Another OMS question

ucd

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    Sorry for another OMS question but:

    1) If one is not competitive enough to get into an oral surgery program after the MATCH, how much benefit does a 1 year Internship really do in their favor of getting accepted into a program the following year. Lets say a person's class rank and Board scores were not enough, could just doing a 1 year internship make that big of a difference?? Or do people also retake Part 1 again?


    2) A 1 year GPR VS 1 Year Internship. Which gives you more exposure and experience as a whole? Does a GPR allow you do deal with medically compromised patients who seek general dental work. Whereas, an oral surgery internship teach you how to be more proficient at pulling 3rds? Sorry for all the questions. Thanks.
     

    koobpheej

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      ucd said:
      Sorry for another OMS question but:

      1) If one is not competitive enough to get into an oral surgery program after the MATCH, how much benefit does a 1 year Internship really do in their favor of getting accepted into a program the following year. Lets say a person's class rank and Board scores were not enough, could just doing a 1 year internship make that big of a difference?? Or do people also retake Part 1 again?


      2) A 1 year GPR VS 1 Year Internship. Which gives you more exposure and experience as a whole? Does a GPR allow you do deal with medically compromised patients who seek general dental work. Whereas, an oral surgery internship teach you how to be more proficient at pulling 3rds? Sorry for all the questions. Thanks.

      i've been told by one oms director that the internship is better than the gpr. however, it may vary with different programs.
       

      OzDDS

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        koobpheej said:
        i've been told by one oms director that the internship is better than the gpr. however, it may vary with different programs.


        I know in medicine if you graduate and do an internship year first year out of med school in surgery. then afterwards you get accepted into a general surgery training program they will most times accept that surgery intern year as credit for your gen surg program. Is it the same in dentistry? If you do an Oral surgery internship, and then later get accepted into the full residency, will they accept that first intern year as going towards your 4 years?
         
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        tjb

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          OzDDS said:
          I know in medicine if you graduate and do an internship year first year out of med school in surgery. then afterwards you get accepted into a general surgery training program they will most times accept that surgery intern year as credit for your gen surg program. Is it the same in dentistry? If you do an Oral surgery internship, and then later get accepted into the full residency, will they accept that first intern year as going towards your 4 years?
          Yes, but that is not common. An intern at Pitt this year was accepted to a four year program half way through the intern year which counted towards his first year of residency.

          tjb
           

          omfsres

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            ItsGavinC said:
            Wow, that's pretty cool. I had know idea it could work out like that!

            Generally, an intership year helps unless the person is not a good intern, then it can hurt you. I think it is extremely rare for a program to except a person who has completed an externship with advanced standing. If would have to be because they lost a peson that has already been accepted in mid year. So if you do an internship, plan on doing another intern year should you be accepted the following year.
             

            KY2007

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              ucd said:
              Sorry for another OMS question but:

              1) If one is not competitive enough to get into an oral surgery program after the MATCH, how much benefit does a 1 year Internship really do in their favor of getting accepted into a program the following year. Lets say a person's class rank and Board scores were not enough, could just doing a 1 year internship make that big of a difference?? Or do people also retake Part 1 again?


              2) A 1 year GPR VS 1 Year Internship. Which gives you more exposure and experience as a whole? Does a GPR allow you do deal with medically compromised patients who seek general dental work. Whereas, an oral surgery internship teach you how to be more proficient at pulling 3rds? Sorry for all the questions. Thanks.
              A internship will definitely help your chances with the program you are interning at. Helps in general as well. As for your second question the internship will give you more exposure to oms while the GPR will give you exposure to general and some of the specialities, but is not as focused on oms like a internship is.
               

              ucd

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                Thanks Ky2007,

                But returning back to my first question, lets say everyone loved you, while you did your 1 year internship in the program you were interested in entering, would it roughly increase your chance by 25%, 50%. I know its alittle subjective, but I'm trying to get an idea in terms of numbers. I guess I'm just looking at it from a predental student perspective who is trying to get into dental school. If they didn't have the GPA and DAts to get in, would doing research and volunteering at that dental school really get them in the following year??
                 

                KY2007

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                  ucd said:
                  Thanks Ky2007,

                  But returning back to my first question, lets say everyone loved you, while you did your 1 year internship in the program you were interested in entering, would it roughly increase your chance by 25%, 50%. I know its alittle subjective, but I'm trying to get an idea in terms of numbers. I guess I'm just looking at it from a predental student perspective who is trying to get into dental school. If they didn't have the GPA and DAts to get in, would doing research and volunteering at that dental school really get them in the following year??[/QUO


                  If they LOVE you, you are in no doubt about it (90%). They will take someone who's stats are a little low and who they like over someone who has great stats and is a tool any day. However, this is if they love you. There are people who intern and do not get accepted into the program. Just keep that in mind.
                   
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                  toofache32

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                    I seem to remember while I was applying that some programs prefer to take someone who has done a 1-year internship. West Virginia comes to mind. Also, for several years in a row Galveston, TX took their 1-year intern into their program which basically made it a 5-year instead of 4-year program, and everyone else applying was just wasting their time and money.
                     

                    toofache32

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                      ucd said:
                      Thanks again Ky2007.

                      Hey Toofache32, do you know what other programs look highly upon a year of internship?
                      I really can't remember. Just look at the residents in each program. Do they all tend to be straight out of school or have many of them done internships? That's the best way to find out, but this info is hard to come by.
                       

                      north2southOMFS

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                        ucd said:
                        Thanks again Ky2007.

                        Hey Toofache32, do you know what other programs look highly upon a year of internship?


                        I know when i interviewed, that detroit recieving hospital takes a 1 year intern and gives him/her higher consideration than other applicants. They told me that in the interview, but fortunately for me their intern at the time only wanted a 4 year program and detroit recieving is a 6 year program, i think he matched at cook. But they were up front about that so it was fine.
                         

                        ucd

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                          Thanks toofache32 and north2southOMFS,

                          I have a couple more questions if any OMS residents are interested in answering:


                          1) In your oms programs are there generally more attending that have a MD title after their name, or are their any equal amount of single and dual degree OMS teaching you guys? Also, if one is interested in becoming an academic surgeon does your chances of working for the dental school or hospital increase with the extra letters?


                          2) It seems like OMS have 2 paths: They either work in private practice (where they pull wizzies all day) or work as an academic surgeon (where perform a broade scope of their surgical skills but take a plunge in their earning potential). My question is do OMS work also work in the ER alongside with other surgeons? So, for example if someone rushes into the ER with head or facial trauma, do OMS generally work along the Plastics and ENTs or is there a turf battle within the hospital???
                           

                          toofache32

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                            ucd said:
                            1) In your oms programs are there generally more attending that have a MD title after their name, or are their any equal amount of single and dual degree OMS teaching you guys? Also, if one is interested in becoming an academic surgeon does your chances of working for the dental school or hospital increase with the extra letters?
                            My program is a 6-year and we just got our first dual-degree guy who did a cosmetics fellowship, but he's not nearly as bad-a$$ as the single-degree guys. All the rest are single-degree. I kind of like that because it gives me more pride in my dental background. MD or not, we're still dentists.

                            With that being said, I'm doing the MD route because I want to go into academics. You definately don't need it, but 2 more letters after your name helps in the academic world regardless of specialty. More important (at least in my mind) is getting a broad scope of training if you want to go into academics. North2southOMFS is in probably the broadest scope program in the country and he could probably tell you more about that.

                            ucd said:
                            2) It seems like OMS have 2 paths: They either work in private practice (where they pull wizzies all day) or work as an academic surgeon (where perform a broade scope of their surgical skills but take a plunge in their earning potential). My question is do OMS work also work in the ER alongside with other surgeons? So, for example if someone rushes into the ER with head or facial trauma, do OMS generally work along the Plastics and ENTs or is there a turf battle within the hospital?

                            I think you hit the 2 career paths right on the money. You have to choose whether you want to do real surgery (academics) or drive a ferrari (private practice). Academic salaries in oral surgery are still some of the best paid people in the US, I would guess.

                            Yes, we work right along with ENT & Plastics in the ER. For the most part, we are a consult service. A patient that comes in with multi-system trauma usually will be admitted to the Trauma service and they consult you to fix their face. You operate on them and hand them back for Trauma to take care of them for the rest of their hospital stay, which is nice.

                            As far as the turf battle, you bring up an interesting point. There is really no turf battle when it comes to trauma, because these are the cases that are an inconvenience and nobody wants to be bothered with in the middle of the night. The Plastics guys here are notorious for trying to get out of their face consults and look for a reason to give it to OMS or ENT. So we end up fixing more than our share of these horrendous broken faces. Then the Plastics guys try to argue that we're not qualified to straighten a crooked nose and other cosmetic stuff. In other words, the turf battle is only over cash-paying patients. But that's another soapbox for another time.
                             

                            ucd

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                              Another question to toofache32 or anyone else,

                              1) Do you guys know how competitive it is to get a position as an academic surgeon after completing your residency? IS there a huge competition for it, or is it like other academic positions within dentistry where there is a shortage?


                              2) I don't believe all oms programs are the same, and some residents have stated that there are programs that mostly focuses on private practice procedures such as wizzies and implants. But in order to be an accredited oms program , I believe the program has to see a certain amount of trauma, cancer, etc. So, if one graduates from a program that is weak in trauma and cancer, would that limit that persons ability to teach a broad scope of procedures once they become an attending? For example, if i graduated from a program that mostly did wizzies and implants, once i started to teach would i then be limited to teaching these procedures, since my program was weak in the trauma/cancer department??
                               

                              toofache32

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                                ucd said:
                                1) Do you guys know how competitive it is to get a position as an academic surgeon after completing your residency? IS there a huge competition for it, or is it like other academic positions within dentistry where there is a shortage?
                                In general there is a shortage, especially for full-timers. Many programs don't allow people to work part-time because they can tell insured/paying patients to just come out to their private office where the work can be done quicker and easier. And the OMS would get a larger piece of the fees since he wouldn't be sharing with the university.

                                ucd said:
                                2) I don't believe all oms programs are the same, and some residents have stated that there are programs that mostly focuses on private practice procedures such as wizzies and implants. But in order to be an accredited oms program , I believe the program has to see a certain amount of trauma, cancer, etc. So, if one graduates from a program that is weak in trauma and cancer, would that limit that persons ability to teach a broad scope of procedures once they become an attending? For example, if i graduated from a program that mostly did wizzies and implants, once i started to teach would i then be limited to teaching these procedures, since my program was weak in the trauma/cancer department??

                                I don't know the answer to this for sure. To be accredited, an OMS program has to provide a minimum number of procedures from different categories (trauma, dentoaveolar, orthognathic, etc). There is a list if you poke around on www.aaoms.org . Trauma is definately bread 'n butter for OMS even though you rarely see it in private practice. But it's hard to get away from it in your residency for the same reason...the private guys don't want it and it gets sent over to the nearest teaching hospital.

                                As far as teaching, you have to apply for hospital privileges to do the procedures you want to do. In general, privileges are granted on the basis of how many you have done in the past in an accredited facillity (residency or local hospital, not your office). But this explanation is a little simplistic because I think there is more to it that I don't really understand yet.
                                 
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