Asking for a raise?

[TheBlaah]

I've been thinking about asking for a raise. I work in a hospital with a staff of 50+ full-time pharmacists and I've been consistently a top-performer both in both clinical terms and productivity (measured using objective methods).

Before everyone decides to just shut me down, I've already received 2 raises, separate from the annual evaluation/raises (which I've been told I'm at the upper range of as well), so it is feasible. While both raises resulted from me requesting a meeting with management, I did not implicitly state that I wanted a raise. Instead, I talked about my work productivity, the changing work environment, and sudden unexpected increases in my workload.

This year though, there's been a transition to a new EMR, and I believe I've been instrumental in its implementation despite it not being my responsibility. However, since I've already received 2 independent raises already in the past few years, and evaluations are coming soon (raises from annual evaluations are capped based on several factors is why I'm considered asking for an independent raise), I don't want to come off as too greedy.

Anyway, wanted to some thoughts and experiences from others to make a more informed decision.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[King2440]

No; your eval is coming up. WTF would you ask for a raise if you will get one with your eval?

 

[deleted480308]

You already got two recent raises and you likely have a third coming...but you want a fourth?

 

[rxkrafted]

Yeah you are coming off as greedy af.

 

[PharmtoCS]

In this market when pay and hours are getting slashed left and right with underemployed/unemployed pharmacists with $200k+ in loans willing to take anything, yes you are coming across as greedy.

 

[M0df]

Clearly not the right question to ask on these forum but don't mind the haters. You already received two without the blessing of this board. So what do we know. To me, the question here is do they feel your additional contribution was above and beyond your current job requirements.

I say go for it? It is between you and the management. I am not sure how anyone here would help you make an informed decision. Let us know how it turns out... I know that most people rarely finish these topics with a follow up.

 

[Sine Cura]

Why not ask for a raise? The time to get money is now, not when you are laid off.

 

[mentos]

OP do you mind sharing how much you made before each raise? If you started at like $55/hr and make $58 now then it wouldn't seem greedy. If you're making $65+ then it probably does.

Many people here haven't gotten a raise or bonus in two years so you can see where the hate comes from.

 

[owlegrad]

I mean I guess you have nothing to loss but personally I would at least wait until you see what you get for your review before asking for more. After all they could factor this request/raise into your review.

 

[CNJ_Anon]

Since you've had success with asking for and getting raises in the past, you've proven that you understand the system and that you know what you're doing. So outsiders' advice shouldn't hold too much sway in what you do. If you're at the top of the range for your position, maybe you can have them create a new position for you with a new range.

The issue of "am I paid fairly?" comes up occassionally on here. I believe the answer is always market-driven. It doesn't matter how awesome you are, how much you've sacrificed, or how long you worked there. How much does it cost a hospital to buy a pharmacist in your local market? How much would it cost to replace you? In 2019, pharmacists are on sale. They're plentiful and cheap. If you believe you are cheaper (i.e. paid less) than other pharmacists, or if you believe you're a luxury model that a hospital can justify paying top-dollar for, then by all means, ask and get that raise. You can also do your own research, by applying for jobs and seeing whether you get contacted for interviews. You can even go a couple steps further: attend an interview, get an offer, and start negotiating salary. That's the only way to know what you're truly worth in this market. Knowing how much your current coworkers make helps too!

And by all means, please let us know how it turns out. I wonder whether former pizza delivery guy got a raise from his $60,000? S/he hasn't been signed on since his post. But rural PIC (VictorOfHungerGames) is still here. Did you ever ask for a higher salary?

Hi I got hired full-time in an independent pharmacy. It's my very first pharmacist job. They offered me 60K while getting trained and 90K later on. Does that sound reasonable to you? I guess you can justify lower pay due to independent pharmacies not being as busy as chains? I'd like hear your thoughts. Thanks.

All that being said, my question is, what should my salary be? Considering it's a rural area, I have to relocate and am now going to have two households virtually, should I ask for a high salary than what I've gotten previously? Thank you all in advance.

I posted my current pay here:

The job I accepted is paying $57/hr with benefits, which is my highest-paying job so far. I have typically made $48-$50/hr.

 

[rxkrafted]

how long have you been working there btw?

 

[peteronfireee]

Eh I’d say go for it; the world doesn’t reward the humble and Meek unfortunately - I worked super hard for 4 years and I kindly asked for a raise and it backfired on me. You gotta be slightly aggressive in this world. If you feel like you deserve it do it.

 

[TheBlaah]

You already got two recent raises and you likely have a third coming...but you want a fourth?

Technically, it's 4 recent raises (2 raises and 2 annual eval raises, plus the upcoming annual eval)

OP do you mind sharing how much you made before each raise? If you started at like $55/hr and make $58 now then it wouldn't seem greedy. If you're making $65+ then it probably does.

I don't want to get into too much detail, but my "base pay" which is what my raises affect was and still is fairly lower than your numbers. The raises averaged out to be around 3% each. I expect future evals to be around 4%.

I mean I guess you have nothing to loss but personally I would at least wait until you see what you get for your review before asking for more. After all they could factor this request/raise into your review.

They most likely will. However, my concern would be that since I'm already in the upper range in terms of annual raises, not salary, there's not much space for a further increase than I've already received before unless I receive a perfect score.

how long have you been working there btw?

Little over 2 years

Eh I’d say go for it; the world doesn’t reward the humble and Meek unfortunately - I worked super hard for 4 years and I kindly asked for a raise and it backfired on me. You gotta be slightly aggressive in this world. If you feel like you deserve it do it.

I feel the same way. Mind revealing how it backfired?

 

[rxkrafted]

In my own opinion, I feel like you would be leaving an annoying impression on your director because you have only been working there for a little over 2 years and have gotten 2 official raises and 2 annual eval raises... It's good that you are a top performer but I promise you that you aren't carrying the entire weight of 50+ pharmacists you are working with. You won't lose your job or anything but you better have more compelling reasons to ask for another raise on top of all these you have already gotten in such a short period of time.

 

[PharmDBro2017]

Eh I’d say go for it; the world doesn’t reward the humble and Meek unfortunately - I worked super hard for 4 years and I kindly asked for a raise and it backfired on me. You gotta be slightly aggressive in this world. If you feel like you deserve it do it.

This. Go for it, the worst they can do is tell you NO. As long as you have objective reasons to state and backup your ask, I don't see why you wouldn't go for it.

You're obviously doing well in your role since they've given you multiple raises fairly quickly. I admire the cojones and tenacity of someone who will come to my face and ask the difficult questions. Your boss should too.

 

[lord999]

In the private sector, you don't get what you deserve, you get what you negotiate. This question is how you play the management. Push too hard, and you're going to get small raises. Don't push at all, and you'll be paid like the rest of the sheep.

One other problem that you need to figure out, what is the actual ceiling for your hospital, because if your bosses are so readily willing to concede raises, then you accepted too low a starting base.

One question to consider: Why are you so outstandingly productive, is there a management problem there? Because if you are asking this from a narcissist position, you'd never know, would you?

 

[TheBlaah]

One other problem that you need to figure out, what is the actual ceiling for your hospital, because if your bosses are so readily willing to concede raises, then you accepted too low a starting base.

One question to consider: Why are you so outstandingly productive, is there a management problem there? Because if you are asking this from a narcissist position, you'd never know, would you?

You're right in that I'm quite a bit away away from the ceiling. I'm about 20/hr away from it currently, and I do think the starting base is low. But I was told that the initial salary was based on a existing formula and that there was no wiggle room there (and from starting salaries I've gleaned off other pharmacists who started before me, the starting salary has been slowly increasing over time). Only thing I could negotiate then was relocation.

As for productivity, I probably am narcissistic, but I still view it from a objective perspective in that I measure it using reports and metrics. And with the new EMR, and everyone being reset to "zero", the difference became all the more obvious.

 

[sozetone]

I've been thinking about asking for a raise. I work in a hospital with a staff of 50+ full-time pharmacists and I've been consistently a top-performer both in both clinical terms and productivity (measured using objective methods).

Before everyone decides to just shut me down, I've already received 2 raises, separate from the annual evaluation/raises (which I've been told I'm at the upper range of as well), so it is feasible. While both raises resulted from me requesting a meeting with management, I did not implicitly state that I wanted a raise. Instead, I talked about my work productivity, the changing work environment, and sudden unexpected increases in my workload.

This year though, there's been a transition to a new EMR, and I believe I've been instrumental in its implementation despite it not being my responsibility. However, since I've already received 2 independent raises already in the past few years, and evaluations are coming soon (raises from annual evaluations are capped based on several factors is why I'm considered asking for an independent raise), I don't want to come off as too greedy.

Anyway, wanted to some thoughts and experiences from others to make a more informed decision.

I think it's a great idea to ask and i want to know how it goes for you and what they say. At the same time, i don't expect they will accommodate you. And from the bottom of my heart man, i'm not being mean, it;s just in this environment today, they don't have to give raises anymore....they are in the position where they can use and abuse pharmacists until they break your back. If they told us to come to work and walk naked in the snow uphill BOTH WAYS...lol.... I bet some would....

 

[lord999]

You're right in that I'm quite a bit away away from the ceiling. I'm about 20/hr away from it currently, and I do think the starting base is low. But I was told that the initial salary was based on a existing formula and that there was no wiggle room there (and from starting salaries I've gleaned off other pharmacists who started before me, the starting salary has been slowly increasing over time). Only thing I could negotiate then was relocation.

As for productivity, I probably am narcissistic, but I still view it from a objective perspective in that I measure it using reports and metrics. And with the new EMR, and everyone being reset to "zero", the difference became all the more obvious.

Yeah, ask for the #$@*ing raise, if the discrepancy is that high from the ceiling, they can make it a bit better considering that's probably more than 25% off the tip. Your target at 5 years seniority is to be at 85%-90% of the ceiling and 10 years to be 95-100% if you are consistently performing above level (look up HR compensation metrics papers). For standard level performance, they should reach the ceiling naturally in 15 years.

And, yes, especially if you know how to do the metrics, it's pretty apparent just who isn't doing their job (and I don't mean the IV room) in an inpatient situation.

 

[peteronfireee]

Technically, it's 4 recent raises (2 raises and 2 annual eval raises, plus the upcoming annual eval)

I don't want to get into too much detail, but my "base pay" which is what my raises affect was and still is fairly lower than your numbers. The raises averaged out to be around 3% each. I expect future evals to be around 4%.

They most likely will. However, my concern would be that since I'm already in the upper range in terms of annual raises, not salary, there's not much space for a further increase than I've already received before unless I receive a perfect score.

Little over 2 years

I feel the same way. Mind revealing how it backfired?

Basically I was too nice for all the years when I should have been more demanding from the get go; what ended up happening was the boss basically gave me a long list of things I didn’t do right and until I did everything perfectly then *maybe* it could be discussed. lol. Never again.

It’s like the nice substitute teacher that tries to play hard ball too late; all the students don’t take you seriously enough. Gotta be the strict tough teacher from the get go.

 

[Dred Pirate]

Yeah, ask for the #$@*ing raise, if the discrepancy is that high from the ceiling, they can make it a bit better considering that's probably more than 25% off the tip. Your target at 5 years seniority is to be at 85%-90% of the ceiling and 10 years to be 95-100% if you are consistently performing above level (look up HR compensation metrics papers). For standard level performance, they should reach the ceiling naturally in 15 years.

And, yes, especially if you know how to do the metrics, it's pretty apparent just who isn't doing their job (and I don't mean the IV room) in an inpatient situation.

this is different than at my work - we expect an "average RPh" to be at mid point in 10 years and max out at 20 - and this is true average - half above, and half below via a bell curve. the top 10% max out in around 12-15 years

 

[TheBlaah]

Thank you everyone for your feedback. I wanted to provide an overdue update.

I had my 3rd performance review a few months ago, and received a 3.25% raise (as well as 8 hrs of PTO increase). In the end, I decided not to ask for an additional raise.

On top of the previous raises I mentioned, one thing I neglected to bring up that affected my decision was that I transitioned over to a new position last year. While the new position has the same work hours basically, it had an innate ~2% base pay increase (not related to shift differential) as well as shifting to 7-on-7 off (paid 80 hours for working 70 hours). The new position allowed me to pick up many overtime shifts. For a frame of reference of how big an effect it had, I calculated that I made an extra 20k this year while working 130 less hours compared to last year.

I decided I'd be simply asking for a lot at that point.

 

[PharmDBro2017]

Damn sounds like an awesome gig you have Blaah.