are podiatrists considered physicians?

[billclinton]

this is not meant to belittle or anything like that. This is only a question of terminology. Do you consider podatrists to be physicians?

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[Sohalia]

No

 

[vtrain]

They are definitely doctors by way of their doctorate degree, but they are not physicians. That title can only be reserved for MBBS/DO/MDs.

 

[Sohalia]

I admit, I googled.

From Wikipedia:

Medicinæ Baccalaureus & Baccalaureus Chirurgiæ (MB BChir or MB ChB or MBBS or variations thereof) are the two degrees awarded after a course in medicine and surgery at a university in the United Kingdom and other places following the British tradition, such as Australian and New Zealand medical schools. In theory they are two separate degrees, but in practice the two are usually treated as one. The degrees are the British equivalent of the M.D.

 

[surgdia]

Remind me of Seinfeld...
that being said, they perform surgery, they prescribe medications, etc., etc. They are foot doctors.
sd

 

[yomama]

It actually is not up to opinion to be decided - rather, it is a fact that DPMs are physicians...they are legally physicians in all U.S. hospitals...ask around. I am an MD resident and this is a fact. Yes, they only specialize in the foot and ankle, but they have been through medical school...all of it, same schooling as MDs and DOs, but more focus on lower extremity during the 3rd and 4th years. So, one can think differently, but the truth is that they are physicians.

 

[EctopicFetus]

Hmm yomama.. so are dentists physicians too? and im not talking about OMFS guys.. orthodontists etc..? Curious..

 

[yomama]

Don't know, I will only speak about what I know. Podiatrists go to school and sit in the exact same classes, same standards,etc...as MDs and DOs...they are in a Podiatric Medical program and legally are considered physicians, doctors of podiatric medicine.

Hmm yomama.. so are dentists physicians too? and im not talking about OMFS guys.. orthodontists etc..? Curious..

 

[Laryngospasm]

It actually is not up to opinion to be decided - rather, it is a fact that DPMs are physicians...they are legally physicians in all U.S. hospitals...ask around. I am an MD resident and this is a fact. Yes, they only specialize in the foot and ankle, but they have been through medical school...all of it, same schooling as MDs and DOs, but more focus on lower extremity during the 3rd and 4th years. So, one can think differently, but the truth is that they are physicians.

So they have different third and fourth year, but they have the same schooling as MD's and DO's? I think you contradicted yourself with those statements.

 

[yomama]

missing the point...same schooling, meaning same amount of time and same general education. The pod students learn a little less about obgyn and a lot more about foot and ankle - they do the same thing 3rd and 4th year in that they rotate for those years as MDs and DOs...they do most of the same rotations as MDs/DOs, they just spend more of the time rotating in the foot and ankle specialty. Point is that they are physicians...thats all, no need to really argue or point out small silly differences, just the fact. Im not claiming they are qualified to do more than they are certified to do - just letting it be known that they are doctors of podiatric medicine and that makes them a physician. Im an MD, so this isn't just the view of a DPM, its the view of all out there...at least all who are educated and it is what it is.

So they have different third and fourth year, but they have the same schooling as MD's and DO's? I think you contradicted yourself with those statements.

 

[Poety]

missing the point...same schooling, meaning same amount of time and same general education. The pod students learn a little less about obgyn and a lot more about foot and ankle - they do the same thing 3rd and 4th year in that they rotate for those years as MDs and DOs...they do most of the same rotations as MDs/DOs, they just spend more of the time rotating in the foot and ankle specialty. Point is that they are physicians...thats all, no need to really argue or point out small silly differences, just the fact. Im not claiming they are qualified to do more than they are certified to do - just letting it be known that they are doctors of podiatric medicine and that makes them a physician. Im an MD, so this isn't just the view of a DPM, its the view of all out there...at least all who are educated and it is what it is.

How do the orthopods feel about the DPM's? Are they better than the MD's in this area?

Personally I got no education about the foot except for the usual symptoms that can present in the foot blah blah - are they essentially orthopods for the foot?

 

[Laryngospasm]

missing the point...same schooling, meaning same amount of time and same general education. The pod students learn a little less about obgyn and a lot more about foot and ankle - they do the same thing 3rd and 4th year in that they rotate for those years as MDs and DOs...they do most of the same rotations as MDs/DOs, they just spend more of the time rotating in the foot and ankle specialty. Point is that they are physicians...thats all, no need to really argue or point out small silly differences, just the fact. Im not claiming they are qualified to do more than they are certified to do - just letting it be known that they are doctors of podiatric medicine and that makes them a physician. Im an MD, so this isn't just the view of a DPM, its the view of all out there...at least all who are educated and it is what it is.

No, I didnt miss the point, websters defines a physician as a doctor of medicine-a person skilled in the art of healing; specifically : a doctor of medicine, not a doctor of podiatry. Dentists focus on the same subjects the first two years, they just focus more on the teeth the last two, are they physicians?

 

[Monty Python]

Hmm yomama.. so are dentists physicians too? and im not talking about OMFS guys.. orthodontists etc..? Curious..

My father was a general practice dentist. His DDS stood for Doctor of Dental Surgery. The only difference in the first two years of his education between his and a med student's was that his gross anatomy didn't go into detail below the waist. Everything else (biochem, physio, patho, pharm) was identical.

While the semantics were of absolutely no interest to him (indeed, he wasn't bothered by such silliness after serving in the Marines in WW2), he periodically commented that future dentists should go first to medical school, then do a dental residency, rather than have separate and distinct dental schools.

 

[yomama]

No, you are wrong, they are doctors of podiatric MEDICINE..a DPM is their degree...and most certainly they are a "person skilled in the art of healing."
I don't know enough about dental school to argue whether or not they are physicians.

No, I didnt miss the point, websters defines a physician as a doctor of medicine-a person skilled in the art of healing; specifically : a doctor of medicine, not a doctor of podiatry. Dentists focus on the same subjects the first two years, they just focus more on the teeth the last two, are they physicians?

 

[Laryngospasm]

No, you are wrong, they are doctors of podiatric MEDICINE..a DPM is their degree...and most certainly they are a "person skilled in the art of healing."
I don't know enough about dental school to argue whether or not they are physicians.

So is a doctor of chiropractic medicine a physician? By your argument they are.

 

[yomama]

I am not arguing, I am telling you the fact - legally, in the medical arena..hospitals,etc., DPMs are indeed physicians. My comment on them being doctors of podiatric medicine was in response to your comment that left out the "medicine" part of their degree.

So is a doctor of chiropractic medicine a physician? By your argument they are.

 

[Laryngospasm]

I am not arguing, I am telling you the fact - legally, in the medical arena..hospitals,etc., DPMs are indeed physicians. My comment on them being doctors of podiatric medicine was in response to your comment that left out the "medicine" part of their degree.

You didnt answer the question? I am not a believer in "if its a law, it must be true" either. I understand the hospital priveliging issue. I am not a concrete thinker however. Agree to disagree.

 

[yomama]

I, unlike you, only speak to what I know - I am not completely familiar with the education and training of dentists nor chiropractors...and thus, Im not going to speak out of my ass - you can do as you please. DPMs have proven that they are capable physicians...period, end of it.

You didnt answer the question? I am not a believer in "if its a law, it must be true" either. I understand the hospital priveliging issue. I am not a concrete thinker however. Agree to disagree.

 

[Laryngospasm]

I, unlike you, only speak to what I know - I am not completely familiar with the education and training of dentists nor chiropractors...and thus, Im not going to speak out of my ass - you can do as you please. DPMs have proven that they are capable physicians...period, end of it.

Wow. Youre being pretty hostile, I wasnt trying to ruffle anyones feathers. Im not speaking out of my ass as you say, merely stating my opinion. That is okay right? I didnt say that podiatrists werent capable, or didnt contribute, merely arguing the semantics of the word physician. Definitions of words are in the way that people use them is all that I am saying.

 

[billclinton]

Wow. Youre being pretty hostile, I wasnt trying to ruffle anyones feathers. Im not speaking out of my ass as you say, merely stating my opinion. That is okay right? I didnt say that podiatrists werent capable, or didnt contribute, merely arguing the semantics of the word physician. Definitions of words are in the way that people use them is all that I am saying.

what's yo's problem?!??

 

[pruritis_ani]

what's yo's problem?!??

I bet all the foot odors he has been exposed to have caused extreme irritability. In fact, I get irritable just thinking about foot fungus, bunions and clipping diabetic toenails.

 

[corpsmanUP]

Its actually state dependent. Podiatrists can call themselves physicians only in the states that have determined this is allowable. Second, even chiro's are able to call themselves physicians in some states. Its just a word, and it is not that big of a deal. The only thing though that bothers me is that if their school is so equal to MD/DO education, why do they then not sit for the same licensing exams? Why do they have such a statistically lower admission stats package than MD/DO? Its hard to find a professional field credible to practice medicine if they are not physicians of the entire body first and foremost. I used to work with a Pod that routinely asked me about simple things than ANY physician MD/DO would know....bottom line. Simple pharm questions, simple differential diagnoses....and it was just embarrasing. The Pods are good at feet, but we all know the feet are connected to the rest of the body!! And in surgery, not everything "dams up" at the mid shin. Medicine by its very nature is an art that treats the entire human, and Pods have found a way to circumvent having to take the long road to do a rather finite set of skills. No other specialists get this benefit, and thus this is the reason why Pods will never be seen as equivilant. They are the same as optometrists in most people's eyes. Pod should honestly become a branch of medicine...a subspecialty for DO's and MD's. The problem is that no one would want to do it. Do you think an MD orthopedic specialty in elbow medicine could exist that did not require the physicians to train in any joint other than the elbow? Hec now!! There are already foot and ankle surgeons who are board certified orthos in the general sense prior to pursuing this course. Same with hand surgeons....spinal surgeons....Everyone in surgery must start basic and narrow their focus after mastering the basics. Pods somehow got away without having to do this stuff. Shortcuts, low admission standards, lobbying to call themselves physicians...all has led to less credibility. Things won't soon change.

 

[AlternateSome1]

Wow. Youre being pretty hostile, I wasnt trying to ruffle anyones feathers. Im not speaking out of my ass as you say, merely stating my opinion. That is okay right? I didnt say that podiatrists werent capable, or didnt contribute, merely arguing the semantics of the word physician. Definitions of words are in the way that people use them is all that I am saying.

But they are capable and contribute, they must be physicians. So are plumbers. Didn't you get the memo? We are now to call them lavatory physicians.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

The topic of a chiropractor or dentist being a physician has been brought up over and over again. Just a few thoughts for the debate, would you find a dentist or chiropractor working in a hospital? Many hospitals are now keeping pods on staff.

Also pods rotate through many of the same areas as MD/DOs (off the Region’s residency (St. Paul, MN) website pods rotate in these areas outside of podiatry with the MD residence and the U of M students: radiology, internal med, general surgery, orthopedics, plastic surgery, emergency med, occupational med and anesthesia).

Dentist and chiropractors are not required to go through a residency to practice; pods are required to go through at least 2 years of residency training.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Definitions of words are in the way that people use them is all that I am saying.

You say you are going off a definition but you discount the legal definition of a physician. Is this not a contraction?

Also, if you are claiming "public opinion" definitions then let’s get some eponics in here dawg. Most of the public that we (all podiatrists) see call us doctor. They ask about there health concerns, and I bet if I ask if their opinion they would say a podiatrist was a physician. Most of the time, only medical students and old school doctors look down their nose at pods. Those are the same people who look down their nose as DOs also.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

I bet all the foot odors he has been exposed to have caused extreme irritability. In fact, I get irritable just thinking about foot fungus, bunions and clipping diabetic toenails.

I'm sure his problem is that you all look like ignorant asses. He's an orthopd that thinks his colleagues live in the 1800s and cast the chiropodist out of town for stealing business. Maybe he is the only one in this group that does not still practice bloodletting

 

[OSUdoc08]

this is not meant to belittle or anything like that. This is only a question of terminology. Do you consider podatrists to be physicians?

MD's & DO's are the only 2 types of physicians that have full medical/surgical privileges in EVERY state in the U.S.

You can call anyone else a physician, but they are actually only a "quasi-physician" because of my previous statement.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

MD's & DO's are the only 2 types of physicians that have full medical/surgical privileges in EVERY state in the U.S.

You can call anyone else a physician, but they are actually only a "quasi-physician" because of my previous statement.

I was basing the definition off of the federal definition. Pods are list as primary care physicians.

 

[manik]

I was basing the definition off of the federal definition. Pods are list as primary care physicians.

how can you be a "primary care physician" if you only care for the foot and ankle?? just curious, because it sounds like a contradiction to me.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

how can you be a "primary care physician" if you only care for the foot and ankle?? just curious, because it sounds like a contradiction to me.

Pods can admit patients and yes they see patients w/ foot and ankle problems but if you come in with a calcaneal fracture and the hospital has a pod; they will admit and treat the patient w/o the need of another physician. And depending on the state, pods have a lot more freedom than most people think. Pods have a DEA number w/o restrictions. A lot the restrictions placed on pods are from hospital administrators, but I don't want to ignore the fact there are limited scopes in some states.

If you look at the health care system in a whole, a podiatrist is no different than a orthopod. You would not go to an orthopod for an STD, same goes for a pod.

 

[OSUdoc08]

Pods can admit patients and yes they see patients w/ foot and ankle problems but if you come in with a calcaneal fracture and the hospital has a pod; they will admit and treat the patient w/o the need of another physician. And depending on the state, pods have a lot more freedom than most people think. Pods have a DEA number w/o restrictions. A lot the restrictions placed on pods are from hospital administrators, but I don't want to ignore the fact there are limited scopes in some states.

If you look at the health care system in a whole, a podiatrist is no different than a orthopod. You would not go to an orthopod for an STD, same goes for a pod.

An orthopod can treat medical conditions outside of orthopedics as needed. This is not true for podiatrists.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

What the heck are you talking about? If I have patient that comes in w/ blue-toe syndrome, which is usually a manifestation of atrial fib/embolic showering, I'm going to treat them. I will also refer them to a cardiologist just like an orthopod would. Do you think that a patient comes in w/ a systemic disease and pods ignore it? Seriously, think about it we are doctors not snake oil salesmen. Do you know how many systemic disease pods catch everyday that our physicians overlook? We are not trained circus monkeys there for you amusement. Wow, I guess I'm amazed by the lack of knowledge and ignorance in this thread. If we only treated foot and ankle then why is there no limit our DEA numbers?

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Most good family practitioners will consult pods they trust and visa versa. If I am seeing one of your patients out of professional courtesy I won't step on your toes. If for no other reason, you won't send me you patients anymore. If you send me someone that I think has a systemic disease, I will bring it to your attention. If it needs immediate treatment, I will do what I can as I admit them to the hospital and wait for you. This is why it is called a health care network. I don't expect you to know everything about Charcot arthropathy, but I will expect you to listen to me when I tell you that I think this person has blah blah blah. We work together to treat the patient. Pods go way outside to foot to make diagnosis and treat illnesses. We prefer to do it w/ whatever specialty that pathology falls under b/c we are not experts on everything. Guess what no one is.

 

[OSUdoc08]

What the heck are you talking about? If I have patient that comes in w/ blue-toe syndrome, which is usually a manifestation of atrial fib/embolic showering, I'm going to treat them. I will also refer them to a cardiologist just like an orthopod would. Do you think that a patient comes in w/ a systemic disease and pods ignore it? Seriously, think about it we are doctors not snake oil salesmen. Do you know how many systemic disease pods catch everyday that our physicians overlook? We are not trained circus monkeys there for you amusement. Wow, I guess I'm amazed by the lack of knowledge and ignorance in this thread. If we only treated foot and ankle then why is there no limit our DEA numbers?

Just because you can catch any medical or sugical condition, doesn't mean you are legally qualified to treat said condition nationwide.

Orthopods can treat the whole body. You are not licensed to do so. Sorry.

 

[pruritis_ani]

Nobody is saying pods are not well qualified to do what they do. You guys are great with the foot. But that is it.

Just compare the training. The orthopod has done 4 years of med school including rotations in all the specialties. He then does an internship where works on the entire body. Follow this with 5 more years of training in orthopedics involving the entire musulo-skeletal system.

I appreciate the knowledge you have of the foot and ankle. And I am confident that you can recoginze the presentations of systemic disease that involve the foot and ankle. But, I think that your global understanding of the pathophysiology of the human body will be far less than your medical colleagues, who have studied the entire thing, in depth, for a longer period of time.

Are you a doctor? Sure. And very well qualified to do what you do. But, IMHO, you are no more a physician than a dentist, chiropractor or optometrist. You are a very qualifed provider of care for a single part of the body. To me, a physician is competent (or at least trained) in the care of the entire thing.

 

[pruritis_ani]

and from webster:

Main Entry: phy·si·cian
Pronunciation: f&-'zi-sh&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English fisicien, from Old French, from fisique medicine
1 : a person skilled in the art of healing; specifically : a doctor of medicine

 

[latinfridley]

Here is some fuel for the flame war:

Comparison of entrance requirements for health care professions.

Doxey TT, Phillips RB.

Los Angeles College of Chiropractic, Whittier, California 90609-1166, USA.

OBJECTIVE: To compare U.S. chiropractic college admissions requirements with those of allopathy, osteopathy, optometry, podiatry and dentistry. DESIGN: Survey. PARTICIPANTS: The schools that participated in the comparison were selected based on their geographic location within the United States. The number of schools selected were 16 chiropractic college, 17 allopathic colleges, 16 osteopathic colleges, 16 optometric colleges, 7 podiatric colleges and 15 dental colleges. MAIN OUTCOME MEASURES: Information collected from the individual schools included: (a) minimum number of undergraduate semester hours (toward a bachelor's degree) that are required on entrance; (b) actual percentage of applicants with a 4-yr bachelor's degree on entrance; (c) minimum GPA required on entrance and (d) actual average GPA of applicants on entrance. RESULTS: Averages were computed for each outcome. Overall, allopathic averages were highest and chiropractic averages were lowest for each of the four outcome measures, with the other programs scoring at varying points in between. CONCLUSION: Successful completion of preprofessional requirements may be an indicator for success within a rigorous professional curriculum. These data reflect overall differences between health-care professions on a very few entrance criteria. Further investigation is needed to understand the long-term impact of these differences as well as the possible economic or political factors that may be influencing these results.


Here is some data from this paper:

Type and Number
of Schools (selected from same geographic region)
Medical (17)
Podiatry (7)
Chiropractic (16)

% with
Bachelor's Degree
Medical 99.35%
Podiatry 89.40%
Chiropractic 42.25%

Avg. Minimum
GPA Required
Medical 3.16
Podiatry 2.76
Chiropractic 2.38

Avg. GPA of Enrollees
Medical 3.56
Podiatry 3.06
Chiropractic 2.90


Sum: "Podiatrists......at least we're not chiropracters.... "

 

[ekydrd]

An orthopod can treat medical conditions outside of orthopedics as needed. This is not true for podiatrists.

I can't tell you all how many times I've had another service (i.e. ortho, surg., neuro, etc) ask how to manage a patient's medical issues. They may be theoretically able to treat, but are not that willing to go outside their specialty most times. In the same breath I will also say that while I can set and cast a broken limb, I will call ortho to check it out to ensure the bones are properly set, or diagnose cholelithiasis, then call the surgeon to do the operation, althought I've scrubbed in on many such procedures. We are a medical community that includes lots of specialists and subspecialists, who rely on the skills and training of our counterparts to complement our own skills and training.

 

[OSUdoc08]

I can't tell you all how many times I've had another service (i.e. ortho, surg., neuro, etc) ask how to manage a patient's medical issues. They may be theoretically able to treat, but are not that willing to go outside their specialty most times. In the same breath I will also say that while I can set and cast a broken limb, I will call ortho to check it out to ensure the bones are properly set, or diagnose cholelithiasis, then call the surgeon to do the operation, althought I've scrubbed in on many such procedures. We are a medical community that includes lots of specialists and subspecialists, who rely on the skills and training of our counterparts to complement our own skills and training.

It's not a matter of being willing to do something. It's a matter of legally being properly trained and qualified to do something. There is a clear delineation between DO/MD and DPM, since a DO/MD can legally treat any condition after a year of internship with subsequent licensure.

 

[carpe diem]

Pods can admit patients and yes they see patients w/ foot and ankle problems but if you come in with a calcaneal fracture and the hospital has a pod; they will admit and treat the patient w/o the need of another physician. And depending on the state, pods have a lot more freedom than most people think. Pods have a DEA number w/o restrictions. A lot the restrictions placed on pods are from hospital administrators, but I don't want to ignore the fact there are limited scopes in some states.

If you look at the health care system in a whole, a podiatrist is no different than a orthopod. You would not go to an orthopod for an STD, same goes for a pod.

"limited scopes in some states" should be "limited scopes in most, if not all, states". Pharmacists ( I am a pharmacist about to graduate from medical school) in most states are not legally bound to fill DPM prescriptions that do not relate to, for lack of the correct legal term, "foot, pain, or lower-extremity surgery-related" problems. This is much more strict than say a pharmacist being concerned that an orthopod (ok, just using orthopod as an example here--- no hate mail please) is writing someone's prescription for hypertension medications. Not that the right to write prescriptions defines a physician, but I think it does help make the distinction.

Carpster

 

[P Diddy]

In the same breath I will also say that while I can set and cast a broken limb, I will call ortho to check it out to ensure the bones are properly set, or diagnose cholelithiasis, then call the surgeon to do the operation, althought I've scrubbed in on many such procedures.

how do you get to set bones and perform cholecystectomies? are you doing FP?

p diddy

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

It's not a matter of being willing to do something. It's a matter of legally being properly trained and qualified to do something. There is a clear delineation between DO/MD and DPM, since a DO/MD can legally treat any condition after a year of internship with subsequent licensure.

Since it appears you are from Oklahoma I figured you would like to see the limit of a pod in your state:

Podiatric medicine is that profession of the health sciences concerned with the diagnosis and treatment of conditions affecting the human foot and ankle, including the local manifestations of systemic conditions, by all
appropriate systems and means.

I guess in your state they are physicians?

Also it has been brought up that dentist and chiropractors are under the same umbrella as us. Like I've stated before, some not all, pods sit next to DO/MD students and take the same test as those students. I am not disagreeing that MD/DOs have better training in the "whole body." As for the filling the scripts, pharmacists don't have to fill anything they don't want to, look at the whole debate w/ filling birth control.

My question is "Are old prejudice the basis for these laws and your opinions?"

 

[Poety]

Pods can admit patients and yes they see patients w/ foot and ankle problems but if you come in with a calcaneal fracture and the hospital has a pod; they will admit and treat the patient w/o the need of another physician. And depending on the state, pods have a lot more freedom than most people think. Pods have a DEA number w/o restrictions. A lot the restrictions placed on pods are from hospital administrators, but I don't want to ignore the fact there are limited scopes in some states.

If you look at the health care system in a whole, a podiatrist is no different than a orthopod. You would not go to an orthopod for an STD, same goes for a pod.

I always go to the orthopod for STD issues.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

[/B]

I always go to the orthopod for STD issues.

Me too, but for some reason it still burns when I pee. I would go to on of two doctors depending on what you call your unit. If you call your dong a bone, you go to an orthopod, but if you are blessed to be able to call it a third leg, you should go to a podiatrist.

 

[12R34Y]

i absolutely view DPM's as physicians. I had the privelage of working with a podiatry group in junior high/highschool for years. I followed them to the hospital watched them to major ankle reconstruction surgeries under general anesthesia, club foot repairs, bunion repairs, endoscopic plantar fascia releases, accessory navicular removals (with subsequent reattachment of the tendon) etc....

these guys were amazing. As mentioned they have a DEA number, admitting privelages (these guys admitted to 2 hospitals, wrote their own orders etc...), had thriving clinical practices.

Not to mention I had 2 foot operation on both feet due to some orthopedic foot trouble in junior high and they were phenomenal. I would have become a podiatrist if Emergency medicine wasn't so darn cool.


I'm pretty sure that optometrists, chiropractors don't have DEA numbers and admit to hospitals and perform surgery under general anesthesia. Sounds quite similar to what physicians do? no?

enjoy the flame festivities! I match this week and am incapable of caring about much else.

later!

 

[EctopicFetus]

I believe optometrists can perform surgery in Oklahoma. The thing is this whole question is nothing more than a question of how strong orthopods are to hold back Pods and how strong ophtho is to hold back optometry. Optometry IMO is a lot like Pods, they do 4 yrs of "medical" school and can CHOOSE to do residency. I believe Pods have to do 1 yr, but opto can choose to do it. Generally there is less surgery related to the eye than Pods/feet.

 

[pruritis_ani]

Since it appears you are from Oklahoma I figured you would like to see the limit of a pod in your state:

Podiatric medicine is that profession of the health sciences concerned with the diagnosis and treatment of conditions affecting the human foot and ankle, including the local manifestations of systemic conditions, by all
appropriate systems and means.

I guess in your state they are physicians?

Sounds to me like they are foot doctors in OK.

Also it has been brought up that dentist and chiropractors are under the same umbrella as us. Like I've stated before, some not all, pods sit next to DO/MD students and take the same test as those students. I am not disagreeing that MD/DOs have better training in the "whole body." As for the filling the scripts, pharmacists don't have to fill anything they don't want to, look at the whole debate w/ filling birth control.

Who cares if you sat next to an MD in one class and took the same biochem test? That is not the definition of physician anywhere that I have looked!

The point is that you are a foot specialist. Period. All of your training has been relvoved around the foot and how disease affects the foot. To me, that doesn't mean physician, that means foot doctor. If you think foot doctor=physician, that is your perogative. But, by that argument you would have to include chiros and optometrists in your definition.

My question is "Are old prejudice the basis for these laws and your opinions?"

Old prejudice? Not from me. I just have a different definition of physician than you do. I think pods are great at being pods.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

I believe optometrists can perform surgery in Oklahoma. The thing is this whole question is nothing more than a question of how strong orthopods are to hold back Pods and how strong ophtho is to hold back optometry. Optometry IMO is a lot like Pods, they do 4 yrs of "medical" school and can CHOOSE to do residency. I believe Pods have to do 1 yr, but opto can choose to do it. Generally there is less surgery related to the eye than Pods/feet.

Pods and optometrist are really different. Pod schools have to be connected to a DO/MD program. Pods have to do a residency. Most are 3 years but there are a few 2 year residencies left. I don't know the scope for an optometrist though. I’m sure the same debate rages btwn optometry and ophthalmology. I’m not qualified to comment on that, but if there is no residency than I don't think they are as similar as pods and orthopods.

 

[toughlife]

What the heck are you talking about? If I have patient that comes in w/ blue-toe syndrome, which is usually a manifestation of atrial fib/embolic showering, I'm going to treat them. I will also refer them to a cardiologist just like an orthopod would. Do you think that a patient comes in w/ a systemic disease and pods ignore it? Seriously, think about it we are doctors not snake oil salesmen. Do you know how many systemic disease pods catch everyday that our physicians overlook? We are not trained circus monkeys there for you amusement. Wow, I guess I'm amazed by the lack of knowledge and ignorance in this thread. If we only treated foot and ankle then why is there no limit our DEA numbers?

If I have any vascular compromise I want no one else but vascular surgery and IR on my case not a podiatrist.

 

[OSUdoc08]

If I have any vascular compromise I want no one else but vascular surgery and IR on my case not a podiatrist.

You should see the average stats for acceptance to DPM schools. They are worse than Caribbean MD schools.