Application Process (prerequisites to acceptance) Non Traditional

[Sisero68]

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Good Morning SDN, i have come to like reading these forums more then watching TV and thought i would give something back to everyone that is part of this community. Below is my personal breakdown and projected schedule for my Non-Traditional dental school application (this has been created from multiple websites including SDN)

I have to first apologies for the large post (when I created this document i did not intend to share it), but hopefully it can help more of you then irritate those who read it and gain no new information. this is my personal To-Do-List so its still a work in progress as i am educating myself as i go.

Please feel free to comment and critique this breakdown, i will respect and appreciate any honest responses (and frankly may need them)

Thank you, to all the posters, moderators and especially you current dental students and practicing DDS/DMD who take the time to help the pre-dental community out. everything you guys do is appreciated even if we sometime get caught up in our own questions and forget to say it from time to time.

And lastly i wish you all the best of luck
__________________________________

DDS Degree Process (prerequisites to acceptance) prepared October 11th-14th 2009

Previous Experience:
Graduated from SUNY Buffalo (University at Buffalo) May 2005
-Bachelors of Science - Major Architecture
-126 Credit Hours - 2.803 GPA (no dental prerequisites attempted)
Designer for Architect firm 3.75 years August 2005 - June 2009
-LEED Accredited Professional (Green design)
-2 promotions within 3.75 years
-completed architecture IDP requirements (Intern Development Program)
--need 1.25 more years of active experience to sit for ARE's (Architect Registration Examination)
Decided to switch my career to Dentistry September 2009
-realized I am about to enter a world of hurt

***

Apply for un-matriculated courses Spring semester at SUNY University: October 15th 2009
-call and schedule appointment to meet with pre-health academic advisor

Dental office: Job/shadow - work in an office shadow 50hrs minimum: October 16th 2009
-Some programs requires 100hrs or more of shadowing verify with each school
-shadow as many specialties as possible understand why i like or dislike each
--once you have found out what specialty you got most excited for concentrate in those offices
-Intern/Shadow for experience
-Part time job with any Dentist office
-Dental Laboratory Technician ect.
-keep track of hours
-Letter of recommendation should include hours of work
-Questions to ask DDS/DMD
--Are they happy:
---with their career - why and why not (if they could choose any other profession what would it be)
---with patient load
---with time off
---with compensation
---with their practice structure

Research local Dental society: Friday October 23rd
-Sent email and letter with resume
-Contact to get resume/shadowing on monthly news letter (suggested by local dentist)

Shadow: Monday October 26th 2009
-Local Orthodontist office 8:00am - 11:30am
-inquiry about future shadowing - weekly preferred

Get the ADEA official guide to dental schools
-purchase from ADEA's website verify best opportunities for acceptance (when ready to apply)

Meet with Pre Health academic adviser for best class schedule: Monday November 2nd 10:30am
-SUNY University - he will also be the one who prepares the composite letter of recommendation
-meet at-least once per semester
-discuss attempting June 2010 application to DDS schools 2011 semester
-realistic application to the 2012 semester

Proposed Academic Schedule: Chem is not offered in the spring
-Spring Semester - 12 credits
--Biology I w/lab
--Organic Chemistry I w/lab
--Physics I w/ lab

-Summer Session I - 4 credits
--Chemistry I w/ lab

-Summer Session I I - 4 credits
--Chemistry II w/ lab

-Fall Semester - 12 credits
--Biology II w/lab
--Organic Chemistry II w/lab
--Physics II w/ lab

Options for overall 3.0 average - with 32 credit hours (need 3.778 Average)
-1) A 4.0 (5), A- 3.666 (1), B+ 3.333(2)
-2) A 4.0 (4), A- 3.666 (3), B+ 3.333(1)
-3) A 4.0 (3), A- 3.666 (5)

DAT:
-Study and take practice test continuously from now on
-Continue studying until your first DAT exam
-minimum 1 practice test a month - increase toured test date
-Join pre-dental clubs to form study groups

Join a pre-dental student society: great support and information
-pre-dental ASDA (American Student Dental Association) is preferred
-Local university pre-dental

Hobbies:
-Working out
-LEED - Green activities
-Habitat - volunteer at what you enjoy doing

Professor relations: maintain 3.5 GPA or higher (see GPA breakdown above for overall 3.0GPA requirements)
-Attend office hours with the professor 1-2 times a month
-ask questions
-read relative chapters prior to class
-take advantage of all extra credit items
-volunteer in labs and any research with these professors if possible

Research: preferred biomedical and clinical research
-Lab research is preferred
-If necessary go lab to lab offering to any researcher that needs assistance

Social lifestyle: prove well rounded lifestyle and academics

Volunteer Work:
-At hospital functions
-Dentist offices
-Dental clinics
-any related field or events
-Habitat - as much as possible (since 2004 - 200+ hrs)

Documented information: related to dentistry
-Awards and honors
-Job shadowing and volunteering
-extracurricular activities and leadership efforts (LEED classes to coworkers)
-Volunteer and community service
-Work Experience
-Research Experience
-Anything that demonstrates manual dexterity

Application Process:
-Apply as early as possible - do not rush for quality
-Apply to a minimum of 10 dental schools preferably 15+ (as money allows)
-verify applications are received but be polite they are busy and stressed
-Write a powerful personal essay
--no controversy
--why dentistry
--bring notice to key points from the documents information above
--include items from interview skills below
--perfect grammar - english department review, unbiased skilled reviews
--be unique
-submit all transcripts from all schools (as soon as you have your application number)
-Verify you entered all courses properly
-AADSAS - takes 1-2 months to process your application
--verify everything is in order
--verify the last day of acceptance for each school
-Letters of reference - verify the professor knows and/or likes you
--AADSAS only accepts 4 letters
--3 from pure science professors
--1 from a practicing dentist
---it may be beneficial for a composite letter and professional reference
--Submit. submit - verify your submited your AADSAS application without errors

DDS programs to apply to: ranked in acceptance possibility - 2008 NY Resident (IMO)
-1) 19aa/21pat/3.65/s3.63 - prefer in state (Y) - (NY) University at Buffalo (BUF)
---$50 fee, Official DAT scores - December 31st
-2) 20aa/19pat/3.54/3.53s - prefer in state (N) - (NY) New York University (NYU)
---$75 fee, Official DAT scores - February 1st
-3) 21aa/xxpat/3.5/3.5s - prefer in state (N) - (NY) Columbia University (CUL)
---$75 fee, Official DAT scores - January 16th
-4) 22aa/19pat/3.7/3.7s - prefer in state (Y) - (NY) Stony Brook University (SUSB)
---$75 fee - January 15th

-5) 19aa/19pat/3.32/3.24s - prefer in state (N) - (MA) Boston University (BU)
---$70 fee, Official DAT scores - February 1st
-6) 19aa/19pat/3.43/3.36s - prefer in state (N) - (MA)Tufts University (TUF)
---$70 fee, Official DAT scores - February 1st
-7) 18aa/18pat/3.43/3.33s - prefer in state (N) - (AZ) Arizone School of Dentistry and Oral Health (AZ)
---$60 fee, Official DAT scores, Supplementary application - December 1st
-8) 17aa/18pat/3.45/3.35s - prefer in state (Y) - (KY) University of Louisville (UL)
---$50 fee, Official DAT scores - January 1st
-9) 19aa/19pat/3.4/3.31s - prefer in state (Y) - (PA) Maurice H Kornberg School of Dentistry Temple (TEMP)
---$30 fee - February 1st
-10) 20aa/20pat/3.3/3.2s - prefer in state (N) - (CA) University of Southern California (USC)
---$85 fee, Official DAT scores - February 1st
-11) 20aa/21pat/3.41/3.34s - prefer in state (N) - (CA) University of the Pacific (UOP)
---$75 fee, Official DAT scores - December 1st
-12) 19aa/19pat/3.58/3.26s - prefer in state (N) - (AZ) Midwestern University (MWU)
---$50 fee, Official DAT scores - January 1st
-13) 18aa/20pat/3.56/3.46s - prefer in state (N) - (NE) Creighton University (CRE)
---$55 fee, Official DAT scores, Supplemental Application, Photos - February 1st
-14) 19aa/20/pat/3.5/3.36s - prefer in state (Y) - (MI) University of Michigan (MICH)
---$50 fee, Official DAT scores - December 1st
-15) 19aa/20pat/3.61/3.57s - prefer in state (N) - (OH) Case School of Dental Medicine (CWR)
---$45 fee, Official DAT scores - January 1st
-16) 20aa/20pat/3.68/3.64s - prefer in state (N) - (PA) University of Pennsylvania (PENN)
---$50 fee, fee card, Supplemental application, Official DAT scores - January 1st
-17) 19aa/21pat/3.77/3.54s - prefer in state (N) - (PA) University of Pittsburgh (PITT)
---$35 fee, Official DAT scores, photos - December 1st
-18) 18aa/19pat/3.6/3.5s - prefer in state (Y) - (WI) Marquette University (MQT)
---$45 fee, Official DAT scores - January 1st
-19) xxaa/xxpat/3.5/3.4s - prefer in state (Y) - (MD) University of Maryland (MYD)
---$75 fee, Official DAT scores - January 1st
-20) 19aa/20pat/3.52/3.49s - prefer in state (Y) - (VA) Virginia Commonwealth University (VCU)
---$70 fee, Official DAT scores, photos - November 1st
-21) 19aa/20pat/3.6/3.56s - prefer in state (Y) - (OR) Oregon Health & science University (OHSU)
---$75 fee, Official DAT scores - November 1st
-22) 19aa/19pat/3.69/3.6s - prefer in state (Y) - (IW) University of Iowa (IOWA)
---$60 fee, Official DAT scores - November 1st


Ace Fall Semester courses - admission may be tentative on final grades 3.5 or higher
-see professor relations above
-see requirements for overall 3.0 GPA above

Perfect Interview Skills: Know my application inside and out and be able to restate it
-Honesty - tell the truth
-stay polite and professional
-wear a suit - preferably non black but professional (unique)
-show passion
-Personal History
-relative experience
-what makes me a great dentist
-future goals/ideas (research)
-Prepare concise answer for common questions samples below - know 3 answers each
--why did you decide to pursue dentistry
--what are your strengths
--what are your weaknesses
--why did you apply to our dental school
--what are your goals
-Get to the interview a day early - verify interviews dont overlap allow adequate time

Questions to ask a prospective dental school
-do students share lockers, manikins in lab, clinical chairs - more resources the better
-is patient swapping allowed in clinics - for experience reasons
-housing options around campus - cost of living
-what is the ratio of research to laboratory work
-are patients easy or hard to come across
-do faculty try to improve courses based on feedback or stay tried and true
-are students provided time off for essential exams - NBDE Part-1...
-how do students obtain chair time in clinics - rotational, online
-what does the school do to encourage the collegial environment
--big brother programs, social events, non competitive grading (bell curve)
-If a student falls behind on requirements to graduate on time is their a support system

Take DAT - October 2009 - goal 24 in all areas higher in PAT (aim small, miss small)

November 1st Finalize all applications verify schools have received them.
-Verify deadlines and requirements to all 2011 Fall DDS programs
-Prepare any classes or studying that is needed for the Spring semester 2010
-prepare classes and experience for Dental school curriculum / or incase not accepted
--Biochemistry needed for some schools
--microbiology, virology, human anatomy, neuro anatomy, gross anatomy,
--biomedical latin and greek, business management, accounting
-find a full time job in related field
--Dental Laboratory Technician ect. - see dental office above

Realistic AADSAS application June 2010
-Early Application
-All prerequisites completed
-Unpressured time to write Personal Statements

 

[TedyBearSuicide]

Just a helpful tip: its career, you have been spelling it carrier.

 

[doc toothache]

It appears you have been working rather hard in building yourself a house of cards. You left out the names and number of children you are going to have. The first thing that should be on your agenda is to purchase an ADEA Official Guide to DS.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=598696

You will have a hard time following the proposed course schedule, since gen chemistry is usually a pre requisite for organic chemistry. Considering your undergraduate record, applying in 2010 makes about as much sense as using papiermache as the material of choice for a Habitat of Humanity House, and including your laundry list in the post is about as useful as including pages of your personal diary. Why not try some shadowing, take a few science course to see of those synapses are still in good working order, finish your prerequisites, take the DAT and then come out and play.

 

[Sisero68]

Doc;
thank you for being direct, and for your advice looks like i will be aiming for 2012, but i am also stubborn so we will see.

yah i thought it might be a little much so i removed the names of the two dogs that i am going to purchase when i am 61 on August 3rd at 2:13pm

 

[KitKat09]

I totally support ADEA book, it is very helpful when you try figuring out details, specially pre recs for each school and whether your numbers are good fit. During the process I would recommend going to few open houses if you happen to have DS nearby. Those schools might have some activities for predents like voluteering in free dental clinic and such. It is also possible to schedule a visit during off season usually late winter-spring with adcom member or dean and discuss your application in details. Once you on your way, you could use search engine or interview feedback to look up individual schools and see what kind of school it is and whether it is going to be a good fit for you. I think it is rarely benefitial to apply more than 15 schools if you've done your homework well. Applying early is a must! so schedule yourself well.
I think if you as detailed in your work as in this post you will make a great dentist! Good luck!

 

[doc toothache]

Doc;
thank you for being direct, and for your advice looks like i will be aiming for 2012, but i am also stubborn so we will see. yah i thought it might be a little much so i removed the names of the two dogs that i am going to purchase when i am 61 on August 3rd at 2:13pm

Being "stubborn" is not necessarily something to be proud of. Cats must not be in your future.

 

[komradrobot]

Aaaaaarghhhh reading this post is stressing me out! It's great that you are planning everything so well, I'm sure you will succeed.

It's frustrating that orgo is the only reason the prereqs can't be taken in a year. I'm doing a post bac and last year I took a full load of sciences for two semesters. Now orgo is the only thing holding me back, and I'm stuck taking one class! It's a good time to study for the dat and pick up extra shadowing hours though.

What made you decide to go into dentistry?

 

[skiphotsauce]

I did a post-bac like you and I was in the same position as you, trying to go as fast as possible to get my app in for the next cycle. However, since you are not taking classes this term, it will be impossible for you to apply next cycle. You need to take chem before orgo, so it would be ideal for you to take bio/chem/physics in the spring, then finish the second semesters in the summer, then orgo 1 and 2 next year. You could take the DAT at the beginning of the summer 2011.

It's great you have this all planned out, but this can be stressful with all of this information. Just focus on the present, which is getting straight A's in your science classes for the next year. It's a long journey, no need to rush it. You want to make sure to give yourself the best shot. It seems you are fully committed so I'm sure you will do fine.

Good luck

 

[Sisero68]

Thank you guys for the encouragement, i have a long ways to go but am excited for these next few years even before i apply to Dental school.

KitKat09-
thanx for the advise about visiting the schools prior to applying, i have a few friends i have not seen in a couple of yeas i can visit them and tour the campuses of the cities they live in. (i am thinking it would be best to have at least 1 full semester under my belt before scheduling an appointment to meet with an adcom? while drive is nice its hard to convince anyone of potential without some figures to back up ones abilities/drive) or do you think this is not to important for a review or requirements visit with the adcom.

Komradrobot/skiphotsauce-
I found out i can take both Org Chem in the summer semesters I and II but i would have to take a higher level Chem that combines the standard 1 year general chem courses... while this is tempting - the years i have been away from the academic field and lack of previous science background i dont think i want anything else working against me. by taking harder level classes just to attempt to rush this process. (does this make sense or do you guys think it would be beneficial to shoot for this) i would still have to take a second Chem semester but the prerequisites for Org would be done.

Doc-
unfortunately i have cats in my present (2 strays) but you are right i am not seeing new cats in my future...

 

[Sisero68]

What made you decide to go into dentistry?

In truth there is no one answer it is a combination of many things.

understanding what things i dont enjoy in life and work.
and more importantly understanding what i do enjoy in life and work.
all of this added up to the decision not only to change my career but to go into dentistry.

 

[sketo43]

I commend your advance planning, but I'd like to make a couple comments, because I did a postbac also:

First, taking orgo before genchem is asking for a beating. I think that taking orgo over the summer would also be really tough. If possible, I would recommend taking it during the academic year.

Second, taking 3 lab classes at once is a lot more work than you may think. Even though it was just 12 credits, it was a lot more work than when I took 18 credits of liberal arts classes in undergrad. I'm not trying to discourage you - you can get good grades in 3 lab classes (I did), just don't expect it to be as easy as 12 credits may seem.

If you take chem 1 & 2 over the 2010 summer, and take orgo 1 & 2 during the 2010-2011 academic year, you could take the DAT and submit your applications in the summer of 2011. You might as well start physics this upcoming spring semester to get it over with. For bio, my school recommended doing chem first, but if your school doesn't care, then take it this spring. During spring 2010, you could also take other classes you may need: English (if you don't have 2 semesters) or calculus (since BU is high on your list).

You put a lot more advance planning into the overall postbac and application process than I did. Keep working hard, and don't let the length of the process discourage you. Finishing the classes ASAP is nice, but it's much more important to do really well in them. You will have many years to be a practicing dentist even if your postbac takes an extra year or so. Good luck!

 

[Sisero68]

thank you - you guys have given me a lot of questions and advice that i dont think i would have came up with on my own for when i sit down with my advisor this upcoming monday.

 

[passerby1ce]

Hey Sisero!
I was just curious, I'm in the process of applying to Architecture school after taking a BFA, and wondered why the change of careers?

It was always my plan to do architecture after deciding to do a BFA, but I'm having some second thoughts. I've been contemplating about going into medicine instead. That was the original plan in high school (medicine that is, taking chem, physics and biology in high school), but I don't know what happened. I guess I took a drawing class 1st year and the teacher wanted me to stay and so I thought I'd give it a shot. I think the frontal lobe decision making skills weren't fully developed for me at that time, cause looking back I learned nothing with that degree.

Now I realize that money while it may not buy happiness, is good for what it's good for, and security may be something I'm more concerned about than I originally thought. I know Architecture is cyclic, and more about politics than medicine is (which is more based on your knowledge, which I find attractive), so second thoughts are arising. Since politicking/marketing/business is not one of my strong suits (even though creativity/design is) seems like to be financially lucrative in architecture you have to be more business minded. Which I think I can learn to be but it'll be a strain.

So just wondering why you decided to leave profession? money? underemployment?