any programs with minimum scores?

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
Emory and the Delaware program are about 225.. others I dont know and for those 2 im sorta just guessing (educated guessing though).
 
EctopicFetus said:
Emory and the Delaware program are about 225.. others I dont know and for those 2 im sorta just guessing (educated guessing though).
Click to expand...

You know, it is kind of funny. I was once told by a VERY reputable source that Arizona had a 230 cut-off. Then Ectopic mentions he got in with less. So who really knows anything about score cut-offs. I wouldn't worry about them much. If they invite you, they invite you. If not, that's life.
 
zinjanthropus said:
of course - that's why I'm asking which programs openly state their minimum score (the specific number) - on their website, by email, etc.
Click to expand...

I don't think you want an "arms race" between programs for the most prestigious cut off score.

Just apply to the programs you want and see what happens.
 
All programs (that I'm aware of) have various methods of screening applicants, and Step I scores is a popular one (FMG vs UMG is another). They get at least 5-10 applications/interview spot and they have to have an easy way to choose who to look at. (because everyone applies to 30-50 programs now, it's getting more and more tedious)

However, PDs will pull some applicants out of the 'cut-off' pile if they are requested to by a friend, impressed by a personal experience with an applicant, see the applicant on an audition rotation, or have some other reason to do so. Some people can even get out of the pile if they simply call and request an interview.

BKN, being a PD, is probably the person you should listen to the most closely. Just apply to the places you want to go, and convince them that they should interview you (politely).
 
A former PD told me he used USMLE step 1 cutoffs, but not just one absolute score. I don't know the exact numbers, but the general idea is that he would start by offering interviews to candidates he liked who scored over 230. Then he looked at candidates from 220-230, then 210-220, and so on until the slots were filled.
 
All the programs I've ever heard of had a cutoff of at least 182 for Step 1
 
I emailed a program in the NE that is near where most of my family is located to ask them if they would review my application since I am interested in interviewing there given the family ties. We are going within 60 miles of there for Thanksgiving, and emailed them as much for the convience factor as anything...and wanted to check before I booked our airplane tickets...

I got a prompt return email that said sorry, you USMLE scores do not meet our minimum requirements.

I was surprised since the program is smaller and I would bet is on the lower side of competitive. I may have just made someone upset by asking for an interview so early..

Oh well, but at least one school admitted to having requirements...
 
EM_Rebuilder said:
I emailed a program in the NE that is near where most of my family is located to ask them if they would review my application since I am interested in interviewing there given the family ties. We are going within 60 miles of there for Thanksgiving, and emailed them as much for the convience factor as anything...and wanted to check before I booked our airplane tickets...

I got a prompt return email that said sorry, you USMLE scores do not meet our minimum requirements.

I was surprised since the program is smaller and I would bet is on the lower side of competitive. I may have just made someone upset by asking for an interview so early..

Oh well, but at least one school admitted to having requirements...
Click to expand...
A lot of the NE programs have high USMLE standards. The reason is very similar to the California programs: they're popular because a lot of people live nearby. Not many people relocate across country for residency. The higher the population around a residency site, the more likely they are to be competitive.
 
Wash U state 'Applicants must have passed USMLE Steps 1 and 2 with scores above 220 without difficulty' although this is under the IMG section so maybe its different for AMGs
 
SuitsYou said:
'Applicants must have passed USMLE Steps 1 and 2 with scores above 220 without difficulty'
Click to expand...

So, do you go in and tell them that it was easy to get that score? Or only take it once?

I've always wondered, do programs weigh Step II any higher than Step I, or do they only look at Step I first? I ask because some people at national conferences have said that they like Step II better than Step I, but in my own anecdotal experience, I haven't noticed it opening as many doors as I would like.
 
IbnSina said:
Or only take it once?
Click to expand...

Since most people don't fail, some people don't know this - you can't retake a step for a better score. If you pass with a 185, you're damned with faint praise. The only way to retake a step you've passed is if time limits have expired (like 7 years to take all three steps in some states).
 
At last year's (2005) ACEP conference in DC, Dr. Mattu, the PD at the University of Maryland, gave a speech regarding planning for application in an EM residency. His breakdown was as follows regarding the issue of Step I scores and when to take Step II relative to applying for residency:

> 220: Don't worry about taking Step II before your application is reviewed
200 - 220: Take them early if you think you will significantly improve you score (typically out of this score range)
< 200: Take them early, you have nothing to lose

It was his contention that he was unaware of any program that had a score cutoff greater than 220.

As for Step II scores, my personal observation is that while PD's seem to place more value on the Step II scores in that they are more clinically oriented and represent a fund of knowledge more relevant to the practice of medicine, they seem to be of slightly less value in the residency application setting because not everyone has taken them yet. A great Step II score can certainly help counteract a mediocre Step I score, but in comparing applicants from a given year, Step I is the great equalizer because everyone has to have taken it prior to applying for residency.
 
Apollyon said:
Since most people don't fail, some people don't know this - you can't retake a step for a better score. If you pass with a 185, you're damned with faint praise. The only way to retake a step you've passed is if time limits have expired (like 7 years to take all three steps in some states).
Click to expand...

Yes, I knew this. That was why I was asking if getting a 220 easily means only taking it once, whereas getting a 220 the hard way would be failing first.
 
Desperado said:
You know, it is kind of funny. I was once told by a VERY reputable source that Arizona had a 230 cut-off. Then Ectopic mentions he got in with less. So who really knows anything about score cut-offs. I wouldn't worry about them much. If they invite you, they invite you. If not, that's life.
Click to expand...

Yeah BTW we havent really talked board scores but i know of 2 other people in my class with sub 230 scores.. I will say they had great things on their app besides their step scores..

We have heard we are the best class in a long while BTW 😉
 
As some have already stated, I imagine most programs don't have a hard line cut off of 230 or 225, but they may start their screening process by looking at applicants with scores above a certain number...if the interview slots fill before they get to scores below 225, well that's effectively a cut off.

There are always exceptions. I received an interview at a place I probably wasn't going to get an interview by asking the chair of my department in medical school to contact their PD. If you really want an interview somewhere, you can probably get it if you grease enough wheels.
 
EctopicFetus said:
Yeah BTW we havent really talked board scores but i know of 2 other people in my class with sub 230 scores.. I will say they had great things on their app besides their step scores..

We have heard we are the best class in a long while BTW 😉
Click to expand...

Yes, they had to recruit a great class this year to attempt to make up for the one they lost.
 
So if my Step I score was 220 - what should I do about Step II? Take it early or wait? very confused...
 
My PD also tends to give step II more weight.

DocChez said:
A great Step II score can certainly help counteract a mediocre Step I score, but in comparing applicants from a given year, Step I is the great equalizer because everyone has to have taken it prior to applying for residency.
Click to expand...

Fortunately for us, most EM folks improve their score from Step I to Step II. Folks who aced the first step may not have the study time to pull another stellar performance--understandable, especially if you had more than a few weeks to study for the exam. For everyone else, why not put in the two weeks of studying to have an even better score for PD's to see? Why not show them an objective evaluation of your clinical knowledge?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

G
Daily reminder to do the bare minimum
4 5 6 7 8
Replies
392
Views
28K
ScepticSkeksis
ScepticSkeksis
alpinism
Resident ITE scores have plummeted 25% in the last 5 years
2
Replies
94
Views
6K
HemorrhagicShock
HemorrhagicShock
HemorrhagicShock
Is There Any Money to be Made in Telehealth with EM Training?
Replies
10
Views
3K
cyanide12345678
cyanide12345678
Elbrus
  • Poll Poll
Are physical therapists working with you in the ED?
Replies
18
Views
1K
old_boy
old_boy
southerndoc
Fun with ChatGPT
Replies
1
Views
771
Apollyon
A
Top