Anyone else glued to the elections??

[Michael_Scott]

---

Members do not see this ad.

Very easy for a person of privilege to just say "hey, lets just ignore it."

There was a really great video on YouTube - I'll see if I can find it - that showed how minorities are placed at an automatic disadvantage and how the system works against them. That is why affirmative action is put in place.

please...I am a minority and affirmative action has not helped me in any way...
I do agree disadvantaged minorities need help to get somewhere BUT AA targets only specific minorities thus it is very exclusive in nature. It is the same beast that is it trying to destroy.

 

[blablabla1]

please...I am a minority and affirmative action has not helped me in any way...
I do agree disadvantaged minorities need help to get somewhere BUT AA targets only specific minorities thus it is very exclusive in nature. It is the same beast that is it trying to destroy.

I'm also a minority (Asian descent), but not one of the types of minorities that typically benefits from affirmative action. Regardless, just because I don't personally benefit from it doesn't mean I can't acknowledge that it greatly benefits others who need it and are truly disadvantaged.

 

[x0jessmariex3]

I am also an URM. I'm Cuban and I think AA really serves to people who show that it was more difficult for them to achieve their accomplishments. Its one thing to be an URM but were your circumstances actually different? Did you come from a family making income below $25,000? Did you grow up in an area where few individuals go to college? Or that has a high crime rate? Like Newark, Detroit, Chicago, etc.? I think if they see in your application that you are, say, Hispanic but grew up in a family of physicians in a suburban area then it doesn't really apply as much. Just my thoughts.

 

[oralcare123]

And why shouldn't they protest? It is their 1st Amendment right to do so. You have a right to bear arms under the 2nd Amendment, and you have a right to protest under the 1st. What you don't have the right to do is threaten to exercise your 2nd Amendment rights in order to suppress another voter's 1st or 15th Amendment rights. That is what many Trump supporters stated they would do. As far as Trump's dangerous rhetoric throughout the campaign that everything was rigged all the way down the line, I don't think that is really defensible nor do I think you were defending it (or at least I hope you weren't).



Gender should be a non-factor, and yet here we are with our 45th consecutive male president.



It most certainly has, though rarely.



There is nothing inherently racist about calling attention to the fact that black people are killed and incarcerated in higher proportions than other ethnicities. It is a movement calling attention to a fact no matter the cause. That people mistakenly assume that BLM blames the police is really their own mistake. BLM is simply drawing attention to the fact that black lives in American society are treated as more expendable for whatever reason. Until we can acknowledge the facts (including the fact that the majority of black victims are killed by other blacks) then we will never resolve the underlying issues.

Like Trump said " All lives matter". If blacks are so concerned about themselves, they should stop being involved in crime at such high rate

 

[oralcare123]

In my opinion all people should have equal rights. Even though it may seem more difficult to stay on track for someone in a "bad and poor" area, it does not justify discriminating against someone just on a basis of race. All your arguments sound great, but basically mean that white or asian dentist would treat black or latino patient worse, then black or latino dentist. Isn't that racist?

In other words, you are questioning why we need affirmative action right?

1. Our nation is changing, and our higher education institutions need to reflect this diversity. More than half of all U.S. babies today are people of color, and by 2050 our nation will have no clear racial or ethnic majority. Communities of color are tomorrow’s leaders, and we need to better prepare our future workforce.

2. While communities of color have made great strides in closing the education gap, disparities in higher education remain prevalent.According to the U.S. Census Bureau, in 2009 about 28 percent of Americans older than 25 years of age had a four-year college degree. That same year only 17 percent of African Americans and 13 percent for Hispanics had a four-year degree.

3. It’s in our national interest to invest in our future workforce. People of color today make up about 36 percent of the workforce. According to Census Bureau projections, by 2050 one in two workers will be a person of color. As our nation becomes more diverse, so too does our workforce.

4. Diversity in the workforce fosters innovation and competitiveness in business.Studies consistently show that diversity drives innovation and fosters creativity. In a Forbes survey, 85 percent of respondents said diversity is crucial for their businesses, and approximately75 percentindicated that their companies will put more focus during the next three years to leverage diversity to achieve their business goals.

5. Fortune 500 companies agree that diversity is good for the bottom line.More than 60 leading 500 Fortune companies—including Coca-Cola, General Electric, Hewlett-Packard, Intel, Johnson & Johnson, and many others—came out in support of race-based admission policies in an amicus brief to the Supreme Court in the Grutter v. Bollingerruling.

6. Diversity is a national security issue.In the past, our U.S. armed forces have argued that a highly qualified and racially diverse officer corps is essential to the military’s ability to provide national security. A top Army personnel official states that, “Diversity adds to the strength of the military as a force.” In Grutter v.Bollinger a number of high-ranking officers and civilian leaders of the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marine Corps urged the Court to uphold the limited consideration of race.

7. Diversity on campus benefits all students.Diversity on college campuses isn’t just a benefit for the brown and black students. Learning with people from a variety of backgrounds encourages collaboration and fosters innovation, thereby benefitting all students. Research shows that the overall academic and social effects of increased racial diversity on campus are likely to be positive, ranging from higher levels of academic achievement to the improvement of near- and long-term intergroup relations.

8. The implications of race-neutral policies in educational opportunities are detrimental to the next generation.Admission polices that do not consider race are predicted to decrease representation of students of color at the most selective four-year institutions by 10 percent. Given that our future workforce is projected to be nearly half people of color, it is necessary that universities create a fair process for expanding opportunities to all students.

9. Research show that race-neutral polices simply don’t work.Scholars have already debunked the myth that a class-based admission system is an adequate replacement for a race-based admission policy as a means of creating greater levels of diversity. A study conducted by the University of California, Los Angeles, School of Law found that after using a class-based admission system, enrollment of African Americans and American Indians fell by more than 70 percent. A wide breadth of research concludes that race-conscious practices are necessary in some capacity to achieve a level of diversity that encompasses our diverse nation.

10. The majority of Americans support race-conscious policies in higher education.A CBS News/New York Times poll in 2009 shows that the majority of Americans are in favor of promoting diversity on college campuses through race-conscious policies—including the Asian American population, a group that is inaccurately speculated to benefit from the ban of such practices. An Asian American Legal Defense and Education Fund poll found that 75 percent of Asian Americans voters in Michigan rejected Michigan’s Proposition 2, a 2006 state referendum seeking to ban race-conscious policies.

If we want racism to go away in our country, we should mention it, not ignore it and have intellectual debates about it. Saying that URM getting preferential treatment is racist isn't intellectual at all. If it had not been for years and years and years of oppression, affirmative action wouldn't even exist. There is a very nice documentary on Netflix called "the 13th". I found it very informative and I'm sure you will too.

 

[oralcare123]

When is the last time BLM nailed someone to a cross or hanged them from a tree?

They just assassinated several police officers. Same to me. And they think they are better then anyone else

 

[x0jessmariex3]

Like Trump said " All lives matter". If blacks are so concerned about themselves, they should stop being involved in crime at such high rate

Lol that is really ignorant. If you lived in an area of a dense population of Hispanics, Blacks, etc. you would realize its much easier for them to lead a life of crime. Not only are they more likely to be locked up for crimes making them have a criminal record and not able to get a decent job. They also usually grow up with little role models. They only are exposed to life of welfare, drug dealing, gangs. Have you ever actually been in these cities late at night like Newark or Chicago. Its pretty much kill or be killed when you're living in these places. I go to school in Newark and we very often get emails of thefts, assaults, and murders. I'm actually taking a course this semester about this topic otherwise I would barely understand the subject.

 

[Incis0r]

.

 

[aj30]

In my opinion all people should have equal rights. Even though it may seem more difficult to stay on track for someone in a "bad and poor" area, it does not justify discriminating against someone just on a basis of race. All your arguments sound great, but basically mean that white or asian dentist would treat black or latino patient worse, then black or latino dentist. Isn't that racist?

You're 100% right. Favoring a member of a "minority" over the "majority" is straight up racism. Racism is defined as distinguishing between people on the basis of race and that's EXACLTY what that is. Affirmative action is simply a form of politically correct racism (instituted to correct the supposed wrongs of my generation's great grandparents at innocent people's expense) so it's considered to be ok.

And let it be noted that I'm a "minority" member myself and still I find the notion of my possibly getting preference because of my race utterly reprehensible. (I put "minority" in brackets because I don't subscribe to the left wing politics of division in which I'm different than the next guy because of my race. I'm not "minority", "majority", nor do I belong to any other "class"-I'm simply an American just like everybody else.)

 

[x0jessmariex3]

In my opinion all people should have equal rights. Even though it may seem more difficult to stay on track for someone in a "bad and poor" area, it does not justify discriminating against someone just on a basis of race. All your arguments sound great, but basically mean that white or asian dentist would treat black or latino patient worse, then black or latino dentist. Isn't that racist?

I agree if an adcom is just solely choosing an applicant because he or she is black or Latino that is definitely racist. What I meant was if two applicants have the same or similar credentials (GPA, DAT, etc) but one had a more difficult life experience than the other then that person faced more challenges in achieving those accomplishments. That is definitely a question I got at many of my interviews. What is a challenge you had to overcome? I think coming from a bad or poor area and still being able to focus on academics, earn a 3.8 GPA and 20 DAT, when there are much bigger problems you face daily displays you are a better candidate. Things that the applicant from a "richer" area wouldn't have to worry about like the likelihood of getting robbed, family members overdosing on drugs, or not having enough food to eat. This list is actually much longer but yeah.

 

[FrenchyM.D/D.O]

The "supposed wrongs" your generation's great grand parents need to be corrected somehow. If affirmative action is a way to do it then so be it. Unless you have a better idea...? Please tell me how to close the Black vs White income gap. Please tell me how to improve the conditions in which most Blacks live in this country. Please tell me how...!!!


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[asdf99]

I agree if an adcom is just solely choosing an applicant because he or she is black or Latino that is definitely racist. What I meant was if two applicants have the same or similar credentials (GPA, DAT, etc) but one had a more difficult life experience than the other then that person faced more challenges in achieving those accomplishments. That is definitely a question I got at many of my interviews. What is a challenge you had to overcome? I think coming from a bad or poor area and still being able to focus on academics, earn a 3.8 GPA and 20 DAT, when there are much bigger problems you face daily displays you are a better candidate. Things that the applicant from a "richer" area wouldn't have to worry about like the likelihood of getting robbed, family members overdosing on drugs, or not having enough food to eat. This list is actually much longer but yeah.

Like anything in life, there are probably exceptions here and there, but I pretty much 100% agree with you. I'm not biased or anything as I probably fall into the category that did not have to worry about that stuff.

 

[Cello]

The "supposed wrongs" your generation's great grand parents need to be corrected somehow. If affirmative action is a way to do it then so be it. Unless you have a better idea...? Please tell me how to close the Black vs White income gap. Please tell me how to improve the conditions in which most Blacks live in this country. Please tell me how...!!!


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

I think that a lot of people don't realize that racism was baked right into the system. In the south, black slaves often outnumbered their owners 10 to 1. On top of that, the majority of whites were poor. The wealthy elites were dangerously outnumbered, and when poor whites and black slaves would occasionally revolt together it was bad for plantation owners. Racism was a way to divide poor whites and black slaves, to prevent them from unifying against their masters. It was highly effective. Even amongst black slaves the masters were crafty and would mix them from different African tribes so that they could not communicate effectively and thus could not hatch any plans for rebellion. Racism's roots run deep in this nation, and it is wishful thinking to believe that an institution which lasted for 400+ years can be erased in only a couple of generations. The deplorable and inhumane actions of our ancestors require more than simply shaking hands and calling a truce.

People don't seem to wonder why natives weren't enslaved like Africans were. The answer to that is that the colonists tried, but they failed to retain Native Americans who knew the land better, and could escape to neighboring tribes for safety. Africans could never escape the color of their skin, and thus even if they did manage to integrate with Native Americans as some did, the US government threatened tribes who dared take them in, savagely murdering many Native Americans who dared to harbor escaped black slaves. Enslaving Africans was a brutally effective measure of enslavement because they could never escape the brand upon their skin.

 

[FrenchyM.D/D.O]

Couldn't agree more celo


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[Cello]

You're 100% right. Favoring a member of a "minority" over the "majority" is straight up racism. Racism is defined as distinguishing between people on the basis of race and that's EXACLTY what that is. Affirmative action is simply a form of politically correct racism (instituted to correct the supposed wrongs of my generation's great grandparents at innocent people's expense) so it's considered to be ok.

And let it be noted that I'm a "minority" member myself and still I find the notion of my possibly getting preference because of my race utterly reprehensible. (I put "minority" in brackets because I don't subscribe to the left wing politics of division in which I'm different than the next guy because of my race. I'm not "minority", "majority", nor do I belong to any other "class"-I'm simply an American just like everybody else.)

There is a power component to racism which is often overlooked. The master doesn't care much for the lives of his black slaves (except that they are expensive to replace), and they probably don't care much for him either. But it doesn't really matter what the slaves think, because the master has all of the power. No one writes books about the poor master whose slaves didn't like him because no modern American can empathise with someone who used their power to take ownership of other human beings.

The same is true for black folks in this country right on up to the present. When you look at the power dynamic of whites to blacks, it isn't even close. Black people are still recovering from hundreds of years of bondage and slavery, not to mention Jim Crow and other laws in the south which still segregated and mistreated black people right on up into the 60s and 70s. The people who once thought that black people should have their own drinking fountain are still alive and many of them still have those views, even if they won't share them publicly. When those are the people who own the majority of businesses, who own the majority of land, who have the education and the wealth, then they are the power brokers and the vast majority of black people will ultimately be bargaining from a disadvantaged position. Things are changing slowly, progress is being made, but it is delicate and we owe much of that progress to programs like AA.

Like Trump said " All lives matter". If blacks are so concerned about themselves, they should stop being involved in crime at such high rate

This ignores the reason that they may be involved in crime at a higher rate than other races. Are you suggesting that upregulated melanin production does something to the brain which makes black people more violent? Have you ever considered the possibility that the explanation for higher rates of violent crime is social and not physiological or psychological?

 

[FrenchyM.D/D.O]

I agree with everything you said Cello.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[blablabla1]

There is a power component to racism which is often overlooked. The master doesn't care much for the lives of his black slaves (except that they are expensive to replace), and they probably don't care much for him either. But it doesn't really matter what the slaves think, because the master has all of the power. No one writes books about the poor master whose slaves didn't like him because no modern American can empathise with someone who used their power to take ownership of other human beings.

The same is true for black folks in this country right on up to the present. When you look at the power dynamic of whites to blacks, it isn't even close. Black people are still recovering from hundreds of years of bondage and slavery, not to mention Jim Crow and other laws in the south which still segregated and mistreated black people right on up into the 60s and 70s. The people who once thought that black people should have their own drinking fountain are still alive and many of them still have those views, even if they won't share them publicly. When those are the people who own the majority of businesses, who own the majority of land, who have the education and the wealth, then they are the power brokers and the vast majority of black people will ultimately be bargaining from a disadvantaged position. Things are changing slowly, progress is being made, but it is delicate and we owe much of that progress to programs like AA.



This ignores the reason that they may be involved in crime at a higher rate than other races. Are you suggesting that upregulated melanin production does something to the brain which makes black people more violent? Have you ever considered the possibility that the explanation for higher rates of violent crime is social and not physiological or psychological?

It's crazy to me how some of the brightest minds in this country - future dentists/healthcare workers - are so ignorant and insensitive about these social issues that plague our country. I completely agree Cello.

 

[zhngbrg]

Like Trump said " All lives matter". If blacks are so concerned about themselves, they should stop being involved in crime at such high rate

And there it is. Your not-so-subtle belief that something in the color of your skin inherently makes you more moral or just. Absolutely disgusting.

 

[DATanimelover]

The "supposed wrongs" your generation's great grand parents need to be corrected somehow. If affirmative action is a way to do it then so be it. Unless you have a better idea...? Please tell me how to close the Black vs White income gap. Please tell me how to improve the conditions in which most Blacks live in this country. Please tell me how...!!!


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

..and this is what people ignore. Years and years of the wrongs your ancestors committed , how are you all gonna fix it, because the consequences are still seen today. Mind you its better today than in the 90s ,80s 70s... but still people think to just ignoring the mess the past puts us in now will makes things better or it goes away.
Every good thing AA people tried to do in the past, was destroyed.. Ex: "The black wall street" look it up and educate yourselves, and thats just one example.
This thread just highlights the fact that you can be "book smart" you can have a PhD but you can still be unintelligent, ignorant, and insensitive on important matters.

 

[Cello]

..and this is what people ignore. Years and years of the wrongs your ancestors committed , how are you all gonna fix it, because the consequences are still seen today. Mind you its better today than in the 90s ,80s 70s... but still people think to just ignoring the mess the past puts us in now will makes things better or it goes away.
Every good thing AA people tried to do in the past, was destroyed.. Ex: "The black wall street" look it up and educate yourselves, and thats just one example.
This thread just highlights the fact that you can be "book smart" you can have a PhD but you can still be unintelligent, ignorant, and insensitive on important matters.

To be fair, I doubt anyone in this thread has a PhD, and most people here are pre-dents which means they likely don't quite have their Bachelor's yet either.

 

[x0jessmariex3]

To be fair, I doubt anyone in this thread has a PhD, and most people here are pre-dents which means they likely don't quite have their Bachelor's yet either.

Ehh. That's true but there are still people with PhDs that think this way also.

 

[Rand627]

It's interesting to me how people exaggerate their opinion and try to make it fact. Whether or not AA is a good thing is an opinion. There's too much hate in the world. Respect other people's opinions, agree to disagree, and move on!