MD Away Rotations for General Surgery

[mehc012]

Hey all,
So M3 is winding up and it's time for me to start planning my M4. I've decided to apply into general surgery (woo!) and fortunately, have a little extra time in my schedule before applications are due.

I've been considering doing an away rotation. Now, I know that they're not required for GS, and in fact are sometimes considered risky, as you can make yourself look bad quite easily. However, I've done very well in clinicals, getting honors in every rotation I've completed thus far and getting good comments on my knowledge, work ethic, and being generally a pleasure to work with. I'm fairly confident that I could do well in an away, if I were to choose to do one.

That being said...any other reason I should not do an away?
And, if I choose to do one, what would be a good time for one? I was thinking after applications go in, but before interview season goes into full swing. However, I could also probably manage August, if that's better. Or even September, assuming I get everything in order before then for my application.


I will have 3 home AIs with letters, hopefully, so I don't need the letter from the away so much as I was hoping to use it to up my chances at one of the programs in the area I would most like to practice in (New England).
My application will overall be fairly strong, with a very solid Step score, straight or near-straight honors in clinicals (depending on how this last one goes), some good extracurricular interests. The main weak point, and the reason that I'm considering doing an audition as a final boost, is that I have little research (though I am putting a lot of effort into rectifying that right now, I will almost certainly not have meaningful pubs by application season...but I will have some projects to talk about, and perhaps a case report. Basically enough involvement to hopefully make that not stand out as a glaring hole/red flag, but not up to par, and certainly not enough to be an asset).

Any other suggestions?

Thanks all

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[NotaCop]

Do one away. At the very least, seeing another program will be valuable perspective when it comes time to make a rank list. Whether you do it at your top choice or a school you are less invested in, up to you how much risk you’d like to take. One common piece of advice is that if they didn’t like you at the away, you probably wouldn’t have wanted to match there anyways (could lead to 5-6 miserable years) so the “risk” of bombing at your top choice may not be so risky after all.

As for your timeline, you’re way off. You want this done before 9/15, not after. The latest you’d want to do it is August. Some of the most value you’ll get from the away is in the 1-2 LORs you’ll ask for. They show people reviewing your application that you actually are decent, and it’s not just your home program saying nice things about you. Bonus points if you go to a program that has some big names in the field who can write a letter. You may want to avoid early summer due to new interns, but many just do it anyway. Still, ideal timing for you might be to start August 1. Do an AI/Sub-I at your home program just before you go to get yourself in good shape and then pull out all the stops to crush it.

Just my 2 cents as a fellow student in the clinical years. Take with a grain of salt if you must

 

[mehc012]

I mean, I wasn't too worried about the LOR from the away. I think my app will be pretty solid without them. The idea of the away was more to make a particular program aware of me/like me, which I think could be done after the application submission, so long as it's before they make their rank list.

For my homes, I was planning on having 3 different rotations in three different, large hospital systems, at least one of which is very well known and will have big names in the field. That's why I wasn't too concerned about the LOR from my away.

 

[NotaCop]

Correct me if I'm wrong but if you did an away somewhere and did not get a letter, it would be a very reasonable assumption to think that you performed poorly and thus could not/did not ask for a letter for that reason. Thus it could end up harming you across the board if PDs perceive it that way.

You should definitely let others chime in here before making a decision, just sharing my two cents

 

[mehc012]

Correct me if I'm wrong but if you did an away somewhere and did not get a letter, it would be a very reasonable assumption to think that you performed poorly and thus could not/did not ask for a letter for that reason. Thus it could end up harming you across the board if PDs perceive it that way.

You should definitely let others chime in here before making a decision, just sharing my two cents

I thought you could add LORs even after submitting ERAS?
Further, if I did an away in, say, October, wouldn't it be fairly obvious why I did not have an LOR on my application that went out in September?

 

[NotaCop]

I thought you could add LORs even after submitting ERAS?
Further, if I did an away in, say, October, wouldn't it be fairly obvious why I did not have an LOR on my application that went out in September?

Valid point, yes

 

[mehc012]

Valid point, yes

Sorry, not to solicit advice and then do nothing but argue. I was sort of hoping to garner at least a couple responses, though, ideally from one of the surgeons who tend to lurk around here.
Ah, well...this is why I'm meeting with people in real life for their advice!

 

[NotaCop]

Sorry, not to solicit advice and then do nothing but argue. I was sort of hoping to garner at least a couple responses, though, ideally from one of the surgeons who tend to lurk around here.
Ah, well...this is why I'm meeting with people in real life for their advice!

No no you’re right, I neglected that timing aspect of your post. My response was short as I was in a rush, sorry!

The traditional strategy for surgical AIs is to do them early to obtain LORs and to audition. You seem to care less about that, so while I’d still recommend the traditional strategy you can be fine doing a late away and not getting a letter if your main concern is just seeing another program. I’m not sure it will be as high yield as doing it the traditional route though. Ultimately, your call!

 

[Rekt]

It sounds like you have a strong application and will be fine regardless. My thought would be that you would want to do at least one "trial" away before the place you want to go. Although I'm a DO, many many of my classmates that are doing/already matched GS did several aways and all agreed that it was incredibly helpful. I honestly believe aways are the way to go. It makes you a stronger candidate in my opinion and shows that you know what you're getting into. I would include letters from the aways. They will be more impressive than some dumb FM clinic letter.