Any opinions/advice for my plans?

[ragingmaelstrom]

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Halloo! I have posted on this forum before and received good advice and wish to post again with my updated circumstances.

I have just graduated from UCLA with a 2.45 gpa in the Biology major. (yuh I know it's a stinky gpa) My science gpa is even worse since I've failed and retaken a bunch of courses. But I just got a 33 on my MCAT taken in August with a breakdown of P:11 V:11 B:11 so I'm not completely hopeless. I just started working full-time as a research assistant/associate at a lab for digestive diseases at UCLA and my boss is a surgeon at the UCLA clinic. I plan to start taking classes through UCLA extention starting next quarter. Since I am working full time, I won't be able to take on a full load of classes so I'm hoping to take one or two at a time and do really well in them. I'll apply next year and hope to get in somewhere/anywhere.

What do you think of my circumstances and plan?
Any feedback at all would be greatly appreciated! Thanks! 🙂

 

[ragingmaelstrom]

bump.
Anyone?

 

[Sundarban1]

bump.
Anyone?

Being a bio major with a 2.45 GPA AND only taking 1/2 classes at a time seems like a waste of time simply because even if you get all A's over 2 years, how much is your GPA going to go up? Maybe .1? You need an SMP.

 

[relentless11]

I see no problems with the MCAT score, in fact its great, and should hold up well against other MCAT scores. BUT, the undergrad GPA will hurt you big time. Optimally, you want to get your overall undergrad GPA to at least a 3.0.

At the very least, you want to show at least a years worth of good grades in upper division science classes under rigorous conditions...in other words, a full-time courseload.

Being part-time will: (1) increase the time it will take for you to get to a 3.0, and (2) does not say anything about your ability to do well under a full-time courseload. There's no such thing as part-time status in med school for obvious reasons. The MCAT score is great, but it does not say anything about how you will handle a rigorous courseload over a long period of time (e.g., quarters and academic years). Talk to your advisors at UCLA, they will probably suggest the same thing. Take a full-time courseload of upper division science classes. Otherwise you will risk: (1) not meeting the GPA cut-offs at some schools (e.g., UC med schools), and (2) not prove to adcoms that you can handle a full-time courseload.

It is certainly understandable that working full-time + school is hard to do, especially when you have to keep grades up, and pay for school. But it will come down to the point where you either have to consider making money vs. getting into med school. I was in the same position as you when I took classes through UCD Extension. Wasn't worth it...and would've taken me 4 years to get my GPA to a 3.0 assuming I maintained a 4.0 GPA and took 2 classes per quarter...thats 6 classes a year👎 . Now in a different program, I'm going to get to a 3.0 within half the time, and get a doctorate degree at the same time. 👍

Since you clearly have the ability to do well, given your MCAT score, I really encourage you to take the hit, and follow through to show the adcoms that you can handle hard classes under full time conditions. The <3.0 GPA hurt, especially since you're in CA. Remember that UC's have GPA cut-offs around 3.0-3.2, and MCAT scores are treated EQUALLY as GPA, so doing well in one does not neccessarily make up for the other. Good luck!

 

[Sundarban1]

Even with full time classes, a biology major with a 2.4 would need a 4.0 in a second bachelors to get anywhere near a 3.0 overall. I'd say forget about and of the UC schools, those schools are competative ever for those with 35 MCAT and 3.6 GPA.

 

[relentless11]

Even with full time classes, a biology major with a 2.4 would need a 4.0 in a second bachelors to get anywhere near a 3.0 overall. I'd say forget about and of the UC schools, those schools are competative ever for those with 35 MCAT and 3.6 GPA.

I agree. But one must admit, a 2.4 really torpedoes ones chances at any school despite MCAT...inside or outside CA assuming you don't do anything about the GPA of course.

ragingmaelstrom, do the math to figure out how many years of 3.5-4.0 work to reach 3.0, or get very close to it (~2.99), then you will be in a better place to figure out how much you have to do. I'm assuming you have at least 180-225 units of undergrad course work at UCLA, so thats a tall mountain to climb over....but certainly not impossible if you put in the time...and sadly, the money. Good luck!

 

[ragingmaelstrom]

Ok... I did the math and I'll need a whopping 25 classes with all As to bring my overall gpa to a 3.0!! And with a full time job it'll be 2 class a quarter, to be perfectly realistic. So maybe a SMP would be better? Is there a comprehensive list somewhere out there or do I just have to search them up one at a time?

 

[PlAnEjaNe]

Ok... I did the math and I'll need a whopping 25 classes with all As to bring my overall gpa to a 3.0!! And with a full time job it'll be 2 class a quarter, to be perfectly realistic. So maybe a SMP would be better? Is there a comprehensive list somewhere out there or do I just have to search them up one at a time?

I will tell you the same thing relentless told me: Even if you do an smp your ugrad gpa will not change, you have to take upperdivision ugrad bio classes in order to fix that gpa, no amount of masters or smp work will rectify that gpa.

Even if you got into an smp, I think you have to have about 2.5 science gpa at the lowest to even be considered (this does not mean you would get accepted as there are people with much higher gpas applying for only a few coveted spots), and got a 4.0 (really really difficult to do) no med school would consider you, in fact, for those that screen, you wouldn't even make it past the screening...all uc schools screen. I know this sounds negative but you have to be realistic. It is going to take a while but if this is what you really want then you will see past those huge mountains that you have to climb and see how much this will benefit you in the long run. I am taking postbac classes (on my own) and I am going to improve my ugrad gpa significantly enough to get into an smp. I will continue to take postbac classes when and where I can until I am confident that I have raised it enough to be competitive with other applicants.

You said you figured out how many units/courses you would need to raise your gpa to 3.0, I say go with that...just take it one step at a time and remember to take a breath every now and then and remember why you are doing this. You can do this (I am now quoting what Dr. Peterson, dean of adm at UCI SOM told me) but you have to put your whole heart and soul into it.

 

[relentless11]

Ok... I did the math and I'll need a whopping 25 classes with all As to bring my overall gpa to a 3.0!! And with a full time job it'll be 2 class a quarter, to be perfectly realistic. So maybe a SMP would be better? Is there a comprehensive list somewhere out there or do I just have to search them up one at a time?

PlAnEjaNe pretty much hit it on the nose. You are assuming:

(1) you will get into an SMP based on your GPA. I think...and someone please correct me if i'm wrong, but SMPs probably take in those with a 2.7-3.3 (or more!) As stated, SMPs are competative, in fact more competative to get into than standard post-baccs. SMPs are also entitled to favor students who are MOST LIKELY to be admitted (e.g., with already good stats), in order to improve their reputation. Same applies to big-name post-baccs.

(2) you will do well in med school classes in the SMP and med schools would overlook your GPA. I applaud your MCAT score, its 👍 AWESOME👍, BUT there is clearly something aloof with your undergrad GPA. I must point out that your ability to handle rigorous courses may translate over to how you handle rigorous med school courses. The MCAT is a measurement of how well you do in a standardized environment, in one moment in time. While your undergrad GPA is a reflection of how well you do in a variable environment, over a huge time interval (quarters and years). Both have value, and thus med schools weigh MCAT and GPA equally. So this may come up in the eyes of both adcoms and the SMP admissions folk.

However I must digress, YES, if you ace an SMP, then that is certainly a good thing, but your low undergrad GPA is FAIR GAME, and can be used against you during the application cycle. Conversely, if you have an undergrad GPA of 3.0, and then do an SMP, then that would be better right? Sure it is. In this application game, you want to minimize the reasons which adcoms can reject you, and maximize the reasons which adcoms would accept you. Remember, nationally, those that get into med schools, on average, have a GPA of 3.4-3.5. Since med schools habitually report UNDERGRAD GPA, its clear that there is a bias towards undergrad GPAs towards the higher end of the spectrum.

In conclusion, I must urge you to improve your undergrad GPA. This will open up so many doors including admission to SMPs. You have to show them you can do well in upper division courses, under RIGOROUS conditions. I can sympathize that one has to work, but getting a 4.0 based on 2 classes is not academically rigorous. Yes you have to work, remember, you accrued a GPA of 2.45 after several years of full-time work at UCLA. Thus adcoms may just assume "oh they did better because they are part-time". In med school, you cannot be part-time. At the very least, going full-time would reduce the time it takes to get your GPA up. Lastly, I also want to note that most med schools only accept MCAT scores that are no more than 3 years old, so you may be working against the clock there too🙁 . I actually have to retake the MCAT since mine are >3 years old now too..haha😳 But yea, it ultimately comes down to how much you want this, how much you want to sacrifice, and how far you want go. You may want to sit and do a "cost-benefit" analysis. Can you do it? How much would it cost? Would you be willing to take the hit in terms of time, money, and sanity? Good luck!

 

[Lindyhopper]

One route. Get into a smp type program at a DO program such as PCOM or LECOM. Advance to the parent program

 

[sendwich]

hey there, 25 more classes? if you're taking them at UCLA, it'll take you 12 units (average) per quarter X 3 quarters=36units in one year.

great job on your MCAT! If i were you,i would try to hurry up and get my grades up, rather than work full time. I dont know how long you're thinking about taking to apply but MCAT scores will expire in 3 years ( i know it sounds like a "long time" but since you're going to need some time to do a post bac or an smp, you're going to need all the time you have!! 3 yrs really isn't that long! you might have to take the dam2 test again!).

i'm actually "recovering" from what you're in currently. ucla, bio major with a really sucky ug. dont give up, you can do it!!!

 

[daeojkim]

I have not read all the advices given by others here but I will give my 2 cents.

EC are secondary to GPA and MCAT scores. Seeing how much improvement in GPA is needed, I would suggest to take full time course work for at least year including summer. Then see if you can enroll in a SMP program if you don't get in to med school. Then Kick ass in SMP and your application will look much better.

While you are taking full time courses do some volunteer work in a hospital once a week or every two weeks for a year so that you have something to put on your EC. Doing research may seem good but it takes a lot of time and you don't want to jeopardize GPA.