Are top schools the best choice

[medtrial82]

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[Law2Doc]

Hi Experienced Folks,

My question is this. Assume one gets in a top school and a medium school. Is it better to go to a top school and be in bottom 25% of the class, or would it be better to go to reasonable medium school and be in top 50% of the class. Obviously the question is for a medium student, not someone in the top bracket.

Medtrial

This question has been posed a zillion times. There is an active thread on the allo board on this exact topic with fairly good responses.
But FWIW there is simply no basis for assuming you will be in a different rung of the class based on the school you attend. The level of competition at a school with folks who had A/A- averages is not sufficiently different than one where folks had an A-/B+ averages. Everyone who gets into med school is capable of getting the high grade or flubbing. Everybody shows up expecting to be at the top of their class. All the folks who made you look good in college have been truncated away, thanks to competitive admissions standards. And many of the people who go to the medium schools had rough freshman years but followed it with a number of stellar semesters. Also what got a lot of folks A's in college doesn't work in med school, and so med school worthy study habits and organization tend to be more important than the ultimate GPA you got in with. So I would assume you will gravitate toward close to the same percentile in whichever school you attend. Expect to work hard for every inch in med school whereever you attend.

 

[MeBeans]

Hi Experienced Folks,

My question is this. Assume one gets in a top school and a medium school. Is it better to go to a top school and be in bottom 25% of the class, or would it be better to go to reasonable medium school and be in top 50% of the class. Obviously the question is for a medium student, not someone in the top bracket.

Medtrial

Yes, pay attention to what a comprised list of arbitrary factors tells you to think of schools.
You don't know yourself better than such a list. You don't realize what level of difficulty you consider sufficient, or whether geographic location and amicable peers are important to you. Only a list published in a book or magazine can answer such questions.

 

[TPROrgoTutor]

I dont think it will make a huge difference as to which part of the class you were in. Assuming that the assumption (which I still maintain is false) is true, it would be better to be in top 50% of the state school's class.

 

[braluk]

The fact that acceptance rates into medical schools (10% or less usually) pretty much says that whever you'll go, theres no guarantee where you'll place because you're goin to be in a class full of people who will bust their ass. It's presumptious to think that you may be at the top of a state school, almost akin to "plan on getting a 40" on the MCAT. In the end, I would presume that the decision should bank on 1) how their students place for residency because of associated faculty and facilities 2) how you feel there, because ultimately, whever you go will have the same classes of the same difficulty filled with really hardworking students. If you enjoy, at least somewhat, where you attend medical school, your mood might affect your performance.

 

[Pshizzle]

It's reasonable to assume that you will not rank as well in a top tier school. And while yes, in all likelyhood you could wind up the same rank at either school, you will have to work much much harder at the top tier school. Higher mcats and undergrade gpa's equates maybe not to intelligence, but definetly to better test takers which I assume will make life much tougher at a top medical school.

 

[Guile]

This question has been posed a zillion times. There is an active thread on the allo board on this exact topic with fairly good responses.
But FWIW there is simply no basis for assuming you will be in a different rung of the class based on the school you attend. The level of competition at a school with folks who had A/A- averages is not sufficiently different than one where folks had an A-/B+ averages. Everyone who gets into med school is capable of getting the high grade or flubbing. Everybody shows up expecting to be at the top of their class. All the folks who made you look good in college have been truncated away, thanks to competitive admissions standards. And many of the people who go to the medium schools had rough freshman years but followed it with a number of stellar semesters. Also what got a lot of folks A's in college doesn't work in med school, and so med school worthy study habits and organization tend to be more important than the ultimate GPA you got in with. So I would assume you will gravitate toward close to the same percentile in whichever school you attend. Expect to work hard for every inch in med school whereever you attend.

It was a thread I started: here. It's good. Read through the responses and post there if you have any more questions.

 

[DASTERN]

This question has been posed a zillion times. There is an active thread on the allo board on this exact topic with fairly good responses.
But FWIW there is simply no basis for assuming you will be in a different rung of the class based on the school you attend. The level of competition at a school with folks who had A/A- averages is not sufficiently different than one where folks had an A-/B+ averages. Everyone who gets into med school is capable of getting the high grade or flubbing. Everybody shows up expecting to be at the top of their class. All the folks who made you look good in college have been truncated away, thanks to competitive admissions standards. And many of the people who go to the medium schools had rough freshman years but followed it with a number of stellar semesters. Also what got a lot of folks A's in college doesn't work in med school, and so med school worthy study habits and organization tend to be more important than the ultimate GPA you got in with. So I would assume you will gravitate toward close to the same percentile in whichever school you attend. Expect to work hard for every inch in med school whereever you attend.

sorry I just don't think I follow your logic

If someone goes to a top school they are competing with people who are, on average, smarter, have better work habits, are better at taking tests... than pps who go to a second tier school. So I definately think that the person asking the question has a legitamate concern. Do you really think its as easy to be in the top ten percent at one of the top ten schools as schools which are ranked in the forties???

 

[Dr.TobiasFünke]

Hi Experienced Folks,

My question is this. Assume one gets in a top school and a medium school. Is it better to go to a top school and be in bottom 25% of the class, or would it be better to go to reasonable medium school and be in top 50% of the class. Obviously the question is for a medium student, not someone in the top bracket.

Medtrial

Most top schools are pass/fail (at least first two years), so I'd go top (although, it is really f**cking hard to pass i recently found out). Also, dont sell yourself short... why not go for top school top 50%?

 

[snobored18]

Grades matter little...believe it or not there are true pass/fail curriculums out there (ie no rank, no AOA, just a P or an F and thats it)...that fact alone proves how little grades matter during didactics, whats gonna help you out is 1. your board scores and 2. how you do in your third year clinicals...when I looked at schools I focused on places with smaller student bodies (more exposure to attendings/consultants while on service, equates to a better evaluation if you are good because they actually know who you are...difficult when there are 240 other M3s rotating through their service in a given year) and who had their own hospital system with strong residency programs (ie its not what you know, but who...knowing the residency director is a gigantic advantage) in most specialties. Research is also going to come into play if you are looking at a tough residency at a top academic research institution, you don't have to slave away in a biochem lab, but if you want to do ortho you best have your name on a couple of case/chart review papers is specialized journals and if possible some cadaver/anatomical work that results in publication. By and large this leads you to the higher ranked schools, but there are certainly terrific schools not on those stupid US News lists that will provide the above opportunities (the University of Nebraska Medical Center comes quickly to my mind --> own hospitals, small class and lots of research opportunities to fit any specialty interest...especially transplant med).

 

[Law2Doc]

sorry I just don't think I follow your logic

If someone goes to a top school they are competing with people who are, on average, smarter, have better work habits, are better at taking tests... than pps who go to a second tier school. So I definately think that the person asking the question has a legitamate concern. Do you really think its as easy to be in the top ten percent at one of the top ten schools as schools which are ranked in the forties???

The difference in competition is simply not as great as you or the OP make it out to be. Again, the average GPA at the middle ranked school still required most of those folks to have gotten mostly A's throughout their college careers. We are talking about the difference between folks who had an A average versus an A-. The world is different in med school and there is no longer anyone historically average. So anyone in med school is capable of getting the top grades. And again, what worked in college isn't always what works in med school, so you really have no sense of whether your competition is competitive at a med school level, or just a paper tiger, or further, whether you are going to be competitive at either school.
I never said it was easier to be ranked in the top ten percent at a top ten school. I said the OP would end up ranked about the same in either place. It is extremely difficult for someone to get into the top ten percent of ANY med school class. Statistically, odds are the OP won't be there at even the lowest ranked allo school he can find. Particularly so if you show up underestimating your competition. EVERYBODY shows up expecting to do well, and has a track record evidencing his/her ability to do so. If you aren't capable to trhive in this environment, adcoms won't let you in (they do a surprisingly good job at this).
Med school is an interesting place because a lot of historically "A students" get to experience being below average for the first time in their lives. Half the class will experience this. And it won't always (or even usually) be the half that you would predict.
I guess this is one of those things a lot of you guys aren't going to believe until you get here. All I can suggest is plan to work harder than you ever have in your life no matter where you go. And prepare yourself -- a lot of smart folks will end up below average even with your maximum effort. 😎

 

[Law2Doc]

Grades matter little...believe it or not there are true pass/fail curriculums out there (ie no rank, no AOA, just a P or an F and thats it)...that fact alone proves how little grades matter during didactics, whats gonna help you out is 1. your board scores and 2. how you do in your third year clinicals...

I absolutely agree with this 100%. Everything counts, but on the continuum of what is important, basic science years grades in med school are WAY far down the list (although second year grades may be predictive of how prepared you are for Step 1). Not like college at all.

However grades will loom large during the first two years, as that is the only basis of evaluation/comparison you have. So med students, fairly anal by nature, will focus on them, and know how well they are doing to the last decimal point.

 

[silas2642]

sorry I just don't think I follow your logic

If someone goes to a top school they are competing with people who are, on average, smarter, have better work habits, are better at taking tests... than pps who go to a second tier school. So I definately think that the person asking the question has a legitamate concern. Do you really think its as easy to be in the top ten percent at one of the top ten schools as schools which are ranked in the forties???

The point you're missing is that once you're in med school, how well you did during undergrad and what percentile you scored on the mcat becomes completely irrelevant. The people who are the "top students" during the pre-clinical years (in my limited experience) tend to be those who work the hardest. Intelligence helps, but it definitely isn't everything in this game.

 

[psipsina]

You're kidding yourself if you think that the kids who chose to attend state medschools only went there because they couldn't go to the private ones. Alot of the best/brightest premeds go to state schools choosing them over more highly ranked private schools. Also at my school alot of the students didn't even apply out of state, so who know where they were capable of gaining an acceptance if they had tried Then once you get there, these best/brightest premeds don't necessarily outpreform the kids who didn't get in anywhere else or didn't apply anywhere else. If you look at the forum for usmle, some people posted both their step one score and their mcat and some kids with mcat scores that premeds would scoff at are getting killer usmles. The way that you studied for undergrad/mcat often doesn't work for the volume/pace of medschool, so alot of medschool success is dependent on how quickly one adapts, not to how well you took the mcat. Also the time that is necessary just to pass medschool for the great majority of students is quite overwhelming, and many people find that they just aren't willing to put in the time that is required to exceed a passing grade. . . or that their full bore studying is only getting them a pass. Anyway, point being, don't pick a state school simply because you think you'll be in the top of your class there, because chances are you're not going to be in the top of your class ANYWHERE . . . and you need to be happy at the medschool you choose even if you are just in the middle of the pack or below. I know it seems unfathomable on a personal level that you, a superstar premed, will not in fact be a superstar medstudent, but in all probability that will be the case, and its one of the toughest things to come to terms with in the first year. If you end up being the rocketscientist of your class, congrats, but don't go in expecting it and having that be what your choice depended on, because you're going to be miserable if you end up like the majority of your class of once superstar premeds, sweating blood just to pass.

 

[Towelie]

For getting a residency, it's always better to be in a top school. Many competitive residencies will sort applicants by school, and won't even consider applicants from lower tiered schools unless they honor everything, are in AOA, or get published. We had a few residency directors come to my undergrad and they told us that going to a mid-level school won't hurt you too much (e.g. #20 vs. #1) but it will still be an uphill battle, but going to a low-tier school can kill your chances for a lot of residencies.

 

[jackieMD2007]

Case in point why I could never be a mod: I read posts like this and have the following reactions (in no particular order)....

1. stfu noob!
2. use the search function!
3. stop trying to start a flame war!
4. where is my coffee?
5. refresh inbox.

Repeat 1-5 as necessary while perusing SDN.

 

[Missterious1]

hmm... there are 125 allo schools, but #20 is mid-level?? please excuse my poor math skills...

 

[Guile]

For getting a residency, it's always better to be in a top school. Many competitive residencies will sort applicants by school, and won't even consider applicants from lower tiered schools unless they honor everything, are in AOA, or get published. We had a few residency directors come to my undergrad and they told us that going to a mid-level school won't hurt you too much (e.g. #20 vs. #1) but it will still be an uphill battle, but going to a low-tier school can kill your chances for a lot of residencies.

Hmmm....are you a PD? It's funny you mention this because all of the people I've ever talked to who sort through residency applications just look at board score. A 230 from a state school and a 230 from a top school...they basically know the same amount. This is why the boards were created.

 

[Towelie]

Hmmm....are you a PD? It's funny you mention this because all of the people I've ever talked to who sort through residency applications just look at board score. A 230 from a state school and a 230 from a top school...they basically know the same amount. This is why the boards were created.

By that logic what school you go to plays absolutely no role in residency acceptance, and Harvard = Hollywood Upstairs Medical College as long as your boards are the same. The two directors that spoke at my college said that, for example, a 230 board score from a top school will probably get you further than a 245 from a bottom-tiered school.

 

[Guile]

By that logic what school you go to plays absolutely no role in residency acceptance, and Harvard = Hollywood Upstairs Medical College as long as your boards are the same. The two directors that spoke at my college said that, for example, a 230 board score from a top school will probably get you further than a 245 from a bottom-tiered school.

If you want to pay $250K for a name, be my guest.

How do you explain graduates of Guadalajara matching at Duke? Or people from the Caribbean matching at Johns Hopskins?

 

[Towelie]

If you want to pay $250K for a name, be my guest.

How do you explain graduates of Guadalajara matching at Duke? Or people from the Caribbean matching at Johns Hopskins?

I would rather pay $250K for a good name than pay $250K for an average name. Wouldn't you?

It's easy to explain these match results. They have ridiculous board scores.

 

[myleghurts]

If you want to pay $250K for a name, be my guest.

How do you explain graduates of Guadalajara matching at Duke? Or people from the Caribbean matching at Johns Hopskins?

I have never heard of Johns Hopskins... (Sorry, couldn't resist... 😳 )

 

[desidr]

I generally agree with Towelie. We can extrapolate this to something we're more familiar with: med school admissions. If they only looked at MCAT scores, then a 36 mcat from anywhere should have an equal shot at a hopkins interview. this isnt the case. undergrad instituation plays a big role in admission to the top tiers. this is most likely the case with top residency positions as well. MGH is going to be more amenable to taking a stanford 215 vs. a mid - lower tier 230. thats just how it works.

 

[modelslashactor]

why are people getting so upset over this? if you don't want to go to the name school, DON'T GO! it's as easy as that, you shouldn't feel guilty for turning down a name school and you definitely don't need to explain it to a bunch of people you don't know on the internet. if the money is important to you, just work hard and you will still go far.

i agree that it would be silly to pay the same price to go to a crummy program over a top 10 school. but if you're looking at no financial help and 250k in loans, it's probably better to go the cheap route.

 

[Law2Doc]

MGH is going to be more amenable to taking a stanford 215 vs. a mid - lower tier 230.

That's not likely an accurate statement, and you are unlikely to be able to demonstrate proof of this -- certainly there are an awful lot of non-top tier school folks matching at MGH.

However there is some benefit of top tier schools (although not nearly as much as folks on SDN would like to believe). MGH may be more amenable to a recommendation from a big name doc at stanford over a lesser known doc, and may be more amenable to intense research experience you might be able to get at a stanford not get at a non-top tier school. But no, if you score significantly better on Step 1 you are better off regardless of your US allo school rank.

 

[desidr]

That's not likely an accurate statement, and you are unlikely to be able to demonstrate proof of this -- certainly there are an awful lot of non-top tier school folks matching at MGH.

However there is some benefit of top tier schools (although not nearly as much as folks on SDN would like to believe). MGH may be more amenable to a recommendation from a big name doc at stanford over a lesser known doc, and may be more amenable to intense research experience you might be able to get at a stanford not get at a non-top tier school. But no, if you score significantly better on Step 1 you are better off regardless of your US allo school rank.

do you think this is also the case with med school admissions? i.e. higher mcat from lower tier school beats avg mcat from big name all other things equal.

 

[Mr. Tee]

Hmmm...for academic medicine I say it matters.

However, I would LOVE to get into a state school. For example, the state school called UCSF.

 

[Towelie]

if you score significantly better on Step 1 you are better off regardless of your US allo school rank.

This is true, but only with a very dramatic score difference.

 

[Law2Doc]

do you think this is also the case with med school admissions? i.e. higher mcat from lower tier school beats avg mcat from big name all other things equal.

The scores are not really used the same way-- GPA matters more in premed than during basic science years in med school-- but yes, I'd personally rather have the 40 MCAT from Joe Schmo U than the Harvard 30. Bear in mind though in terms of admissions, the brand name is also lessened in that you have other competing factors, eg. for some states, in state beats out of state, etc.

 

[Law2Doc]

This is true, but only with a very dramatic score difference.

The 15 points the prior poster described are close enough to dramatic for me.

 

[Towelie]

The scores are not really used the same way-- GPA matters more in premed than during basic science years in med school-- but yes, I'd personally rather have the 40 MCAT from Joe Schmo U than the Harvard 30. Bear in mind though in terms of admissions, the brand name is also lessened in that you have other competing factors, eg. for some states, in state beats out of state, etc.

Yeah, but a 33 from Harvard would be better than a 36 from Joe Schmo U--I think that's more along the lines of what we're talking about.

 

[Law2Doc]

Yeah, but a 33 from Harvard would be better than a 36 from Joe Schmo U--I think that's more along the lines of what we're talking about.

Both people are likely to have a shot at very good schools, if we are assuming all other aspects of their application are equally competitive. I wouldn't stress if I was either of these folks.

 

[Towelie]

The 15 points the prior poster described are close enough to dramatic for me.

The point is, if you want to get into a top medical school and you go to Joe Schmo U, you NEED to get around a 40 on the MCAT and have a near 4.0 GPA even to be considered. If you go to Harvard, the GPA and MCAT that you would need to be considered are substantially lower.

The same trend is true for residencies. If you want a top residency and you go to a lower-tier medical school, you NEED to honor everything, be AOA, and have a ridiculous board score. If you're at a top tier school, the requirements are greatly relaxed.

 

[desidr]

The point is, if you want to get into a top medical school and you go to Joe Schmo U, you NEED to get around a 40 on the MCAT and have a near 4.0 GPA even to be considered. If you go to Harvard, the GPA and MCAT that you would need to be considered are substantially lower.

The same trend is true for residencies. If you want a top residency and you go to a lower-tier medical school, you NEED to honor everything, be AOA, and have a ridiculous board score. If you're at a top tier school, the requirements are greatly relaxed.

Thank you 👍

 

[Reimat]

However there is some benefit of top tier schools (although not nearly as much as folks on SDN would like to believe).

So true - this whole argument boils down to a chicken/egg dilemma. Do people at the top med schools get better residencies because they went to those schools, or did they end up at those schools because they have the ability to land good residencies? Maybe school name helps - to the degree that they are interacting with and getting LORs from top docs in the field. But obviously average scores MCAT scores at a 'top 10' school are higher than at lower ranked schools - so the 'average' graduate of one of these schools probably will have higher average board scores. And they got into that school in the first place because they had better average MCATs and grades. So, if you get into Harvard and your state school, obviously you will do well at either and it doesn't really matter where you go. If you think that going to a top school will give you a better education, you are kidding yourself. If you know you will always kick yourself for turning down a top school then be honest with yourself and go!

Also, those estimate of being 'top 50%' at #20 school and 'bottom 25%' at #1 school are way off - you're probably looking at 10-15% difference MAX since like a previous poster said your rank is mostly due to the volume of studying you do.

 

[Law2Doc]

The same trend is true for residencies. If you want a top residency and you go to a lower-tier medical school, you NEED to honor everything, be AOA, and have a ridiculous board score. If you're at a top tier school, the requirements are greatly relaxed.

You will be posting very differently when you get to med school. Many people who get top residencies were not AOA, did not honor everything etc. They do very well on the boards, and in rotations, and maybe some solid research. Word of mouth plays a huge role -- never underestimate the value of contacts. Things like med school prestige and grades are very secondary, although certainly are not totally of no value. The extent that requirements are relaxed at top schools is pretty insignificant -- if you want a top spot you need to be a top student no matter what school.

 

[Towelie]

You will be posting very differently when you get to med school. Many people who get top residencies were not AOA, did not honor everything etc. They do very well on the boards, and in rotations, and maybe some solid research. Word of mouth plays a huge role -- never underestimate the value of contacts. Things like med school prestige and grades are very secondary, although certainly are not totally of no value. The extent that requirements are relaxed at top schools is pretty insignificant -- if you want a top spot you need to be a top student no matter what school.

I totally agree--it seems like having good letters of rec plays a huge role in getting a top residency. However, this is yet another major benefit to going to a top school, where there are likely to be leaders in most fields, who can write letters that will carry a lot of weight.

 

[Law2Doc]

But obviously average scores at a 'top 10' school are higher than at lower ranked schools - so the 'average' graduate of one of these schools probably will have higher average board scores.

While I agree with most of your post, bear in mind that there isn't a perfect correlation with the top schools posting the top board scores.

 

[Law2Doc]

I totally agree--it seems like having good letters of rec plays a huge role in getting a top residency. However, this is yet another major benefit to going to a top school, where there are likely to be leaders in most fields, who can write letters that will carry a lot of weight.

Perhaps. Although it is conceivable that the big name types at the lower ranked schools are more accessible to med students. Hard to say.

 

[Towelie]

Perhaps. Although it is conceivable that the big name types at the lower ranked schools are more accessible to med students. Hard to say.

I would think that they would be less accessible, because there are fewer of them (so more people will be vying for their attention). Definitely hard to say though.

 

[Dr.Watson]

.

 

[dr_90210]

This question has been posed a zillion times. There is an active thread on the allo board on this exact topic with fairly good responses.
But FWIW there is simply no basis for assuming you will be in a different rung of the class based on the school you attend. The level of competition at a school with folks who had A/A- averages is not sufficiently different than one where folks had an A-/B+ averages. Everyone who gets into med school is capable of getting the high grade or flubbing. Everybody shows up expecting to be at the top of their class. All the folks who made you look good in college have been truncated away, thanks to competitive admissions standards. And many of the people who go to the medium schools had rough freshman years but followed it with a number of stellar semesters. Also what got a lot of folks A's in college doesn't work in med school, and so med school worthy study habits and organization tend to be more important than the ultimate GPA you got in with. So I would assume you will gravitate toward close to the same percentile in whichever school you attend. Expect to work hard for every inch in med school whereever you attend.

I was just wondering why people with crappy stats are so cynical towards top schools... to say that there is no difference in intelligence between the population at a state med school and washu or hopkins, where some kids score higher in just 2 sections of their mcat than total scores from state schools.
yeah, the kid who got a 30 (now attending medical school of *insert state here*) WILL MAKE A KID WHO GOT A 40 (a lot of ppl at the top 10 schools) look GREAT! if you argue that there is no difference in intelligence between these two kids you are either 1)ignorant or 2) ******ed.

 

[modelslashactor]

Yup. I believe UTMB at Galveston's average was about 5-10 points above Johns Hopkins's average last year.

perhaps the argument we should be making, instead of whether a good board score from anywhere will get you a top residency, is whether a mediocre board score at a top school will get you a top residency. the fact that utmb has higher scores than jhu would seem to suggest this is true.

 

[Law2Doc]

I was just wondering why people with crappy stats are so cynical towards top schools... to say that there is no difference in intelligence between the population at a state med school and washu or hopkins, where some kids score higher in just 2 sections of their mcat than total scores from state schools.
yeah, the kid who got a 30 (now attending medical school of *insert state here*) WILL MAKE A KID WHO GOT A 40 (a lot of ppl at the top 10 schools) look GREAT! if you argue that there is no difference in intelligence between these two kids you are either 1)ignorant or 2) ******ed.

I'm unclear as to whom you think has crappy stats. 🙄
However I'm pretty comfortable in my prediction that you will be singing a different tune on this point when you get to med school and beyond. Some of the things that loom hugely important while applying to med school are simply not going to matter as much when you get to med school. The MCAT doesn't matter as of your med school orientation, and you have to prove yourself again. And as I said, when you are comparing the folks who got straight A's in college versus the ones who got mostly A's in college, you aren't going to see a huge difference in the level of competition. I'm not sure from your post that you really ought to be calling others names - wait until you get further along and see what's what.

 

[Law2Doc]

is whether a mediocre board score at a top school will get you a top residency.

It won't. You need to have top notch stats to get a top notch match. Mediocre doesn't get you very far no matter where you are coming from. You will always have to prove yourself in medicine.

 

[Towelie]

Question out of dumb curiousity:

Law2Doc, where do you go to med school?

Also, what does that "Advisor" sign mean?

 

[Guile]

I love it how these pre-meds think they know everything about med school and prestige. Ask attendings what they think. It's no accident that the farther out people are from med school, the less and less med school name matters. The older people are, the more they will tell you to go to the cheapest place you got into because your debt is going to matter more than the name on your diploma. (Now of course in response to the earlier question, with equal cost of attendance, why would you not go to the more prestigious school unless you hated it?)

Case in point: Duke's surgical resident list. Let's give it look-see, shall we?

Orthopedics: U of Cincinnati (people are told to apply there if your stats are low), Rush (ditto), U of Vermont (ditto), New York Medical College, (WHERE ARE ALL THE PRESTIGIOUS MEDICAL SCHOOLS?!?!), and Albany Medical College. There were 3 from top 10 schools. 3 out of 8. Maybe there were only 3 people from top schools who wanted to go to Duke ortho--you know one of the top programs in the country. Or maybe your school's name doesn't hold you back....

(Examples from the match list abound and are too numerous to list here. Of the 3 neurosurgery residents at Duke, one was from Medical College of Georgia, one from SUNY-Syracuse, and the other from Duke. 67% from state schools not in the top 50. But, nope, gotta go to the top med school to match well!)

 

[R.P. McMurphy]

I love it how these pre-meds think they know everything about med school and prestige. Ask attendings what they think. It's no accident that the farther out people are from med school, the less and less med school name matters. The older people are, the more they will tell you to go to the cheapest place you got into because your debt is going to matter more than the name on your diploma. (Now of course in response to the earlier question, with equal cost of attendance, why would you not go to the more prestigious school unless you hated it?)

Case in point: Duke's surgical resident list. Let's give it look-see, shall we?

Orthopedics: U of Cincinnati (people are told to apply there if your stats are low), Rush (ditto), U of Vermont (ditto), New York Medical College, (WHERE ARE ALL THE PRESTIGIOUS MEDICAL SCHOOLS?!?!), and Albany Medical College. There were 3 from top 10 schools. 3 out of 8. Maybe there were only 3 people from top schools who wanted to go to Duke ortho--you know one of the top programs in the country. Or maybe your school's name doesn't hold you back....

(Examples from the match list abound and are too numerous to list here. Of the 3 neurosurgery residents at Duke, one was from Medical College of Georgia, one from SUNY-Syracuse, and the other from Duke. 67% from state schools not in the top 50. But, nope, gotta go to the top med school to match well!)

OH MY OH MY Someone got into Duke Surgery from Albany and NYMC...but aren't those trashy schools!!! 🙄 What has the world come to!!!!😛

Good post

 

[Towelie]

I love it how these pre-meds think they know everything about med school and prestige. Ask attendings what they think. It's no accident that the farther out people are from med school, the less and less med school name matters. The older people are, the more they will tell you to go to the cheapest place you got into because your debt is going to matter more than the name on your diploma. (Now of course in response to the earlier question, with equal cost of attendance, why would you not go to the more prestigious school unless you hated it?)

Case in point: Duke's surgical resident list. Let's give it look-see, shall we?

Orthopedics: U of Cincinnati (people are told to apply there if your stats are low), Rush (ditto), U of Vermont (ditto), New York Medical College, (WHERE ARE ALL THE PRESTIGIOUS MEDICAL SCHOOLS?!?!), and Albany Medical College. There were 3 from top 10 schools. 3 out of 8. Maybe there were only 3 people from top schools who wanted to go to Duke ortho--you know one of the top programs in the country. Or maybe your school's name doesn't hold you back....

(Examples from the match list abound and are too numerous to list here. Of the 3 neurosurgery residents at Duke, one was from Medical College of Georgia, one from SUNY-Syracuse, and the other from Duke. 67% from state schools not in the top 50. But, nope, gotta go to the top med school to match well!)

Not that an anecdotal analysis of one match list means anything, but...

Ok, so 3 out of 8 residents were from top 10 schools. That's about 35-40% Now, top 10 schools make up less than 10% of all medical schools, yet they are accounting for over 3 TIMES THAT in this residency. So, even based on your analysis, top 10 students have a HUGE advantage over students of other schools.

On an unrelated note, since Jack Bauer is your avatar--have you seen the trailer for season 6? It looks awesome. Check it out:

http://www.fox.com/24/

 

[IckeyShuffle]

Not that an anecdotal analysis of one match list means anything, but...

Ok, so 3 out of 8 residents were from top 10 schools. That's about 35-40% Now, top 10 schools make up less than 10% of all medical schools, yet they are accounting for over 3 TIMES THAT in this residency. So, even based on your analysis, top 10 students have a HUGE advantage over students of other schools.

On an unrelated note, since Jack Bauer is your avatar--have you seen the trailer for season 6? It looks awesome. Check it out:

http://www.fox.com/24/

i say go to the medical school where you feel the most comfortable and have the best chance of standing out. If you feel this way at Harvard, go there. If you feel this way at nymc, go there. Almost all doctors I talk to say it doesnt matter where you go to medical school, unless you want to get into academia.