Advice?

[violetflame]

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I'm a senior in college and I'm a sociology major. I have taken all the prerequisites and currently have a gpa of 3.45c and 3.08s. Apart from the prereq science classes (which I have all As and Bs in) I didn't do too well in Biomedical Anatomy & Physiology my sophomore year (AP1: C AP2: C-). Other than that, I haven't take any other upper level courses, mainly because I was focusing on getting my degree and taking those classes for sociology.
I took the MCAT the first time and didn't do well on it (at all). I just retook it on January 8th & am hoping to have done better. I am totally okay with applying to DO programs, as I'm pretty sure I don't have the grades to get into MD ones. I have over 200 hours of shadowing experience (Physiatrist, Surgeon, Pediatrician, Physical Therapist, Occupational Therapist) and I have a lot of ECs and Volunteer/Service hours.
I still don't think I'm a good enough applicant for DO School and am trying to decide whether to apply anyways or apply to a Master's/Post-Bac or to just take some upper level biology courses or just find some research experience. Any ideas or comments would be very much appreciated!
Thank you in advance 🙂

 

[Stlblues17]

I'm a senior in college and I'm a sociology major. I have taken all the prerequisites and currently have a gpa of 3.45c and 3.08s. Apart from the prereq science classes (which I have all As and Bs in) I didn't do too well in Biomedical Anatomy & Physiology my sophomore year (AP1: C AP2: C-). Other than that, I haven't take any other upper level courses, mainly because I was focusing on getting my degree and taking those classes for sociology.
I took the MCAT the first time and didn't do well on it (at all). I just retook it on January 8th & am hoping to have done better. I am totally okay with applying to DO programs, as I'm pretty sure I don't have the grades to get into MD ones. I have over 200 hours of shadowing experience (Physiatrist, Surgeon, Pediatrician, Physical Therapist, Occupational Therapist) and I have a lot of ECs and Volunteer/Service hours.
I still don't think I'm a good enough applicant for DO School and am trying to decide whether to apply anyways or apply to a Master's/Post-Bac or to just take some upper level biology courses or just find some research experience. Any ideas or comments would be very much appreciated!
Thank you in advance 🙂

Retake anything C+ or lower, get that sci gpa >3.2 and 27+ MCAT (w/e 2015 mcat equivalent). Apply early/broadly and your good.

Save your money, don't do masters, just retake what's necessary.

 

[violetflame]

Retake anything C+ or lower, get that sci gpa >3.2 and 27+ MCAT (w/e 2015 mcat equivalent). Apply early/broadly and your good.

Save your money, don't do masters, just retake what's necessary.

Thank you Stlblues17 🙂
I was told by a teacher that I should take some upper level courses (immunology, histology, etc.) Do you think that is necessary? Or just retake Anatomy & Physio I and II? Because by retaking, if I get an A in both, my science GPA jumps to a 3.3, but I wonder if I should boost it more with other upper level courses [not necessarily taking a masters, but maybe just spending the summer taking a few courses].

 

[Awesome Sauceome]

Retake anything C+ or lower, get that sci gpa >3.2 and 27+ MCAT (w/e 2015 mcat equivalent). Apply early/broadly and your good.

Save your money, don't do masters, just retake what's necessary.

+1
All of those things are 100% spot on and you will make yourself the strongest applicant by having all of those things. The only thing I would add to just help solidify your chances are to shadow a DO and get a letter of recommendation if you can.

Btw, what kind of score are we talking about for your first MCAT, and how were your practice tests leading up to your second test?

Also you technically do not need upper level courses. Some adcoms will question your ability to do well in the sciences, but if your grades are good one of the schools will definitely take the chance on you. This is especially true if your MCAT score is good (particularly bio section) - a 10+ score in your bio science section will likely erase any concerns.

 

[baxt1412]

Retake anything C+ or lower, get that sci gpa >3.2 and 27+ MCAT (w/e 2015 mcat equivalent). Apply early/broadly and your good.

Save your money, don't do masters, just retake what's necessary.

+1
All of those things are 100% spot on and you will make yourself the strongest applicant by having all of those things. The only thing I would add to just help solidify your chances are to shadow a DO and get a letter of recommendation if you can.

Btw, what kind of score are we talking about for your first MCAT, and how were your practice tests leading up to your second test?

Also you technically do not need upper level courses. Some adcoms will question your ability to do well in the sciences, but if your grades are good one of the schools will definitely take the chance on you. This is especially true if your MCAT score is good (particularly bio section) - a 10+ score in your bio science section will likely erase any concerns.

agreed with both of these gentlemen. get that 10 on the bio and I don't think you will get many scoffs at your GPA. but definitely need that sGPA above a 3.2 or 3.25 so you don't get autoscreened at some schools.

definitely get DO shadowing and definitely try to get a letter from them as well. (some schools require it and other strongly suggest it, don't burn any bridges if a DO is readily accessible to you).

not critical, but try to get some non-clinical and clinical volunteering too. nothing has to be super high in # of hours, but regularity and consistency go a long way. a few hours a week for many months or a year or so will look great. I volunteered at an art gallery and it got brought up in one of my interviews.

 

[Stlblues17]

Thank you Stlblues17 🙂
I was told by a teacher that I should take some upper level courses (immunology, histology, etc.) Do you think that is necessary? Or just retake Anatomy & Physio I and II? Because by retaking, if I get an A in both, my science GPA jumps to a 3.3, but I wonder if I should boost it more with other upper level courses [not necessarily taking a masters, but maybe just spending the summer taking a few courses].

Upper levels aren't 'required' but make sure to look up which schools require or 'prefer' you take something (eg biochem comes to mind). I wouldn't overload yourself with upper levels, doing poorly will hurt you. As
Baxt and awesome sauceome mentioned, beat that bio section's arse (10+) and you'll be good.

Obviously numbers are important, but make sure your application is well rounded. I do feel the DO schools do a good job of looking at us with a 'whole picture' mentality... With that said, don't give them a reason to deny you (grades/mcat).

Hope this helps

 

[evooo8]

Your science GPA needs to get up a little higher. Do well on the MCAT, get a strong DO letter and apply early and broadly and you should be fine.

 

[Goro]

Concur.

Retake anything C+ or lower, get that sci gpa >3.2 and 27+ MCAT (w/e 2015 mcat equivalent). Apply early/broadly and your good.

Save your money, don't do masters, just retake what's necessary.

 

[violetflame]

+1
All of those things are 100% spot on and you will make yourself the strongest applicant by having all of those things. The only thing I would add to just help solidify your chances are to shadow a DO and get a letter of recommendation if you can.

Btw, what kind of score are we talking about for your first MCAT, and how were your practice tests leading up to your second test?

Also you technically do not need upper level courses. Some adcoms will question your ability to do well in the sciences, but if your grades are good one of the schools will definitely take the chance on you. This is especially true if your MCAT score is good (particularly bio section) - a 10+ score in your bio science section will likely erase any concerns.

Thank you! My MCAT score was not good. I wasn't as prepared as I could have been and got a 5 on the Biology section. Leading up to the second test, I was scoring 8s and 9s for the most part. I'm hoping that my score improved considerably. But I'm wondering, if I didn't do as well...would it look bad to take the MCAT a third time (especially since it will now be a new test)?

agreed with both of these gentlemen. get that 10 on the bio and I don't think you will get many scoffs at your GPA. but definitely need that sGPA above a 3.2 or 3.25 so you don't get autoscreened at some schools.

definitely get DO shadowing and definitely try to get a letter from them as well. (some schools require it and other strongly suggest it, don't burn any bridges if a DO is readily accessible to you).

not critical, but try to get some non-clinical and clinical volunteering too. nothing has to be super high in # of hours, but regularity and consistency go a long way. a few hours a week for many months or a year or so will look great. I volunteered at an art gallery and it got brought up in one of my interviews.

I have done non-clinical and clinical volunteering. It has been pretty consistent and continuous throughout my undergrad years. As far as getting some hours/rec letter from a DO, I will most probably be doing that this summer. I assume it doesn't really matter what kind of DO they are, right?

 

[AlteredScale]

Thank you! My MCAT score was not good. I wasn't as prepared as I could have been and got a 5 on the Biology section. Leading up to the second test, I was scoring 8s and 9s for the most part. I'm hoping that my score improved considerably. But I'm wondering, if I didn't do as well...would it look bad to take the MCAT a third time (especially since it will now be a new test)?

I have done non-clinical and clinical volunteering. It has been pretty consistent and continuous throughout my undergrad years. As far as getting some hours/rec letter from a DO, I will most probably be doing that this summer. I assume it doesn't really matter what kind of DO they are, right?

A 5 in biology will leave you dead in the water during the application cycle so it's good that you decided on a retake. What were your other subsections?

You should only take the MCAT once. Every retake is looked down upon. But if you didn't do good the second time then you will have no choice but to retake it again. Remember that when you are taking the USMLE Step 1 in medical school you will essentially only have one chance to do it and do well. If you score mediocre then you can kiss those dreams of landing a RadOnc or Surgery residency good bye because you cannot retake a passing USMLE score.

It would be ideal for you to shadow a DO who is primary care and/or practices Osteopathic Manipulative Medicine (OMM) as that is really the only defining difference between DO's and MD's presently.

 

[Awesome Sauceome]

Thank you! My MCAT score was not good. I wasn't as prepared as I could have been and got a 5 on the Biology section. Leading up to the second test, I was scoring 8s and 9s for the most part. I'm hoping that my score improved considerably. But I'm wondering, if I didn't do as well...would it look bad to take the MCAT a third time (especially since it will now be a new test)?



I have done non-clinical and clinical volunteering. It has been pretty consistent and continuous throughout my undergrad years. As far as getting some hours/rec letter from a DO, I will most probably be doing that this summer. I assume it doesn't really matter what kind of DO they are, right?

Yea, personally if I was you and I could not break like a 24 and/or had any section under like a 6 after a 2nd try taking the MCAT I know I would give up and find some other career path. If it feels like you are forcing it to happen its because you are. It only gets harder once you start school as @AlteredScale has suggested. If you get your 2nd scores back and they still suck then technically you can take it a third time but I would strongly suggest you take some time off and figure out what the heck is actually wrong. That may mean taking the time to recognize that you are not mature enough to dedicate the time needed to do well on the exam (because of legit circumstances or just laziness or whatever). Or it may mean taking the time to recognize that you need to take more classes in order to gain more knowledge required for the exam (I think you fall into this category since you havent taken many upper level science classes)..

I tend to generally be an optimistic person on here because I am not one for killing dreams. But a poor GPA combined with a poor MCAT is going to make for a very challenging time during your application, and likely while you are in school.

As for your shadowing... The letter doesnt necessarily have to be from a specific type of physician; although obviously an OMM specialist or primary care is best (as this aligns with the mission of most DO schools). As long as you can articulate some things about osteopathic medicine philosophy that you learned through the process, then you are good. For instance - I got a letter of rec from a DO ortho surgeon - about as far from primary care or OMM as you can get. Yet I highlighted his advocating for preventative medicine (and how that aligns with my own personal goals) - basically the second tenet of osteopathic medicine. Its all about how you use the resources and experiences to your advantage.

But no amount of letters or experiences will make up for a poor MCAT or grades. Medical schools are not charities where everyone deserves an equal shot at becoming a doctor: their #1 concern is to make sure you can pass your licensing exams and graduate. If you cant hit their mark then, without sugar coating it, you dont deserve a shot at it. The combo of your poor grades, a 5 in the bio section, and C's in bio classes that pertain directly to medical school absolutely indicate that you would likely not do well in med school at this current time.

***Side note, it would significantly help if you give your actual scores on here. It does not remove your anonymity, as literally thousands of people get your score every year. But it would definitely help us on here gauge your actual chances.

 

[Awesome Sauceome]

Again, refer to Stlblues17 original response at the beginning of this thread. That is roughly the mark you need to hit. If you havent hit it then it means you need to take some time before applying and make sure you adjust those parts of your application.