loca Dr. chica

Junior Member
10+ Year Member
Mar 28, 2005
47
0
Status
I was looking to do an away rotation at UCSF's new EM program. I'm strongly considering EM, but want to use this rotation to finalize my decision and see if I like the day-to-day aspects of it. I would ideally like to learn a lot, see trauma, and learn some basic procedures. There are also 2 options, Parnassus (which I think is Moffit?) and SFGH. Does anyone have any ideas on which one may be better in terms of experiences (incl. trauma), teaching or faculty? I was wondering if any of the residents who interviewed there or are currently there could comment on the quality of learning/variety of cases/med student or resident experiences at the 2 hospitals and at UCSF in general.

Also heard that UCSF (at least in other specialties) is notorious for not giving interview invites to visiting students who rotated there. Is this true for EM as well?

Thanks.
 

Hard24Get

The black sleepymed
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Feb 3, 2006
4,768
2
In my skin, when I jump out you jump in!
Status
Resident [Any Field]
SFGH is the only level 1 trauma center in the city.

Yes, Parnassus is the same as Moffett-Long Hospital (it's the street it's on).

I had the impression the faculty might be the same at the two hospitals, but I don't know for sure.
To my knowledge the only attending that works shifts at both hospitals is Dr. Promes, the PD :)love:).

I think SFGH might be a better place to rotate, only because it is so county, with so many sick patients! The teaching seems excellent both places, as the medicine and highland residents (only SFGH) that rotate through can attest to. All things being equal, I think it is good to experience both type of EDs. I'm sure they would let you do a couple shifts at the hospital you didn't chose.

The only criteria UCSF EM seems to consistently use for resident selection is superstar status, as evidenced by the vast majority of their incoming class being AOA. :smuggrin:
 

plasticcigar

Med stud
10+ Year Member
Feb 9, 2008
13
0
California
Status
Medical Student
since we all know that the most thoughtful, compassionate, and caring people get AOA. It will be interesting to see if that turns out to be a smart way to pick residents.
 

pseudoknot

Lifetime Donor
15+ Year Member
Jan 1, 2004
2,925
5
41
Hershey, PA
Status
Attending Physician
I'm sure there were plenty of AOA members they passed over as well, or at least ranked lower. It's an SDN myth that people who are academically strong are bad with people. There is a surprising number of people who are smart, socially gifted, athletic, etc., and these are the people who rise to the top.

And then there are people like me...oh well...
 

Hard24Get

The black sleepymed
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Feb 3, 2006
4,768
2
In my skin, when I jump out you jump in!
Status
Resident [Any Field]
I'm sure there were plenty of AOA members they passed over as well, or at least ranked lower. It's an SDN myth that people who are academically strong are bad with people. There is a surprising number of people who are smart, socially gifted, athletic, etc., and these are the people who rise to the top.

And then there are people like me...oh well...
I was actually kidding about the AOA selection criteria. They seemed to search for those with a history of leadership and accomplishment for their inaugural class, and I think exemplary clinical grades, etc, go along with this. The people I know who matched there are just delightful. :)
 

pseudoknot

Lifetime Donor
15+ Year Member
Jan 1, 2004
2,925
5
41
Hershey, PA
Status
Attending Physician
I was actually kidding about the AOA selection criteria. They seemed to search for those with a history of leadership and accomplishment for their inaugural class, and I think exemplary clinical grades, etc, go along with this. The people I know who matched there are just delightful. :)
Well, it's a moot point to say you're kidding when you make a true statement. Anyway, it's clear that they had a lot more going for them than just the numbers.
 

overthebars

10+ Year Member
Oct 3, 2007
78
0
LBC
Status
Resident [Any Field]
sfgh should be way more interesting than moffit, that being said i'd go for highland over both of them. that place was so rad
 

EM Cowgirl

10+ Year Member
Feb 28, 2008
11
0
Status
Resident [Any Field]
Having spent time in both EDs, I'd highly recommend a rotation at SFGH. Great trauma, outstanding attendings, very hands-on learning with lots of autonomy and variety. You'll do everything from reducing shoulders to throwing in a needle thoracostomy in a trauma to working up funky ID stuff. The attendings generally let you do as much as you are comfortable with and are love to teach. The Parnassus/Moffit ED is a bit slower paced, more teaching but less hands-on, fewer and shorter shifts (not as much time to really get involved and feel a part of the department). Both have excellent attendings, and honestly it's hard to go wrong, but if you want the true SF ED experience it's got to be SFGH.
 

roja

7+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Oct 20, 2003
6,040
19
47
NYC--->San Francisco
Status
Attending Physician
So, as my ID isn't really that much of a secret, I would say, rotate at SF general. (I will be the new Assistant Residency Director there and the Director of UME for the Parnassus site).

The Parnassus site is a level 2, meaning you will not see as much trauma. If you are trying to make a career deciding rotation, take the General site.

Currently, the faculty do not split. Dr. Prommes does. Hopefully, after a forrest worth of paperwork, I will.
 

theCamel

wessssside
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Sep 18, 2006
181
2
Status
Resident [Any Field]
I was looking to do an away rotation at UCSF's new EM program. I'm strongly considering EM, but want to use this rotation to finalize my decision and see if I like the day-to-day aspects of it. I would ideally like to learn a lot, see trauma, and learn some basic procedures. There are also 2 options, Parnassus (which I think is Moffit?) and SFGH. Does anyone have any ideas on which one may be better in terms of experiences (incl. trauma), teaching or faculty? I was wondering if any of the residents who interviewed there or are currently there could comment on the quality of learning/variety of cases/med student or resident experiences at the 2 hospitals and at UCSF in general.

Also heard that UCSF (at least in other specialties) is notorious for not giving interview invites to visiting students who rotated there. Is this true for EM as well?

Thanks.
i'd definitely go to SFGH, what a cool place. i spent some time in the ED there and really liked the faculty and staff. there are too many superstars there to list in this msg, but definitely go there for a month. i've heard good things about highland too, but for what it's worth i did have 3 friends rotate there who didn't even choose to interview there after their month. they might be the exception though, rather than the rule.
 

Flopotomist

I love the Chicago USPS
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
May 22, 2005
3,216
15
Status
Resident [Any Field]
i'd definitely go to SFGH, what a cool place. i spent some time in the ED there and really liked the faculty and staff. there are too many superstars there to list in this msg, but definitely go there for a month. i've heard good things about highland too, but for what it's worth i did have 3 friends rotate there who didn't even choose to interview there after their month. they might be the exception though, rather than the rule.
I worked in the ED at Highland for 4 years before medical school - and can attest to its awesomeness. The attendings are top-notch, the patient population has amazing and varied pathology, the residents that they tend to attract are fun and interesting. I am amazed that anybody that rotated there would choose to not interview there.
 

78222

Guest
10+ Year Member
Sep 11, 2005
8,904
5
l33thuania
Status
Medical Student
So, as my ID isn't really that much of a secret, I would say, rotate at SF general. (I will be the new Assistant Residency Director there and the Director of UME for the Parnassus site).
Woah, I was thinking about planning my away rotation there:eek::eek:
 

Flopotomist

I love the Chicago USPS
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
May 22, 2005
3,216
15
Status
Resident [Any Field]
So, as my ID isn't really that much of a secret, I would say, rotate at SF general. (I will be the new Assistant Residency Director there and the Director of UME for the Parnassus site).

The Parnassus site is a level 2, meaning you will not see as much trauma. If you are trying to make a career deciding rotation, take the General site.

Currently, the faculty do not split. Dr. Prommes does. Hopefully, after a forrest worth of paperwork, I will.
So in a few years remember all the nice things I have said about you over the years here on SDN Roja! Also notice my mad super-squirrel outfit, and my dashing fur! I also tap dance and play the accordian - who could be more fun to spend a few years teaching?

**note, accordian and tap dancing skills may or may not be actually reflected in reality.**
 

theCamel

wessssside
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
Sep 18, 2006
181
2
Status
Resident [Any Field]
So in a few years remember all the nice things I have said about you over the years here on SDN Roja! Also notice my mad super-squirrel outfit, and my dashing fur! I also tap dance and play the accordian - who could be more fun to spend a few years teaching?

**note, accordian and tap dancing skills may or may not be actually reflected in reality.**
roja i cringed when i read your last post : ) you're in for a lot of these kinds of posts lol
 

RxnMan

Who, me? A doctor?
Moderator Emeritus
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Jan 13, 2006
4,112
15
Somewhere in time and relative dimensions in space
Status
Medical Student

pdp2001

pdp2001
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Jul 12, 2005
51
0
35
chicago
Status
Attending Physician
i just got my acceptance letter for parnassus. i have to say, i'm a little disappointed since i really wanted to be at sfgh. does anyone have any advice on how to get the most out of a level 2 center rotation? the ones i've rotated through so far have a lot less hands-on than the level 1.
 

roja

7+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Oct 20, 2003
6,040
19
47
NYC--->San Francisco
Status
Attending Physician
You will get plenty of hands on.

How do you make the most of it? Work hard, see patients, read, ask questions.
 

pdp2001

pdp2001
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Jul 12, 2005
51
0
35
chicago
Status
Attending Physician
i guess i should have been more clear. the level II i'm at now isn't the most student-friendly place. only 1 resident rotates through there each month. unlike my level 1 center where i have residents constantly around to ask questions to, the level II docs for the most part treat the MSIV like a chore. i'm not the only that feels this way, so i wanted to know more about what parnassus is like. i don't know what to expect in terms of learning environment in a place that residents don't do most of their shifts at.
 

roja

7+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Oct 20, 2003
6,040
19
47
NYC--->San Francisco
Status
Attending Physician
I am not sure what you are referring to. The residents split thier shifts between Moffitt and the General. Highland and Stanford also rotate through both EDs. Other residents also rotate in the ED.
 

Eric1332

Junior Member
7+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Jan 29, 2004
15
0
Visit site
Status
Hi all, just wanted to post to give you some info and answer some questions. I'm an intern in the new UCSF-SFGH program.

For your 4th year Sub-I, either ED is great:
-UCSF (Moffit) is the gateway to a world-class tertiary care hospital. The patients are really sick, and although it is not a trauma center, there are plenty of procedures (ie. suturing, central lines, I&D's, tons of ultrasound) to be had. The faculty are stellar, great teachers, and fun to work with.
-SFGH ("The General") is SF's only level 1 trauma center and serves a slightly-less sick, more indigent population. Also lots of procedures, great staff, and some trauma. I wouldn't be too worries about seeing trauma as a medical student, you'll see PLENTY in your residency, I promise. During your rotation at either ED, set up a couple of tag-along or shadow shifts with a resident or attending at the other ED to get a feel for it. Michelle Lin (SFGH) or Chris Fee (UCSF) can help with this. Also try to meet up with Susan Promes and Michelle Lin to talk about the program. You're welcome at conference, journal club, etc. or whenever we all go out and have fun.

As for the faculty, there are about 4-5 who work in both ED's. I am so impressed with everyone here, with their academic involvements, clinical knowledge, teaching skills, and awesome personalities.

The program is going great, the education is amazing, and the off-service rotations are so awesome. I'm a little biased, but I think we have one of the best intern years in the country as far as EM goes. Just look at the stats.

As for our class, there are 12 of us. Some of us are AOA. We're from all over the country. Most of us have done some sort of leadership activities. We're fun, we love EM, and we love SF. Our bios and emails are on the website, so email any of us with questions.

There is not likely a numerical or AOA cutoff to match at any EM residency, and it's my true belief that in this specialty in particular, clinical performance and extracurricular involvement are more important than numbers, and all the SAEM match stats support that.

Anyway, I was too lazy to read all the posts but email me if you have any questions:

Email: [email protected]
Website: http://www.emresidency.ucsf.edu

Best of luck this season!
 

NeuroSync

Every day is a good day
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Jan 22, 2005
487
0
Puget Sound
Status
Attending Physician
I am not sure what you are referring to. The residents split thier shifts between Moffitt and the General. Highland and Stanford also rotate through both EDs. Other residents also rotate in the ED.
As of next year, Stanford residents will no longer rotate in SF, but will instead spend more time at Santa Clara Valley.
 

Eric1332

Junior Member
7+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Jan 29, 2004
15
0
Visit site
Status
Stanford residents (the 2's and 3's rotate at the General) are phasing out. Next year only their 3's will come (we'll be 2's), then the following year they will be done.
 

NeuroSync

Every day is a good day
10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Jan 22, 2005
487
0
Puget Sound
Status
Attending Physician
Stanford residents (the 2's and 3's rotate at the General) are phasing out. Next year only their 3's will come (we'll be 2's), then the following year they will be done.
Thanks for the clarification. The phase out makes sense as the new UCSF program fills...