attending hates me! what do i do

[KnuxNole]

Exactly how do your career and financial future get compromised for asking to be on a different team? Do you guys really live in this much fear?! Maybe my medical school is unique in that the administration actually cares about medical students getting a good education and not just a piece of paper. Attendings have been removed from teaching students when things were not working. These same attendings also have a much harder time climbing the academic ladder. If you do not want to teach, get out of teaching hospitals.

Thing is, tons of residents are forced to do residency when they despise/hate teaching at all costs. Some even say "That's not my job" and walk away.

And those guys become attendings who let med students shadow and not touch a patient

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[plauto]

No offense taken...but i had several very successful job experiences before going to med school. I guess a clerkship grade is a big deal to me. It is an important part of residency application and, imo, it is worth fighting for. Good luck to the op whatever you end up doing. Consider it a life lesson.

 

[Gastrapathy]

The OP should ask a resident on the team which of these applies to him/her.

This is good advice. Talk to a resident (preferably not an intern) who you feel will be receptive. Get some sense how bad things are and see if they will intervene on your behalf. Also, consider the timing of your eval (and who writes it). If this attending isn't writing your eval, his influence may not be too significant. We solicit feedback from the other staff but the person writing the eval has by far the most influence.

I would definitely wait before going to your administration. That's just such a crapshoot regardless of whether you are as blameless as you believe.

 

[link2swim06]

No offense taken...but i had several very successful job experiences before going to med school. I guess a clerkship grade is a big deal to me. It is an important part of residency application and, imo, it is worth fighting for. Good luck to the op whatever you end up doing. Consider it a life lesson.

Oh I agree the clerkship grades are important, but for a few reasons I could go into, I doubt the OP is going to be able to improve his grade by making noise about the situation.

 

[Mr hawkings]

Your attending does not hate you. Infact, unless if you are the best med student ever or the worst ever, your attending will need to be reminded who you are and how exactly they are supposed to feel about you 24 hrs after you leave the service.

 

[SeminoleVesicle]

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Gqwi7Y96sk[/YOUTUBE]

 

[Signifier]

I think ZagDoc provided the best response.

It is funny, the culture that has evolved in the teaching institutions of modern U.S. medicine. A smattering of jerks being jerks to underlings, with a smattering of those underlings going on to themselves be jerks. I know this happens in every profession with hierarchical roles (IE every profession), but it seems to be much more intense in medicine than many other professions.

Does anyone know of any objective studies of medical bullying, and how it impacts 1) performance during rotations and 2) performance later in career?

Does it actually lead to people working harder or better or is just insecure jerks trying to breed insecurity in others?

 

[link2swim06]

I think ZagDoc provided the best response.

It is funny, the culture that has evolved in the teaching institutions of modern U.S. medicine. A smattering of jerks being jerks to underlings, with a smattering of those underlings going on to themselves be jerks. I know this happens in every profession with hierarchical roles (IE every profession), but it seems to be much more intense in medicine than many other professions.

Does anyone know of any objective studies of medical bullying, and how it impacts 1) performance during rotations and 2) performance later in career?

Does it actually lead to people working harder or better or is just insecure jerks trying to breed insecurity in others?

Why? I would contend its not as bad as other professions from my experience.

 

[KnuxNole]

I think ZagDoc provided the best response.

It is funny, the culture that has evolved in the teaching institutions of modern U.S. medicine. A smattering of jerks being jerks to underlings, with a smattering of those underlings going on to themselves be jerks. I know this happens in every profession with hierarchical roles (IE every profession), but it seems to be much more intense in medicine than many other professions.

Does anyone know of any objective studies of medical bullying, and how it impacts 1) performance during rotations and 2) performance later in career?

Does it actually lead to people working harder or better or is just insecure jerks trying to breed insecurity in others?

I can't think of one person who would work harder because of a mean attending. Since being mean only makes you resent someone, regardless of what type of person they are. That's why nice, down to earth people get others to listen to them MUCH more

It would lead more to talking about the attending's obese stomach, how there's no surprise a divorce happened, big fat ass knocking over instruments, how the patient yelled at the attending and wanting to punch him/her, rolling their eyes everytime the attending passes by, you get the drill. Basically having "underlings" lose respect for them and mocking them with others.

 

[Mr hawkings]

Why? I would contend its not as bad as other professions from my experience.

I dissagree. the only other fields that i see being worse are law enforcement/military

 

[Signifier]

So some attendings attack their underlings and generate feelings of resentment and anger. How is it that these attendings are able to build effective teams at all?

Or are they only this cruel to temporary figures in their world (IE rotating medical school students)? Or is ruling by fear? Or are their teams not effective?

Or - something else? (Keep in mind that I have very little clue how the med school/residency beatdown world works and I am asking with honest interest).

 

[KnuxNole]

So some attendings attack their underlings and generate feelings of resentment and anger. How is it that these attendings are able to build effective teams at all?

Or are they only this cruel to temporary figures in their world (IE rotating medical school students)? Or is ruling by fear? Or are their teams not effective?

Or - something else? (Keep in mind that I have very little clue how the med school/residency beatdown world works and I am asking with honest interest).

The residents probably just pretend to respect the attending and focus on their training.
Med students just pretend to listen to a word the attending says since it's temporary

So they probably DONT build effective teams. They have little impact if that is the natural way they act. It's the residents who work together by their own doing.

 

[michaelrack]

So some attendings attack their underlings and generate feelings of resentment and anger. How is it that these attendings are able to build effective teams at all?

Or are they only this cruel to temporary figures in their world (IE rotating medical school students)? Or is ruling by fear? Or are their teams not effective?

Or - something else? (Keep in mind that I have very little clue how the med school/residency beatdown world works and I am asking with honest interest).

In many non-surg fields, most of the team members are rotating/temporary- there are constantly rotating residents/interns/students on most IM services.

 

[bad virus]

If you are 100% sure he is in the wrong and you are in the right, then only one thing you can do as the small man is: Deflate all four of the SOB's tires.

He won't get far enough out of the parking structure to hurt himself but it will ruin his day. You will probably treated even more ****ty the next day but, he will never have a clue what hit him.

I'm semi kidding depending on how much this guy is ruining your rotation.

 

[ImmunoPharmD]

so i just started a rotation at a new hospital and have been here for a few weeks. i have been getting along great with all the attendings and was having a fun time. the last 2 days i was on service i was working with the "big deal" attending for that service. and for some reason from the very first moment i worked with him i could tell he really does not like me. I am working with some other classmates and he acknowledges them but ignores me completely. When i talk to him he instantly puts on a mad face. Whenever i present he is extremely harsh on me and picks on small details of everything i say. During my first patient presentation for him he cut me off by yelling at me in front of the whole team telling me to "Shut your mouth" because he wanted to talk about it himself. he never had an outburst like this for anyone else. it was an absolutely traumatic experience. When i tried to help him out with a patient with family present he made a joke about me and everyone including the team laughed at me. we were asking for midterm evaluations and he basically pointed to all my colleagues and said to each one "you did good" but when it would have been my turn he just turned around and kept walking. the only time he even looks at me is when he asks how we are enjoying the rotation and ONLY looks at me, smiles and pats my back, then keeps walking (happened at least 3 times already). i can't think of anything i did to deserve this treatment. I was in such good spirits for this rotation too but now i am feeling CRUSHED. this attending really is a big shot and i can't tell if its a ego/personality thing and how i got singled out so quickly. I am terrified of him and don't know what to do. I really like the course material and dont want 1 attending to ruin my view about the whole field.

TLDR: been on service for a few weeks, having a great time, new attending shows up, takes a dump on me, i dont know how i got in to this situation, what do i do

Maybe you're an attractive fella and the female attendees loves you.

 

[Red Five]

man this situation sucks, but honestly all you can do is remain professional and make sure you perform your best. Hopefully that will be enough to change the attending's opinion.

 

[Bigz]

Treat this as a learning experience. There are going to people in your professional life who will not like you for some unbeknownst reason. Successful people learn to how minimize the effect of this and be confident in who they are. Also, you should ask a "truth teller" in your life about any potential foibles in your personality that you may be able to correct..

BS. Quit blaming the victim. Why does medicine accept this crap. Bullying and complete lack of respect for others is conduct unbecoming of a physician IMOH at best and it is flat out despicable.

 

[thedoctor8706]

Don't worry JD, Dr. Cox may hate you now, but he'll come around, in his own way.

 

[GladifImakeit]

Okay, not sure if you are even working with the guy anymore, but here's what I recommend:

Ask him to give feedback. At my school, midpoint feedback is practically required. You might say, "Dr. X, is there anything I could to perform my performance? I want to make sure I am doing my best work."

If he does not give you legitimate feedback you can use or just insults you, then I would talk to the clerkship director and see what she suggests. Usually the CD is sympathetic to a situation such as this.

 

[Freakfarm0]

man the f*** up and call him out on his BS.

great advice, bro!

I'm sure OP doesn't want honors in whatever rotation they are doing.