AuntMinnie.Com suppressing the truth about radiology

[SrRadiologyRes]

I'm a senior resident in radiology and the job market has completely collapsed. Any mention of this on auntminnie and administrators immediately threaten you and take down your threads. DO NOT BELIEVE WHAT PEOPLE ARE SAYING. All negative threads are no being taken down at aunt minnie. Let me inform you of the job situation:

Unless you want to get pigeon-holed into doing mammo for the res of your life, or used and abused and then dropped as a night hawk, there are no jobs.

People are doing a fellowship, seeing there are no jobs available, and then doing another fellowship without any guarantee of employment. The only other field that does this is pathology.

If you're lucky enough to get a job and say you're trained in MSK, it has no bearing on your day to day work. If they already have an MSK guy you'll read ultrasound all day, every day unless you want to be unemployed.

I can't believe after all this money, hard work and training I don't know how I'm going to pay off my loans. This is a nightmare.

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[colbgw02]

We should all become hospitalists, amirite?

 

[cowme]

Trolllolololol

(well, you may be forced into mamms, that part is true)

If you truly can't find ANY job, you must be a terrible resident

 

[dude1344]

let's see. new member posting this one month before eras can be submitted.

 

[fun8stuff]

they talk like a med student...

 

[SrRadiologyRes]

You're a complete fool. How does "being a terrible resident" have anything to do with it? Board certified is board certified. How does "being a terrible resident" come into play? I haven't taken oral boards yet though, we do that in June. If I was to fail boards then I wouldn't get a job regardless of the job market. However, there are now very few jobs. Anyone who says otherwise is a liar or has another agenda. Check out radworking.com for more info.


2012 match 85 unmatched spots. Radiology is no longer competitive, why do you figure that is? Read Outcomes in the Match you buffoon.

 

[diagonal]

OP has a point. I'm not sure what you guys do. Got a CXR today and read the **** out of it. And I want to go into psychiatry. Stay strong my radiologist friends.

 

[Dr. USMLE]

.

 

[Dr. USMLE]

How does "being a terrible resident" come into play?

2012 match 85 unmatched spots. Radiology is no longer competitive, why do you figure that is? Read Outcomes in the Match you buffoon.

Wow...you don't understand how being a terrible resident comes into play for job prospects?

Regarding unmatched spots, you don't seem to understand the game that programs play. The overwhelming majority of unmatched spots went to very competitive candidates. In quite a few cases, more competitive than those who matched originally.

 

[IJL]

I'm an MS3 strongly considering radiology, but posts like the OP's scare me (even though I think he is just trolling). It's hard to know who to listen to.

Anybody have any insight or opinions on the future of rads?

 

[cowme]

You're a complete fool. How does "being a terrible resident" have anything to do with it? Board certified is board certified. How does "being a terrible resident" come into play? I haven't taken oral boards yet though, we do that in June. If I was to fail boards then I wouldn't get a job regardless of the job market. However, there are now very few jobs. Anyone who says otherwise is a liar or has another agenda. Check out radworking.com for more info.


2012 match 85 unmatched spots. Radiology is no longer competitive, why do you figure that is? Read Outcomes in the Match you buffoon.

Im a complete fool? You dont think that employers usually like to know something about you before paying you hundreds of thousands of dollars? They will ALWAYS ask your attendings how you were in residency. If they say you suck, and are lazy, but are competent enough pass a test, you aren't going to get a job.

And wtf are you complaining about if you are an R4 without a fellowship? Of course you aren't going to find a good job that way.

To med students applying. Feel free to pm me with any legitimate concerns. This guy is a blatant troll. He Is 10 months from finishing residency, in a field where a fellowship Is essential to getting a good job (in fact, it's becoming a requirement next year)

 

[cowme]

OP has a point. I'm not sure what you guys do. Got a CXR today and read the **** out of it. And I want to go into psychiatry. Stay strong my radiologist friends.

You think I can't listen a 15 year old's BS sob story and prescribe him ssri's? Interpreting one study in the most simplistic modality in our field isn't anything to brag about...

 

[shark2000]

OP has a point. I'm not sure what you guys do. Got a CXR today and read the **** out of it. And I want to go into psychiatry. Stay strong my radiologist friends.

If you think reading a CXR is easy, you don't know anything about CXR.

 

[EeePC1005PR]

If you think reading a CXR is easy, you don't know anything about CXR.

CXR is really hard. It's like stacking all the CT slices together and give you 1 view, and expect you to report on it. And all the overlapping ghosts screw with your mind big time.

 

[DrBowtie]

Actually, I've found AM to be more doom and gloom than unicorns and fairies.

I don't think there are many other fields that I'd enjoy. Trudging along through my prelim year is already painful, no chance I'd sign on for another 2 years.

 

[MossPoh]

Soylent green is radiologyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!

 

[Asp]

I'm an MS3 strongly considering radiology, but posts like the OP's scare me (even though I think he is just trolling). It's hard to know who to listen to.

Anybody have any insight or opinions on the future of rads?

The job market is indeed bad. The big money is still there if you're location and fellowship subspecialization flexible, but radiologists are working 4-5% harder for the same amount of money compared to a few years ago with the recent CMS cuts. Radiology is no longer a lifestyle specialty (if it ever was). Private practice: when you work you work like a dog. Academics is cush but half the pay. Radiology still has some advantages in its scalability, patient independence (plenty of vacation time), and location independence via telerads.

Personally I would still pick radiology, but it's not all peaches.

 

[IJL]

The job market is indeed bad. The big money is still there if you're location and fellowship subspecialization flexible, but radiologists are working 4-5% harder for the same amount of money compared to a few years ago with the recent CMS cuts. Radiology is no longer a lifestyle specialty (if it ever was). Private practice: when you work you work like a dog. Academics is cush but half the pay. Radiology still has some advantages in its scalability, patient independence (plenty of vacation time), and location independence via telerads.

Personally I would still pick radiology, but it's not all peaches.

Thanks for the response.

May I ask you why you picked radiology in the first place?

 

[MossPoh]

Many of the problems cited with working harder for less pay per case aren't unique to radiology. With the exclusion of the specialties that can get paid out-of-pocket, it is pretty universal across all specialties. Even those out-of-pocket specialties have seen a slow down with current economic climate.

My hunch is that now is a bad time for radiology jobs because it is a career that lends itself to working longer and many retirement age radiologists took a significant hit on their retirement funds. I don't think it is wise to choose a specialty based on hypothetical prospects in 6+ years, unless there are significant indicators that it will be a prolonged problem or you have very strict living requirements.

Where I am now just hired 5 new radiologists, another group in a different city hired 3 new radiologists and I know of another group in a less desireable locale that has been searching for 2 more docs for a while now. (Aside from the locale, the hospital is great with lots of new equipment and friendly people) I knew of those without even actively searching for gigs.

 

[ar2388]

I just want to say that I agree with Cowme... its not only about passing your boards. how many publications do you have? any first author? have you done a lot of research or toher contributions to the field? do your attendings trust you and your reads? are you often wrong in your reads which leads to attendings often making addendums that impact patient care?
The important this is: WHY would people want to hire you? you need to give them a reason, not just expect someone to hire you just because you passed the boards.
and yes, you need a fellowship... i havent heard of ANYONE in radiology from my instituion applying for jobs before doing a fellowship.

 

[cowme]

I just want to say that I agree with Cowme... its not only about passing your boards. how many publications do you have? any first author? have you done a lot of research or toher contributions to the field?

These matter in academia...but don't matter for squat in private practice (where the majority of us will end up).

do your attendings trust you and your reads? are you often wrong in your reads which leads to attendings often making addendums that impact patient care?

In reality, this is all that really matters for a PP job . An attending will not stick his neck out for a crappy resident who will constantly mess up; it looks bad for the attending's credibility. If an attending knows you are going to be a rock star for a group (give clear, concise, reports, and work well with clinicians) he will vouch for you in a heartbeat

 

[shark2000]

The most helpful thing in job hunting is knowing people. Most pp groups do not give a crap about your research background.If you go to a large academic center in the region that you want to practice, after 5 years you will know about 200 people in that area including all the fellows in that 5 years, most of these people are practicing in the same region. Also your attendings who have been in the same program for 20 years, may know half of the practicing radiologists in the region. Now, do the math.


This is the most important reason that jobs esp good omes are mostly not advertised. And also this makes job hunting for graduates of smaller programs much harder.

 

[cowme]

This is the most important reason that jobs esp good omes are mostly not advertised. And also this makes job hunting for graduates of smaller programs much harder.

Is this actually true though, or just more speculation? I mean, I understand why in theory it should work, but at the same time, these attendings also have proportionally more residents to find jobs for. Helping 3 residents find jobs sounds a bit easier than helping 15.

I go to a relatively small program, and none of the recent grads I've heard about had too tough of a time finding jobs (granted, they all had pretty great fellowships)

 

[shark2000]

Is this actually true though, or just more speculation? I mean, I understand why in theory it should work, but at the same time, these attendings also have proportionally more residents to find jobs for. Helping 3 residents find jobs sounds a bit easier than helping 15.

I go to a relatively small program, and none of the recent grads I've heard about had too tough of a time finding jobs (granted, they all had pretty great fellowships)

Generally speaking finding a job is not as tough as people say. It is just no way close to 6 years ago. In 2006 one of my friends had more than 10 job offers in one of the largest metropolitan areas.


Anyway, finding a job is a gamble. I know people who went to small programs and find great jobs. Believe me, you will be fine. Don't listen to what people say. If you go to a smaller program go to a big program for fellowship which is not really difficult if you are geographically flexible and you will find the connections. On the other hand many smaller programs send their graduates to bigger fellowships and hire them back.


As long as you are proactive and socially reasonable you will find your way.

 

[russellb]

My hunch is that now is a bad time for radiology jobs because it is a career that lends itself to working longer and many retirement age radiologists took a significant hit on their retirement funds.

This is likely correct. Radiologists can continue working, often part-time, well into their senior years.

You dont think that employers usually like to know something about you before paying you hundreds of thousands of dollars? They will ALWAYS ask your attendings how you were in residency. If they say you suck, and are lazy, but are competent enough pass a test, you aren't going to get a job.

This is 100% correct. As someone who makes the final decision regarding hiring for a fairly large group, I can tell you that unless I were desperate from a manpower point of view, I would not hire someone who did not have solid references. If the quality of your work is suspect, or if you are known as a personality problem, then finding a decent job will be tough.