August 2020 - CBSE

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Cito said:
Wonder if anyone is actually taking the test the 15th or even Monday. If not, they ought to have all our scores ready to go
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i got it tomorrow. had to postpone due to family stuff
 
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Ivy.ch said:
D2s/D3s at this school said they planned to take it as late as possible because they don’t need the score to apply this cycle. I think one kid was doing it the 15th.
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Some students who took the exam at different dates said it was the same exam. After hearing this, someone I know rescheduled it and is now taking it on September 15th. So let's see how they do with all the *hints* from earlier test takers.
 
OoPredentoO said:
Some students who took the exam at different dates said it was the same exam. After hearing this, someone I know rescheduled it and is now taking it on September 15th. So let's see how they do with all the *hints* from earlier test takers.
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That's unfortunate that they didn't use multiple forms/versions. May lead to a slightly higher average due to people talking and giving answers to friends.
 
OoPredentoO said:
Some students who took the exam at different dates said it was the same exam. After hearing this, someone I know rescheduled it and is now taking it on September 15th. So let's see how they do with all the *hints* from earlier test takers.
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.
 
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OoPredentoO said:
Some students who took the exam at different dates said it was the same exam. After hearing this, someone I know rescheduled it and is now taking it on September 15th. So let's see how they do with all the *hints* from earlier test takers.
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If that's the case, the earlier test takers benefit drastically on the curve. In a sense, the test makers can see the trend with certain questions and whether or not those who scored high (August 15th) correlate to those on September (15th). In which case, they can then adjust the points associated with that question.

Maybe I'm naive, but I'd like to think they used different exams. Kinda ****ty to think your seat gets stolen by someone who was told answers. Not really the kind of person you want with you in the OR when things get rocky.
 
providence819 said:
If that's the case, the earlier test takers benefit drastically on the curve. In a sense, the test makers can see the trend with certain questions and whether or not those who scored high (August 15th) correlate to those on September (15th). In which case, they can then adjust the points associated with that question.

Maybe I'm naive, but I'd like to think they used different exams. Kinda ****ty to think your seat gets stolen by someone who was told answers. Not really the kind of person you want with you in the OR when things get rocky.
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It’s precurved based on how the medical students do on those questions, not dental students
 
Can confirm that at least some of the questions were the same
 
We may see very high average AND standard deviation this time.
 
TeethAndTitanium said:
I don't think average will be higher than 60. The exam is still a beast to study for regardless
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Agreed. And with the complexity of the questions, I would find it hard to believe that somebody would remember more than 2 or 3 questions in enough detail to make a difference for somebody else
 
CubsFan44 said:
Agreed. And with the complexity of the questions, I would find it hard to believe that somebody would remember more than 2 or 3 questions in enough detail to make a difference for somebody else
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The average for the last exam was 58.
It's not that hard for the average to increase by more than 2 points given the circumstance.
Additionally, people will definitely remember more than 2 or 3. I would say more than 20 especially if they sit together and discuss about it.
Ironically, it's easier to remember hard, weird, peculiar questions simply because test takers get shocked when they confront those type of questions.
If those who take the exam later get those hard questions correct because they knew the answer ahead, their scores will be significantly higher.
 
I thought it was a different exam each day? Like I know that the people who take the exam on the same day had the same tests, but I thought each new day was a different exam
 
Demilaax said:
Harder questions actually weigh less points on the CBSE. Also tell me about this person where multiple people gather to risk their career just to compile things for them. Who ever it is, must be super freaking hot.
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While harder questions may weigh less, if a person gets those harder questions correct while almost all others get them wrong, he or she will definitely get a substantial advantage.
But I do agree with you that whoever sharing exam questions should understand that they are seriously risking their career.
 
people share RQs for boards all the time online. If the CBSE was P/F like boards, this would be a completely different discussion. Nobody is risking their career lol
 
Like I said previously, would be a real shame to have someone on the OR table next to you simply because they were told answers on the exam.
 
If people really are sharing questions and cheating, then this whole exam session is a joke. Shame that it cheapens the effort of everyone who actually put in the work to study properly
 
StealBloodandTears said:
I took the exam early August and I am now 100% sure that the exam stayed the same throughout. Also Positive people who took it today and yesterday had questions ahead of time.
Makes this exam and entire process absolutely BS. Group of us are emailing John and asking they analyze the trend from start of the exam perio until the end (anonymously of course, and not naming any names of course.) Imagine if you had all the anatomy before going in.
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I'm not saying there weren't some of the same versions of the exam floating around and that some people, by chance, could've gotten the same version, but nobody I've talked to (6 people) so far has gotten the same exam. It would be a valid point to bring up to JL, though and see what he says.
 
cant trust this organization with a dime.
 
StealBloodandTears said:
How sure are you? Just reached out to another person today. Same exact photos.
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I mean they're my friends, and I doubt they'd all straight up lie. Again, I'm sure that the NBME administered multiple versions of the exam and it's possible that 2 people taking the exam on different days got the same exam, but I don't think everyone had the same exam. Let us know if JL responds to your email.
 
StealBloodandTears said:
Anyone who took it towards September and had idiots telling them stuff, super BS.
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I mean that's a bit of a stretch dont you think?

Attendings know this stuff happens tho. There are certain schools that definitely have Qbanks going. But isn't this part of the reason 70+ is considered a good/ "cutoff" score? I feel like you shouldn't worry so much about it tbh
 
StealBloodandTears said:
I took the exam early August and I am now 100% sure that the exam stayed the same throughout. Also Positive people who took it today and yesterday had questions ahead of time.
Makes this exam and entire process absolutely BS. Group of us are emailing John and asking they analyze the trend from start of the exam perio until the end (anonymously of course, and not naming any names of course.) Imagine if you had all the anatomy before going in.
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Let's see what the average and standard deviation come out to be. I don't think they will be off very much from past exam dates, but we'll know soon enough.
 
Yeah, I assumed the questions came from a small bank so there were bound to be some repeats. We still know *nothing* for certain just like every year, so I'm hesitant to start rioting quite yet. I would hope that people don't suck enough to cheat, but I also know trying to remember 200 questions to share with a classmate that you're essentially competing with is stupid. I don't have the energy to be mad about cheaters, hope they get what comes around, and I'll just focus on me.
 
If you ask JL to analyze a trend from august to september test takers and there does seem to be a significant difference; I am assuming you'd want a curve to your august score in that case. How then is this fair to september test takers who took it honestly and weren't given answers, who might miss out on that curve?
 
noodles9 said:
Yeah, I assumed the questions came from a small bank so there were bound to be some repeats. We still know *nothing* for certain just like every year, so I'm hesitant to start rioting quite yet. I would hope that people don't suck enough to cheat, but I also know trying to remember 200 questions to share with a classmate that you're essentially competing with is stupid. I don't have the energy to be mad about cheaters, hope they get what comes around, and I'll just focus on me.
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ain’t that the truth! If you’ve never met her, Karmas a real mofo. I’d like to think for every question you got right because you were told an answer, you got four wrong as punishment for it.
 
Cowhorn_10 said:
If you ask JL to analyze a trend from august to september test takers and there does seem to be a significant difference; I am assuming you'd want a curve to your august score in that case. How then is this fair to september test takers who took it honestly and weren't given answers, who might miss out on that curve?
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Definitely no good way to go about it, but I guess that’s the theme of this whole pandemic. If people actually got questions from other people, that sucks and I’m sure it’s possible. Let’s just hope that any question sharing was minimal, and that those people were only a small minority of the entire group of people who took the exam
 
Cowhorn_10 said:
If you ask JL to analyze a trend from august to september test takers and there does seem to be a significant difference; I am assuming you'd want a curve to your august score in that case. How then is this fair to september test takers who took it honestly and weren't given answers, who might miss out on that curve?
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The fairest way I can think of is completely eliminating those questions that might have been shared by people from calculating the score.
 
IOPEU said:
The fairest way I can think of is completely eliminating those questions that might have been shared by people from calculating the score.
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Eliminating questions definitely wouldn't be fair. What if I got those eliminated questions right on my exam? I didn't get questions from anyone and I'm sure many that took this exam didn't either. As other people stated in this thread, people are always going to cheat, it's inevitable. Y'all need to relax and wait for the results to come out first lol
 
OCheeselover said:
I'm more surprised by how immature many people are being here. Not everyone is still in dental school and not everyone that took the exam toward the end had hints provided to them. Those that claim they know people that were giving hints need to report the individuals otherwise they're playing a role too, being a hypocrite and therefore need to hush. I had my reasons to schedule my exam toward the end and as much as I hate to think that someone may have gotten some questions correct because they were provided hints, I'd also like to recall and realize that sadly corruption and cheating is everywhere, from school to dental corporations to our very own government. We should voice our concerns but without undermining the honest work the majority people did.
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Well said - also I can't help but wonder if this reaction is a result of not doing well on the test and blaming external factors in order to better one's own score
 
William M Buttlicker said:
Eliminating questions definitely wouldn't be fair. What if I got those eliminated questions right on my exam? I didn't get questions from anyone and I'm sure many that took this exam didn't either. As other people stated in this thread, people are always going to cheat, it's inevitable. Y'all need to relax and wait for the results to come out first lol
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I guess everyone thinks of it differently.
By dropping those questions, I say it is going to ultimately benefit people who did NOT cheat.
 
Reschedule few weeks from now? Only one date as it should have been? I think this would be viable solution and if you learned you won’t forget it. It’s been over 6 months and I still can answer so many questions from NBME’s correctly
 
StealBloodandTears said:
I took the exam early August and I am now 100% sure that the exam stayed the same throughout. Also Positive people who took it today and yesterday had questions ahead of time.
Makes this exam and entire process absolutely BS. Group of us are emailing John and asking they analyze the trend from start of the exam perio until the end (anonymously of course, and not naming any names of course.) Imagine if you had all the anatomy before going in.
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I understand the frustration, but it's really unfair to September test takers who did not cheat. I for myself, took it yesterday, and got no prior help because I have no friends (that's another issue). If there was a way to find and punish ONLY the cheaters then so be it, but at this point only thing JL can do that is "fair" to everyone is to cancel the entire exam, which I know none of us want. How is he going to find who cheated based on "trend"? If anybody have solid evidence and name, please report them to JL so we only punish the cheaters and not other who worked really hard to study for this exam. Once again, last thing we want is JL to think too many cheating/problem with this test and cancel the whole thing.
 
August/September exam is what it is. Let karma handle those who cheated. I think applying to 30 programs and getting rejected from all is good karma. Maybe live in a pit of constant guilt for your career. Nonetheless, the solution is quite simple. February should be one set date. If you have to take it from your couch, you take it from your couch. If my school watches me via zoom while I take a damn quiz, I'm sure there's some software that can track our eye movements from home.
 
StealBloodandTears said:
Absolutely agree. Whole idea is that if the virus is still going on in February the same thing doesn’t happen
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They will most likely do the same thing in feb and maybe even next aug-they will have to space out the exam over a month again. Pandemic and social distancing is not expected to end till end of 2021 or early 2022 in the US.
 
I hope they do it differently in February 2021. It all needs to happen on the same day, or multiple tests have to be issued if the CBSE is given on different days. Does the NBME have a contract with Prometric? I wonder if a combination of testing center companies can be utilized so that all test takers can be accommodated on the same day.
 
There was once a time they released a nbme in 2013 I believe that had questions appearing on the cbse. They forgot to retire the questions from the cbse. The average was a 60 for that cbse exam. Aaoms did nothing about that So I doubt anything happens here.

Overloading JL with emails is just gonna take longer for scores to come out and there’s people who really need it. Watch the average and STD be the same anyways.
 
Guys, take a breather. There is no way to make it fair; life isn't fair. No one is denying it's a wack situation. Regardless of what was going on among others, it is YOUR score, not theirs, which is either going to get you your interview invites or not. At that point, your score ceases to matter. Complaining when nothing can be done is whining.
 
OCheeselover said:
I'm going to follow the same level of logic people are following here and demand that the exam be curved against those that took the exam in August... because it's their fault for sharing information, if it wasn't for them, we wouldn't have this problem in September.

As someone else mentioned, I'm starting to wonder if people are looking for external sources to blame for their poor performance.
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Not really. Most people after taking an exam will rant to their friends about bs questions. I doubt many people who shared information about the August 15th CBSE knew the exam would stay the same for the entire month. JL concealed this information, which goes to show how flawed the entire thing really is.
 
Likkriue said:
There was once a time they released a nbme in 2013 I believe that had questions appearing on the cbse. They forgot to retire the questions from the cbse. The average was a 60 for that cbse exam. Aaoms did nothing about that So I doubt anything happens here.

Overloading JL with emails is just gonna take longer for scores to come out and there’s people who really need it. Watch the average and STD be the same anyways.
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Yes. Please let’s not make scores get delayed any more than they already have been.
 
Ivy.ch said:
Guys, take a breather. There is no way to make it fair; life isn't fair. No one is denying it's a wack situation. Regardless of what was going on among others, it is YOUR score, not theirs, which is either going to get you your interview invites or not. At that point, your score ceases to matter. Complaining when nothing can be done is whining.
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I agree but the logic of their score vs your score doesn’t really work here. I get what you’re saying, but if 100 people take a test and 95 people have some answers given to them bumping their score to a 90%, while the other 5 do not, and they get an 85%, that difference matters. Even if it’s only a handful of questions that create the difference. When they’re competing for 10 spots why would - program consider any of the 5 with a lower score if they have 95 others to choose from who did better? Overall i agree life isn’t fair, **** happens and everyone just has to deal with it. I don’t really care either way
 
nonociceptors said:
I agree but the logic of their score vs your score doesn’t really work here. I get what you’re saying, but if 100 people take a test and 95 people have some answers given to them bumping their score to a 90%, while the other 5 do not, and they get an 85%, that difference matters. Even if it’s only a handful of questions that create the difference. When they’re competing for 10 spots why would - program consider any of the 5 with a lower score if they have 95 others to choose from who did better? Overall i agree life isn’t fair, **** happens and everyone just has to deal with it. I don’t really care either way
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I really doubt that 95 people are what we're looking at for who allegedly was given answers. I'd assume its just a handful.. and without indisputable evidence that they were handed answers I'm assuming JL cannot do anything. Plus people are applying in 2 weeks so that effectively ruins an entire 2 years for them when considering having to wait to reapply in 2021 and wait again to matriculate in 2022.
 
Also we're basing this entire discussion off word of mouth - unless there is definitive proof/evidence of mass cheating we should not ruin the chances for those applying this cycle

And 95/100 is a vast overestimate... Tbh it would probably be more accurate to say 95/100 didn't cheat.
 
We’ve gone from maybe the exam isn’t fair to it’s probably unfair to 95/100 people knew questions before going in and August testers are in trouble lol. We know nothing yet. And regardless it’s highly unlikely anything will change. I’m of the opinion that it is what it is. Maybe one of the worst parts of the extended testing time is giving highly motivated, anxious, and stressed students a whole month to sit around and worry about what their scores might be.
 
I'm sure most people did not cheat. However, it will definitely result in a number of people not getting interviews if those who cheated are not penalized.
 
IOPEU said:
I'm sure most people did not cheat. However, it will definitely result in a number of people not getting interviews if those who cheated are not penalized.
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I get the worry, I took the exam the first date in August. But there is so much at play it’s impossible to say this definitely. Maybe they cheated and got those questions right, while getting other questions wrong, maybe they are a D2 not applying this cycle, maybe the person who told them the question got some details wrong. Maybe a higher average score isn’t evidence of cheating but instead evidence of a longer timeframe to study...we could probably come up with many more...in the end it is what it is
 
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