At a crossroads now

[ChemicalEng]

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Here comes a really long post. My questions are in blue, and I won't be insulted if you don't read the whole post but just answer a question or two, or just give a little advice.

I'm about to enter my second semester in chemical engineering. I chose it for the intellectual challenge, but in actuality, the concepts presented (just a ton of calculations, reactor, and balance problems) are of no interest me... At all. I am currently doing research that is highly interesting to me. I can see myself following this path to grad school, then who knows what would be next. It is in a quickly developing field, but completely unrelated to pharmacy and health. Would this research be helpful in pharmacy school admissions? If nothing else, I'll have an excellent LOR from this professor.

I'm applying to summer NSF research programs this summer to give a research career a chance. If I don't get into these, I'll probably try to work at a pharmacy and maybe take a biology class and study for the PCAT.

I have completed chemistry 1 (A), 2 (A+), organic 1 (B), the calculus series (all A), physics 1 and 2 (A- and B), and other classes which fit toward my major. I have not taken biology and cannot until next fall. This would leave me enough time to take Bio 1, Anat/Physiology, Micro, and Statistics in my junior and senior years. Is this too late?

I'm considering switching mainly because the idea of chemical engineering is starting to repulse me. It seems interesting from a distance, but I have seen too many horror stories about dead-end jobs (most everyone has a high starting salary which hardly increases more than due to inflation), being manipulated by the MBAs, horrible work environment, etc. The only way I could stay in chemical engineering is if I do research (not industry), but this is such a hard and competitive area to 1) get into and 2) stay current in, that I'm not sure if I want to work that hard for the rest of my life. Location is also an issue; I'd rather pick a location that has a job I'll enjoy than pick a job that has a location I'll hate (I'm a very active, outdoorsy person, and I would really like to live in Colorado or some other scenic location).

I love chemistry. I liked organic chemistry, but my class (aren't they all) was really hard. I've heard that it's a cakewalk compared to the later chemical engineering classes, though. My GPA now is a 3.74...I think I should be able to graduate with at least a 3.7. Would pharmacy schools take my major into account, and is this a reasonable GPA goal? If I bust my arse and get a 4.0 next semester, I would have a 3.9 cumulative. I'm doing a math minor now because I love math. I realize this probably wouldn't be much help for being a pharmacist, so should I switch it to biology? Note that I only have two years to fulfill the biology requirements.

I'm not concerned about salary as long as I make enough to live comfortably, take nice vacations and trips, and support a family (hopefully). I don't need the fanciest car or nicest clothes. I do want a relatively low-stress job (by this I mean I want it to be intellectually challenging but do not want to have to worry about losing it easily). I enjoy working with and helping people. As a female who wants a family, the part-time possibility of pharmacy is strongly alluring. There is basically no chance of this in chemical engineering.

This is a major concern of mine: I don't like drugs. I don't take medicine unless I'm really, really sick, and I never take pain killers. I am very health conscious, eat well, and run marathons, but I don't like the concept of just popping in a pill for everyday (not serious) problems. Would working in a retail pharmacy present moral dilemmas for me? I honestly would probably suggest to people walking in to try holistic techniques first. Is this not "allowed?" Do you pharmacists or pharmacist shadowers often see people coming into the pharmacy to just get pills to solve their ailments without first changing their diet, attitude, and exercise regimen? I should also note that I have somewhat similar concerns in chemical engineering. I fear that technology is taking over our lives (this is directly relevant to what I'm researching now), and personally, I would rather contribute to the simpler, day-to-day aspects of life rather than encourage technological and global debt growth. I'm also very committed to preserving the environment. In chemical engineering, I would have more of an impact on this area than in pharmacy.


To sum it all up:
I plan on finishing my chemical engineering degree. I'll either go to grad school for chE or pharmacy school.
When should I make the final decision?
What do you all recommend that I do, based on what I have provided here? I can provide more responses if you wish.

Also, I am in no (read 0) clubs except for AIChE. There is a Pre-Health club at my school that has a pre-pharmacy group in it, as well as an International Society of Pharmaceutical Engineers club. Are things like this important for pharmacy school admissions? I know that clubs are virtually useless for grad school in engineering. Would something like Habitat for Humanity be good too? It is something I'm interested in, but it does take up pretty much all of weekends.


Thank you. 🙂

 

[PharmD for Me]

Would this research be helpful in pharmacy school admissions? If nothing else, I'll have an excellent LOR from this professor.

Is this too late?

My GPA now is a 3.74...I think I should be able to graduate with at least a 3.7. Would pharmacy schools take my major into account, and is this a reasonable GPA goal? If I bust my arse and get a 4.0 next semester, I would have a 3.9 cumulative. I'm doing a math minor now because I love math. I realize this probably wouldn't be much help for being a pharmacist, so should I switch it to biology? Note that I only have two years to fulfill the biology requirements.

Also, I am in no (read 0) clubs except for AIChE. There is a Pre-Health club at my school that has a pre-pharmacy group in it, as well as an International Society of Pharmaceutical Engineers club. Are things like this important for pharmacy school admissions? I know that clubs are virtually useless for grad school in engineering. Would something like Habitat for Humanity be good too? It is something I'm interested in, but it does take up pretty much all of weekends.


Thank you. 🙂

I did just skim and look at a few of the questions, so I apologize if I don't fully answer your question or cover something that you already discussed.

Research: As far as I know, pretty much any research experience will only improve your application. It shows that you have the ability to critically analyze information and know how to work towards solving a problem. Excellent LORs are also invaluable.

Timing classes: As long as you complete the pre-requisite courses before starting a PharmD program, you'll be fine. I would recommend having as many of your biology courses completed as possible before taking the PCAT since there's an entire section devoted to biology. You can find a list of which biology subjects are generally covered on the PCAT online.

GPA: Your GPA is just fine. From what I know, the average average GPA is about 3.4-3.7, so you're right in the correct range. This is also an average, so many people get in with lower GPAs as well. I think some schools may just look at the GPA of your pre-reqs, but I'm not sure if that's true or common.

Math: Math will only help you. Being able to think critically and solve problems from a mathematical standpoint is less common than it should be (in my opinion). You will take whatever biology courses you absolutely need in your pre-reqs, and it wouldn't hurt to take a few more, but if you enjoy math stick with that as your major. Short story: your major doesn't really matter that much in admissions' eyes, you just need to complete the pre-reqs to get in.

Other: You will want to go beyond being in just AIChE. Admissions people look as other things like experience in pharmacy (employment, shadowing, classes, general knowledge), volunteering (if you don't have it, get it now), leadership, other ECs, etc. Schools' webpages generally have a list of their selection criteria. Take a gander at those and see what you can work on. Tons of students have good academics and high PCAT scores. To stand out, you need to be "well-rounded."

I hope that helped!

 

[fluorometholone]

This is a major concern of mine: I don't like drugs. I don't take medicine unless I'm really, really sick, and I never take pain killers. I am very health conscious, eat well, and run marathons, but I don't like the concept of just popping in a pill for everyday (not serious) problems. Would working in a retail pharmacy present moral dilemmas for me? I honestly would probably suggest to people walking in to try holistic techniques first. Is this not "allowed?" Do you pharmacists or pharmacist shadowers often see people coming into the pharmacy to just get pills to solve their ailments without first changing their diet, attitude, and exercise regimen? I should also note that I have somewhat similar concerns in chemical engineering. I fear that technology is taking over our lives (this is directly relevant to what I'm researching now), and personally, I would rather contribute to the simpler, day-to-day aspects of life rather than encourage technological and global debt growth. I'm also very committed to preserving the environment. In chemical engineering, I would have more of an impact on this area than in pharmacy.

Your questions are really interesting, and pose a common theme among many of my friends who are/were engineering majors. Seems that when you pick your major at age 18 or 19, it's difficult to have a real grasp on what it entails both in the short term and long term.
As for these questions, this would be something you would just have to get over (to be blunt) working in retail. Many jobs present moral dilemmas, overt or otherwise. I come from a very religious family- I will never feel comfortable selling Plan B. It's not my place, however, to deny the sale or counsel the girls (or more often, the boys, while their underage girlfriend hovers around the eye drops) on better alternatives. Yes, a lot of problems could be fixed with diet and lifestyle changes, and pharmacists may step in to counsel when appropriate, but much of this responsibility lies in the hands of the physician prescribing the medications. In retail pharmacy, there is a lot of headaches but also a lot of satisfaction in what you describe as the "day-to-day aspects of life." Most people see their doctor once or twice a year, but they see their pharmacist much more frequently.You can build up a pretty good relationship with people and help them help themselves.

 

[ChemicalEng]

Thank you both for your responses.

PharmD for Me, especially thanks for your advice regarding clubs. I enjoy volunteering where it is helpful. In high school, I feel that my volunteer hours were being abused (long story...), which has kind of turned me off from many large volunteer organizations. Perhaps I can find something that I think is worthwhile.

fluorometholone, yes, I can see where many pharmacists may have moral dilemmas. It is something that would be hard for me to just "get over" and ignore..I'll have to think a lot about it and shadow pharmacists to see how much of a problem this is. I am a very calm individual who has sold fast food to this population, so I suppose it is nearly the same as that.

Thinking these last few days, I have realized that while I do find pharmacy to be an attractive career, I really do love doing research. Perhaps I will pursue pharmacology or something along those lines...

Thanks again for all of your suggestions. I'll probably complete the pre-Pharm requirements just in case I do decide to apply to pharmacy school (probably a 30% chance now).

 

[headortail]

Thinking these last few days, I have realized that while I do find pharmacy to be an attractive career, I really do love doing research. Perhaps I will pursue pharmacology or something along those lines...

You can also do research as a pharmacist, be it clinical or industrial. I can't tell you much about the details yet as I'm only a P1, but I also come from a research background (cell bio/genetics) and also plan on doing research in pharmacy school, as well as possibly after I graduate. In my opinion, a PharmD is nice because it gives you the flexibility. You can pursue research if that's what you love, but later say if you have a family (which you did mention), and can't dedicate your full-time, 100% to your research project(s), the prospect of being able to work part-time in a different setting (retail/hospital) is worth thinking about 🙂

About the moral dilemma, most pharmacists I've met would rather change their lifestyles like you mentioned than "pop in the pill". I myself don't take medicine unless it's extremely severe (maybe for a bad infection that won't go away) and always tell my family not to abuse medicine unless extremely necessary. It also saddens me when I see so many patients who appear OK to me (aka doesn't seem like they have a life-threatening condition) taking 10-15 medications at once. I hope when I become a pharmacist, I can do something to help these patients reduce the number of medications they're taking if possible and make their regimens better. From what I've learned, ambulatory care is the setting that would allow this type of counseling to happen, where you can sit down with the patient and influence their lifestyle decisions.

I was also deciding between grad school/pharmacy school when I was in your shoes, and like you, I want a career that has good job security, but I don't need the biggest house or the nicest car (to be honest, I'll probably spend all my money on travelling 😀); hope it helps 😉

 

[ChemicalEng]

You can also do research as a pharmacist, be it clinical or industrial. I can't tell you much about the details yet as I'm only a P1, but I also come from a research background (cell bio/genetics) and also plan on doing research in pharmacy school, as well as possibly after I graduate. In my opinion, a PharmD is nice because it gives you the flexibility. You can pursue research if that's what you love, but later say if you have a family (which you did mention), and can't dedicate your full-time, 100% to your research project(s), the prospect of being able to work part-time in a different setting (retail/hospital) is worth thinking about 🙂

About the moral dilemma, most pharmacists I've met would rather change their lifestyles like you mentioned than "pop in the pill". I myself don't take medicine unless it's extremely severe (maybe for a bad infection that won't go away) and always tell my family not to abuse medicine unless extremely necessary. It also saddens me when I see so many patients who appear OK to me (aka doesn't seem like they have a life-threatening condition) taking 10-15 medications at once. I hope when I become a pharmacist, I can do something to help these patients reduce the number of medications they're taking if possible and make their regimens better. From what I've learned, ambulatory care is the setting that would allow this type of counseling to happen, where you can sit down with the patient and influence their lifestyle decisions.

I was also deciding between grad school/pharmacy school when I was in your shoes, and like you, I want a career that has good job security, but I don't need the biggest house or the nicest car (to be honest, I'll probably spend all my money on travelling 😀); hope it helps 😉

Wow, we share very similar views! I will look into ambulatory care. It would certainly be great to help educate patients on drug usage; however, I wonder how much of this is predetermined by the doctors' recommendations. I.e. does the problem exist mainly because doctors over-prescribe, or because the patients request prescriptions?

Your response helped a lot, but it has also made my decision harder. 😱 I think the only way I'll be able to decide for sure is to shadow pharmacists and speak to like-minded people. I already know that I love research, so I just need to figure out if I love pharmacy too. 🙂

 

[deleted205891]

This is a major concern of mine: I don't like drugs. I don't take medicine unless I'm really, really sick, and I never take pain killers. I am very health conscious, eat well, and run marathons, but I don't like the concept of just popping in a pill for everyday (not serious) problems. Would working in a retail pharmacy present moral dilemmas for me? I honestly would probably suggest to people walking in to try holistic techniques first. Is this not "allowed?" Do you pharmacists or pharmacist shadowers often see people coming into the pharmacy to just get pills to solve their ailments without first changing their diet, attitude, and exercise regimen? I should also note that I have somewhat similar concerns in chemical engineering. I fear that technology is taking over our lives (this is directly relevant to what I'm researching now), and personally, I would rather contribute to the simpler, day-to-day aspects of life rather than encourage technological and global debt growth. I'm also very committed to preserving the environment. In chemical engineering, I would have more of an impact on this area than in pharmacy.

Thank you. 🙂

I think your attitude is actually a good thing when it comes to pharmacy practice, as many patients should be informed about the good AND bad effects of drugs, so then they can make an informed decision. You may not like retail, as lots of people there just take drugs before changing their diet/exercise/etc, but you could work in other fields, for instance ambulatory care. During my ambulatory care rotation, we counseled the patients on non-pharmacological therapy first, and then added drugs only if they were REALLY needed. However, you probably won't get exposed to that kind of setting until rotations, so you'll probably still need to intern in retail/hospital, so you should just understand that yes, these people are using drugs, but it's better than not taking drugs and not changing their diet/attitude and then winding up in the ICU.