Any chance at SGU?

[el_duderino]

The government seems happy to make loans for questionable fot-profit schools in general. 30+% attrition rate is a damn big gamble when you consider the loan amounts.

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The government seems happy to make loans for questionable fot-profit schools in general. 30+% attrition rate is a damn big gamble when you consider the loan amounts.

The students taking out these loans cannot default on them, even through bankruptcy, and are obligated to repay whether or not they succeed and get a degree. So, it's no gamble to the issuer of the loan.

-Skip

 

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To put it simply the vast majority of that "343" are the students who shouldn't be there in the first place...they are gone by the end of term 1 for the most part. But after that the vast majority of the students end up matching.

I think it is fairly safe to assume that the overall attrition rate at the "big Carib" schools is likely around 30%, most of which happens early and before massive loan debt is accumulated. Whether or not one argues those students "shouldn't be there in the first place", they still got their chance.

But, I think the bigger message is that you will accumulate more than $200K in tuition and charges even if you are successful. That needs to be weighed against the fact that the majority of those successful graduates (around 70%) will end-up in some form of primary care, the least lucrative area in the medical field.

-Skip

 

[el_duderino]

The students taking out these loans cannot default on them, even through bankruptcy, and are obligated to repay whether or not they succeed and get a degree. So, it's no gamble to the issuer of the loan.

-Skip

Gamble for the students, Skip.

 

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Gamble for the students, Skip.

Gotcha. Unclear to me what you meant initially from the way you phrased it. And, also because of this.

-Skip

 

[bedevilled ben]

The 5817 students may be published in march, but that does not take into account those from the August and January classes who fail or decel. They can also change what they publish depending on their goal. For instance, if they are using that number to show how many are enrolled total vs how many match, they can choose to leave out those who were entered in the Keith B Taylor program, or those who failed a step and are currently on a loa to study. They can skew the statistics any way they want to make themselves look better in the eyes of potential students.

But, for arguments sake, lets take that 5817, knowing it already disallows for dropouts and has its flaws.
5,497/4=1374.25 students per year. As you said you like hard facts....
1374 students enter AND continue a year. 850ish matched this year, according to SGU's match page. There is a vast discrepancy there. Where did the other 343 go?

I was in the cohort that just graduated and Matched this year. I did not decel, I didn't take any leave, I had no gaps in my schedule. I'm nearly certain we had nowhere near 1,400 people in our class when we started. The number of students moving between graduating and Matching classes is large and fluid. Given the way that SGU's curriculum and classes are structured, trying to do these statistical gymnastics is an exercise in futility. The Office of Career Guidance gives talks in MS2, MS3, and MS4 which outlines the schools stats for graduating, Matching, required Step scores for various specialties, etc. Their numbers were basically spot on for the previous Match cycles. I expect no big changes for this recent cycle. This data is tracked very closely by the OCG.

The school has borderline-predatory recruiting practices. Their target demographic contains a small subset of people that are looking for an "easy" way to accomplish something that cannot be easy, people that don't consider the far-reaching repercussions of their impulsive decisions.

SGU is like a big armored puzzle box. Clever people figure out how it works before they even start it. Then you follow the steps in the right order. and you get the prize inside. Others throw themselves at it full-tilt until either the box breaks, or they do.

 

[Mikkus]

I was in the cohort that just graduated and Matched this year. I did not decel, I didn't take any leave, I had no gaps in my schedule. I'm nearly certain we had nowhere near 1,400 people in our class when we started. The number of students moving between graduating and Matching classes is large and fluid. Given the way that SGU's curriculum and classes are structured, trying to do these statistical gymnastics is an exercise in futility. The Office of Career Guidance gives talks in MS2, MS3, and MS4 which outlines the schools stats for graduating, Matching, required Step scores for various specialties, etc. Their numbers were basically spot on for the previous Match cycles. I expect no big changes for this recent cycle. This data is tracked very closely by the OCG.

The school has borderline-predatory recruiting practices. Their target demographic contains a small subset of people that are looking for an "easy" way to accomplish something that cannot be easy, people that don't consider the far-reaching repercussions of their impulsive decisions.

SGU is like a big armored puzzle box. Clever people figure out how it works before they even start it. Then you follow the steps in the right order. and you get the prize inside. Others throw themselves at it full-tilt until either the box breaks, or they do.

I also matched from SGU this year. I did my own statistics comparing our anatomy roster names to the names listed in pharm. 66% of the names found in anatomy were also found in pharm. Many of those most likely decelled, and a few I'm sure dropped. I also asked for the rough numbers from someone in the January class, but that I did not see with my own eyes. Our class had around 750 people, and the Keith B taylor had 104, according to the SGU website. The January class had around 500. The 1400 is the number posted by the school, but according to my math it looks about right.

I agree with your last two paragraphs, there is definitely the ability to succeed if all the pieces are there, but the school is not going to help if you don't understand the puzzle. If you go in missing basic science understanding, test taking ability, speed reading, a backbone, study habits, emotional maturity, ect. you will struggle.

 

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SGU is like a big armored puzzle box. Clever people figure out how it works before they even start it. Then you follow the steps in the right order. and you get the prize inside. Others throw themselves at it full-tilt until either the box breaks, or they do.

I can't speak specifically to or criticize your impression of SGU... because it's your impression, you went there, and this is how you perceived your experience.

I can say this, though....

Inherent in a puzzle is the notion that you have to figure something out that isn't obvious. I personally wouldn't consider it a "puzzle box" unless they are purposefully not telling you the rules.

I think if you go to SGU's website (or Ross's or AUC's... or any other reputable school) I think you'll find that they spell it out for you. The problem is that most students either don't take the time to read it, don't think the "rules" apply to them, or somehow think they are slicker or smarter than the administrators and/or they are going to smooth talk their way out of tricky situations.

It is a game. It has rules. The rules are spelled out. Ignore them at your own peril. And, recognize that even if you play by all the rules, you might still lose the game (e.g., fail out, not Match, etc.).

-Skip

 

[Alienman52]

I am quite intrigued by people who label others as idiots while they cannot properly use/differentiate between plural and possessive nouns themselves

LOL you beat me to it


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