AZCOM Rotations--One perspective

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

LukeWhite

USC Pulm/CCM 2014
15+ Year Member
20+ Year Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2002
Messages
829
Reaction score
8
Since every now and then there are threads debating whether AZCOM's preceptor setup and lack of a teaching hospital are good things, I thought I'd provide my experience with setting up third year rotations. Hopefully others will do the same, and give those of you still considering which school to attend some perspective.

First, the bad:

--Setting up rotations at AZCOM requires more work and willingness to travel than at other schools. If you feel as if you'll have no time at all to investigate rotations, AZCOM's setup might be problematic. I emailed and met twice with the clinical ed department looking for specific rotation recommendations, and didn't get too far.

The good:

--When I *did* start researching rotations, things fell into place quickly. Looking through the evlauations and deciding on potential leads should take no more than 8-12 hours; I spent about half that time.

I sacrificed some class time making up a list of docs who seemed to get the best evaluations and who seemed to practice the type of medicine I wanted to learn in each specialty. I brought this in to the clinical ed office, and my third year rotations were set up within half an hour.

Some important things I learned that I think have gotten overlooked in past threads on AZCOM's rotations:

--AZCOM's setup gives you the chance to tailor your instructors to what you want to do. I'm set on broad-scope, procedure-heavy family practice. In a traditional system I wouldn't be able to focus heavily on this until fourth year. AZCOM's do-it-yourself system let me tailor ALL my rotations to this based on geography, evaluations, and clinical office recommendations. The small clinical ed office means that you'll do more work, but the options for personalization are far greater. Once I'd settled on a city for a surgery rotation, the clinical ed coordinator recommended two doctors and went into extensive detail on the merits of each. She gave her impression of various docs, recommended which ones would teach more, etc. Invaluable.

--AZCOM lets you set up your rotation schedule in an advantageous manner. As I understand, at most schools your order isn't up to you. This is also true at AZCOM if you compete for the Phoenix-based rotations that everyone wants. I scheduled all my rotations outside of Phoenix, though, which allowed me to set up my rotations such that I could frontload "training wheels" rotations in preparation for the more demanding months. Since we are working with individual docs or small groups, this isn't perfect; some docs aren't available at certain times. By and large, though, you can get the doc you want when you want if you're proactive.

--AZCOM offers plenty of housing support. All or nearly all of my rotations offer heavily subidized or free housing, allowing for the advantages of travel (my rotations are set up in several Arizona cities as well as three months home in Michigan) without the accompanying financial hardships. The clinical ed office was exemplary in making sure that the rotations I picked had adequate housing.

So to sum, these are the benefits I see without having been on any rotations yet. I fully expect that in third year I'll get far more of a chance to *do* stuff than I would elsewhere, which was my primary reason for choosing the school. It absolutely depends, as best as I can tell, on your wilingness to put in the time researching and to be willing to travel across Arizona a bit. For those willing to make that tradeoff, it seems a huge advantage over the traditional setup. I've found many of the claims made about the clinical ed office in the past to be overblown; hopefully this helps clarify the process a bit.
 
Thank you for the detailed post. I have accepted a spot in the 2009 class, but I'm still hoping to get into my state school (UW). I actually LIKED AZCOM better and really like the DO philosophy. However, I am married and my husband has a great neurology practice up here in the Northwest and so he will stay put, even if I need to leave for my first couple of years. One of the things that I really like about AZCOM is the flexibility with the clinical years. I am hoping to schedule most of my rotations in the Seattle/Tacoma/Olympia/Portland areas. It sounds like this is not an unrealistic expectation, based upon your post. Am I correct?
 
NeuroSync said:
Thank you for the detailed post. I have accepted a spot in the 2009 class, but I'm still hoping to get into my state school (UW). I actually LIKED AZCOM better and really like the DO philosophy. However, I am married and my husband has a great neurology practice up here in the Northwest and so he will stay put, even if I need to leave for my first couple of years. One of the things that I really like about AZCOM is the flexibility with the clinical years. I am hoping to schedule most of my rotations in the Seattle/Tacoma/Olympia/Portland areas. It sounds like this is not an unrealistic expectation, based upon your post. Am I correct?


You are absolutely correct. To my knowledge, there are rotations available in Portland and Wash state. I chose to stay in AZ for most of my rotations with two in TX- I'm in the Air Force, and the largest AF training facility is in TX. I agree with Luke's assessment. I have been assigned well-evaluated, heavy-procedural rotations in rural AZ. I don't mind traveling around the state. My husband and daughter will get to see me on the weekends. And the Clin Ed office was kind enough to consider my family while assigning rotations... meaning I travel one month for a rotation then I return to Phoenix for a month or two. I opted to stay in Phoenix and do the rotations that I'm pretty sure I'm not interested in pursuing as a career.

Congrats on your AZCOM acceptance, and best of luck for UW!

Cyndi
 
Neuro,

Like Cyndi said! It also looks as if a fair number of people do Washington State rotations, and nothing prevents you from setting up your rotations with docs AZCOM hasn't used before...given your husband's position, you probably have enough connections to do this easily.

AZCOM puts a 6 months out of system limit on third year, and requires that the first rotation be in state. However, you can petition to do all your rotations out of state, and if you floated this to the school even before you started they'd probably be very receptive to it.

It's a great school! UW is better, though, in my opinion. I'm sure it's no contest for you with the family situation and all, but if I had been able to get into UW, *that* would have been my first choice over any other school in the nation. UW's spectacular. Best of luck with the applying!
 
Cyndi and LukeWhite:
I cannot believe it...the day I post the question, I hear from UW. I'M IN! It's really hard to believe. This has been such a stressful process. I was worried that I wouldn't even know where I'd be going until weeks or days before I had to go. I feel numb. I'll wait a few days to celebrate, I think. That will give it time to sink in. I was quite certain that I'd at least have to pay the $1,000 deposit to AZCOM before I heard, because most applicants at UW don't hear until Apirl, and the final deposit is due March 1st at AZCOM. I dodged an expensive bullet, I guess.
Thank you very much for the responses and the information. It is my loss that I will not meet the two of you. 😉
Cheers,
Jennifer
 
Congratulations! You've definitely gotten into the dream school, and it's wonderful that you'll be able to stay near your family. Best of luck!
 
Thank you, Luke. 🙂 (Still in shock)
 
cdreed said:
You are absolutely correct. To my knowledge, there are rotations available in Portland and Wash state. I chose to stay in AZ for most of my rotations with two in TX- I'm in the Air Force, and the largest AF training facility is in TX. I agree with Luke's assessment. I have been assigned well-evaluated, heavy-procedural rotations in rural AZ. I don't mind traveling around the state. My husband and daughter will get to see me on the weekends. And the Clin Ed office was kind enough to consider my family while assigning rotations... meaning I travel one month for a rotation then I return to Phoenix for a month or two. I opted to stay in Phoenix and do the rotations that I'm pretty sure I'm not interested in pursuing as a career.

Congrats on your AZCOM acceptance, and best of luck for UW!

Cyndi

Hi Cyndi and Luke,

I am applying to AZCOM, I have an interview coming up on the 15th. I've been to a few open houses and have heard great things about the school. I remember when it first opened! (We drove up to see it) I've been accepted at TUCOM-NV 🙂 , but I would like to stay in AZ (I grew up here). I have a few questions regarding the rotations, you said you did the majority of your rotations in AZ? I also have a husband and children and am interested in doing at the majority of my 3rd year rotations in Arizona (rural would be fine). I hear about 3rd year alot on SDN, many people are happy to rotate back east, but because of my family I'd prefer to stay in AZ mostly. My husband and I have discussed 3rd rotations, and I told him I may have to spend 1/2 the year out of state. Of the rotations you did in AZ, did you do any OB? Any hospital rotations?

Any info would be great!
Thanks,
Virginia
 
Virgie said:
Hi Cyndi and Luke,

I am applying to AZCOM, I have an interview coming up on the 15th. I've been to a few open houses and have heard great things about the school. I remember when it first opened! (We drove up to see it) I've been accepted at TUCOM-NV 🙂 , but I would like to stay in AZ (I grew up here). I have a few questions regarding the rotations, you said you did the majority of your rotations in AZ? I also have a husband and children and am interested in doing at the majority of my 3rd year rotations in Arizona (rural would be fine). I hear about 3rd year alot on SDN, many people are happy to rotate back east, but because of my family I'd prefer to stay in AZ mostly. My husband and I have discussed 3rd rotations, and I told him I may have to spend 1/2 the year out of state. Of the rotations you did in AZ, did you do any OB? Any hospital rotations?

Any info would be great!
Thanks,
Virginia

Virginia,

Staying in Arizona is no problem, and if you're willing to do slightly rural rotations, there are many, many options. Hosptial-based rotations are a tricky subject, as different residency programs and fourth year externships have different criteria for what they'll consider hospital based. While it's easy to find a preceptor who is mainly in the hospital, this may not count as a "hospital-based" rotation. Still, you'll get the equivalent experience and likely more as you won't be buried three layers deep behind residents, interns, and fourth years.

So if you want to spend all your time in Arizona, you won't have a problem. Getting top-notch Phoenix rotations is tougher, but if you don't mind a little travel within Arizona, you could easily do all two years in state.

Congratulations on the acceptance and the AZCOM interview! It really is a fantastic school, and if you're not deadset on doing every rotation in the metro area, it sounds like it would be an excellent fit for you.
 
Top