though. You will have to prove that you can pay for your education. I heard some private school give out scholarships even to int'ls, though.

According to the school I've been accepted to, they ask for a proof-of-finance documentation for the purpose of getting you (the int'l student) a student visa. Now, if you don't need a student visa (and I don't), then you don't have to show that you have $n in the bank account.

 

[Quaero]

According to the school I've been accepted to, they ask for a proof-of-finance documentation for the purpose of getting you (the int'l student) a student visa. Now, if you don't need a student visa (and I don't), then you don't have to show that you have $n in the bank account.

Could you explain more on what you mean when you said you don't need a student visa? Do you have a greencard?

 

[miborovsky]

Could you explain more on what you mean when you said you don't need a student visa? Do you have a greencard?

I'm currently in the PR Adjustment of Status process, i.e. I have filed an I-485. This status allows me to study full time in the US without any other documentation (and work, with an Employment Authorization Document). So I do not need to apply for an F-1 student visa to attend school. Certain other statuses also allow this, for example the L2 visa (which I was on before my AOS).

 

[miborovsky]

Fellow foreigners (WE TUK DER JERBS!!!):

Here's a database that I compiled when deciding what schools to apply to. You might find it useful. If anyone has updates/corrections, email me ([email protected]) and I'll include it.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkT6csiPgT6YdFZXdWZuZXp5ZTBBMDZiZGpYSlRsQUE&hl=en

 

[Quaero]

Fellow foreigners (WE TUK DER JERBS!!!):

Here's a database that I compiled when deciding what schools to apply to. You might find it useful. If anyone has updates/corrections, email me ([email protected]) and I'll include it.

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AkT6csiPgT6YdFZXdWZuZXp5ZTBBMDZiZGpYSlRsQUE&hl=en

What a great resource. Thank you so much!

 

[Catalystik]

A nice resource to have on hand regarding specific US school policy for international applications.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AkT6csiPgT6YdFZXdWZuZXp5ZTBBMDZiZGpYSlRsQUE&hl=en#gid=0

It would be nice if more international applicants added to the schools already listed, based on institutions they have researched. It appears to be a spreadsheet open to editing by anyone.

 

[GS Mikami]

A nice resource to have on hand regarding specific US school policy for international applications.It would be nice if more international applicants added to the schools already listed, based on institutions they have researched. It appears to be a spreadsheet open to editing by anyone.

As an international student, I will have gladly add more info. to the list if I had done more research on school specific policies. I only used the MSAR to pick my school list.

If you're reading this and you're an int' student, you can use my MD applicants profile to see schools that accept int' students. All of the schools I applied do and almost a 100% of them only require proof of payment for the 1st year (none of that escrow account thing).