Anybody else happy with what they'll make?

[lovemesomeTJ]

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To everyone not concerned with money: why are the two most competitive specialties derm and plastic surgery?

Is it perhaps money/lifestyle?!

I'm not concerned with money. I make <20,000 and I ain't dead. I can scrimp and save to pay off my debt if I have to. I love a challenge.

Those residencies are competitive because those concerned with money and lifestyle drove the competitiveness of these residencies. As someone stated before, they were goof specialties in the past, till society caught on to the hype and decided they wanted to look like Cat lady with melons on their chest and perfectly scultped butts and CALVES😱. Then there are those of us chillin' in the cut who just wanna make it out and make enough to pay the rent/mortgage, pay the debt, grab some Micky D's (Subway if you're as health conscious as you're supposed to be), and make it from point A to be in that hoopty that got them through high school, college, and medical school (or is that just me?). I live off <20,000. I'm gonna get BUCK IN HERE when I can net 100,000 and pay my loans down and rent/utilities/etc (and I did the math: I can DO iiiiit!).
I know this is hard to believe, but not everyone in the room wants derm/plastics/ROADs/RAPER or whatever the frick you wanna call it.

The problem here is that we don't believe each other. There are people who don't believe that someone could dare be in this profession solely for the money, and there are people who can't believe that someone would do this even if there were very little money. Both views have different but pertinent consequences. These different angles make us want to sympathize, but our pre-med attitudes and personalities cause for clashing. It's like trying to fit a cube into a cylindrical hole. Why bother? We all have our motivations, and I say live and let live, just don't rain on my party.

 

[DrArete]

I lost my mother to mental illness several years ago. I never had a father. I take out loans to pay for school, get scholarships, and work as an intern at software company for my spending money. I pay my own rent, insurance, car payments, and cell phone bill. Don't even begin to presume you know my financial situation.

Before that, I wasn't rich. But I've always been happy. I have good friends and a good life.

Sounds like life has pissed on you.

Good for you on maintaining a positive attitude.

 

[DrArete]

Theres control and theres control.

For instance, I actually live at a vet clinic as a student, acting as a nurse. Atm, its 4:10am where I am in Australia - I haven't slept tonight, as I've been trying to make sure a hypoglycaemic cat stays alive. Yes, the vet is at home - but yes, he did come in at 1am to help me out when the cat started seizuring. And he will come in again if I need him. In a different clinic, where there are no live in students, the vet would be me.
Most vets operate under similar circumstances - office hours might be 7am-7pm, but when it comes to afterhours, your it. In a typical small animal practice, a vet might spend between 1 in 2 to one in 4 nights on call, and split the weekend work. And this is in a metropolitan area - it all depends on your avaliable emergency clinics, and how much trust you have in those clinics. In a regional or rural setting, your hours are much worse, and calves never get stuck in the daytime!
And when you compare those hours to our reimbursement, you see why we feel its a bit rich to hear you whining about your salaries going down a bit?

http://www.theonion.com/articles/study-us-pets-healthcare-better-than-rwandan-human,492/

 

[JoshUNCW]

Knowing now that he's interested n derm and plastics... well. that sort of ruins your whole argument.

I want to help people!! ....With their acne and wrinkles.

Before I even get into how derm and plastics can change peoples lives, and not just their breasts, I'll just say they're not my top two choices. What I meant was of course I would take more money. But I'll be happy with a six figure salary. You guys can all be miserable with your lives. I'm a poor college kid and am probably happier than you'll ever be since apparently medicine is so horrible.

My top two choices are rads and ER. Obviously ones a fall back. Obviously one makes more than the other. Both save lives. PS, both make roughly the same in the military.

 

[auburnO5]

I'm not concerned with money. I make <20,000 and I ain't dead. I can scrimp and save to pay off my debt if I have to. I love a challenge.

Those residencies are competitive because those concerned with money and lifestyle drove the competitiveness of these residencies. As someone stated before, they were goof specialties in the past, till society caught on to the hype and decided they wanted to look like Cat lady with melons on their chest and perfectly scultped butts and CALVES😱. Then there are those of us chillin' in the cut who just wanna make it out and make enough to pay the rent/mortgage, pay the debt, grab some Micky D's (Subway if you're as health conscious as you're supposed to be), and make it from point A to be in that hoopty that got them through high school, college, and medical school (or is that just me?). I live off <20,000. I'm gonna get BUCK IN HERE when I can net 100,000 and pay my loans down and rent/utilities/etc (and I did the math: I can DO iiiiit!).
I know this is hard to believe, but not everyone in the room wants derm/plastics/ROADs/RAPER or whatever the frick you wanna call it.

The problem here is that we don't believe each other. There are people who don't believe that someone could dare be in this profession solely for the money, and there are people who can't believe that someone would do this even if there were very little money. Both views have different but pertinent consequences. These different angles make us want to sympathize, but our pre-med attitudes and personalities cause for clashing. It's like trying to fit a cube into a cylindrical hole. Why bother? We all have our motivations, and I say live and let live, just don't rain on my party.

Great post! We sound pretty similar...

And no, you're not the only one that will be ridin' in the same old hoopty that got you through high school+. 👍

 

[da8s0859q]

You missed my point when I said "And to people in med school/residency, don't bother telling me how ignorant I am and how my mood will change once I get to M3 or start working resident hours. I've heard that before too, by 100 other people in 40 other threads." To me, you are the one who is full of ****. And you completely missed my point about comparing the doctor to the artist. But I think that's ok, cause you were never one of the ones who was going to get it.

I want to take 4 years of the hardest undergraduate classes I can (notice my major), I want to be top of my class, and I want to go to the best damn grad school I can. That's what makes me happy. You couldn't understand that. So I'm really not going to try.

No, he didn't miss your point. The fact that you're preemptively saying "don't tell me such-and-such" doesn't mean that it won't end up being true for you too, just like it has for lots of people who have done this before you and thus can speak from more than just a nice opinion. As for the rest of your post, calm down and stop telling people that they don't "get it" or that they "couldn't understand that". Then you just look like a tool. My class is full of people who aren't solely in it for the money, but instead have a healthy interest in their own financial well-being after the better part of a decade of hard training and loans. You are not a unique snowflake, snowflake.

JoshUNCW, I briefly skimmed through your post, but the most realistic feedback you should pay attention to is the one from the medical students that posted here so far, they actually KNOW what medical school is like, and have experience that we just don't have.

This.

I have best friends from high school and college who are currently in med school. We talk all the time. One of them goes to UNC, one of the top med schools in the country. She tells me how hard it is. And how much fun she's having. And she tells me this while she's visiting me at the beach, sitting in the sand, drinking beer. She can't take every weekend off, too much work. But she can take SOME off. It's a hard job and I never ever denied that nor disputed the hard work that medical school required.

Not sure why you'd respond to Jennifer like this. Dude, you are not your friends. It's a wonderfully good idea to talk to people doing what you want to do in an effort to find out what you can from an experienced party, but until you're doing it yourself, you do not have the whole story. Yeah, sure, I've had some good times so far and am just about to finish MS-1, but you can't somehow have experience by proxy because you've talked to people who do. It'd be like me suggesting I know more about MS-3 than I actually do because I've talked to people coming off their surgery rotations.

Largely related: the phrase "your mileage may vary" ought to be printed on every birth certificate in the world, and that's no less true for med school.

My top two choices are rads and ER. Obviously ones a fall back. Obviously one makes more than the other.

I'm sure you've got beautiful reasons as to why you like these two, but it is interesting to me that, at least in the civilian world where you might elect to practice later in life, those are generally seen as two well-paying lifestyle specialties. Just a coincidence, no doubt.

 

[JoshUNCW]

No, he didn't miss your point. The fact that you're preemptively saying "don't tell me such-and-such" doesn't mean that it won't end up being true for you too, just like it has for lots of people who have done this before you and thus can speak from more than just a nice opinion. As for the rest of your post, calm down and stop telling people that they don't "get it" or that they "couldn't understand that". Then you just look like a tool. My class is full of people who aren't solely in it for the money, but instead have a healthy interest in their own financial well-being after the better part of a decade of hard training and loans. You are not a unique snowflake, snowflake.



This.



Not sure why you'd respond to Jennifer like this. Dude, you are not your friends. It's a wonderfully good idea to talk to people doing what you want to do in an effort to find out what you can from an experienced party, but until you're doing it yourself, you do not have the whole story. Yeah, sure, I've had some good times so far and am just about to finish MS-1, but you can't somehow have experience by proxy because you've talked to people who do. It'd be like me suggesting I know more about MS-3 than I actually do because I've talked to people coming off their surgery rotations.

Largely related: the phrase "your mileage may vary" ought to be printed on every birth certificate in the world, and that's no less true for med school.



I'm sure you've got beautiful reasons as to why you like these two, but it is interesting to me that, at least in the civilian world where you might elect to practice later in life, those are generally seen as two well-paying lifestyle specialties. Just a coincidence, no doubt.

Yeah, I didn't read that. But I think I understand the gist of what you're saying. Thanks for all your advice. I sincerely appreciated it.

Edit: As I already said on the last page. I'm just trolling. All I want is money.

 

[lovemesomeTJ]

Quote:
Originally Posted by JenniferRU
JoshUNCW, I briefly skimmed through your post, but the most realistic feedback you should pay attention to is the one from the medical students that posted here so far, they actually KNOW what medical school is like, and have experience that we just don't have.

This.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JoshUNCW
I have best friends from high school and college who are currently in med school. We talk all the time. One of them goes to UNC, one of the top med schools in the country. She tells me how hard it is. And how much fun she's having. And she tells me this while she's visiting me at the beach, sitting in the sand, drinking beer. She can't take every weekend off, too much work. But she can take SOME off. It's a hard job and I never ever denied that nor disputed the hard work that medical school required.

Not sure why you'd respond to Jennifer like this. Dude, you are not your friends. It's a wonderfully good idea to talk to people doing what you want to do in an effort to find out what you can from an experienced party, but until you're doing it yourself, you do not have the whole story. Yeah, sure, I've had some good times so far and am just about to finish MS-1, but you can't somehow have experience by proxy because you've talked to people who do. It'd be like me suggesting I know more about MS-3 than I actually do because I've talked to people coming off their surgery rotations.

Largely related: the phrase "your mileage may vary" ought to be printed on every birth certificate in the world, and that's no less true for med school.

He responded that way because she said that OP should listen to people who've been through it, like the med students in this forum, and he said that he has friends in med school that he listens to.

I think you missed something or overanalyzed something.

 

[ILikeDrugs]

I'm gonna be hella happy makin $500K+. 🙂

 

[JenniferRU]

I have best friends from high school and college who are currently in med school. We talk all the time. One of them goes to UNC, one of the top med schools in the country. She tells me how hard it is. And how much fun she's having. And she tells me this while she's visiting me at the beach, sitting in the sand, drinking beer. She can't take every weekend off, too much work. But she can take SOME off. It's a hard job and I never ever denied that nor disputed the hard work that medical school required.

and what did your friends in medical school say about your thread?

No, he didn't miss your point. The fact that you're preemptively saying "don't tell me such-and-such" doesn't mean that it won't end up being true for you too, just like it has for lots of people who have done this before you and thus can speak from more than just a nice opinion. As for the rest of your post, calm down and stop telling people that they don't "get it" or that they "couldn't understand that". Then you just look like a tool. My class is full of people who aren't solely in it for the money, but instead have a healthy interest in their own financial well-being after the better part of a decade of hard training and loans. You are not a unique snowflake, snowflake.

It'd be like me suggesting I know more about MS-3 than I actually do because I've talked to people coming off their surgery rotations.

Largely related: the phrase "your mileage may vary" ought to be printed on every birth certificate in the world, and that's no less true for med school.

👍

 

[JoshUNCW]

and what did your friends in medical school say about your thread?

My friends in medical school told me not to go into medicine for money because it's not worth it. Don't worry about our conversation, what I quoted barely makes sense on your part. A medical student can only tell me how hard medical school is. A doctor can only tell me about how hard being a doctor is. This thread is about money. Not about how hard either medical school or residency is. We're all conceded about how hard it is.

Fyi, the only fellow who even posted in this thread talked about how he was happy. Also, I found out what I wanted to know. There are others like me out there and I'll be happy to meet them in med school and beyond. To the rest of you. Have fun. My advice, get out. Do anything else. For your own sake. Because you're gonna be a bitch to work with.

 

[Perrotfish]

I'm not concerned with money. I make <20,000 and I ain't dead. I can scrimp and save to pay off my debt if I have to. I love a challenge.

Those residencies are competitive because those concerned with money and lifestyle drove the competitiveness of these residencies. As someone stated before, they were goof specialties in the past, till society caught on to the hype and decided they wanted to look like Cat lady with melons on their chest and perfectly scultped butts and CALVES😱. Then there are those of us chillin' in the cut who just wanna make it out and make enough to pay the rent/mortgage, pay the debt, grab some Micky D's (Subway if you're as health conscious as you're supposed to be), and make it from point A to be in that hoopty that got them through high school, college, and medical school (or is that just me?). I live off <20,000. I'm gonna get BUCK IN HERE when I can net 100,000 and pay my loans down and rent/utilities/etc (and I did the math: I can DO iiiiit!).
I know this is hard to believe, but not everyone in the room wants derm/plastics/ROADs/RAPER or whatever the frick you wanna call it.

The problem here is that we don't believe each other. There are people who don't believe that someone could dare be in this profession solely for the money, and there are people who can't believe that someone would do this even if there were very little money. Both views have different but pertinent consequences. These different angles make us want to sympathize, but our pre-med attitudes and personalities cause for clashing. It's like trying to fit a cube into a cylindrical hole. Why bother? We all have our motivations, and I say live and let live, just don't rain on my party.

It's not that we don't believe that this is what you really think right now. It's that we've seen our colleagues go from mostly interested in saving the world (one patient at a time) to 90% thinking of this as 'just a job' before they've even hit residency.

We're not trying to rain on you're party. We're trying to tell you that, like it or not, it is in fact raining at the party you're going to. Hopefully you'll listen and stay indoors, or at least bring an umbrella.

 

[JoshUNCW]

It's not that we don't believe that this is what you really think right now. It's that we've seen our colleagues go from mostly interested in saving the world (one patient at a time) to 90% thinking of this as 'just a job' before they've even hit residency.

We're not trying to rain on you're party. We're trying to tell you that, like it or not, it is in fact raining at the party you're going to. Hopefully you'll listen and stay indoors, or at least bring an umbrella.

Again perrotfish, your overt generalizations invalidate your argument.

 

[vin5cent0]

Do human med students realise that the average vet med student debt is around $200,000 after grad, and the average salary is $80,000?

Stuffs not as bad as you think it is!

Vets also have no residency, no ridiculous malpractice insurance and don't have to bother with accepting insurance for payment.

We've been hopping around vets since our last vet died a year ago. Each time we bring in our dogs or cats to get looked at, the bill is always several hundred dollars for a few tests and an exam. I don't think vets do too badly...

And OP, I don't believe for a second anyone goes into medicine with no salary motivation. Money is important for everyone, especially after 250k in debt and 1000s of hours spent studying.

 

[JoshUNCW]

Vets also have no residency, no ridiculous malpractice insurance and don't have to bother with accepting insurance for payment.

We've been hopping around vets since our last vet died a year ago. Each time we bring in our dogs or cats to get looked at, the bill is always several hundred dollars for a few tests and an exam. I don't think vets do too badly...

And OP, I don't believe for a second anyone goes into medicine with no salary motivation. Money is important for everyone, especially after 250k in debt and 1000s of hours spent studying.

I know you don't believe me. Or anyone else who says it. It's incomprehensible to you. People do some crazy **** in this world, and this is what you guys can't believe.

 

[christina30]

Vets also have no residency, no ridiculous malpractice insurance and don't have to bother with accepting insurance for payment.

We've been hopping around vets since our last vet died a year ago. Each time we bring in our dogs or cats to get looked at, the bill is always several hundred dollars for a few tests and an exam. I don't think vets do too badly...

And OP, I don't believe for a second anyone goes into medicine with no salary motivation. Money is important for everyone, especially after 250k in debt and 1000s of hours spent studying.

This was already addressed - vets do, in fact, partake in residency. Most people aren't willing to pay hundreds/thousands for treatment of their pets. And it's actually starting to become common to offer medical insurance for pets because treatment is so expensive.

 

[Slack3r]

So basically you don't care about money, but you want a six-figure salary in a lifestyle specialty? Lol hypocrisy?

 

[JoshUNCW]

So basically you don't care about money, but you want a six-figure salary in a lifestyle specialty? Lol hypocrisy?

I know it's beyond your comprehension. Don't worry about it bro.

 

[surftheiop]

It's not that we don't believe that this is what you really think right now. It's that we've seen our colleagues go from mostly interested in saving the world (one patient at a time) to 90% thinking of this as 'just a job' before they've even hit residency.

We're not trying to rain on you're party. We're trying to tell you that, like it or not, it is in fact raining at the party you're going to. Hopefully you'll listen and stay indoors, or at least bring an umbrella.

But imagine how miserable people are going to be if they go into medical already cynical about medicine.

I figure its best to start out optimistically and see where you end up, as opposed to going in thinking its going to be awful

 

[JenniferRU]

My friends in medical school told me not to go into medicine for money because it's not worth it. Don't worry about our conversation

Why would i be worried about some pre-med i dont know going on about how he doesn't need money, your not special, a bunch of other idealistic pre-meds posted threads similiar to yours if you used the search function. [/QUOTE]

Also, I found out what I wanted to know. There are others like me out there and I'll be happy to meet them in med school and beyond. To the rest of you. Have fun. My advice, get out. Do anything else. For your own sake. Because you're gonna be a bitch to work with.

Thats assuming you get into medical school I'm sure you will make a "lovely" coworker.

 

[JoshUNCW]

Why would i be worried about some pre-med i dont know going on about how he doesn't need money, your not special, a bunch of other idealistic pre-meds posted threads similiar to yours if you used the search function.

Thats assuming you get into medical school I'm sure you will make a "lovely" coworker.[/QUOTE]

 

[JenniferRU]

Thats assuming you get into medical school I'm sure you will make a "lovely" coworker.

[/QUOTE]
Your getting off your high horse?

 

[JoshUNCW]

Your getting off your high horse?

Again, don't worry about me. I'll be ok. Just seriously think about what you wanna be doing with your life. As I think a lot of people who have can't even seem to comprehend this way of thinking.

 

[Perrotfish]

But imagine how miserable people are going to be if they go into medical already cynical about medicine.

I figure its best to start out optimistically and see where you end up, as opposed to going in thinking its going to be awful

I get where you're coming from, but I disagree. I think the ones who will be most miserable (and who will turn into the worst coworkers) are the ones who expect more from medicine than the profession has to offer. If you make medicine the central pole in your emotional tent then I don't want to be around when you find out that it doesn't offer a whole lot more satisfaction than any other job. On the other hand if you go in expecting medicine (like every other job) to be something that you do because you have to, and if you look to your personal life rather than your professional life for happieness, well then I think you have a good chance of having a rich and fulfilling existance.

 

[JoshUNCW]

I get where you're coming from, but I disagree. I think the ones who will be most miserable (and who will turn into the worst coworkers) are the ones who expect more from medicine than the profession has to offer. If you make medicine the central pole in your emotional tent then I don't want to be around when you find out that it doesn't offer a whole lot more satisfaction than any other job. On the other hand if you go in expecting medicine (like every other job) to be something that you do because you have to, and if you look to your personal life rather than your professional life for happieness, well then I think you have a good chance of having a rich and fulfilling life.

Some people choose to live in a miserable world. Some people find happiness in things that other people just can't. Not everyone falls under your uniform idea. It scares me that you can't understand that.

 

[JenniferRU]

Again, don't worry about me. I'll be ok. Just seriously think about what you wanna be doing with your life. As I think a lot of people who have can't even seem to comprehend this way of thinking.

Like somebody else mentioned your a hypocrite, you are making assumptions on me even though i never actually stated in this thread why I am going into medicine, but before you were whining about how people made assumptions about your financial situation.
There is not one way of thinking, can you comprehend that?
Don't worry about what i want to do with my life, because I am doing it just fine, thank you 👍

 

[JoshUNCW]

Like somebody else mentioned your a hypocrite, you are making assumptions on me even though i never actually stated in this thread why I am going into medicine, but before you were whining about how people made assumptions about your financial situation.
There is not one way of thinking, can you comprehend that?
Don't worry about what i want to do with my life, because I am doing it just fine, thank you 👍

Your personal opinions on the matter were made obvious. Regardless of whether you wanna back track now.

 

[JenniferRU]

Your personal opinions on the matter were made obvious. Regardless of whether you wanna back track now.

I'm not back tracking nothing, the only thing i stated was that your rant is one that gets posted every few weeks, doesn't make you special.
You whine about how people are complaining about not making enough money in the future, you say your not planning on going for a competitive residence yet plan on making six figures, if you cared so little about money, how about after graduating medical school, you go work for free in a third world country.

 

[lovemesomeTJ]

It's not that we don't believe that this is what you really think right now. It's that we've seen our colleagues go from mostly interested in saving the world (one patient at a time) to 90% thinking of this as 'just a job' before they've even hit residency.

We're not trying to rain on you're party. We're trying to tell you that, like it or not, it is in fact raining at the party you're going to. Hopefully you'll listen and stay indoors, or at least bring an umbrella.

Good grief!! If I "stay indoors" and don't do it, WHO WILL?!?!?!

 

[JoshUNCW]

I'm not back tracking nothing, the only thing i stated was that your rant is one that gets posted every few weeks, doesn't make you special.
You whine about how people are complaining about not making enough money in the future, you say your not planning on going for a competitive residence yet plan on making six figures, if you cared so little about money, how about after graduating medical school, you go work for free in a third world country.

Because I want a wife and kids in America. There's more then enough to do here. And I specifically said I don't want to be destitute. But everyone who thinks they can't live off a doctor's salary is a fool.

I will have a nice life and I'll have enough money to do what I want. If you can't manage to do that, get out.

 

[punkedoutriffs]

I swear some of you may in fact work harder on bashing each other on this board than working towards medicine.😀

 

[lovemesomeTJ]

I swear some of you may in fact work harder on bashing each other on this board than working towards medicine.😀

For realz, this thread has taken a very negative and catty turn. 👎

 

[JenniferRU]

Because I want a wife and kids in America. There's more then enough to do here. And I specifically said I don't want to be destitute. But everyone who thinks they can't live off a doctor's salary is a fool.

I will have a nice life and I'll have enough money to do what I want. If you can't manage to do that, get out.

What makes you think I can't manage that?? LOL!
But even if you don't have enough money, you will still be a brilliant doctor right.
Also, stop telling me to get out, its a little annoying.

 

[oaklandguy]

If you have never heard of a doctor going bankrupt then you must live in complete isolation or in a very wealthy area. Come to Michigan, I can show you tons of abandoned doctor's offices and hospitals that have gone through layoffs. Yes, Doctors get fired.

If you think most doctors do what they do without caring about money then you are very ignorant to reality. There are doctors who fraud our insurance system in order to make money. There are doctors who do illegal work on the side and write prescriptions to drug dealers in order to make money. What does this tell you? If Doctors were making enough money then why would there be many doctors jumping through hoops (illegal hoops at that) for the money?

Get off of the LSD and realize what the real-world looks like.

 

[45408]

But I know I'm not the only one who doesn't care. And to people in med school/residency, don't bother telling me how ignorant I am and how my mood will change once I get to M3 or start working resident hours. I've heard that before too, by 100 other people in 40 other threads.

Isn't it possible some of us want to go to med school. We want to be residents. We just want to be doctors.

Yes, there's a reason for that. Your input at this point is like taking sex tips from a virgin.


I'd be happy with $200-250K/year. Whether or not that will still be there when I get there is my concern.

 

[trep14]

Some people choose to live in a miserable world. Some people find happiness in things that other people just can't. Not everyone falls under your uniform idea. It scares me that you can't understand that.

But how do you already know that medicine is going to be something you find happiness in? You keep dismissing what everyone else is saying, including people who have far more experience than you do in the profession. They're trying to tell you that medicine may not meet the idealistic standards you hold for it. I respect the argument you made in your original post and agree with a lot of what you are saying, but I can see how people who entered medical school with the "helping people" mindset only to be torn down by the realities of the medical profession could be a little skeptical and dismissive of your original post.

 

[oaklandguy]

Yes, there's a reason for that. Your input at this point is like taking sex tips from a virgin.


I'd be happy with $200-250K/year. Whether or not that will still be there when I get there is my concern.

+1, I wouldn't complain about making $200k a year, but wouldn't complain if I made more either. The thing is $200k sounds like a lot, but then you have to understand that annual costs can add up, such as the taxes on a home in a nice neighborhood, country club fees, etc.

 

[Salt and Lime]

I get where you're coming from, but I disagree. I think the ones who will be most miserable (and who will turn into the worst coworkers) are the ones who expect more from medicine than the profession has to offer. If you make medicine the central pole in your emotional tent then I don't want to be around when you find out that it doesn't offer a whole lot more satisfaction than any other job. On the other hand if you go in expecting medicine (like every other job) to be something that you do because you have to, and if you look to your personal life rather than your professional life for happieness, well then I think you have a good chance of having a rich and fulfilling existance.

Under what circumstances do you see medicine as something that you do because you have to? Why would anyone have to do medicine? I don't understand.
You really come across as someone who does not at all enjoy what you do.

 

[surftheiop]

+1, I wouldn't complain about making $200k a year, but wouldn't complain if I made more either. The thing is $200k sounds like a lot, but then you have to understand that annual costs can add up, such as the taxes on a home in a nice neighborhood, country club fees, etc.

 

[Perrotfish]

Under what circumstances do you see medicine as something that you do because you have to? Why would anyone have to do medicine? I don't understand.
You really come across as someone who does not at all enjoy what you do.

I mean that you would need to practice medicine because it's your job and you need to work so that you can eat. I didn't mean that you would need to do it vs. another profession.

I wouldn't say I don't enjoy medicine (at least what I've seen of it). As educations/jobs go, I enjoy it more than anything I've previously done. It's just that I look at it for a job. It's something you do to pay the bills. The fun part of life is outside the hospital.

 

[iFearMCAT]

To the OP you are a fool dawg;

Ask 50 what's up:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO22Z0T3qPE

Listen, do you think the NBA players association would be very happy if salaries dropped. Hell NO, they would b**** their asses off. Look baseball has strikes, the NFL player's association whines it A%% off and these guys make way more than doctors. Everyone is concerned with money bc. money makes the world go round. You know this, thats why you want to go into derm or plastics--> because right now they have a potential for lots of money. If derm was suddenly to see the same thing that happened to CT and you were a resident in derm or even worse an attending you would complain too.

OP do yourself a favor and go into academics (aka get a PhD) you can help society a lot and not get paid shat. I will stay in med and try to land a top residency, partner, and hopefully 2 years out make a boat load. Oh yeah don't forget the biotech industry cha-ching$$$$.

Pre-meds are powerless but we should complain, and when the time comes for us to be attendings, we should keep complaining and PETITION those d'bags in Washington....Remember never loose sight of the money!!!

Amen brotha

 

[PetitAllegro]

I wouldn't say I don't enjoy medicine (at least what I've seen of it). As educations/jobs go, I enjoy it more than anything I've previously done. It's just that I look at it for a job. It's something you do to pay the bills. The fun part of life is outside the hospital.

But do you recognize the fact that other people (meaning currently practicing doctors, not naive pre-meds etc etc) do look at it as something more than a way to pay the bills? I can't quite tell from your posts so far.

 

[punkedoutriffs]

Listen, do you think the NBA players association would be very happy if salaries dropped. Hell NO, they would b**** their asses off. Look baseball has strikes, the NFL player's association whines it A%% off and these guys make way more than doctors. Everyone is concerned with money bc. money makes the world go round. You know this, thats why you want to go into derm or plastics--> because right now they have a potential for lots of money. If derm was suddenly to see the same thing that happened to CT and you were a resident in derm or even worse an attending you would complain too.

I think there's something to this post here. Just like the adcoms, I think people just hate being invested in something that's trending downwards. It's like investing in a stock and seeing it drop. Did people have in the back of their minds that they're taking a risk? Yes, but if it is relatively unanticipated, then they're going to feel somewhat cheated.

I think anyone, even those who went into medicine for other (intrinsic) rewards, would feel cheated and complain under present circumstances and trends. If they do not, they're either not being effected, or they want to appear as though they don't care.

 

[da8s0859q]

It's incomprehensible to you.

I know it's beyond your comprehension.

As I think a lot of people ... can't even seem to comprehend this way of thinking.

It scares me that you can't understand that.

Don't worry about our conversation, what I quoted barely makes sense on your part.

To the rest of you. Have fun. My advice, get out. Do anything else. For your own sake. Because you're gonna be a bitch to work with.

Well, unsolicited and useless advice aside, at least you're good for comic relief. Please sir, continue enlightening us with that which we clearly don't understand. 😍

 

[Dr Oops]

But do you recognize the fact that other people (meaning currently practicing doctors, not naive pre-meds etc etc) do look at it as something more than a way to pay the bills? I can't quite tell from your posts so far.

Sure there are some that do and hopefully we can be like those people. However the majority of docs were the same as you guys (so was i) bright and starry eyed, altruistic then go through the system and get beaten down and more realistic or their priorities change (family, retirement etc.).

I agree with perrotfish, the way to not get so jaded is to not expect so much coming in and being pleasantly surprised. Because while there is alot of good stuff in medicine there is a lot more ****. What really sucks for pre-meds today is that you really dont have any idea what youre getting into now because of all the changes going on in healthcare.

 

[Tin Man]

I will say again.

What's funny to me is that the idealist gets bashed for having a motivation that can't be affected by the fluctuation in economy for being disconnected from reality, and is being attacked by people who are going into medicine for the money despite the fact that they don't think they're going to be getting enough money to make them happy, and that there is little evidence that the situation will change any time soon.

I mean, it's one thing to be going in with idealistic views that might change. But it's just... stupid... to go in desiring something that you have a VERY small chance of landing (ie, enough money to make the whole med school process worth it), especially considering that all the high-paying, cushy residencies are probably going to be even harder to get into within the next few years than they ever have been.

I say leave the idealists alone. If their beliefs stay the same, then they're going to be happy doing the same job for the same pay that you're going to be miserable doing, because you went in to get money, despite all indications that you AREN'T going to get money. They have a much, MUCH higher chance of being satisfied with their job than you do with yours, especially with the new health care act.

Who's being more disconnected from reality here?

If the guy has a chance being happy doing medicine, then let him. I know that you all are bitter that you're not going to be able to make the money you wanted, and you're trying to find a way to deal with the fact that you put too much into pre-med to back out now, but that doesn't mean that it's necessary to tell the guy going in for less fluid reasons than you that they're going to change. If they do, they do. But they have a much motivation for going in than you, since they have a much higher chance of getting their happiness from helping people than you do of getting enough money to make the pre-med gauntlet and work hours worth it.

 

[ProgPenguin]

I swear some of you may in fact work harder on bashing each other on this board than working towards medicine.😀

I think SDN can be a good resource, but mostly it just cracks me up... It serves as a check on my own motivations & reminds me not to get entirely consumed by the beast that is the path toward a career in medicine. I know that tone can be misinterpreted online, but it seems like some people are uber-hyper competitive and way too defensive sometimes. Obviously you have to work hard, but relax & enjoy life while you're at it! And be passionate! [or I guess you could not be passionate, but then why would you bother pursuing it? Life is really all about fulfillment...no?], but for the love of God, CHILL!!

 

[oaklandguy]

Country club memberships aren't cheap dude. Jet skis aren't cheap. Like, when people think of doctors they think they can afford those types of things. No one thinks of a doctor that drives a 1989 honda civic living in a shack and just happy to go to work. That isn't how it works man, people go to school for 13 years after high school in order to afford nice cars and houses with crazy taxes and prestigious country club memberships and a slurpee machine in their house. That's life. Take it for what it's worth. You take away someone's dream then you take away their motivation. No one will want to help the progression of medicine.

 

[Slack3r]

I will say again.

What's funny to me is that the idealist gets bashed for having a motivation that can't be affected by the fluctuation in economy for being disconnected from reality, and is being attacked by people who are going into medicine for the money despite the fact that they don't think they're going to be getting enough money to make them happy, and that there is little evidence that the situation will change any time soon.

I mean, it's one thing to be going in with idealistic views that might change. But it's just... stupid... to go in desiring something that you have a VERY small chance of landing (ie, enough money to make the whole med school process worth it), especially considering that all the high-paying, cushy residencies are probably going to be even harder to get into within the next few years than they ever have been.

I say leave the idealists alone. If their beliefs stay the same, then they're going to be happy doing the same job for the same pay that you're going to be miserable doing, because you went in to get money, despite all indications that you AREN'T going to get money. They have a much, MUCH higher chance of being satisfied with their job than you do with yours, especially with the new health care act.

Who's being more disconnected from reality here?

If the guy has a chance being happy doing medicine, then let him. I know that you all are bitter that you're not going to be able to make the money you wanted, and you're trying to find a way to deal with the fact that you put too much into pre-med to back out now, but that doesn't mean that it's necessary to tell the guy going in for less fluid reasons than you that they're going to change. If they do, they do. But they have a much motivation for going in than you, since they have a much higher chance of getting their happiness from helping people than you do of getting enough money to make the pre-med gauntlet and work hours worth it.

Idealism would be nice. Sadly, these "idealists" won't pursue the specialties where they're actually needed. The guy that wants to "help people" will be gunning for derm come 4th year, and I think you know why.

 

[DrArete]

Some people choose to live in a miserable world. Some people find happiness in things that other people just can't. Not everyone falls under your uniform idea. It scares me that you can't understand that.

I have to hand it to you. You have steadily turned this thread into a ridiculous trolling session.
Don't you have to be at the gym in 26 minutes so you can look good on the beach with your Candian girlfriend who no one ever meets, so you can listen to your "friends" in med school drink a beer, give you a hug, and tell you its all going to be ok?