Augsburg University PsyD, Class of 2025

[EKS9]

Hello!
I am entering Augsburg University's PsyD program this fall. I thought I'd start a thread for Fall 2020 PsyD students starting this program as well! Please reach out if you're attending, I'd like to get to know some fellow students (and possibly find a roommate lol)!!!

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[ClinicalABA]

Are you doing the Argosy Teachout?

 

[psych.meout]

oof

 

[EKS9]

Are you doing the Argosy Teachout?

No, I will be a new student in the program that is based off the one that was at Argosy

 

[PsyDuck90]

......so they absorbed a program that went bankrupt and are now building a new program on its back? This sounds like someone just poured gasoline on a trash fire.

 

[psych.meout]

......so they absorbed a program that went bankrupt and are now building a new program on its back? This sounds like someone just poured gasoline on a trash fire.

It's more like using the dumpster of a restaurant that was closed by the health department to supply a new restaurant.

 

[PsyDuck90]

It's more like using the dumpster of a restaurant that was closed by the health department to supply a new restaurant.

I dunno though. I feel like the dumpster would be too far removed. I'm pretty sure in this scenario, especially since it seems many of the faculty are from Argosy, this is a new restaurant taking over the old space without calling in the exterminator or the cleaning crew.

 

[MAClinician]

No, I will be a new student in the program that is based off the one that was at Argosy

I hope you understand that you are enrolling in a program that is NOT accredited and may not be accredited before you graduate. Just because the program applies does not mean it will be granted.


In other news while looking at the APA Accreditation page, the April 2020 meeting moved William James College to Accredited, Inactive.

 

[Seven_Costanza]

In other news while looking at the APA Accreditation page, the April 2020 meeting moved William James College to Accredited, Inactive.

Wow - there’s been a lot of applicants who have asked about this program recently. Hope they didn’t accept.

 

[psych.meout]

Wow - there’s been a lot of applicants who have asked about this program recently. Hope they didn’t accept.

Hopefully lockdowns and sheltering in place delay them long enough to come to their senses.

 

[penpenclown]

On the plus side there's a really good vegetarian restaurant on the same street as Augsburg. Its cash only so plan ahead.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Mod Note: Hi folks, let's try to remain on-topic and maintain a professional tone. Thanks.

To the OP, welcome to the forums.

 

[PsyDuck90]

In all seriousness OP, please thoroughly consider this choice. There is a lot of risk involved in attending this program in that there is a chance they do not get accredited. It is based off of a program (Argosy) that had a reputation as a diploma mill providing subpar education. It is also prohibitively expensive, with a tuition estimate of over $100k. I understand the excitement of getting into school. However, there is a (larger than average) risk that you spend all of this time and money and effort to find you can't be licensed as a clinical psychology in the end.

 

[PsychNLife]

could someone please explain what 'accredited, inactive' actually means ? Is it still accredited or not anymore?

 

[ClinicalABA]

could someone please explain what 'accredited, inactive' actually means ? Is it still accredited or not anymore?

From APA COA website info:
Accredited Inactive:
"Doctoral: a program that has not admitted students for 2 successive academic years or has provided the CoA with notice that it has decided to phase out and close a program. Requests for inactive status are granted by the CoA for 1 year at a time. Request for renewal of inactive status must be done prior to the beginning of the academic/training year. Programs not granted renewal of inactive status are given notice that they are no longer compliant with the provisions of accreditation and then may be placed on probation.

 

[PsychNLife]

From APA COA website info:
Accredited Inactive:
"Doctoral: a program that has not admitted students for 2 successive academic years or has provided the CoA with notice that it has decided to phase out and close a program. Requests for inactive status are granted by the CoA for 1 year at a time. Request for renewal of inactive status must be done prior to the beginning of the academic/training year. Programs not granted renewal of inactive status are given notice that they are no longer compliant with the provisions of accreditation and then may be placed on probation.

Yes I read that but I still find myself confused because it makes it seem like they are in fact still accredited, but won't be if they don't renew it after a year? Or is the program being entirely phased out?

 

[ClinicalABA]

Yes I read that but I still find myself confused because it makes it seem like they are in fact still accredited, but won't be if they don't renew it after a year?

From what I can tell, it means that they are still accredited (i.e. APA COA hasnt taken any action against their accreditation). They have had classes enrolled last two years, so they must have given notification of program closure?! I find that surprising/unlikely...

 

[niceman]

Yes I read that but I still find myself confused because it makes it seem like they are in fact still accredited, but won't be if they don't renew it after a year? Or is the program being entirely phased out?

They are still accredited. The motivation to renew every year is to ensure their students graduate from an accredited program. Students are likely to be notified what the program's plans are so that they can make a decision (e.g., trying to finish the program or transfer elsewhere). If a program is being phased out, the program can renew up to the point where all students have graduated and then stop renewing the accreditation, paying the annual accreditation fees, and maintaining other things in place for the accreditation.

 

[MAClinician]

My bad, it’s the WJC School Psychology PsyD program that moved to inactive status as the program is phasing out. It was late and my eyes thought it said clinical in the report. However WJC clinical was on probation until fall 2018.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

Yes I read that but I still find myself confused because it makes it seem like they are in fact still accredited, but won't be if they don't renew it after a year? Or is the program being entirely phased out?

My guess is that the program needs to go through the whole process of getting accredited since they simply took on Argosy. That process is long and arduous. They were likely not in a position to do that within the past year. Whether they will actually do the self-study and all the other work is not know to us.

Either way, I would be very concerned.

 

[EKS9]

Mod Note: Hi folks, let's try to remain on-topic and maintain a professional tone. Thanks.

To the OP, welcome to the forums.

Thank you.

 

[futureapppsy2]

Thank you.

Yes, welcome!

Can you tell us why you choose this program, given the concerns that others have stated (lack of accreditation, cost, association with a disreputable program [Argosy], etc)?

 

[EKS9]

Yes, welcome!

Can you tell us why you choose this program, given the concerns that others have stated (lack of accreditation, cost, association with a disreputable program [Argosy], etc)?

Yeah! So I was accepted into Palo Alto, UNO, Augsburg, and Midwestern and then declined other interviews because of travel costs. I ended up going with Augsburg since it was far enough away from home but not too much so, I felt comfortable on campus, the professors were so kind and welcoming, and besides UNO, Augsburg was actually the least expensive route for me. (I ended up receiving a scholarship there that covers 25% of my tuition). I talked with the Admissions Counselor excessively concerning everything about the Argosy mess and APA accreditation... from what I learned there were issues not with the PsyD program itself, but with the management and corporate stuff... the people higher up in the chain. It wasn't just the PsyD program either. One day students and professors came to campus and everything was locked up, no notice or anything. So Augsburg was looking to expand anyways and ended up hiring the PsyD faculty to start up an Augsburg program based on the Minnesota School of Professional Psychology (which was accredited for a very long time).
Anyway, the program seems to be what I was looking for and Minneapolis has so many internship opportunities as well. I don't know. Hopefully I didn't make an awful decision based on what others have been saying. I never expected to have my thread practically **** upon when I posted this literally just looking for fellow students in my class. Yikes. Comments have been kind of rude and irrelevant to my post... plus it seems like most of them are from others areas (East Coast region) so I don't see why they would care to reply anyway. What would they gain? Super great welcome into this online community lmao. Oh well hopefully things turn out alright. I loved the campus and profs so hopefully I'm not just being naive. I mean, I know there's a risk but from what I've discussed with the school (quite thoroughly), it is fairly low.
I suppose we'll see! ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[beantownpsych]

Comments have been kind of rude and irrelevant to my post... plus it seems like most of them are from others areas (East Coast region) so I don't see why they would care to reply anyway. What would they gain? Super great welcome into this online community lmao. Oh well hopefully things turn out alright. I loved the campus and profs so hopefully I'm not just being naive. I mean, I know there's a risk but from what I've discussed with the school (quite thoroughly), it is fairly low.

I think people are commenting because they hate to see others make such a huge professional mistake. There is a high probability that you'll come out a program that is not APA accredited program with 100K+ debt (even with the 25% scholarship) and no chance of being licensed to practice as a psychologist.

Yes, you are being naive. I strongly encourage you to see out mentorship from those in the field instead of blindly believing what the admissions coordinator told you.

 

[futureapppsy2]

Yeah! So I was accepted into Palo Alto, UNO, Augsburg, and Midwestern and then declined other interviews because of travel costs. I ended up going with Augsburg since it was far enough away from home but not too much so, I felt comfortable on campus, the professors were so kind and welcoming, and besides UNO, Augsburg was actually the least expensive route for me. (I ended up receiving a scholarship there that covers 25% of my tuition). I talked with the Admissions Counselor excessively concerning everything about the Argosy mess and APA accreditation... from what I learned there were issues not with the PsyD program itself, but with the management and corporate stuff... the people higher up in the chain. It wasn't just the PsyD program either. One day students and professors came to campus and everything was locked up, no notice or anything. So Augsburg was looking to expand anyways and ended up hiring the PsyD faculty to start up an Augsburg program based on the Minnesota School of Professional Psychology (which was accredited for a very long time).
Anyway, the program seems to be what I was looking for and Minneapolis has so many internship opportunities as well. I don't know. Hopefully I didn't make an awful decision based on what others have been saying. I never expected to have my thread practically **** upon when I posted this literally just looking for fellow students in my class. Yikes. Comments have been kind of rude and irrelevant to my post... plus it seems like most of them are from others areas (East Coast region) so I don't see why they would care to reply anyway. What would they gain? Super great welcome into this online community lmao. Oh well hopefully things turn out alright. I loved the campus and profs so hopefully I'm not just being naive. I mean, I know there's a risk but from what I've discussed with the school (quite thoroughly), it is fairly low.
I suppose we'll see! ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Thanks for you response. Like others have said, much of the reaction to this comes out of knowing what a huge debt load this program will cause you and how crushing that can be personally and professionally, especially if the program is not accredited by the time you graduate. You may not be able to get licensed in some states, and most jobs screen out applicants without an accredited doctoral program and internship. A 25% scholarship is nice (congrats!), but with tuition and living expenses, you're still looking at well over $100k in student loan debt for a degree that's a huge gamble. Please listen to caution, even though it may be hard to hear.

This thread may be of particular interest: A PsyD story (mostly $$$ talk)

 

[Sanman]

Yeah! So I was accepted into Palo Alto, UNO, Augsburg, and Midwestern and then declined other interviews because of travel costs. I ended up going with Augsburg since it was far enough away from home but not too much so, I felt comfortable on campus, the professors were so kind and welcoming, and besides UNO, Augsburg was actually the least expensive route for me. (I ended up receiving a scholarship there that covers 25% of my tuition). I talked with the Admissions Counselor excessively concerning everything about the Argosy mess and APA accreditation... from what I learned there were issues not with the PsyD program itself, but with the management and corporate stuff... the people higher up in the chain. It wasn't just the PsyD program either. One day students and professors came to campus and everything was locked up, no notice or anything. So Augsburg was looking to expand anyways and ended up hiring the PsyD faculty to start up an Augsburg program based on the Minnesota School of Professional Psychology (which was accredited for a very long time).
Anyway, the program seems to be what I was looking for and Minneapolis has so many internship opportunities as well. I don't know. Hopefully I didn't make an awful decision based on what others have been saying. I never expected to have my thread practically **** upon when I posted this literally just looking for fellow students in my class. Yikes. Comments have been kind of rude and irrelevant to my post... plus it seems like most of them are from others areas (East Coast region) so I don't see why they would care to reply anyway. What would they gain? Super great welcome into this online community lmao. Oh well hopefully things turn out alright. I loved the campus and profs so hopefully I'm not just being naive. I mean, I know there's a risk but from what I've discussed with the school (quite thoroughly), it is fairly low.
I suppose we'll see! ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Just so that everything is clear, you are part of the first class of the Augsburg U PsyD program? Are you aware that there is no chance the program will be accredited before you graduate and if they become accredited it will not apply to you? Do you know what that means for your career? If not, please ask some questions.

 

[psych.meout]

Yeah! So I was accepted into Palo Alto, UNO, Augsburg, and Midwestern and then declined other interviews because of travel costs. I ended up going with Augsburg since it was far enough away from home but not too much so, I felt comfortable on campus, the professors were so kind and welcoming, and besides UNO, Augsburg was actually the least expensive route for me. (I ended up receiving a scholarship there that covers 25% of my tuition). I talked with the Admissions Counselor excessively concerning everything about the Argosy mess and APA accreditation... from what I learned there were issues not with the PsyD program itself, but with the management and corporate stuff... the people higher up in the chain. It wasn't just the PsyD program either. One day students and professors came to campus and everything was locked up, no notice or anything. So Augsburg was looking to expand anyways and ended up hiring the PsyD faculty to start up an Augsburg program based on the Minnesota School of Professional Psychology (which was accredited for a very long time).

We get that you're excited to start grad school and begin your career, but people here are commenting on the program, because they are knowledgeable about the field in general and about Argosy specifically.

The admissions counselor with whom you spoke explicitly lied to your face by telling you that there were no problems with any of the Argosy PsyD programs and that it was all managerial and corporate problems.

An average 32% internship match rate is a sign of serious programmatic problems.

Anyway, the program seems to be what I was looking for and Minneapolis has so many internship opportunities as well.

If the Augsburg PsyD program has not made substantial changes and merely just adopted what was left when Argosy went under, you'll have substantial difficult matching to any internships, both within and outside Minneapolis.

I don't know. Hopefully I didn't make an awful decision based on what others have been saying. I never expected to have my thread practically **** upon when I posted this literally just looking for fellow students in my class. Yikes. Comments have been kind of rude and irrelevant to my post... plus it seems like most of them are from others areas (East Coast region) so I don't see why they would care to reply anyway. What would they gain? Super great welcome into this online community lmao. Oh well hopefully things turn out alright. I loved the campus and profs so hopefully I'm not just being naive. I mean, I know there's a risk but from what I've discussed with the school (quite thoroughly), it is fairly low.
I suppose we'll see! ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

People here "care to reply" because they care about the field and many who are psychologists supervise trainees directly. They care about what happens to students and don't want them to go into significant debt for a degree that might not be licensable. They care about people having their dreams taken advantage of to line the pockets of institutions who have demonstrated ambivalence towards the financial and career futures of their students.

 

[EKS9]

I think people are commenting because they hate to see others make such a huge professional mistake. There is a high probability that you'll come out a program that is not APA accredited program with 100K+ debt (even with the 25% scholarship) and no chance of being licensed to practice as a psychologist.

Yes, you are being naive. I strongly encourage you to see out mentorship from those in the field instead of blindly believing what the admissions coordinator told you.

Thanks for you response. Like others have said, much of the reaction to this comes out of knowing what a huge debt load this program will cause you and how crushing that can be personally and professionally, especially if the program is not accredited by the time you graduate. You may not be able to get licensed in some states, and most jobs screen out applicants without an accredited doctoral program and internship. A 25% scholarship is nice (congrats!), but with tuition and living expenses, you're still looking at well over $100k in student loan debt for a degree that's a huge gamble. Please listen to caution, even though it may be heard to hear.

This thread may be of particular interest: A PsyD story (mostly $$$ talk)

Just so that everything is clear, you are part of the first class of the Augsburg U PsyD program? Are you aware that there is no chance the program will be accredited before you graduate and if they become accredited it will not apply to you? Do you know what that means for your career? If not, please ask some questions.

We get that you're excited to start grad school and begin your career, but people here are commenting on the program, because they are knowledgeable about the field in general and about Argosy specifically.

The admissions counselor with whom you spoke explicitly lied to your face by telling you that there were no problems with any of the Argosy PsyD programs and that it was all managerial and corporate problems.

View attachment 305872

An average 32% internship match rate is a sign of serious programmatic problems.



If the Augsburg PsyD program has not made substantial changes and merely just adopted what was left when Argosy went under, you'll have substantial difficult matching to any internships, both within and outside Minneapolis.


People here "care to reply" because they care about the field and many who are psychologists supervise trainees directly. They care about what happens to students and don't want them to go into significant debt for a degree that might not be licensable. They care about people having their dreams taken advantage of to line the pockets of institutions who have demonstrated ambivalence towards the financial and career futures of their students.

Thank you all for your replies, I do appreciate it! I've contacted my admissions counselor so hopefully some things will be cleared up. If anyone else has any other information or advice, feel free to share!
Thanks ya'll.

 

[PsyDuck90]

Thank you all for your replies, I do appreciate it! I've contacted my admissions counselor so hopefully some things will be cleared up. If anyone else has any other information or advice, feel free to share!
Thanks ya'll.

Just keep in mind that the admissions counselor has about $100K worth of reasons to be less than honest with you. Also, as further evidence of the sub-par quality of the old Argosy, take a look at their EPPP pass rates. The EPPP is the national licensing exam. The latest published data (which is from 2017) shows that only 75% of the individuals who sat for that exam from Argosy passed. That means that a quarter of their graduates who sat for the exam did not pass and had to wait to hopefully pass the following year. You can look at the full list here and compare what other programs scores are like, as well as other Argosy schools for comparison: https://www.asppb.net/resource/resmgr/eppp_/2017_Doctoral_Report.pdf

I apologize for the snarky remarks earlier. But, when considering this decision, just think about who is more likely to be honest with you. A bunch of strangers within the field in 1 capacity or another on the internet who have nothing to gain or lose (except the further proliferation of bad training bringing down the field), or the admissions counselor for the school who will directly financially profit from more butts in seats. If you want to be a psychologist, you want to focus on evidence and data. We are showing you hard data that suggests the performance of these programs is subpar. Ask the counselor for hard data. They are trained salesmen, so they are very skilled at telling half-truths and selling a dream.

 

[EKS9]

Just keep in mind that the admissions counselor has about $100K worth of reasons to be less than honest with you. Also, as further evidence of the sub-par quality of the old Argosy, take a look at their EPPP pass rates. The EPPP is the national licensing exam. The latest published data (which is from 2017) shows that only 75% of the individuals who sat for that exam from Argosy passed. That means that a quarter of their graduates who sat for the exam did not pass and had to wait to hopefully pass the following year. You can look at the full list here and compare what other programs scores are like, as well as other Argosy schools for comparison: https://www.asppb.net/resource/resmgr/eppp_/2017_Doctoral_Report.pdf

I apologize for the snarky remarks earlier. But, when considering this decision, just think about who is more likely to be honest with you. A bunch of strangers within the field in 1 capacity or another on the internet who have nothing to gain or lose (except the further proliferation of bad training bringing down the field), or the admissions counselor for the school who will directly financially profit from more butts in seats. If you want to be a psychologist, you want to focus on evidence and data. We are showing you hard data that suggests the performance of these programs is subpar. Ask the counselor for hard data. They are trained salesmen, so they are very skilled at telling half-truths and selling a dream.View attachment 305894

Thanks so much for all this info. I don't want to walk into any kind of program naively, so I really appreciate the honesty here. I think I was just taken aback at first with all the negative responses to my initial post, when I was just trying to find some fellow students in the program. But I'm glad I found this network, as I most likely wouldn't have found this info on my own. Maybe I should reach out to the other programs I was accepted in or whose interviews I declined and see if there's still a chance??

 

[Sanman]

Thanks so much for all this info. I don't want to walk into any kind of program naively, so I really appreciate the honesty here. I think I was just taken aback at first with all the negative responses to my initial post, when I was just trying to find some fellow students in the program. But I'm glad I found this network, as I most likely wouldn't have found this info on my own. Maybe I should reach out to the other programs I was accepted in or whose interviews I declined and see if there's still a chance??

Normally, I would say this would not work. However, with corona virus you may still have a chance to go back and accept a spot somewhere.

Just so you know what to ask about when speaking to Augsburg. There are two separate issues being discussed that are concerning to me

1. The Argosy teach out and quality issues that may remain related to this. These issues may or may not affect you. No way to know right now.

2. It seems based on what the program has written, you would be part of the first class of the Augsburg PsyD program. It is my understanding that a program cannot be accredited until it graduates the first class of students (you in this case). Once that happens they can proceed to the final steps in getting accredited as a program. However, this accreditation will not be retroactive. As such, any time you apply for licensure, you will be forced to prove equivalency. You will not be employable for any federal government or most state government positions (including VA, Board of Prisons, DOD, state hospitals etc). Many other higher paying positions will eliminate you due to requiring APA accredited program and internships for application. You may be locked out of many (most) of the higher paying jobs in the field even if you do everything correctly.

 

[WisNeuro]

Normally, I would say this would not work. However, with corona virus you may still have a chance to go back and accept a spot somewhere.

Just so you know what to ask about when speaking to Augsburg. There are two separate issues being discussed that are concerning to me

1. The Argosy teach out and quality issues that may remain related to this. These issues may or may not affect you. No way to know right now.

2. It seems based on what the program has written, you would be part of the first class of the Augsburg PsyD program. It is my understanding that a program cannot be accredited until it graduates the first class of students (you in this case). Once that happens they can proceed to the final steps in getting accredited as a program. However, this accreditation will not be retroactive. As such, any time you apply for licensure, you will be forced to prove equivalency. You will not be employable for any federal government or most state government positions (including VA, Board of Prisons, DOD, state hospitals etc). Many other higher paying positions will eliminate you due to requiring APA accredited program and internships for application. You may be locked out of many (most) of the higher paying jobs in the field even if you do everything correctly.

Not too mention, I am not aware of any of the major hospital systems in MN that hire unaccredited individuals at the doctoral level. Every job posting I have seen requires it. So, chances are, either going a PP route in a fairly crowded market for general therapy, or moving to some state where institutions will hire unaccredited people. And, these institutions are an exception and likely will be clustered in places where it is hard to recruit (e.g., rural).

 

[AcronymAllergy]

As a clarification to a response from above, it actually is now possible to be APA-accredited (on contingency) without having graduated a class (i.e., without distal outcome data). However, the program does need to provide practicum data; I have no idea if the practicum data from Argosy teach-out students would be applicable for this, or if the program would need to obtain practicum data solely from their first class or two and then hope the accreditation goes through quickly.

Also, keep in mind, the program may be limited in what they can actually tell you about accreditation application timelines. This is generally to protect students, such as so that programs don't unfairly influence a student's admissions decisions via inaccurate or unclear statements (e.g., providing "false hope").

Either way, accreditation would be retroactive to the last day of the meeting during which APA's Commission on Accreditation (CoA) approved the accreditation. This may or may not occur while you're still in the program. If you've left the program before the CoA makes their decision, even if they visited the training site while you were there, the accreditation would unfortunately not be retroactive to you.

 

[Sanman]

As a clarification to a response from above, it actually is now possible to be APA-accredited (on contingency) without having graduated a class (i.e., without distal outcome data). However, the program does need to provide practicum data; I have no idea if the practicum data from Argosy teach-out students would be applicable for this, or if the program would need to obtain practicum data solely from their first class or two and then hope the accreditation goes through quickly.

Also, keep in mind, the program may be limited in what they can actually tell you about accreditation application timelines. This is generally to protect students, such as so that programs don't unfairly influence a student's admissions decisions via inaccurate or unclear statements (e.g., providing "false hope").

Either way, accreditation would be retroactive to the last day of the meeting during which APA's Commission on Accreditation (CoA) approved the accreditation. This may or may not occur while you're still in the program. If you've left the program before the CoA makes their decision, even if they visited the training site while you were there, the accreditation would unfortunately not be retroactive to you.

Well, I learned something today.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Well, I learned something today.

That's most days for me, especially with anything related to APA. I can't remember when they implemented the Accredited, On Contingency option, but I'm pretty sure it was only within the past 2-3 years.

 

[BuckeyeLove]

As a clarification to a response from above, it actually is now possible to be APA-accredited (on contingency) without having graduated a class (i.e., without distal outcome data).

Generally I don't think we need any more garbage programs, but that being said, the rule that a new program needed to already have a class go through and graduate always seemed a bit...odd to me. What was the historical logic behind that?

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Generally I don't think we need any more garbage programs, but that being said, the rule that a new program needed to already have a class go through and graduate always seemed a bit...odd to me. What was the historical logic behind that?

I agree, the rule seemed to severely hamstring new programs, and I believe that's what directly contributed to the change. I actually have no idea as to the historical logic behind it. Maybe a vestige of the days of yore, when accreditation wasn't as big a deal?

 

[WisNeuro]

I agree, the rule seemed to severely hamstring new programs, and I believe that's what directly contributed to the change. I actually have no idea as to the historical logic behind it. Maybe a vestige of the days of yore, when accreditation wasn't as big a deal?

I could kind of see the logic about giving potential applicants complete information. Imagine starting a program, getting to year 4 or 5, and then learning they did not adequately adhere to accreditation guidelines. At least with the guidelines the way they were, you at least know where you stand from the get go.

 

[futureapppsy2]

Generally I don't think we need any more garbage programs, but that being said, the rule that a new program needed to already have a class go through and graduate always seemed a bit...odd to me. What was the historical logic behind that?

Man, about 9-10 years ago, I got slammed *so* heavily on here for saying that that rule was bad for screwing over at least one cohort of students for each program, especially funded, university-based programs that were just new.

I think the logic was wanting to be able to evaluate how a program actually handles the entire training process.

 

[Sanman]

I could kind of see the logic about giving potential applicants complete information. Imagine starting a program, getting to year 4 or 5, and then learning they did not adequately adhere to accreditation guidelines. At least with the guidelines the way they were, you at least know where you stand from the get go.

I am actually curious how the on contingency modifier will affect students if they lose accreditation after getting it on contingency, What does the student say if they graduated before the loss of accreditation if it were only contingent?

 

[WisNeuro]

I am actually curious how the on contingency modifier will affect students. If they lose accreditation after getting it on contingency, What does the student say if they graduated before the loss of accreditation if it were only contingent?

Good question. I'm not aware of any program, doctoral or internship, who did not go on to full accreditation after being on contingency. But, I am only aware of a handful of such programs.

 

[EKS9]

Normally, I would say this would not work. However, with corona virus you may still have a chance to go back and accept a spot somewhere.

Just so you know what to ask about when speaking to Augsburg. There are two separate issues being discussed that are concerning to me

1. The Argosy teach out and quality issues that may remain related to this. These issues may or may not affect you. No way to know right now.

2. It seems based on what the program has written, you would be part of the first class of the Augsburg PsyD program. It is my understanding that a program cannot be accredited until it graduates the first class of students (you in this case). Once that happens they can proceed to the final steps in getting accredited as a program. However, this accreditation will not be retroactive. As such, any time you apply for licensure, you will be forced to prove equivalency. You will not be employable for any federal government or most state government positions (including VA, Board of Prisons, DOD, state hospitals etc). Many other higher paying positions will eliminate you due to requiring APA accredited program and internships for application. You may be locked out of many (most) of the higher paying jobs in the field even if you do everything correctly.

Thank you for this feedback. I will keep this in mind when I have a Zoom meeting with the admissions counselor.

 

[WisNeuro]

As another piece of info, Augsburg has currently posted several job postings for associate professors and lecturers for their PsyD program. Which means, they don't currently have the curricula fleshed out entirely. From what I see, they are currently trying to bring on 3 people, but, at the salary ranges I'm seeing, they'll have a hard time bringing on anyone of quality.

 

[futureapppsy2]

Thank you for this feedback. I will keep this in mind when I have a Zoom meeting with the admissions counselor.

Like others have said, the admissions counselor has a huge conflict of interest here and may not be completely honest (or honest at all).

 

[MAClinician]

Thank you for this feedback. I will keep this in mind when I have a Zoom meeting with the admissions counselor.

Maybe other folks have had different experiences than I did. But when I was applying to clinical psych PhD programs back in 2000s, I never spoke to an “admissions counselor”. If I had questions about the program or funding, I was speaking to the DCT or the faculty member I was interested in working with. The only reason I could remember contacting the graduate school was if there was a question about my application materials (before applying was done totally online lol) such as to ensure they received my GRE/transcript etc. If you haven’t done so already, it might be helpful to ask your questions of the actual faculty that will be instructing you, and not someone in an office whose main job is to get butts in seats. I also find it interesting that they list 5 faculty members but not one is identified as CURRENT DCT, just the former DCT from MSPP at Argosy.

 

[psych.meout]

Like others have said, the admissions counselor has a huge conflict of interest here and may not be completely honest (or honest at all).

They've already lied to OP once about the quality of the Argosy program being an issue.

And OP, I want to stress that this is not your fault. No one wants to go through life being suspicious that everyone is trying to get one over on them, but Argosy was a diploma mill that preyed on unsuspecting, well-meaning students. It looks like Augsburg is adopting the same strategy.

Maybe other folks have had different experiences than I did. But when I was applying to clinical psych PhD programs back in 2000s, I never spoke to an “admissions counselor”. If I had questions about the program or funding, I was speaking to the DCT or the faculty member I was interested in working with. The only reason I could remember contacting the graduate school was if there was a question about my application materials (before applying was done totally online lol) such as to ensure they received my GRE/transcript etc. If you haven’t done so already, it might be helpful to ask your questions of the actual faculty that will be instructing you, and not someone in an office whose main job is to get butts in seats. I also find it interesting that they list 5 faculty members but not one is identified as CURRENT DCT, just the former DCT from MSPP at Argosy.

That was my experience as well. There were no "admissions counselors" for any of the programs to which I applied and my communication with administrative staff was mostly logistical, e.g., questions about submitting application materials, attending interview day, etc. My questions about the program itself, funding, etc. were all answered by faculty of some kind. I think I asked current students questions at well, but there were no admissions counselors trying to talk me into spending money on the program.

 

[Sanman]

Maybe other folks have had different experiences than I did. But when I was applying to clinical psych PhD programs back in 2000s, I never spoke to an “admissions counselor”. If I had questions about the program or funding, I was speaking to the DCT or the faculty member I was interested in working with. The only reason I could remember contacting the graduate school was if there was a question about my application materials (before applying was done totally online lol) such as to ensure they received my GRE/transcript etc. If you haven’t done so already, it might be helpful to ask your questions of the actual faculty that will be instructing you, and not someone in an office whose main job is to get butts in seats. I also find it interesting that they list 5 faculty members but not one is identified as CURRENT DCT, just the former DCT from MSPP at Argosy.

Same in my experience. DCT called me to inform me of acceptance.

Augsburg U doesn't have a DCT. Job ad was posted for the position on 4/29/20.

 

[EKS9]

They've already lied to OP once about the quality of the Argosy program being an issue.

And OP, I want to stress that this is not your fault. No one wants to go through life being suspicious that everyone is trying to get one over on them, but Argosy was a diploma mill that preyed on unsuspecting, well-meaning students. It looks like Augsburg is adopting the same strategy.



That was my experience as well. There were no "admissions counselors" for any of the programs to which I applied and my communication with administrative staff was mostly logistical, e.g., questions about submitting application materials, attending interview day, etc. My questions about the program itself, funding, etc. were all answered by faculty of some kind. I think I asked current students questions at well, but there were no admissions counselors trying to talk me into spending money on the program.

hmmm interesting. The admissions counselor did offer to put me in touch with current and past students to get different perspectives, and I'm going to take her up on that. I'm planning on emailing professors as well. Things seemed pretty straight forward and normal at my interview while I was asking questions about the program but now that I have all this information, I will need to bring it up for further discussion. There's no way I can afford to be $100K in debt and spend 5 years of my life working toward a degree that my not even be licensable. :/

 

[PsyDuck90]

Augsburg U doesn't have a DCT. Job ad was posted for the position on 4/29/20.

So instead of having an interim DCT, they just have no one until they get a new hire? You'd think that the person who was DCT at the old Argosy would at least be acting DCT until someone new fills the role.

And as others, I also had no exposure talking to an admissions counselor. My communication was mostly with the director of the program rather than the DCT though, but this person was also the faculty mentor I was interested in working with. And at other programs I was considering, it was pretty much all faculty of interest.

 

[Sanman]

So instead of having an interim DCT, they just have no one until they get a new hire? You'd think that the person who was DCT at the old Argosy would at least be acting DCT until someone new fills the role.

And as others, I also had no exposure talking to an admissions counselor. My communication was mostly with the director of the program rather than the DCT though, but this person was also the faculty mentor I was interested in working with. And at other programs I was considering, it was pretty much all faculty of interest.

There might be an interim DCT, no idea. However, they only have 5 faculty listed for the program and no one is listed as interim DCT or anything else.