Anatomy Respirator?

[lilTXcatMD]

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Anyone know what kind of respirators should be worn if pregnant during gross lab?

 

[DickyV]

Anyone know what kind of respirators should be worn if pregnant during gross lab?

I don't.

But I'd suggest calling the school you'll be attending and asking them. The anatomy lab managers will be the best resource for you; particularly one who is familiar with the "recipe" of preserving/re-wetting fluids used on your school's cadavers.

 

[odrade1]

at our school one of the things you could do would be to contact the occupational health & safety office. They have protocols for appropriate exposure & protection for both pregnant and non-pregnant person. Find out what chemicals are used to fix the cadavers, then check with occupational health about how to limit your exposure.

Really, your school should let you miss lab. Anatomy lab is pointless. 90% scraping fat & 10% looking at sub-optimal structures. I learned more from the atlases. And don't believe them when they tell you you can't get an appreciation for the anatomy without lab. Tissue looks and feels completely different in a cadaver vs. a live subject. I know this now after doing surg research this summer.

Best of luck.

 

[Blade28]

Really, your school should let you miss lab. Anatomy lab is pointless. 90% scraping fat & 10% looking at sub-optimal structures. I learned more from the atlases. And don't believe them when they tell you you can't get an appreciation for the anatomy without lab. Tissue looks and feels completely different in a cadaver vs. a live subject. I know this now after doing surg research this summer.

Really? While I agree that anatomy in Netter's is different from anatomy in a cadaver, is different from anatomy in the OR...I think you really need all three to fully understand the relationship between structures.

I don't think you can fully appreciate the anatomy of simple regions like the neck muscles, or stomach, or celiac/SMA/IMA without a little time in the gross lab.

 

[RockShox]

Anyone know what kind of respirators should be worn if pregnant during gross lab?

There are three options...

1. There are respirators for formaldehyde and other organics. (Keep in mind a normal gas mask will not work well because activated charcoal does not do so well with nitrogen containing molecules). This can get quite expensive, the cartridges need to be replaced, and you will have trouble talking.


Here are some links..

http://www.levineautoparts.com/3mfulfacres.html

http://www.amazon.com/Respirator-Cartridge-Formaldehyde-Certain-Organic/dp/B0006I1P32


2. Self-contained breathing system (Clearly not practical)

3. Waiver from the lab. I know several students and residents who were excused from required labs due to pregnancy. (Some good can come from litigation as no school wants to be liable for some deformed infant.)

Hope this helps.

 

[Northerner]

Really? While I agree that anatomy in Netter's is different from anatomy in a cadaver, is different from anatomy in the OR...I think you really need all three to fully understand the relationship between structures.

I don't think you can fully appreciate the anatomy of simple regions like the neck muscles, or stomach, or celiac/SMA/IMA without a little time in the gross lab.

Whoa, you mean to say you're actually disagreeing with a person who
DID "SURG" RESEARCH THIS SUMMER!!!!!!!
Jesus, you've got some stones....I think we can all agree that odrade1, in fact, is the "resident" expert on this sort of thing. If you get your act together he might let you snip the sutures he saw placed this summer, but frankly I'm not convinced you won't **** it up....

 

[Droopy Snoopy]

Whoa, you mean to say you're actually disagreeing with a person who
DID "SURG" RESEARCH THIS SUMMER!!!!!!!
Jesus, you've got some stones....I think we can all agree that odrade1, in fact, is the "resident" expert on this sort of thing. If you get your act together he might let you snip the sutures he saw placed this summer, but frankly I'm not convinced you won't **** it up....

 

[Miami_med]

I'm pretty sure that you get some absorption through the skin. We had a girl who put off lab and did it over the summer between first and second year who was in your situation. The health impact on the fetus is largely unknown (atleast according to my understanding). I would consider all of your options before trying to go to lab pregnant. Not to mention the fact that the atrocious smell will be 10x worse if you have morning sickness.

 

[Blade28]

Whoa, you mean to say you're actually disagreeing with a person who
DID "SURG" RESEARCH THIS SUMMER!!!!!!!
Jesus, you've got some stones....I think we can all agree that odrade1, in fact, is the "resident" expert on this sort of thing. If you get your act together he might let you snip the sutures he saw placed this summer, but frankly I'm not convinced you won't **** it up....

👍

Yeah I hate it when I cut the suture ends too short/long. 🙂

 

[ggk]

I did anatomy lab last year, while pregnant. I was in the lab for my entire 1st trimester and part of my 2nd trimester. I thought about the respirator but worried that it might decrease my oxygen supply which would be worse for the baby. So I spoke to the lab director who told me that he knew of plenty of people who had spent time in lab while pregnant, and they all had healthy babies, and my doctor said not to worry either. I think the chemicals are broken down in your airway well before they can get into your bloodstream. I just double gloved but mostly kept my hands out of the cadaver and didn't cut at all (didn't want to risk slipping and cutting myself and letting the chemicals get into my skin), and brought over a stool to sit on in case I didn't feel good and needed to sit.

My baby is 3 months old now and is doing great. Hope that helps.

 

[Dr JPH]

Really, your school should let you miss lab. Anatomy lab is pointless. 90% scraping fat & 10% looking at sub-optimal structures. I learned more from the atlases. And don't believe them when they tell you you can't get an appreciation for the anatomy without lab. Tissue looks and feels completely different in a cadaver vs. a live subject. I know this now after doing surg research this summer.

Youre completely wrong. I hope no one listens to your nonsense.

 

[odrade1]

Youre completely wrong. I hope no one listens to your nonsense.

Notice that surgeons esteem the putative learning advantages of the anatomy lab. Also bear in mind that surgeons (at our school) continue to make use of cadavers & the study of anatomy throughout their careers. It shouldn't be surprising that surgery resident types value their time in the anatomy lab.

That still doesn't make MS1 anatomy lab any less of a waste of time for everyone else who isn't going into surgery.

You are welcome to your opinion as well. However, I stand by my opinion. My experience was that anatomy (as a class, especially the lab) was the second biggest waste of my time all last year. Student-dissected cadavers taught me very little that Rohens + Netters didn't, and the lab consumed hours each day to obtain a learning experience that could be had in 15 minutes.

This summer, I was astounded at how much better everything looked in live patients & in the experimental animals we worked on. Cadavers are nasty, tend to be very fat, and the tissue is fixed, grey, and lifeless. The tissue even feels different, as you work on a live animal. What does an MS1 learn from cadavers during freshman anatomy that is essential to their work 4 years later? (1) anatomy varies among subjects (2) Americans are extremely fat (or the people that donate their bodies are fat) (3) students cannot dissect as well as professors. Give the MS1 students a couple of atlases and some live (but anesthetized) rats and dogs to learn basic anatomy on. Let MS4 students interested in surgery do an intensive anatomy course later. Otherwise, MS1 anatomy lab = waste of time.

 

[Northerner]

Notice that surgeons esteem the putative learning advantages of the anatomy lab. Also bear in mind that surgeons (at our school) continue to make use of cadavers & the study of anatomy throughout their careers. It shouldn't be surprising that surgery resident types value their time in the anatomy lab.

That still doesn't make MS1 anatomy lab any less of a waste of time for everyone else who isn't going into surgery.

You are welcome to your opinion as well. However, I stand by my opinion. My experience was that anatomy (as a class, especially the lab) was the second biggest waste of my time all last year. Student-dissected cadavers taught me very little that Rohens + Netters didn't, and the lab consumed hours each day to obtain a learning experience that could be had in 15 minutes.

This summer, I was astounded at how much better everything looked in live patients & in the experimental animals we worked on. Cadavers are nasty, tend to be very fat, and the tissue is fixed, grey, and lifeless. The tissue even feels different, as you work on a live animal. What does an MS1 learn from cadavers during freshman anatomy that is essential to their work 4 years later? (1) anatomy varies among subjects (2) Americans are extremely fat (or the people that donate their bodies are fat) (3) students cannot dissect as well as professors. Give the MS1 students a couple of atlases and some live (but anesthetized) rats and dogs to learn basic anatomy on. Let MS4 students interested in surgery do an intensive anatomy course later. Otherwise, MS1 anatomy lab = waste of time.

You've got to admire his stubborn chutzpah.

 

[bluechipper]

I hope odrade is right because I don't remember anything from anatomy lab.

 

[Dr JPH]

Let MS4 students interested in surgery do an intensive anatomy course later. Otherwise, MS1 anatomy lab = waste of time.

Perhaps their M1 anatomy course is the reason they became interested in surgery in the first place.

By that logic we should let all 4th year students make their own curriculum based on what they think they will match into.

The Derm wannabes will go pop pimples, the Rabs wannabes will get fit for lead vests and the Orthos will arm wrestle all day in the cafeteria.

Anatomy is the fundamental aspect in medicine. Not everyone is lucky enough to spend a significant amount of time with living tissue to full comprehend the 3 dimensional body. Cadaveric dissection is the best that we have.

As it is now there are too many residents in non surgical fields who have a piss poor knowledge of anatomy. Not a big deal when youre writing an Rx for Augmentin. A VERY big deal when your placing a central line at 2am.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

I hope odrade is right because I don't remember anything from anatomy lab.

I'm with you here. 😳

 

[Dr JPH]

I'm with you here. 😳

FP right?

 

[Doctor Bagel]

FP right?

nope, but not surgery. probably psych, neuro or an IM subspecialty (endo, rheum). at least that's what the tests tell me i should do.

 

[Dr JPH]

nope, but not surgery.

No kidding.

Then what?

 

[Doctor Bagel]

No kidding.

Then what?

edited my response above with thoughts. 🙂

 

[MossPoh]

Anatomy is the fundamental aspect in medicine. Not everyone is lucky enough to spend a significant amount of time with living tissue to full comprehend the 3 dimensional body. Cadaveric dissection is the best that we have.

It is funny how for hundreds of years of medical doctors refused to learn anatomy because it was seen as worthless. Then ballsy guys started stealing corpses outside of their allotted 1-2 bodies per year in order to learn every bit of anatomy and lead stuff into modern medicine. Now there seems to be backtracking amongst people to return to following the ways of old. Whether you like it or not, during the history of medicine it hasn't been THAT common to use cadavers to learn from. Count yourself lucky to get access to it.You might hate the lab, maybe won't learn as much, but whether acknowledged or not there is some form of learning that happens.
I know I know..I'm not in medical school so I should have no input, but these arguments can be transferred into nearly every form of education.

OP. Do what others say, talk to them and see what the administration or profs think. I would be more concerned with the litter box. 😉

 

[Blade28]

Anatomy is the fundamental aspect in medicine. Not everyone is lucky enough to spend a significant amount of time with living tissue to full comprehend the 3 dimensional body. Cadaveric dissection is the best that we have.

Agreed. Excellent post. 👍