Applying only DO?

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Prairiepalmeri

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I'm graduating this spring and am taking a gap year because I didn't become a biology major until my sophomore year. I've had all A's and A-'s until last semester when OChem pulled a quick one on me and I ended up with a dreaded C (I've still managed to avoid a B though, right?). Right now I'm taking Genetics, Ochem 2, Physics 2, biochem and my senior thesis. Without derailing, I hope I'll pull a mixture of A's and A-'s this semester and graduate with a cGPA of 3.85 and a sGPA of 3.80.

In other news, I've done a bit of volunteering, 2 years as an RA, some volunteering at our local hospital, and participated in a SURF program last summer. I was in a clinical research lab so I got to do a lot of shadowing with two MD's, residents, a fellow, a PA and a nurse. My closest relationship with a DO is a pathologist that a physician frequented during rounds. I think he brought a really interesting DO approach to his practice and I'd like to talk about that during my interviews. I also have about 1oo hours of research experience gathered during my senior thesis project. I'm graduating with a Bachelor of Science in Biology with Minors in Advanced Science and Chemistry.

I'm planning on taking the July MCAT and am currently looking for non science related jobs. What suggestions and recommendations do you guys have in order for me to have a successful upcoming cycle. Also, what are valuable experiences that I can have this year in order to show my commitment during interviews. Any application suggestions would be appreciated. (I'm kinda worried about this new MCAT....no psychology/sociology course ever taken)...

I think I want to go DO no matter what. Every day, I am more set on applying strictly DO. Could this possibly be detrimental to my chances of getting accepted somewhere? Also, a somewhat urban school is highly preferred, but I wouldn't say no to anyone who showed me love. Any school suggestions will be appreciated. My undergraduate school is in Iowa and I am an Illinois resident. Thanks!
 
1. Do as well as possible in school and on the MCAT
2. Apply to MD & DO schools, you shouldn't limit yourself right now, others will definitely explain further. Your GPA should be high enough to be competitive for MD admissions, if you perform the way you expect.
3. Visit or call the schools you are interested tomorrow and keep visiting/calling until you get an Admissions director or associate director on the phone or you get a meeting with them in person. If you do this, explain your situation and ask them all the questions you have (tactfully of course) and express your interest in the school. And dress nice and act professionally etc. etc. etc.
4. They will tell you to basically assess your application and find your weaknesses and strengthen those weaknesses during the cycle.
5. From what I see, I'm not really sure... possibly volunteering? Idk

If you feel confident in all areas, go find a job or travel or do something exciting (but be able to explain to med schools how it's relevant)... you will have to explain in most of your secondaries what you are up to now
 
Nothin wrong with applying only DO. That's what I did and it worked out very well for me.

Also, how on earth did you complete an honors thesis with only 100 hours in the lab?
 
Just take the MCAT and then everyone can talk hard numbers on what your chances are. Your grades are rock solid though. If you get a good MCAT score I see no reason to not apply at least to your state MD schools - they are usually cheaper.
 
Nothin wrong with applying only DO. That's what I did and it worked out very well for me.

Also, how on earth did you complete an honors thesis with only 100 hours in the lab?

It's not an honor thesis! A year long thesis is required to graduate from my school's biology program. University of Illinois is my state school but the require some behavioral science classes. Are they, along with DO schools with the same requirements, okay about giving acceptances before these classes are completed. I honestly don't want to sign up for them unless I have to take them. I registered for the MCAT this morning and am taking it in July. I'm thinking about applying to 10 or 15 DO programs and maybe 5 MD. Does that seem okay? I think I'm most interested in NOVA, DMU, KCUMB, any of the Touro's, and either AZCOM or CCOM. And I'd be thrilled to get into any of the Chicago area schools (Loyola, Rush, Rosalind Franklin, etc). I'd be especially thrilled to get into UCF!
 
It's not an honor thesis! A year long thesis is required to graduate from my school's biology program. University of Illinois is my state school but the require some behavioral science classes. Are they, along with DO schools with the same requirements, okay about giving acceptances before these classes are completed. I honestly don't want to sign up for them unless I have to take them. I registered for the MCAT this morning and am taking it in July. I'm thinking about applying to 10 or 15 DO programs and maybe 5 MD. Does that seem okay? I think I'm most interested in NOVA, DMU, KCUMB, any of the Touro's, and either AZCOM or CCOM. And I'd be thrilled to get into any of the Chicago area schools (Loyola, Rush, Rosalind Franklin, etc). I'd be especially thrilled to get into UCF!

UCF is a great school. Better rock the MCAT. Are you a FL resident?

If you want to go to a DO school in FL, I'd choose LECOM because it's cheaper.

Best of luck to you!
 
It's not an honor thesis! A year long thesis is required to graduate from my school's biology program. University of Illinois is my state school but the require some behavioral science classes. Are they, along with DO schools with the same requirements, okay about giving acceptances before these classes are completed. I honestly don't want to sign up for them unless I have to take them. I registered for the MCAT this morning and am taking it in July. I'm thinking about applying to 10 or 15 DO programs and maybe 5 MD. Does that seem okay? I think I'm most interested in NOVA, DMU, KCUMB, any of the Touro's, and either AZCOM or CCOM. And I'd be thrilled to get into any of the Chicago area schools (Loyola, Rush, Rosalind Franklin, etc). I'd be especially thrilled to get into UCF!
Oh. My bad. Misread your post. That number of schools is fine especially if you can score between 26-32. With a score in there and an early app you shouldn't have trouble getting an interview an At just about any do school you want. CCOM and AZCOM tend to prefer higher MCATs than other schools.

Good luck man
 
Nope. My schools gets a fair number of applicants would could easily get into our state school, but they want to come to my school (or other COMs).

DO schools do not have the ""s/he'll never come here" attitude.


I think I want to go DO no matter what. Every day, I am more set on applying strictly DO. Could this possibly be detrimental to my chances of getting accepted somewhere? Also, a somewhat urban school is highly preferred, but I wouldn't say no to anyone who showed me love. Any school suggestions will be appreciated.
 
I only applied DO. If I could do it again, I'd apply to both. Being a USMD does make your life much easier. Being a DO is fine, though, and I don't think being an MD would have greatly changed where I personally ended up for residency.
 
Nope. My schools gets a fair number of applicants would could easily get into our state school, but they want to come to my school (or other COMs).

DO schools do not have the ""s/he'll never come here" attitude.


I think I want to go DO no matter what. Every day, I am more set on applying strictly DO. Could this possibly be detrimental to my chances of getting accepted somewhere? Also, a somewhat urban school is highly preferred, but I wouldn't say no to anyone who showed me love. Any school suggestions will be appreciated.

I think my point is that I wouldn't want to diminish a chance of an acceptance by avoiding MD schools all together. I haven't had a shadowing opportunity with a DO at this point and I don't want to ultimately screw myself out of matriculation. I think my personality is better aligned for a DO school. But would I have a better chance at an acceptance with 5 MD apps and 15 DO apps, or 20 DO apps?
 
I think my point is that I wouldn't want to diminish a chance of an acceptance by avoiding MD schools all together. I haven't had a shadowing opportunity with a DO at this point and I don't want to ultimately screw myself out of matriculation. I think my personality is better aligned for a DO school. But would I have a better chance at an acceptance with 5 MD apps and 15 DO apps, or 20 DO apps?

If you're good enough for one DO school, you're probably good enough for multiple DO schools. I'd do 5 MD, 15 DO apps. Maybe even fewer DO apps if cost is a consideration.
 
I think I want to go DO no matter what. Every day, I am more set on applying strictly DO. Could this possibly be detrimental to my chances of getting accepted somewhere? Also, a somewhat urban school is highly preferred, but I wouldn't say no to anyone who showed me love. Any school suggestions will be appreciated. My undergraduate school is in Iowa and I am an Illinois resident. Thanks!

That should not be detrimental to your chances anywhere. With that GPA, you seem likely to get a strong MCAT score. If you score 30+, that MCAT/GPA should get you in to every single DO school in the country.

DO schools do not have the ""s/he'll never come here" attitude.

Eh that's definitely not always true. My first cycle, I didn't get in to the one D.O. school I applied to, or any other school. When I applied to that school again the next year, they said they were stunned I didn't get in anywhere. That school likes to brag about the percentage of students they offer acceptances who end up matriculating there, and they explicitly told me the only reason they didn't accept me was because they felt like I was likely to receive and take an MD acceptance, hurting their stats. Needless to say, I ended up making sure I hurt their stats by rejecting my acceptance on the last possible day.
 
Definitely not my school. So did they offer you an acceptance? You last sentence implies that they did. I suspect that there's more to the story than what they were letting on.




Eh that's definitely not always true. My first cycle, I didn't get in to the one D.O. school I applied to, or any other school. When I applied to that school again the next year, they said they were stunned I didn't get in anywhere. That school likes to brag about the percentage of students they offer acceptances who end up matriculating there, and they explicitly told me the only reason they didn't accept me was because they felt like I was likely to receive and take an MD acceptance, hurting their stats. Needless to say, I ended up making sure I hurt their stats by rejecting my acceptance on the last possible day.[/QUOTE]
 
I'm graduating this spring and am taking a gap year because I didn't become a biology major until my sophomore year. I've had all A's and A-'s until last semester when OChem pulled a quick one on me and I ended up with a dreaded C (I've still managed to avoid a B though, right?). Right now I'm taking Genetics, Ochem 2, Physics 2, biochem and my senior thesis. Without derailing, I hope I'll pull a mixture of A's and A-'s this semester and graduate with a cGPA of 3.85 and a sGPA of 3.80.

In other news, I've done a bit of volunteering, 2 years as an RA, some volunteering at our local hospital, and participated in a SURF program last summer. I was in a clinical research lab so I got to do a lot of shadowing with two MD's, residents, a fellow, a PA and a nurse. My closest relationship with a DO is a pathologist that a physician frequented during rounds. I think he brought a really interesting DO approach to his practice and I'd like to talk about that during my interviews. I also have about 1oo hours of research experience gathered during my senior thesis project. I'm graduating with a Bachelor of Science in Biology with Minors in Advanced Science and Chemistry.

I'm planning on taking the July MCAT and am currently looking for non science related jobs. What suggestions and recommendations do you guys have in order for me to have a successful upcoming cycle. Also, what are valuable experiences that I can have this year in order to show my commitment during interviews. Any application suggestions would be appreciated. (I'm kinda worried about this new MCAT....no psychology/sociology course ever taken)...

I think I want to go DO no matter what. Every day, I am more set on applying strictly DO. Could this possibly be detrimental to my chances of getting accepted somewhere? Also, a somewhat urban school is highly preferred, but I wouldn't say no to anyone who showed me love. Any school suggestions will be appreciated. My undergraduate school is in Iowa and I am an Illinois resident. Thanks!
I applied only DO and have no regrets. I had grades lower than yours though. If you want to be a DO, go for it! There are plenty of students in my class who had the option to go MD but chose to be DOs instead. If you do well in your MCAT and apply broadly I would bet that you'll get in somewhere, and most likely have multiple acceptances.
 
As someone who applied only DO, apply to both. Several reasons.
1) many MD schools are WAY less expensive.
2) taking more than one set of boards is annoying. (No you don't HAVE to take the USMLE, but I would rather not have to take the COMLEX, as I'm more interested in specialties that I'd pursue via MD residencies)
3) there is literally NO difference whatsoever in our medical educations, except that we spend many hours doing OMM. Some is useful, some us not. That which is not, is enough to make it almost not worth it (cranial... ahem).
 
But mostly, the money. Go wherever is least expensive. I'm just annoyed right now studying for boards and seeing truly ridiculous comlex style questions and paying an extra 600 bones for am extra test. Me sleepy.
 
Go MD if possible. Take it from someone with similar numbers to yours that had a 35 on the MCAT and only applied DO. Not having to learn OMM is a real time saver, and the holistic focus is kind of overblown. I like my education, but feel that the added opportunities I would have had at an MD school and the wider range of residencies I could have applied to would have been far more to my benefit than the tradeoffs. I'm much more geographically limited in my specialties of choice, and much less likely to match a good program, all because I chose to go the DO route. I have to work harder on the boards because I learned a little extra OMM. It's just not worth it dude. Apply to both, and if you get into an MD, go MD, but if you get into only a DO, go DO. I wouldn't wait an extra year to go MD vs DO, but I would never forego an MD for a DO unless you really want to do manual manipulation and have a strong idea of what it is from close, first-hand experience.
 
That should not be detrimental to your chances anywhere. With that GPA, you seem likely to get a strong MCAT score. If you score 30+, that MCAT/GPA should get you in to every single DO school in the country.



Eh that's definitely not always true. My first cycle, I didn't get in to the one D.O. school I applied to, or any other school. When I applied to that school again the next year, they said they were stunned I didn't get in anywhere. That school likes to brag about the percentage of students they offer acceptances who end up matriculating there, and they explicitly told me the only reason they didn't accept me was because they felt like I was likely to receive and take an MD acceptance, hurting their stats. Needless to say, I ended up making sure I hurt their stats by rejecting my acceptance on the last possible day.
I'm betting it's the one that didn't accept me for having high stats, even though I had put on my application I was applying only DO lol.
 
Go MD if possible. Take it from someone with similar numbers to yours that had a 35 on the MCAT and only applied DO. Not having to learn OMM is a real time saver, and the holistic focus is kind of overblown. I like my education, but feel that the added opportunities I would have had at an MD school and the wider range of residencies I could have applied to would have been far more to my benefit than the tradeoffs. I'm much more geographically limited in my specialties of choice, and much less likely to match a good program, all because I chose to go the DO route. I have to work harder on the boards because I learned a little extra OMM. It's just not worth it dude. Apply to both, and if you get into an MD, go MD, but if you get into only a DO, go DO. I wouldn't wait an extra year to go MD vs DO, but I would never forego an MD for a DO unless you really want to do manual manipulation and have a strong idea of what it is from close, first-hand experience.
This more appropriately states my thoughts so read it again. I guess the big thing is when you start school you realize the only difference is OMM. If that's a must for you, go for it. If not, then apply to both.
 
I applied to both despite knowing that I wanted to go to a DO school (for many reasons). I applied to 5 MD, including a state school, and 12 DO. I actually got accepted into 2 MD programs and still chose DO! Best of luck to you!
 
I'm about to be a DO student, but if I were given a chance at a SUNY, I'd be dropping my acceptance and taking the cheaper in-state tuition. There is a pretty good selection of MD schools in Illinois.

Having known many MD and DO students over the past 10 years, I feel the whole wanting to become a DO b/c of treating the whole patient, the ways DOs approach patients etc. is overblown. Granted, you did not state why you wanted to apply only to DO schools.

Go into it eyes wide open. Here is a list of things you should consider:
1) Tuition. With the exception of LECOM, DO schools are generally more expensive than your state MD schools (and some other private MD schools).
2) Scholarships. MD schools have deeper pockets in general to be able to offer more scholarships and the like.
3) Boards. Greater than 70% of DO students take both the USMLE. That means, studying for not one, but two boards. DO students on average do slightly worse on the USMLE.
4) Research. If you're interested in research, I've found DO schools to be lacking in comparison to their MD counterparts in what is offered.
5) A lifetime of "what is a DO?" I worked in a hospital for over a year and had to ask that question when I saw it on a doctor's white coat.
6) Uncertainty: no one knows how the upcoming residency merger is going to affect DO grads as now MDs can compete for what was once solely a DO affair.

The only big pros of a DO schools over an MD school that I can think of: DO schools give you a chance to learn OMM or a DO school being located in a location you really want to be. I don't know why you would limit yourself to DO at the outset. Apply to both MD and DO schools. Once you are accepted, then decide where you want to attend.
 
You should really reconsider if it's an option.
Do you know what LECOM's tuition is like? Unless you get a really heavy scholarship to go somewhere else, there are literally tens of thousands of reasons to choose to go there.
 
Do you know what LECOM's tuition is like? Unless you get a really heavy scholarship to go somewhere else, there are literally tens of thousands of reasons to choose to go there.

I personally think the extra money is worth the benefits of having a USMD. I guess everyone will have different thresholds.
 
You should really reconsider if it's an option.
Nope, I am quite happy with my decision. Thanks, though!

Edit: tuition was just one reason for my choice. There are many reasons that can lead someone to a certain school. Telling someone to go USMD because it's a "better" choice doesn't really take those reasons into account.
 
Nope, I am quite happy with my decision. Thanks, though!

Edit: tuition was just one reason for my choice. There are many reasons that can lead someone to a certain school. Telling someone to go USMD because it's a "better" choice doesn't really take those reasons into account.

Yep, I get it. I just try to warn people of the difficulties DOs face in the match process. I don't want anyone to be naive about the plight of being a DO.
 
Yep, I get it. I just try to warn people of the difficulties DOs face in the match process. I don't want anyone to be naive about the plight of being a DO.
Believe me, people on SDN make it pretty clear from day 1, yet I happen to know a lot of successful DOs and plenty who have not had issues matching. We will see what the changes/merger will bring!
 
Believe me, people on SDN make it pretty clear from day 1, yet I happen to know a lot of successful DOs and plenty who have not had issues matching. We will see what the changes/merger will bring!

The problem isn't match per say but the quality of match that cliquish is trying to warn people about. You are going to match no matter which DO school you go to. However, if you want something hyper competitive (program or specialty), where you go to school will give you an edge (even true among MD schools).
 
I'm curious what some of your reasons were for you to choose LECOM over a US MD school?

Nope, I am quite happy with my decision. Thanks, though!

Edit: tuition was just one reason for my choice. There are many reasons that can lead someone to a certain school. Telling someone to go USMD because it's a "better" choice doesn't really take those reasons into account.
 
Some of the reasons are rather personal and I'd rather not list them here. Feel free to PM me.
 
I don't plan on going into a hypercompetitive field. I'm a non traditional with background in medicine already and have a good idea of what I'd like to do. Thanks for the input, guys.
 
The problem isn't match per say but the quality of match that cliquish is trying to warn people about. You are going to match no matter which DO school you go to. However, if you want something hyper competitive (program or specialty), where you go to school will give you an edge (even true among MD schools).

Your post should be stickied.

If you want something hyper competitive, program or speciality, you will likely not make it as a DO

It sucks to hear but people like cliquesh and sylvanthus are people who did extremely well in school and despite pursuing DO friendly fields, still met a good amount of resistance during the match. It's not really a big deal in the grand scheme of things but there are clear ceilings for DOs.

I think the mentality to have as a DO student is to do as well as you can and love what you do. Don't focus on pedigree and prestige.
 
Your post should be stickied.

If you want something hyper competitive, program or speciality, you will likely not make it as a DO

It sucks to hear but people like cliquesh and sylvanthus are people who did extremely well in school and despite pursuing DO friendly fields, still met a good amount of resistance during the match. It's not really a big deal in the grand scheme of things but there are clear ceilings for DOs.

I think the mentality to have as a DO student is to do as well as you can and love what you do. Don't focus on pedigree and prestige.
Luckily for me, I don't care about pedigree or prestige. I'm one of the rare people going into medicine because I believe in helping people lead the healthiest life possible and preventative care. 😛
 
Luckily for me, I don't care about pedigree or prestige. I'm one of the rare people going into medicine because I believe in helping people lead the healthiest life possible and preventative care. 😛

A lot of us do (myself included, heck my personal statement was focused on preventative care) and these people deserve the best doctor possible. This means getting the best training possible. And most of the time the best training is at the most competitive places.

Let say you want internal medicine and what to match into an MD residency with the best training possible. You find out that these place have average step I scores of 240 and may even require research. To top it all off these places you find out have a vast majority of MD graduates. This means that in order to stand a chance, as a DO student, you have to be better than the average MD applicant that wants to apply to the IM residency. You won't be judged on the same playing field because everyone applying there will have 230-250 step I scores and honors in a ton of classes. So program directors (the one in charge of residencies) will use other weeder tools such as "where you went to school."

You have to be stellar to get into these programs. Field of IM itself is not competitive, but the programs vary greatly in competitiveness. You want the best training because the people deserve the best doctor. This is why going to the school which gives the most options will make it all the more easier to match into a good program, not just a competitive one.
 
Luckily for me, I don't care about pedigree or prestige. I'm one of the rare people going into medicine because I believe in helping people lead the healthiest life possible and preventative care. 😛
Seriously, I am calling BS here.

Yes, we are all altruistic and want to help people. Some of us are motivated by our own personal desires. Some of us even feel a legitimate spiritual calling into the field.

But that does not negate the fact that you should also be called to do your absolute best and attempt to get the best quality of training possible. There is nothing wrong with wanting to be as well trained as those guys and gals at the top tier institutions - pedigree and prestige aside. We are not discussing this in terms of just wanting that name for the sake of having the name on your residency. The reason these programs are considered good and at coveted, really is because they are that good. They have the patient population and the resources available to likely give you a slightly more well rounded training and/or a leg up if you are truly called to go into subspecialization.

Even if you say, oh well I just want to go into peds or something. Well then you dang well better be shooting for Denver, Cincinnati, Boston children's, or any of the other top programs. You are doing yourself a disservice by not at least trying.
 
I have my reasons for wanting to stay near my home (illness, etc) which happens to be in a rural setting. I am also non traditional like I already said. I am older than most going into this and have already had a successful career. I do not NEED or want to shoot for the very top of anything because I know exactly where I want to be and what I want to do. Please be respectful. I'm done responding now.
 
Let's be respectful and not call someone out on BS without knowing their situation . I suggest a friendly PM next time. As in my above statement, for this person, LOCATION was more important than anything (b/c of secondary factors). Like I said, LOCATION or a STRONG DESIRE to learn OMM are good reasons to go to a DO school.

Also, while I agree seeking out the best training is important, not everyone (especially non-trads) can just pick-up and move to Denver, Cincinnati or Boston. Also, having worked for many years at Children's Hospital Boston and later at Lucile Packard, what sets these institutions apart is research [NIH] dollars (which may not be relevant to a person's needs). You might be equally well-trained at some lesser known institutes and actually get more personalized attention and be happier.


Seriously, I am calling BS here.

Even if you say, oh well I just want to go into peds or something. Well then you dang well better be shooting for Denver, Cincinnati, Boston children's, or any of the other top programs. You are doing yourself a disservice by not at least trying.
 
Read the tone of the message I quoted. It suggested that deejay is in it for the "right" reasons, as if anyone going for a prestigious place is going for the wrong reasons.

I totally get location being a factor and I get specialty choice because of family factors and such. But the tone of that particular post frustrated me a lot.

Either way, I am out as well, honestly I don't have any skin in whatever this conversation was about.
 
Understood. It could have been better expressed. I hear you there. Looks like you're also going to be Class of 2019. Good luck with the upcoming semester!
Thanks for the support. I'll admit, i try not to reveal too much on here because SDN isn't the most supportive and kind place. I actually post way less than I've wanted to because of the awful and judgmental people in this forum! Thanks for being one of the kind ones!
 
I'm a proud DO...but "NRMP Charting Outcomes" speaks for itself. If you are a great DO applicant, you are fighting it out with average to below average MD applicants for the mass majority of specialties.

I personally would not have done it any different in hindsight...but I think that it's foolish to think that MDs don't have the upper hand in regards to the residency match...and the mass majority of sub specialty matches.
 
I agree with your statement, do you think this is true of brand new MD schools over long established DO schools. I feel that you, in a way, going to a brand new MD school might not be as great as going to certain DO schools. Curious about your opinion.

I'm a proud DO...but "NRMP Charting Outcomes" speaks for itself. If you are a great DO applicant, you are fighting it out with average to below average MD applicants for the mass majority of specialties.

I personally would not have done it any different in hindsight...but I think that it's foolish to think that MDs don't have the upper hand in regards to the residency match...and the mass majority of sub specialty matches.
 
I agree with your statement, do you think this is true of brand new MD schools over long established DO schools. I feel that you, in a way, going to a brand new MD school might not be as great as going to certain DO schools. Curious about your opinion.

I don't think that Allopathic residency programs know much about the DO programs. I think that most residency programs see it: AOA MD, non-AOA MD, DO, then FMG/IMG. Otherwise I doubt that your program matters.

I see it as opening doors. MDs have more doors open to then than DOs. Pretty sure that the stats confirm that. It doesn't mean that strong DO applicants can't go on to great residencies...but more often than not they have to go above and beyond.
 
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