anyone else depressed all of a sudden about their undergrad?

[meanderson]

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I guess these feelings are just stronger now because everyone is filling out their amcas. One of my cousin's friends from emory who is also going through the process for the first time is a little worried because she didn't go to a top 10 undergrad. Lol.....I wonder what she thinks of my chances considering my undergrad.

I know some in here give large state universities like UGA, FSU, UF, etc a rough time, but I would be a lot less worried if I came from one of these schools. At least they have some standards and med schools know that students who post 3.9+ gpa's from these schools are likely the real deal. No gpa from a small state school with a subpar student body(980-1020 mean SAT) is going to be respected. A kid who goes to UGA and puts up a 3.9 in a tough major is going to have a tiny bit of leeway on the mcat. Sure, scoring 24 or so would probably raise a serious red flag, but a 28-29 will be competitive. After all, he/she has proven themselves to some degree by doing well academically.

It's weird how some in this forum say that a 3.9-4.0 gpa and a 30 MCAT score don't match up. Hell, I know students at my former school who put up 3.9-4.0 gpa's and scored 18-23 on the mcat. No joke. One story from my undergrad days:

I'm taking a genetics course my senior year. The course is taight fairly well, and I'm doing ok in it. The tests are reasonably hard; they are mainly multiple choice but test the material on an appropriate level considering the class. I was studying several hours a week and my first three test scores were 89, 93, 92. What I didn't understand was why other students in the class were also doing well. It seemed like on every test a large number of students were scoring 94-100, and these were not the type of students who could make such grades on real genetics tests. They were making C's in general chem, and now they blow away genetics?? On the last test I make a 93. I've got my A and I'm satisfied. The class average on the final test was a 41. Yes, a 41!! Apparently the professor decided to make up a different test. It turns out other students did so well because the professor used the same tests semester after semester after semester. They just memorized the multiple choice answers and felt they were doing well. But the real kicker is that instead of just giving them their final grades, the prof. explains that it was probably unfair to make up a new test and that a re-test will be given to anyone who desires. Well guess what....the re-test is the same as the test we had just taken 3 days ago. I'd guess that 40/50 people in that class recieved an A....some of whom would have problems solving even the simplest of genetics problems.

Yeah, that's an extreme example concerning my undergrad. There were a few really challenging classes, but many were like that genetics class. It's just a scary thought to know that there is NO margin for error on the mcat. If I slip up and struggle with a few passages for whatever reason, that's it......I feel like one of those olympic athletes who train years for one big moment, and then they lose .3 points because they convert a triple axle into a double and their dream is over.

Oh well...sorry for rambling on but I just felt like I had to type out my frustrations....

 

[Dr Chooch]

Dude, there is no need to fret. Stick behind your undergrad. No matter what people say about prestige and the importance of your undergrad school, it is still YOU that they are more interested in understanding, not your school.

I didn't go to a top ranked school either, not even close, and used to wonder if med schools would look down on that. Overall, that is not the case and I think most adcoms would agree with that. I think many people look at the undergrad presige thing a little backwards anyway. Rather than thinking that going to a lower tiered school detracts from your application and having gone to an upper tier school is up to par, I think its more accurate to think that having gone to a lowered tier school is just fine, and those that did get their education at a top school sometimes get a little extra bump. But that's nothing you can help, and it isn't worth worrying over the prestige of your undergrad because it's not nearly as important as you think it is. There are tens of thousands of applicant every year that didn't go to a top ten, and I can assure you they do just fine. Sure many people that have gone to a top ten get into great schools, and that can seem really scary and intimidating, but you gotta remember that those people are a self-selecting group and many of them would have gotten in any of those same schools if they would have come from almost any other institution. It's not the school, it's the person.

As for the MCAT, there is only no margin for error if you want a 45. I'm assuming you haven't taken it yet or begun studying hardcore. It's all about prepping. If you give yourself enough time to prep (a few months) and focus on ways to stay calm and not freak yourself out, you will do just fine. For most people, after you have learned your stuff, the MCAT is all about staying calm. If you worry about effing up, you aren't going to help yourself. Relax and take a deep breath, it will all be fine, I promise. 🙂

 

[kreno]

i agree.. stick behind your school! And take full advantages of the fact that it may be easier to get better grades too! Remember, a 2.8 from Cornell won't do you good anywhere, but a 3.5 from Random University might get you an interview!

I went to Michigan State... certainly now a random school but definitely *NOT* a prestigious school and i'm so glad i did 'cuz it really was a great experience, both socially (*VERY* important) and academically.... although I grew out of it academically, it certainly developed me in the beginning years (i went to a really bad high school, and hence was a little behind coming to college). Now i'm off to an ivy med school! good luck!

 

[meanderson]

Kreno, as you said, MSU is certainly not a random school. If I went to a school like that, this wouldn't be worrying me. Looking through the student bodies of many schools I would like to attend, I saw almost no students from schools like mine, yet lots of students(if not the majority) from decent large research universities like MSU. It makes me wonder if I should even bother applying to many schools.

Is there anyone else on this board in a similar situation(went to an undergrad where the avg entering student had 3.0/980 type numbers)?

 

[steve007]

yeah, my schools around there. bottom line is this, do well on the mcat. this will verify your gpa. also, keep in mind, education is often what you make of it. i know i have gotten a very good education at my undergrad and i'll say that proudly on interviews. one last thing, most schools use a system of gpaX10 + MCAT score to determine who gets an interview. prestige of undergrad prolly doesn't come into play until later in the app process. if you've written good essays and given a great interview, i certainly think you can overcome a not so prestigious undergrad.

 

[VienneseWaltz]

I've given you this advice before, but I'll say it again, and then, please, quit fretting. You don't have room for error in the rest of your application, but if you DO nail it (you had been testing pretty well on the MCAT, as I recall)--including MCAT, LORs, PS, prompt return of secondaries, etc., you WILL get interviews, and then you're on the same level as everyone else. I went to the Univ. SC and still had a good bit of success in this process. Also, you have several years' public school teaching experience (in a rural area, if I recall correctly?), which will really make you stand out.

It's true that the Ivy kids sometimes get a little slack the rest of us don't, but we can still get into their med schools. You can't undo your undergraduate choice, and you will drive yourself crazy if you keep freaking out over it.

 

[Dr Chooch]

Originally posted by steve007
if you've written good essays and given a great interview, i certainly think you can overcome a not so prestigious undergrad.

I agree with the rest of what you said, but this was kinda what I was talking about. There is nothing to overcome. Your undergrad was the school that helped shape you into the person you are today. If you have pride in your school you should never look at it as a ball and chain in the application process or anywhere in life.

🙂

 

[meanderson]

VW, I really appreciate reading your posts, especially considering your success in the process, but again, I believe there is a definite gap between a school like Univ. of South Carolina and a school like mine. I'd really like to get more advice from people in *my* situation. I know I've fretted over the same thing a few times, but that's only because I was hoping to get some more advice from people who went to small non-research non-competitetive state schools.

 

[steve007]

Originally posted by Dr Chooch
I agree with the rest of what you said, but this was kinda what I was talking about. There is nothing to overcome. Your undergrad was the school that helped shape you into the person you are today. If you have pride in your school you should never look at it as a ball and chain in the application process or anywhere in life.

🙂

i meant overcome a preconception about the level of the institution. i think you're 100% right. i've gotten a ton out of my not so competitive undergrad, and i'd proudly tell it to anyone who'd care to listen.

 

[moops]

Originally posted by meanderson
VW, I really appreciate reading your posts, especially considering your success in the process, but again, I believe there is a definite gap between a school like Univ. of South Carolina and a school like mine. I'd really like to get more advice from people in *my* situation. I know I've fretted over the same thing a few times, but that's only because I was hoping to get some more advice from people who went to small non-research non-competitetive state schools.

what IS your school? peole are giving examples and you request examples more similar to yours.. what IS your school man?

 

[meanderson]

it's a smallish non-research state school with an average entering high school class mean of 2.9-3.0/980 SAT. I think that gives people a pretty good idea about what level school we're talking about. Large state universities like UGA, UF, Auburn, etc typically have average entering class means of 3.4-3.7/1150-1230 SAT. That's a big difference in student quality.

 

[meanderson]

I just realized I wrote "average entering mean......"

Let's hope I don't make the same dumb mistakes on my medical school application to get into medical school 🙂

 

[VienneseWaltz]

Originally posted by steve007
i meant overcome a preconception about the level of the institution. i think you're 100% right. i've gotten a ton out of my not so competitive undergrad, and i'd proudly tell it to anyone who'd care to listen.

Steve makes a good point. Some of the changes that have taken place over the last decade at USC are impressive, but its reputation has not caught up to the high quality, and some schools DO have preconceived notions, especially outside the South. One interviewer at a prestigious Midwestern school basically tried to make me apologize for having been born in the South. I was much more diplomatic than he deserved (after all, I'm Southern--I'm not going to hate you to your FACE 😉 ), but I took great pleasure in writing my withdrawal letter. Another student from USC told me that this same school acted like they were doing her a big favor by interviewing her.

So, yeah, there will be some discrimination, but I think most schools get over it once they realize that you're still a good candidate.

 

[FutureM.D.]

I go to UF 😀 The statisitics are that over half the pre-meds here at UF who apply to med school will get in. I found that on the school webpage somewhere. if i ever find it again, i'll be sure to post it

 

[moops]

if you severely dislike your undergrad, what made you choose it in the first place? as longas your mcats are superb, i wouldn't worry about anything

 

[irlandesa]

so you are at an undergrad school that you consider to be sub-par. At this point, what can you do about it? it seems like you can't transfer and you certainly can't make the school into UGa or UF overnight. you have to accept what you can not change and realize what you can. If I remember correctly, you were doing pretty well on those MCAT practice tests, so you might want to relax about that and have confidence in yourself. If you feel that your undergrad courses have left you unprepared for medical school and that the reputation is severely lacking in the eyes of admissions comittees, you may want to consider doing an MS in medical sciences at a more well-known school like Drexel, BU, or Georgetown, or an MPH from a well-respected program (Emory, JHU, UMN, Yale, and many other schools I'm sure). But were I in your situation, I would go ahead and at least apply to your state schools and maybe 4-5 other schools. If you really like your MCAT score in the end, you can always add on additional schools to improve your application.

 

[SunnyS81]

I don't know where you go to school, although I'm thinking it is in the likes of southern or westGA. Anyways, if I remember correctly from the Vanderbilt list of students, they have more students from West GA (2) over the past four years than UGA (1) and almost Tech (4). And if you look at MCG's list of schools, they accept people from just about everywhere/anywhere. The key is the MCAT. No one will challenge you if you have MCAT >=30.

Good luck.

 

[meanderson]

Yeah I know...I'm probably overly paranoid about it...at least my family thinks so. Thanks for the advice everyone.

I'm not interested in doing a mph or anything. I don't feel like I need further preparation in the basic sciences. The idea of a recent graduate with a 3.9 doing a post-bacc or masters would probably raise even more eyebrows.

I teach general bio, chemistry, and physics now at the high school level so maybe that's why my initial mcat practice scores were very high. But now I'm reaching something of a plateau, which is dissapointing because I haven't been hitting it hard for that long. I started out in the mid 30's, and I still have not hit a 40 yet. My last two tests(one from Kaplan and one BR) have been 36's.

Oh well, it's lunch and I need to get back to work on my amcas personal experiences. thanks again...

 

[samenewme]

The other thing to keep in mind is that if schools like yours are very small, there will be very few pre-med students to begin with. So in schools that only list the top dozen or so undergrad institutions, the smaller schools will all be buried under "other".

Chill and just be the coolest damn student your school ever graduated. You'll be fine.

 

[Dr Chooch]

Originally posted by meanderson
Yeah I know...I'm probably overly paranoid about it...at least my family thinks so. Thanks for the advice everyone.

I'm not interested in doing a mph or anything. I don't feel like I need further preparation in the basic sciences. The idea of a recent graduate with a 3.9 doing a post-bacc or masters would probably raise even more eyebrows.

I teach general bio, chemistry, and physics now at the high school level so maybe that's why my initial mcat practice scores were very high. But now I'm reaching something of a plateau, which is dissapointing because I haven't been hitting it hard for that long. I started out in the mid 30's, and I still have not hit a 40 yet. My last two tests(one from Kaplan and one BR) have been 36's.

Oh well, it's lunch and I need to get back to work on my amcas personal experiences. thanks again...

You are golden. If you are doing that well on your MCAT practices already, you will be absolutely fine. If you are really worried about proving yourself to medical schools, just continue what you are doing, and I guarantee you that you will. Just keep yourself in the groove and continue to kick it on test day. I mean seriously, it's still freaking May and you are pulling upper 30's right? You have NO reason to worry. You need to take a couple days away from studying and go on a vacation. 😎

 

[DW]

dude, seriously, if you get a mid 30s MCAT, you're going to be fine 🙂

 

[VienneseWaltz]

Originally posted by meanderson
But now I'm reaching something of a plateau, which is dissapointing because I haven't been hitting it hard for that long. I started out in the mid 30's, and I still have not hit a 40 yet. My last two tests(one from Kaplan and one BR) have been 36's.

Sheesh. I know some crank told you that you have to get at least a 37 to be considered outside Georgia, but that totally isn't true. If you score in the mid-30's, you will be competitive everywhere, even if your undergrad isn't so hot. Any adcom ready to discount a 3.9 (or whatever you have) from no-name college will realize you ARE prepared if your MCAT is good.

 

[spumoni620]

Originally posted by steve007
i think you're 100% right. i've gotten a ton out of my not so competitive undergrad, and i'd proudly tell it to anyone who'd care to listen.

bingo. like my dad says, it's better to be a big fish in a little pond. due to financial reasons, i went to a university that is not exactly popping out of the rankings charts...and like you I did complain at first, because i thought i'd be "missing out". the reality: I ended up keeping an open mind and now I have close friends and mentors in about 7-8 professors as well as some really awesome experiences to write about. more than one of my friends from my university ended up going to a top 3 med school...(even though one did say harvard gave him a VERY hard time about his undergrad institution...)

we do have to work harder in terms of mcat to illustrate that our gpa's aren't just products of "grade inflation". but...man, a 36 sounds great. don't stress!!!
😎

 

[gapremed]

I go to UGA, and I have never thought of it as being signficantly better in admissions officers' eyes than other public colleges in the state. But maybe it is, though I know it's not anywhere near Ivy-League material or anything. Just my two cents.

 

[teripsia]

I took my pre-med courses at a community college, got a 4.0, scored ok on the MCAT (33), and got into 3 schools. Pretty good ones, too! Don't worry about reputation so much - just do your best and learn the material.