Did you guys do away rotations 4th year? Do you feel its necessary/helpful in path? Any ones that you would recommend in the northeast, or not recommend? Thanks for any help in advance.
away rotations
- Thread starter dr.weiner
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nope, didn't do one. don't feel it hurt me along the interview trail. if you have a clearcut #1 and think you can impress them, and you have the financial resources to make it happen, consider it.
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I did an away elective. I think that if there's a program you think is a "best fit" for you now, this is a good time to go and spend a month there to make sure you like the program (and a career in path as well).
For me, I found that the program I had as my pre-applications #1 was NOT a good fit for me, and I'm really glad that I got a chance to figure that out.
You obviously DON'T have to do this, but if you do well in your rotation you can show that program how interested you are in them.
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I wasn't able to, due to my program scheduling constraints and the fact that I have a family... and I don't think it hurt me at all. I do think it would be nice to get to live, work and breathe inside a program for a couple of weeks before making the plunge into residency. Still, I would've had to do like 5 away rotations to cover all my bases.
I met at least one person who did a post-sophmore fellowship at a well known place and was told they were ranked to match before ultimately being screwed over by said program on match day, so I don't think doing an away rotation is necessarily a way to get a "lock" on someplace, either...
BH
I met at least one person who did a post-sophmore fellowship at a well known place and was told they were ranked to match before ultimately being screwed over by said program on match day, so I don't think doing an away rotation is necessarily a way to get a "lock" on someplace, either...
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b&ierstiefel
Do an away rotation at your own risk. I've posted on this before. You can find out a lot about a program by spending a month with them, yes. However, if you do something inadvertantly to irritate people, that can go a long way to hurt you. I've been here a few years...I've seen it happen to about half the people who have done rotations here. And we've been medical students before so we know med students are on their best behavior on rotations but the stuff we've seen is sometimes laughable and asinine (like boasting a step 2 score in the residents room by yelling it out for everyone to know--I wasn't there but I fell out of my chair when I heard about this).
Dr. Weiner...I would recommend my program for an outside rotation since you get to work with residents but especially because there are didactics on topics taught to you at the scope. I didn't get that at my home institution's rotation and I see med students enjoying that a lot. One piece of advice though...if you are going to do an away rotation, do it during July, August, or September. Then you won't have to give a talk at the end of your rotation...I've seen the performance of that talk really screw people here, and these were cool people we liked! But doing a bad job on that talk (and expectations are high) can potentially negate the positive impressions you make so if you come here, do yourself a favor and come during the summer.
A few people here have done rotations at another hospital in the area (the one across the river to the north) and said positive things about that rotations too. Both places are busy centers where you will see a lot and not be bored.
Dr. Weiner...I would recommend my program for an outside rotation since you get to work with residents but especially because there are didactics on topics taught to you at the scope. I didn't get that at my home institution's rotation and I see med students enjoying that a lot. One piece of advice though...if you are going to do an away rotation, do it during July, August, or September. Then you won't have to give a talk at the end of your rotation...I've seen the performance of that talk really screw people here, and these were cool people we liked! But doing a bad job on that talk (and expectations are high) can potentially negate the positive impressions you make so if you come here, do yourself a favor and come during the summer.
A few people here have done rotations at another hospital in the area (the one across the river to the north) and said positive things about that rotations too. Both places are busy centers where you will see a lot and not be bored.
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So what are some of the more memorable/common blunders med students make? (concentrate on the funny ones, though! 🙂)
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Along these lines, I am debating on whether or not to do an away at the University of Utah (I would really like to end up there for residency). Has anyone done rotations there? Is it intense, or laid back?
Ultimately, if that's where I want to go, does anyone with experience at Utah recommend going/not going?
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I agree with Bierstiefel. Rotations serve two purposes: 1) you get to know the program better and 2) the program gets to know you better. If you can't act like a normal human being for 2-4 weeks, I suggest you not do one (or do one and at least give the residents a chance to make sure that you don't match at their program by telling the PD that you sucked and that we would rather go unfilled than have you, but I digress....)
I'm glad that I did an away at a program I was considering, it gave me a chance to meet the residents, get a feel for the attendings and the environment, and ultimately showed me that I didn't want to be at that place for 4 years.
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b&ierstiefel
I can't remember the funny ones...in fact, when a med student gives a bad talk, I feel really bad for them. It's actually painful to watch rather than something to laugh at.
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In general, rotations should help you, especially if you aren't that great on paper. However, you absolutely positively can screw yourself too. I know for a fact that both situations have happened here (a mediocre candidate on paper gets ranked b/c of a strong rotation, a strong candidate drops entirely off the rank list b/c of a crummy rotation).
I can't say it enough. Programs are looking for sane people who are enjoyable to be around and work with. If you can't fake those two traits for a four week rotation, then you better not do one.
I can't say it enough. Programs are looking for sane people who are enjoyable to be around and work with. If you can't fake those two traits for a four week rotation, then you better not do one.
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I can't think of a better way to get a feel for the structure and atmosphere of a program than by doing an away rotation and I'd imagine that a student could create a very strong impression of him or herself by delivering a decent talk. At your program, how far in advance are students assigned a topic for their presentation and are the expectations made clear to them?
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b&ierstiefel
Here, students pick their own topic. Residents here are more than happy to help students with topic selection and I highly suggest students to get the low-down regarding what is expected.
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How much is typically expected of a 4th year student?
I'm not worried about getting along with residents, etc., but more worried because honestly, I don't know much and if they have any expectations then I'm bound to look pretty stupid. I don't know if my patented shrugging of the shoulders followed by a trailing "uhhhhh...." will last 4 weeks.
I'm not worried about getting along with residents, etc., but more worried because honestly, I don't know much and if they have any expectations then I'm bound to look pretty stupid. I don't know if my patented shrugging of the shoulders followed by a trailing "uhhhhh...." will last 4 weeks.
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My experience is that the 4th year student is held to quite a low standard. If, for example, you read a little bit of the Robbins GI chapter and can pick out a few things on histology, you look quite good.
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Actually I think it is more important not to try and seem like you know something when you don't.
Reading Robbins and reviewing histology is good. But don't try and out diagnosis the resident (not because they don't want to be shown up, but more likely you are way off).
I remember one Med student who tried to Dx RCC every time he saw something that looked even vaguely clear cell.
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Actually I think it is more important not to try and seem like you know something when you don't.
Reading Robbins and reviewing histology is good. But don't try and out diagnosis the resident (not because they don't want to be shown up, but more likely you are way off).
I remember one Med student who tried to Dx RCC every time he saw something that looked even vaguely clear cell.
Yes I think that should hold up for any rotation. In general, I would not really interject diagnoses at all, unless specifically asked. Asking reasonable questions is always good, but if in doubt, I would err on the side of asking less. For almost all of my med school rotations I went with the strategy of asking an occasional reasonable question and otherwise keeping quiet.
But what I am saying is, any "diagnosing" I would ever have to do would be in the form of pimping, which did not get more severe than tubular adenoma/hyperplastic polyp or "Name some ovarian tumors." And even if you don't know that sort of thing for the first time you're asked, you may get a second chance with a different attending later. Anyhow, that's how my rotations went. Maybe if you're at WashU they pimp on advanced topics.
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b&ierstiefel
Little to none. Seriously, just relax on these rotations, act cool, and take it all in. That will be sufficient to come across as a hero...cuz you don't wanna be seen as a zero.
