Another "failure" thread from a gunner's* perspective

[Gunher]

M1 just finished my first year and I'm really struggling with the taste of failure. Unlike some of our friends who are in really dire circumstances with advancement committees and multiple failures on their records I'm struggling because I am what you'd probably call a gunner and I'm feeling like I've already blown my chances at a top specialty. I haven't honored anything and my school seems to be pretty damn smart. People have already put up honors in multiple tough classes and I'm absolutely certain I'm behind when it comes to things like class rank and AOA.

People will tell me not to worry but the fact of the matter is that, if you read the literature, you see top programs and competitive specialties using those preclinical grades as their 3rd or 4th most important factor. Hell, the orthopedists even published a paper demonstrating that great preclinicals are a positive predictor of a person's quality as a surgeon. It's brutal to me. I put up a series of passes in my first term and after re-evaluating my life and habits came back strong in semester 2 only to blow it on my finals. I missed honoring my classes by margins of 4 or 5 test questions.

It absolutely sucks. I feel inferior and worthless. I feel like a failure. I'm afraid that my below average grades will keep me from doing anything I'm actually interested in. I feel like a complete fraud, to be honest. I know PDs will look at my grades and tell me I'm horrible and I just don't know how to overcome it.

The pressure is really on me now, too. Next year I have to study for boards and with my weak, bottom 50% of the class grades I have GOT to put up a +2SD kind of score while honoring everything. After this semester I'm not sure that I can do it. I used to think I was a capable student and competent person but right now I just feel like garbage.

Sure, I passed everything but I'm "below average" on paper. Some people around me tell me to take solace in the fact that I had a lot going on this term outside of school but does anyone really give a crap? Absolutely not. I won't accept any excuses for my own mediocrity. I had an opportunity and I absolutely failed to get it done. No one is going to care why I got a P, nor should they. They will only care that someone else got the H.

So right now I feel like my whole career is crashing down. No matter what I do I'll still be behind and my deepest fear is that really I'm just mediocre. I'm not as capable as I thought. I'm definitely not the student I thought and clearly I'm not as good as my peers.

So you all can read this and tell me what a tool I am but I'm betting I'm not the first to feel this way and maybe someone reading this has been there and can tell me how to cope with it. I hate feeling like I'm working from a disadvantage but all the evidence makes it seem like I'm below average and will never recover.



*I consider this thread to be from the gunner's perspective because of things I want to do with my career. I'm not going to be satisfied to head into something where P really does = MD.

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[Law2Doc]

M1 just finished my first year and I'm really struggling with the taste of failure. Unlike some of our friends who are in really dire circumstances with advancement committees and multiple failures on their records I'm struggling because I am what you'd probably call a gunner and I'm feeling like I've already blown my chances at a top specialty. I haven't honored anything and my school seems to be pretty damn smart. People have already put up honors in multiple tough classes and I'm absolutely certain I'm behind when it comes to things like class rank and AOA.

People will tell me not to worry but the fact of the matter is that, if you read the literature, you see top programs and competitive specialties using those preclinical grades as their 3rd or 4th most important factor. Hell, the orthopedists even published a paper demonstrating that great preclinicals are a positive predictor of a person's quality as a surgeon. It's brutal to me. I put up a series of passes in my first term and after re-evaluating my life and habits came back strong in semester 2 only to blow it on my finals. I missed honoring my classes by margins of 4 or 5 test questions.

It absolutely sucks. I feel inferior and worthless. I feel like a failure. I'm afraid that my below average grades will keep me from doing anything I'm actually interested in. I feel like a complete fraud, to be honest. I know PDs will look at my grades and tell me I'm horrible and I just don't know how to overcome it.

The pressure is really on me now, too. Next year I have to study for boards and with my weak, bottom 50% of the class grades I have GOT to put up a +2SD kind of score while honoring everything. After this semester I'm not sure that I can do it. I used to think I was a capable student and competent person but right now I just feel like garbage.

Sure, I passed everything but I'm "below average" on paper. Some people around me tell me to take solace in the fact that I had a lot going on this term outside of school but does anyone really give a crap? Absolutely not. I won't accept any excuses for my own mediocrity. I had an opportunity and I absolutely failed to get it done. No one is going to care why I got a P, nor should they. They will only care that someone else got the H.

So right now I feel like my whole career is crashing down. No matter what I do I'll still be behind and my deepest fear is that really I'm just mediocre. I'm not as capable as I thought. I'm definitely not the student I thought and clearly I'm not as good as my peers.

So you all can read this and tell me what a tool I am but I'm betting I'm not the first to feel this way and maybe someone reading this has been there and can tell me how to cope with it. I hate feeling like I'm working from a disadvantage but all the evidence makes it seem like I'm below average and will never recover.



*I consider this thread to be from the gunner's perspective because of things I want to do with my career. I'm not going to be satisfied to head into something where P really does = MD.

A little melodramatic, don't you think?
I don't know where you are getting your info, but the truth of the matter is that if you are first you who has passed everything, you are not yet out of the running for any specialty. Step 1 is going to be the biggest determinator. Your preclinical years won't. The fact that you say the PDs look at this as the 5th most important factor is only meaningful if these guys routinely have to look beyond factor #4. Which they don't often. Your residency will be decided by the clinical year evals, Step 1, away rotations/networking, and for some fields research. All the rest is just more or less icing on the cake, but it doesn't really detract from a good cake. Many people in the top programs in the top fields didn't honor anything in their preclinical years. Believe what you want, but that's the fact. Doing well on Step 1 forgives a lot of mediocrity.

That being said, how you are doing in med school thus far is potentially indicative of how effective your study plan is, and that in turn could inhibit a good Step 1 score. Time to work on this, if you haven't already. But as for the rest -- cool the drama. Nothing is over and nothing is set in stone yet. Your attitude may make all that a reality, but your first year grades won't.

 

[bergwood]

*I consider this thread to be from the gunner's perspective because of things I want to do with my career. I'm not going to be satisfied to head into something where P really does = MD.

Just out of curiosity, why not? Is it because you've had experience in all of the non-competitive specialties and none of them seem to satisfy you? Or is it because you can't tolerate not being better than everyone else? There are plenty of non-competitive specialties that can lead to a satisfying lifestyle.

Getting honors in all your classes and doing well on the boards typically go together, unless your classes poorly correlate with step 1 material. So if you do well in your classes next year, you will be well prepared for step 1 and will have an easier time pulling off a good score. Classes and boards are not entirely separate entities where working towards one comes at the expense of the other. Study hard next year and give yourself plenty of free time before taking step 1 and you should be fine.

 

[AlexMorph]

The histrionics are strong in this one.

 

[ucsfstudents]

Things will work out in the end. You don't have to worry so much. Some stress is good, but too much stress will be detrimental to your productivity. You will not do well if you overwhelm yourself with the prospect of failure. You will be ok.

 

[VoiceofReason]

Next year I have to study for boards and with my weak, bottom 50% of the class grades I have GOT to put up a +2SD kind of score while honoring everything. After this semester I'm not sure that I can do it.

You probably can't

 

[adaptation1]

do people really think like this?

 

[AlexMorph]

You probably can't

lol. love it

 

[gravitywave]

do people really think like this?

i know. weird, isn't it?

 

[ArcGurren]

Just out of curiosity, why not? Is it because you've had experience in all of the non-competitive specialties and none of them seem to satisfy you? Or is it because you can't tolerate not being better than everyone else? There are plenty of non-competitive specialties that can lead to a satisfying lifestyle.

Getting honors in all your classes and doing well on the boards typically go together, unless your classes poorly correlate with step 1 material. So if you do well in your classes next year, you will be well prepared for step 1 and will have an easier time pulling off a good score. Classes and boards are not entirely separate entities where working towards one comes at the expense of the other. Study hard next year and give yourself plenty of free time before taking step 1 and you should be fine.

Yeah, except not. I've seen people score 250s with barely passing grades and 230s with all honors. It takes a very different set of skills to excel in class vs. excel on standardized exams.

 

[ArcGurren]

M1 just finished my first year and I'm really struggling with the taste of failure. Unlike some of our friends who are in really dire circumstances with advancement committees and multiple failures on their records I'm struggling because I am what you'd probably call a gunner and I'm feeling like I've already blown my chances at a top specialty. I haven't honored anything and my school seems to be pretty damn smart. People have already put up honors in multiple tough classes and I'm absolutely certain I'm behind when it comes to things like class rank and AOA.

People will tell me not to worry but the fact of the matter is that, if you read the literature, you see top programs and competitive specialties using those preclinical grades as their 3rd or 4th most important factor. Hell, the orthopedists even published a paper demonstrating that great preclinicals are a positive predictor of a person's quality as a surgeon. It's brutal to me. I put up a series of passes in my first term and after re-evaluating my life and habits came back strong in semester 2 only to blow it on my finals. I missed honoring my classes by margins of 4 or 5 test questions.

It absolutely sucks. I feel inferior and worthless. I feel like a failure. I'm afraid that my below average grades will keep me from doing anything I'm actually interested in. I feel like a complete fraud, to be honest. I know PDs will look at my grades and tell me I'm horrible and I just don't know how to overcome it.

The pressure is really on me now, too. Next year I have to study for boards and with my weak, bottom 50% of the class grades I have GOT to put up a +2SD kind of score while honoring everything. After this semester I'm not sure that I can do it. I used to think I was a capable student and competent person but right now I just feel like garbage.

Sure, I passed everything but I'm "below average" on paper. Some people around me tell me to take solace in the fact that I had a lot going on this term outside of school but does anyone really give a crap? Absolutely not. I won't accept any excuses for my own mediocrity. I had an opportunity and I absolutely failed to get it done. No one is going to care why I got a P, nor should they. They will only care that someone else got the H.

So right now I feel like my whole career is crashing down. No matter what I do I'll still be behind and my deepest fear is that really I'm just mediocre. I'm not as capable as I thought. I'm definitely not the student I thought and clearly I'm not as good as my peers.

So you all can read this and tell me what a tool I am but I'm betting I'm not the first to feel this way and maybe someone reading this has been there and can tell me how to cope with it. I hate feeling like I'm working from a disadvantage but all the evidence makes it seem like I'm below average and will never recover.



*I consider this thread to be from the gunner's perspective because of things I want to do with my career. I'm not going to be satisfied to head into something where P really does = MD.

As said before... histrionic personality disorder much?

And as for the paper published by the orthopedic surgeons about how preclinical grades somehow rank with abilities as a surgeon... yeah I bet that those grades you got from memorizing the Krebs cycle will totally help you as a surgeon... or memorizing the different causes of pancreatitis... sometimes I wonder where the hell they draw these conclusions from.

If you feel like your professional life is over just because you THINK you don't have the grades to do orthopedics (which I don't really get, since I know people who've matched Ortho with barely passing preclinicals but stellar clinicals and step 1) then you need to reevaluate your way of thinking entirely.

 

[thepoopologist]

WELL....

If a NORMAL medical student with ambitions was in your situation, they would:

1. Know that what's done is done
2. Spend the summer enjoying themselves since they successfully passed all their classes
3. Re-evaluate their study techniques and try to do better 2nd year.


There is a difference between aiming for a goal and experiencing disappointment with falling short, and what you've written below.

If I were you, I would spend this summer seeing a psychiatrist.

It absolutely sucks. I feel inferior and worthless. I feel like a failure. I'm afraid that my below average grades will keep me from doing anything I'm actually interested in. I feel like a complete fraud, to be honest. I know PDs will look at my grades and tell me I'm horrible and I just don't know how to overcome it.

The pressure is really on me now, too. Next year I have to study for boards and with my weak, bottom 50% of the class grades I have GOT to put up a +2SD kind of score while honoring everything. After this semester I'm not sure that I can do it. I used to think I was a capable student and competent person but right now I just feel like garbage.

Sure, I passed everything but I'm "below average" on paper. Some people around me tell me to take solace in the fact that I had a lot going on this term outside of school but does anyone really give a crap? Absolutely not. I won't accept any excuses for my own mediocrity. I had an opportunity and I absolutely failed to get it done. No one is going to care why I got a P, nor should they. They will only care that someone else got the H.

So right now I feel like my whole career is crashing down. No matter what I do I'll still be behind and my deepest fear is that really I'm just mediocre. I'm not as capable as I thought. I'm definitely not the student I thought and clearly I'm not as good as my peers.

*I consider this thread to be from the gunner's perspective because of things I want to do with my career. I'm not going to be satisfied to head into something where P really does = MD.

 

[Untraditional]

.

It absolutely sucks. I feel inferior and worthless. I feel like a failure. I'm afraid that my below average grades will keep me from doing anything I'm actually interested in.

I think right now the best advice anyone could give you would be to clear your head for a few days and get off sites like SDN. You just finished your first year of medical school, somehow I doubt that this is the end of the world.

You're clearly motivated and I think in the end it will all be ok for you. Some time will give you perspective. Enjoy your summer! Seriously!

 

[cpants]

Your problem is how you are setting goals. You gotta look smaller picture to survive these years. Your goal should not be to land an ortho residency right now. It should be to get an A on your next test or even to get through your pharm cards for this unit without making any mistakes. It's meeting these small goals that lets you achieve a big one. The pressure of your whole career can't ride on every exam.

 

[officedepot]

I'll just say that preclinical grades going from M1 to M2 will probably be similar for you no matter what you do. Sorry. Also your grades now are a pretty good correlation to how your board scores will be. Again I am sorry.

There's not a ton you can do about it. I doubt your grades will improve significantly. Your problem is this massive ego you have.

Does this remove you from consideration for good specialities? No. You don't have to be tops in the class to get a orthopedic spot. But you better study hard for step 1.

Nothing is written in stone so I of course can be wrong. But this is just my experience talking here. I said the same thing as you after M1 year (I was top 33% or so and wanted to be better). But guess what I am still the same and I feel like I study more. You're not the only one who's going to study more. Also my step 1 score of 230s is probably top 33% or so as well. In order to get AOA you need to be like top 15-20%. You just need to get off your high horse. Residencies won't want you if they think you are an arrogant douche.

 

[ArcGurren]

I'll just say that preclinical grades going from M1 to M2 will probably be similar for you no matter what you do. Sorry. Also your grades now are a pretty good correlation to how your board scores will be. Again I am sorry.

There's not a ton you can do about it. I doubt your grades will improve significantly. Your problem is this massive ego you have.

Does this remove you from consideration for good specialities? No. You don't have to be tops in the class to get a orthopedic spot. But you better study hard for step 1.

Nothing is written in stone so I of course can be wrong. But this is just my experience talking here. I said the same thing as you after M1 year (I was top 33% or so and wanted to be better). But guess what I am still the same and I feel like I study more. You're not the only one who's going to study more. Also my step 1 score of 230s is probably top 33% or so as well. In order to get AOA you need to be like top 15-20%. You just need to get off your high horse. Residencies won't want you if they think you are an arrogant douche.

My M2 grades were markedly better than my M1 grades

 

[username456789]

Yeah, except not. I've seen people score 250s with barely passing grades and 230s with all honors. It takes a very different set of skills to excel in class vs. excel on standardized exams.

There's a fairly strong correlation between M1/M2 performance and Step I grades. No, it's not 1.00, but the people who barely pass the first two years and then score 250 (or the people who honor M1/M2 and score 210 or something) are not likely to fall along the line of best fit with this regression.

I suck at stats so I'm probably not using that terminology correctly, but a few anecdotes doesn't invalidate the fact that typically the better you do during the first two years, the more likely it is that you will perform well on Step I. We all know of a few kids who don't fit the model.

 

[gravitywave]

I'll just say that preclinical grades going from M1 to M2 will probably be similar for you no matter what you do. Sorry. Also your grades now are a pretty good correlation to how your board scores will be. Again I am sorry.

There's not a ton you can do about it. I doubt your grades will improve significantly. Your problem is this massive ego you have.

Does this remove you from consideration for good specialities? No. You don't have to be tops in the class to get a orthopedic spot. But you better study hard for step 1.

Nothing is written in stone so I of course can be wrong. But this is just my experience talking here. I said the same thing as you after M1 year (I was top 33% or so and wanted to be better). But guess what I am still the same and I feel like I study more. You're not the only one who's going to study more. Also my step 1 score of 230s is probably top 33% or so as well. In order to get AOA you need to be like top 15-20%. You just need to get off your high horse. Residencies won't want you if they think you are an arrogant douche.

yeah, um, lol. M1 grades don't have much to say about a person's Step score, especially if said person is at a school with a traditional curriculum.

besides, some schools don't even use preclinical grades for AOA. OP could truly be freaking out over nothing (as opposed to simply freaking out over what most people consider to be nothing)

 

[CaptainSSO]

So sad. You're a self-proclaimed gunner yet you're in the bottom 50% of your class. I can't really say I feel bad for you, because your post says "I'm supposed to be better than everyone else. I'm not doing better than everyone else, and it's not fair." Get over yourself.

tell me how to cope with it

There's nothing you can do. All you can do is suck it up and do better, or not. Work harder (or smarter, or both)--that's literally your only option.

 

[Day man]

M1 just finished my first year and I'm really struggling with the taste of failure. Unlike some of our friends who are in really dire circumstances with advancement committees and multiple failures on their records I'm struggling because I am what you'd probably call a gunner and I'm feeling like I've already blown my chances at a top specialty. I haven't honored anything and my school seems to be pretty damn smart. People have already put up honors in multiple tough classes and I'm absolutely certain I'm behind when it comes to things like class rank and AOA.

People will tell me not to worry but the fact of the matter is that, if you read the literature, you see top programs and competitive specialties using those preclinical grades as their 3rd or 4th most important factor. Hell, the orthopedists even published a paper demonstrating that great preclinicals are a positive predictor of a person's quality as a surgeon. It's brutal to me. I put up a series of passes in my first term and after re-evaluating my life and habits came back strong in semester 2 only to blow it on my finals. I missed honoring my classes by margins of 4 or 5 test questions.

It absolutely sucks. I feel inferior and worthless. I feel like a failure. I'm afraid that my below average grades will keep me from doing anything I'm actually interested in. I feel like a complete fraud, to be honest. I know PDs will look at my grades and tell me I'm horrible and I just don't know how to overcome it.

The pressure is really on me now, too. Next year I have to study for boards and with my weak, bottom 50% of the class grades I have GOT to put up a +2SD kind of score while honoring everything. After this semester I'm not sure that I can do it. I used to think I was a capable student and competent person but right now I just feel like garbage.

Sure, I passed everything but I'm "below average" on paper. Some people around me tell me to take solace in the fact that I had a lot going on this term outside of school but does anyone really give a crap? Absolutely not. I won't accept any excuses for my own mediocrity. I had an opportunity and I absolutely failed to get it done. No one is going to care why I got a P, nor should they. They will only care that someone else got the H.

So right now I feel like my whole career is crashing down. No matter what I do I'll still be behind and my deepest fear is that really I'm just mediocre. I'm not as capable as I thought. I'm definitely not the student I thought and clearly I'm not as good as my peers.

So you all can read this and tell me what a tool I am but I'm betting I'm not the first to feel this way and maybe someone reading this has been there and can tell me how to cope with it. I hate feeling like I'm working from a disadvantage but all the evidence makes it seem like I'm below average and will never recover.



*I consider this thread to be from the gunner's perspective because of things I want to do with my career. I'm not going to be satisfied to head into something where P really does = MD.

That's a great user name, I totally should've thought of that.

 

[Law2Doc]

There's a fairly strong correlation between M1/M2 performance and Step I grades. No, it's not 1.00, but the people who barely pass the first two years and then score 250 (or the people who honor M1/M2 and score 210 or something) are not likely to fall along the line of best fit with this regression.

I suck at stats so I'm probably not using that terminology correctly, but a few anecdotes doesn't invalidate the fact that typically the better you do during the first two years, the more likely it is that you will perform well on Step I. We all know of a few kids who don't fit the model.

Folks like to use phrases like "strong correlation" but in fact that's not the case. There's a definite correlation between M2 performance and Step 1. It's not remarkably strong from a statistics point of view, and it's not something I would regard as set in stone. It is a bit more of a correlation than simply saying that smart people do well on tests though. I agree with gravitywave that M1 performance has a whole lot less correlation to Step 1. Why? Not only is first year material very low yield for the Step, but also because to a large degree you are learning how to study in the first year of med school, and that learning process can result in under-performance that masks how you will really do on Step 1. We all know folks who did well on Step 1 who seemed to be bottom feeders during med school. We all know even more people who seemed like super stars in med school but ended up with pretty unimpressive results. So no point dwelling on correlations. You need to put yourself in a position to succeed, not doom yourself because some people who don't do as well in med school also seem to have trouble on that test.

 

[drizzt3117]

Don't worry OP, there's probably still a few rural FP residencies out there for you.

 

[bluejay99]

I feel like a failure. I'm afraid that my below average grades will keep me from doing anything I'm actually interested in.

Hey Guhner, my question is do you even know what you're interested in at this point or do you want to get into a top specialty just for the sake of it being a "top specialty?"

I know everyone is trying to keep their options open, but I think it might reduce some stress for you if you found your true passion instead of just trying to be at the top of your class.

Aside from that, they tell us at our school that residency programs don't really care about first/second year honors. So as long as you do well on your USMLE/rotations you still have a shot even if you decide to do derm.

 

[username456789]

Folks like to use phrases like "strong correlation" but in fact that's not the case. There's a definite correlation between M2 performance and Step 1. It's not remarkably strong from a statistics point of view, and it's not something I would regard as set in stone.

I'm mostly going off of our school's data, which reports a correlation of 0.80. I'd say that's fairly strong.

 

[username456789]

We all know folks who did well on Step 1 who seemed to be bottom feeders during med school. We all know even more people who seemed like super stars in med school but ended up with pretty unimpressive results. So no point dwelling on correlations.

You're helping illustrate my very point: correlations are correlations for a reason, and although we all know the stories of people who don't fall directly in line with those (and thus the OP should certainly not give up hope), doing well during M1/M2 can surely help when it comes time to study for Step I.

 

[KinesStudent]

The year's done homie, go to the beach.

 

[Slack3r]

Just out of curiosity, why not? Is it because you've had experience in all of the non-competitive specialties and none of them seem to satisfy you? Or is it because you can't tolerate not being better than everyone else? There are plenty of non-competitive specialties that can lead to a satisfying lifestyle.

Probably this.

 

[UAAWolf]

M1 just finished my first year and I'm really struggling with the taste of failure. Unlike some of our friends who are in really dire circumstances with advancement committees and multiple failures on their records I'm struggling because I am what you'd probably call a gunner and I'm feeling like I've already blown my chances at a top specialty. I haven't honored anything and my school seems to be pretty damn smart. People have already put up honors in multiple tough classes and I'm absolutely certain I'm behind when it comes to things like class rank and AOA.

People will tell me not to worry but the fact of the matter is that, if you read the literature, you see top programs and competitive specialties using those preclinical grades as their 3rd or 4th most important factor. Hell, the orthopedists even published a paper demonstrating that great preclinicals are a positive predictor of a person's quality as a surgeon. It's brutal to me. I put up a series of passes in my first term and after re-evaluating my life and habits came back strong in semester 2 only to blow it on my finals. I missed honoring my classes by margins of 4 or 5 test questions.

It absolutely sucks. I feel inferior and worthless. I feel like a failure. I'm afraid that my below average grades will keep me from doing anything I'm actually interested in. I feel like a complete fraud, to be honest. I know PDs will look at my grades and tell me I'm horrible and I just don't know how to overcome it.

The pressure is really on me now, too. Next year I have to study for boards and with my weak, bottom 50% of the class grades I have GOT to put up a +2SD kind of score while honoring everything. After this semester I'm not sure that I can do it. I used to think I was a capable student and competent person but right now I just feel like garbage.

Sure, I passed everything but I'm "below average" on paper. Some people around me tell me to take solace in the fact that I had a lot going on this term outside of school but does anyone really give a crap? Absolutely not. I won't accept any excuses for my own mediocrity. I had an opportunity and I absolutely failed to get it done. No one is going to care why I got a P, nor should they. They will only care that someone else got the H.

So right now I feel like my whole career is crashing down. No matter what I do I'll still be behind and my deepest fear is that really I'm just mediocre. I'm not as capable as I thought. I'm definitely not the student I thought and clearly I'm not as good as my peers.

So you all can read this and tell me what a tool I am but I'm betting I'm not the first to feel this way and maybe someone reading this has been there and can tell me how to cope with it. I hate feeling like I'm working from a disadvantage but all the evidence makes it seem like I'm below average and will never recover.



*I consider this thread to be from the gunner's perspective because of things I want to do with my career. I'm not going to be satisfied to head into something where P really does = MD.

Med students are smart. Everyone here destroyed undergrad. Once you figure out how to adjust to med school- I think things will go great for you, and it sounds like you're not even doing bad.

Pre clinical grades mean nothing bro

 

[UAAWolf]

If I were you, I would spend this summer seeing a psychiatrist.

Uncalled for

 

[thepoopologist]

Uncalled for

I've been watching the NBA playoffs. There are hundreds of shots missed in a game. I have yet to see a player miss a shot and stand there self flagellating while the rest of his team gets back in transition.

 

[adaptation1]

lol...you just cry in the locker room and move on! seriously tho, hope this post was a troll.

I've been watching the NBA playoffs. There are hundreds of shots missed in a game. I have yet to see a player miss a shot and stand there self flagellating while the rest of his team gets back in transition.

 

[UAAWolf]

I've been watching the NBA playoffs. There are hundreds of shots missed in a game. I have yet to see a player miss a shot and stand there self flagellating while the rest of his team gets back in transition.

Miami sucked today. Bron Bron is probably crying

 

[vrq525]

To the OP: I found myself in a similar position after first year and felt somewhat down, but really turned it around for second year, did well on step I and in the clinical years, made AOA, and matched at a top residency program. Life isn't a controlled experiment, but what I THINK made the difference for me was identifying how I learned best, explicitly evaluating my knowledge of tough topics by discussing them with other med students in study sessions, and re-exposing myself to the material (I'm kind of an audio learner and listened to podcasts/recordings of each lecture at least twice). I seriously went from scoring around the mean to being in the top 10% on all exams while still having a life, just by figuring out how to study effectively and being active vs. passive when reviewing tough topics.

In a larger sense, I'd be careful to address other things going on in your life that may be contributing to these feelings of worthlessness (including major depression if that's the case). The other big point, as others have noted, is that your step I/II scores and clinical performance are the major factors that residency programs will use in evaluating you. Even though I did really well starting in second year, I don't think my second year performance did much for my residency application in and of itself-- but it did boost my AOA credentials a bit, build confidence, ensure that I had a good foundation for step I studying, and help me to realize how I learned best.

Best wishes to you.

 

[motomed]

OP, go talk to someone! sounds like you would be an excellent candidate for some CBT. go spill all of this to a therapist and keep an open mind. I can't promise you that they'll help you get your desired residency, but I can pretty much guarantee that if you give it a couple months it'll leave you in a far better position than you're in now, and maybe having a clear mind on all of this will help you perfrom like you want to be too. nothing to lose by giving it a try.

 

[RapplixGmed]

I'd say get used to it. As you keep on going up, people just keep on getting smarter and smarter. Unless you truly are the one smartest person in the world, somewhere along the way you are going to end up in the bottom 50% and that will be the end of it.

 

[2012mdc]

M1 just finished my first year and I'm really struggling with the taste of failure. Unlike some of our friends who are in really dire circumstances with advancement committees and multiple failures on their records I'm struggling because I am what you'd probably call a gunner and I'm feeling like I've already blown my chances at a top specialty. I haven't honored anything and my school seems to be pretty damn smart. People have already put up honors in multiple tough classes and I'm absolutely certain I'm behind when it comes to things like class rank and AOA.

People will tell me not to worry but the fact of the matter is that, if you read the literature, you see top programs and competitive specialties using those preclinical grades as their 3rd or 4th most important factor. Hell, the orthopedists even published a paper demonstrating that great preclinicals are a positive predictor of a person's quality as a surgeon. It's brutal to me. I put up a series of passes in my first term and after re-evaluating my life and habits came back strong in semester 2 only to blow it on my finals. I missed honoring my classes by margins of 4 or 5 test questions.

It absolutely sucks. I feel inferior and worthless. I feel like a failure. I'm afraid that my below average grades will keep me from doing anything I'm actually interested in. I feel like a complete fraud, to be honest. I know PDs will look at my grades and tell me I'm horrible and I just don't know how to overcome it.

The pressure is really on me now, too. Next year I have to study for boards and with my weak, bottom 50% of the class grades I have GOT to put up a +2SD kind of score while honoring everything. After this semester I'm not sure that I can do it. I used to think I was a capable student and competent person but right now I just feel like garbage.

Sure, I passed everything but I'm "below average" on paper. Some people around me tell me to take solace in the fact that I had a lot going on this term outside of school but does anyone really give a crap? Absolutely not. I won't accept any excuses for my own mediocrity. I had an opportunity and I absolutely failed to get it done. No one is going to care why I got a P, nor should they. They will only care that someone else got the H.

So right now I feel like my whole career is crashing down. No matter what I do I'll still be behind and my deepest fear is that really I'm just mediocre. I'm not as capable as I thought. I'm definitely not the student I thought and clearly I'm not as good as my peers.

So you all can read this and tell me what a tool I am but I'm betting I'm not the first to feel this way and maybe someone reading this has been there and can tell me how to cope with it. I hate feeling like I'm working from a disadvantage but all the evidence makes it seem like I'm below average and will never recover.



*I consider this thread to be from the gunner's perspective because of things I want to do with my career. I'm not going to be satisfied to head into something where P really does = MD.

You're being way too dramatic. You said you missed honors by 4 or 5 questions. So 4 or 5 questions is the difference between making honors and feeling inferior and worthless?

Enjoy your summer, be thankful you passed everything and are moving on to 2nd year. Find out your weaknesses and work hard to improve them, specifically your study habits.

You cannot put too much stock into exam results, whether you have all passes or all honors. It does not determine how intelligent you are or how you will be as a doctor.

Do well on Step 1, leave your arrogant attitude at the door when 3rd yeat starts, and get good evals and honors 3rd year.

 

[adaptation1]

by his definition, 50% of his med school class should go jump off the cliff right now, being failures and worthless and all. sometimes it's good to take a blow to one's self-esteem, if not to walk amongst plebians, for just a quick sec.

 

[OveractiveBrain]

Med students are smart.Everyone here destroyed undergrad. Once you figure out how to adjust to med school- I think things will go great for you, and it sounds like you're not even doing bad.

I didn't. Gentlemen's C'd Orgo, had to take it again over the summer. I spent my college life growing as a person, from an selfish, introspective, reactive person who had to be better than everyone else into the person I am today... ACTUALLY better than everyone else. All it cost me was two years working as a paramedic to get to medical school.

Seriously, though. I was completely dissatisfied with my medical school classmates. Either had no real world experience and were strangely idealistic (or in the case of the OP, blind to humanity), or were what medical education selects for (memory, multiple question crunching machines). A lot of people did "perform" better than I did (in terms of ass kissing, bus throwing, and mcq). Strange then that I ended up choosing my residency and getting my number one choice.

As UAA says, things will go great. Learn that you aren't the best anymore. You're part of the upper 1% of the upper 1%, fighting for thousandths just isnt worth it.

Pre clinical grades mean nothing bro

They do if he wants AOA, which is what he needs to go into Optho at Johns-Hopkins. He's pretty much blown his chances at any Ivy League residency. Which is, after all, what we're all after, isn't it?

 

[OveractiveBrain]

M1 just finished my first year and I'm really struggling with the taste of failure. Unlike some of our friends who are in really dire circumstances with advancement committees and multiple failures on their records I'm struggling because I am what you'd probably call a gunner and I'm feeling like I've already blown my chances at a top specialty. I haven't honored anything and my school seems to be pretty damn smart. People have already put up honors in multiple tough classes and I'm absolutely certain I'm behind when it comes to things like class rank and AOA.

etc...

I've decided to respond to the OP, directly. I sort of did it sarcastically in the previous post.

What you're struggling with is the fact that your entire life you've been the best, you,ve been told you're the best, you're expected to be the best. For 20 something years all you have had to do is perform well on grades and earned the respect of your family, the rewards of our culture, and promises of greatness.

The realization that grades mean less and less is both startling and difficult to accept. The farther you go in medicine the less grades matter. Sure it helps to be in the top 10% of your class. Sure it helps to be AOA. But what matters more is your ability to be a team player, to interact with patients and staff, to do well for your patients. It sounds hokey. It is a little hokey. And its totally foreign to everything we've learned our whole lives.

Realize that grades matter a little. But they matter only for the people going into ROAD at top institutions. But then what's the goal? Those MD/PhDs youre competing against for the ID fellowship at Mayo? They have a different plan, a different goal than the rest of us. Just being in medicine means you want to practice. You get an education anywhere. You won't be dumped on some IMG hospital because you didn't do perfect in M1.

Step back, take a breath. Realize that you are in the top 1% of the top 1% already, realize that medicine is the most difficult profession to enter and is the only one with as much training as we have to go through. Masters of the human spirit, the body, with the ability to influence beyond our scope. Getting a 72 on neuroscience just seems peculiarly small in comparison.

 

[Mattchiavelli]

I'm glad that at every jump in training a good chunk of the totally out of touch crazy students get dropped (HS -> Premed -> Med school -> Residency), or maybe they just naturally mature as they age and you see less of the overdramatic reactions to little stuff like this.

I hope that in MS3/MS4 you take care of some people with crippling psychiatric disease, terminal cancer, a wife that survived an MVA that killed her husband, etc, just to get some perspective and realize that some people in life have REAL problems

 

[naus]

Nothing sadder than a wannabe/failed gunner.

If you're going to call yourself a gunner, at least be 1 SD above your class and in the running for AOA. Otherwise that's just sad...

If you are barely at 50% in your class now, good luck getting that 2 SD next year. You're going to need it with your histrionics and lack of calm under stress and bad news.

 

[naus]

Folks like to use phrases like "strong correlation" but in fact that's not the case. There's a definite correlation between M2 performance and Step 1. It's not remarkably strong from a statistics point of view, and it's not something I would regard as set in stone. It is a bit more of a correlation than simply saying that smart people do well on tests though. I agree with gravitywave that M1 performance has a whole lot less correlation to Step 1. Why? Not only is first year material very low yield for the Step, but also because to a large degree you are learning how to study in the first year of med school, and that learning process can result in under-performance that masks how you will really do on Step 1. We all know folks who did well on Step 1 who seemed to be bottom feeders during med school. We all know even more people who seemed like super stars in med school but ended up with pretty unimpressive results. So no point dwelling on correlations. You need to put yourself in a position to succeed, not doom yourself because some people who don't do as well in med school also seem to have trouble on that test.

This kind of fuzzy thinking hurts my head. Must be the law degree. No ****, every distribution has tails and no correlation short of 1.00 is absolute. The only places where preclinical grades have little correlation with Step 1 scores are schools with Pass/Fail grades.

 

[ArcGurren]

I didn't. Gentlemen's C'd Orgo, had to take it again over the summer. I spent my college life growing as a person, from an selfish, introspective, reactive person who had to be better than everyone else into the person I am today... ACTUALLY better than everyone else. All it cost me was two years working as a paramedic to get to medical school.

Seriously, though. I was completely dissatisfied with my medical school classmates. Either had no real world experience and were strangely idealistic (or in the case of the OP, blind to humanity), or were what medical education selects for (memory, multiple question crunching machines). A lot of people did "perform" better than I did (in terms of ass kissing, bus throwing, and mcq). Strange then that I ended up choosing my residency and getting my number one choice.

As UAA says, things will go great. Learn that you aren't the best anymore. You're part of the upper 1% of the upper 1%, fighting for thousandths just isnt worth it.


They do if he wants AOA, which is what he needs to go into Optho at Johns-Hopkins. He's pretty much blown his chances at any Ivy League residency. Which is, after all, what we're all after, isn't it?

lol

 

[Untraditional]

Nothing sadder than a wannabe/failed gunner.

If you're going to call yourself a gunner, at least be 1 SD above your class and in the running for AOA. Otherwise that's just sad...

If you are barely at 50% in your class now, good luck getting that 2 SD next year. You're going to need it with your histrionics and lack of calm under stress and bad news.

Is it bad when I can tell the seriousness of neither the OP nor the responses? I should make a thread: "Just finished M1 and can't detect trolling or sarcasm. Help!"

 

[393656]

what a toolbag!!

 

[2012mdc]

Is it bad when I can tell the seriousness of neither the OP nor the responses? I should make a thread: "Just finished M1 and can't detect trolling or sarcasm. Help!"

Well gunners are supposed to suck at everything except exams/grades because they have tunnel vision on just school. So there is nothing sadder than a gunner who can't even shoot straight

 

[Awesomeness]

To the OP:

I know the feeling, and it sucks. As much as I hate to say this, in the end its your attitude thats going to determine your happiness, how successful a doctor you are, and how good your grades are. I can identify with your post all too well, so I know what I'm saying will not resonate with you immediately, but trust me, a positive attitude will turn things around. I went from being a mostly Cs and a few Bs student first year to being a mostly As and some Bs student second year due to nothing more than a positive attitude.

So yeah, I feel you, I have my dreams of going ortho slowly slipping from thy grasp every day that I get closer to step, but a good attitude will maximize your grades, and in case you don't meet your own stratospheric expectations, a good attitude will help you recover and learn from your mistakes later on.

Best of luck, and never ever give up, never give in!


P.S. Don't listen to the naysayers on these boards, I've been reading them for 5? years now and almost never post, but they are all closet gunners will eat you alive if you're anything less than perfect.

 

[cpants]

What's this top 1% of the top 1% nonsense people keep dropping? You really think that if we included you, the average med student, in a random sample of 10,000 Americans you would be the smartest in the group? Maybe your numbers refer to some other criterion. I would believe the top 1% of the top 1% most inflated egos.

 

[2012mdc]

What's this top 1% of the top 1% nonsense people keep dropping? You really think that if we included you, the average med student, in a random sample of 10,000 Americans you would be the smartest in the group? Maybe your numbers refer to some other criterion. I would believe the top 1% of the top 1% most inflated egos.

Med students are smart enough to get into med school and dumb enough to actually go through with it.

As a group med students are pretty smart but most of us would not make the 30,000 smartest people in this country

 

[Slack3r]

Step back, take a breath. Realize that you are in the top 1% of the top 1% already, realize that medicine is the most difficult profession to enter and is the only one with as much training as we have to go through.

Not one of these statements is correct.

Memorizing and regurgitating biology facts hardly qualifies as massive intelligence.