Back to basics WW again

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Zensing said:
Correction, DVMD did.
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Oh I meant she never commented on the day assassination during the last basics game because she was in the middle of arguing, so I am leaning towards believing her on not remembering even if she was a wolf. That plus her playing a lot of games since then. I haven't played very many games so I don't know how easy it is to get confused between things that happen in multiple games.
 
WildZoo said:
That list was from near the end of the game when almost everyone was dead. I just copied and pasted and then filled in the roles that were revealed when the game ended. I did note that rojo was a 2 shot vig, and I think STL mentioned it too, but I posted that list before cdo revealed so it didn't necessarily mean anything. And neither of us remembered he had been a day vig.

If you look back to where Zen linked, I checked back in long after the situation with Deva had already been cleared up. As I said yesterday, day roles aren't unheard of, so since I wasn't around for the initial confusion, it really didn't stick in my brain. And yes, I've played quite a few games since then.
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Zensing said:
Can confirm that role names were included in the roster near the end of the last back to basics game.
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Okay, I must have missed it then. I thought it would be at the beginning of the game or after the game ended. And I couldn't find it in the search engine for some reason

Unlynch WZ
 
nyanko said:
ally: if I'd ever had my sights on you for any reason, you'd probably revise that a bit.
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The games I've played with you, you've been pretty quiet. [emoji4]
 
When zen brought up the situation with the vigilante in the last game, I did recall someone died mid-lynch and I thought it was weird, but I don't think I really understood how it happened until later in the game. I had honestly completely forgotten about it.
 
From skimming this morning:

I completely forgot it was a day vig last game even after really recently looking at roster. That is, imo, not a good reason for a lynch. Feels elsewhere, sure.

Lyra had a post yesterday that made me cringe and think she was implying a role, sounds like others noticed too.

I don't think wondering if someone who hasn't checked in at all - in a basics game where I wouldn't necessarily think there to be silenced roles - is still an active player is unreasonable and not a question for the general thread. :shrug:

Stl is reading sketchy as normal but he's a fun player, keep him around. I still tend to think most wolves usually hide in the quieter noncomittal people.
 
I'm not super suspicious of the cdo voters, I think cdo ended up with a weird role that ended up getting her lynched, but I don't blame people for thinking that role was sketchy. I'm also thinking Ski is probably village, I feel like a wolf wouldn't try to start a lynch on someone random so early that might take off and end up lynching a villager. I just feel like that's too risky for a wolf on D1.

I don't really want to lynch STL either, I just think he's fun and pretty great at picking out wolves as long as he's village. I'm ok with keeping him around for a few more days and seeing where his ideas go. If he's obviously leading village astray, then we can lynch him. If he's onto something good, the wolves will probably kill him. Either way, I don't want to lynch there today.

I could still go with my snowy lynch from yesterday. I posted my feels yesterday and her posts today seem like they're trying to be helpful with figuring things out, but then don't really seem to go anywhere. I'm just getting a lot of feels there.
 
WildZoo said:
lynch jil
I'll stick with that for now. Don't y'all go and pile on and cause plurality to happen or something.
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I am going to reiterate this. Do not pile for plurality. I am pretty sure @Jilary
Still hasn't checked in. I want her defending, not just seeing a pile and day ending.
 
I was initially thinking that the early cdo votes would be a good place for a wolf to hide because of the confusion over her role. But I'm satisfied by all three of their responses for now. I am especially not concerned about otter right now for reasons I mentioned yesterday (for now, that is).

I do think we are barking up the wrong tree as far as the remembering the day vigilante from last game.

I am going to read back through posts this afternoon to see if I get any weird feels I didn't pick up on yesterday. I would not mind investigating further into some of the quiet players from yesterday.
 
Okay can we chill with the plurality crap? Unless I'm crazy, with 25-27 players we've gotten nowhere near hitting plurality this game. A little bit of pressure on someone isn't a bad thing, and all the hand wringing about it is annoying.
 
Trilt said:
Okay can we chill with the plurality crap? Unless I'm crazy, with 25-27 players we've gotten nowhere near hitting plurality this game. A little bit of pressure on someone isn't a bad thing, and all the hand wringing about it is annoying.
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:laugh: You always crack me up
 
Trilt said:
Okay can we chill with the plurality crap? Unless I'm crazy, with 25-27 players we've gotten nowhere near hitting plurality this game. A little bit of pressure on someone isn't a bad thing, and all the hand wringing about it is annoying.
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Plurality hits quickly in these games. You do NOT have to vote for someone to get "a little bit of pressure". It should be obvious enough that if multiple people mention your name as suspicious you should speak up. The idea that you have to vote for someone in order to apply pressure is just wrong.
 
Trilt said:
Okay can we chill with the plurality crap? Unless I'm crazy, with 25-27 players we've gotten nowhere near hitting plurality this game. A little bit of pressure on someone isn't a bad thing, and all the hand wringing about it is annoying.
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A little bit of pressure isn't, but it can be easy to forget how many votes have already been placed. If two or three people forget at the same time, and it's been a more chaotic cycle, that can be enough to tip towards plurality. I know that's not the situation that we're in now, but there's also several players who haven't experienced plurality rules before. Why not practice good habits now?

FWIW, I read villager for STL and null for Jilary. I'm holding off of voting because I'd rather lynch someone I read as wolf than a null. However, if there's not more discussion/direction on this issue by tomorrow morning, I'll probably vote Jilary to get this resolved. This is the type of issue that can easily take up too many day cycles.
 
DVMDream said:
Plurality hits quickly in these games. You do NOT have to vote for someone to get "a little bit of pressure". It should be obvious enough that if multiple people mention your name as suspicious you should speak up. The idea that you have to vote for someone in order to apply pressure is just wrong.
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Then we need to stop arguing that people defending after a vote or two is sketchy, which we haven't. :shrug:

I'm just saying all the hullabaloo and "oh god guyyysss don't hit plurality" with two freaking votes on is silly.
 
I am a bit surprised that the issue hasn't been addressed yet by Jilary due to all of the commotion last night. It might just be because of the long day cycle, but still
 
After skimming the threads above, I'm waiting for check-ins/comments from other posters. I don't have enough information or solid "feels" at this time.

[Given that Super Bowl begins pretty soon, I'm not sure if this thread will be overly active while the Super Bowl football game is on TV. But, I may be wrong.]
 
Doctor-S said:
After skimming the threads above, I'm waiting for check-ins/comments from other posters. I don't have enough information or solid "feels" at this time.

[Given that Super Bowl begins pretty soon, I'm not sure if this thread will be overly active while the Super Bowl football game is on TV. But, I may be wrong.]
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Pfffft American football. My hockey game is over so I'll be around the rest of the day now hahaha.🤣
 
So I agree that looking at queiter people might be at least an interesting way to look for some discussion today. With that said, I'd like to hear from:

Cyndia (3 posts yesterday/0 today). Didn't even make the 5 posts yesterday when it seemed pretty clear that such was the expectation.

Finn (3 posts yesterday/0 today). Same thing, didn't even make post count yesterday.

LIS - obviously no posts yesterday or today. But I have feels that something more is going on here based on prior posts about this?

AM (11 posts yesterday/3 today). While AM has been more active on the thread, almost every single post made has been a one liner with just about nothing useful added/no participation in discussion. This stood out to me when comparing to literally everyone else so far posting on the thread. Everyone else seems to have at least a few posts partaking in discussion.

Other quieter people that I'm not really suspicious of at this point but should be mentioned (though note that a lot of this people will likely be removed from this list as they seem to be quite active today):

Nyanko (5 posts yesterday/3 today)
HowConfusing (7 posts yesterday/2 today)
Kcoughli (9/0)
Mmmd (9/1)
Awesomenessity (5/1)


LEaving Zensing and DVMD off this list. Not many posts yesterday relatively, but both are on track to be much higher today. I'm also on the lower count for yesterday, but aiming to be more useful today.

*Note "Yesterday" and "Today" are referring to game day cycles.
 
nyanko said:
hurr durr lynch the quiet people
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I'm not saying to straight up lynch the quiet people. Just pointing out what I've noticed so far as a possible discussion route. Just trying to actually help game solve/put information out there for others to think about since I'm not super great at it :shrug:
 
nyanko said:
I understand cdo here, it's a lot easier to check in on snapchat/texts than read a WW thread and make coherent posts. I don't think this necessarily clears her, but I also don't think it means she's a wolf. I don't think it means anything honestly.
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Agree. But the important point is that people canNOT be suckered into NOT voting for someone just because they are (or claim to be?) busy in real life. It doesn't mean you're a wolf, but it doesn't mean you AREN'T.

If you have a reason to vote for someone and they claim "oh, I've just been busy" ... ignore it and vote for them.

I think it was .... TT? No. Hm. I can't remember who it was that had some legitimately REALLY ****ty stuff going on in life. Basically cried tears in the thread because I was voting for her. Talked about dropping out of the game, how cruel/mean I was. Etc.

And was a wolf.

You can't let real life intrude into whether you vote for someone or don't vote for them.
 
Abnerrs said:
Omg. I really don't think it's a big deal. I feel like this is seriously over thinking.
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Sketchy, Abs.

It might be overthinking, sure, but it's at least THINKING.

What's your proposal - just RNG every day, instead? There's not much to go on for D1 or D2 votes, so even a little bit hinky is a good vote. I don't know why you'd be trying to shut that down. Maybe just bad play, but....
 
SARdoghandler said:
AM (11 posts yesterday/3 today). While AM has been more active on the thread, almost every single post made has been a one liner with just about nothing useful added/no participation in discussion. This stood out to me when comparing to literally everyone else so far posting on the thread. Everyone else seems to have at least a few posts partaking in discussion.
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I noticed this as well, and I may lean this way for a lynch vote after I give it some more thought today.

SARdoghandler said:
Kcoughli (9/0)
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KC also kind of triggered feels for me, although I think I may just be bad at reading her because I thought she was a wolf for a good chunk of the last game. Along the same lines, SAR, you also came up on my radar yesterday, but I was/am doubting myself because I also thought you were sketchy last game & you turned out to be village.

nyanko said:
hurr durr lynch the quiet people
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DVMDream said:
Somehow always turns to this and as has been proven many times, doesn't work about 90% of the time.
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SAR just clarified what she meant, but when I read her post, I didn't take it to mean "omg lynch the quiet ones right now" -- it's just to get discussion going. I don't think we should be critiquing someone for trying to get more people talking.
 
I'll do my spiel once and then leave it be.

The game requires participation. It is fun with participation. It is A) less fun if people are quiet and B) you cannot analyze players easily if they don't give thoughts and opinions and feels.

In these "not a lot of info or play to analyze," beginning lynches, I think removing the people who are not as fun and who give you jack **** to work with is a solid option. Better than getting 3/4 of the way through the game and all they've done is throw down lynch votes and you have basically nothing to work with.

And of course it doesn't work most of the time. Games are usually ~20% wolf, most of our lynches are wrong.
 
PippyPony said:
SAR just clarified what she meant, but when I read her post, I didn't take it to mean "omg lynch the quiet ones right now" -- it's just to get discussion going. I don't think we should be critiquing someone for trying to get more people talking.
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It isn't a critique of someone trying to get more discussion going. It is a critique of that particular idea, regardless of who would have posted it, I'd say the same thing. Lynching the quiet people rarely results in a wolf lynch. That isn't to say we ignore quiet people but keep in mind it rarely finds a wolf.
 
PippyPony said:
Along the same lines, SAR, you also came up on my radar yesterday, but I was/am doubting myself because I also thought you were sketchy last game & you turned out to be village.
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Yeah, I have to admit I felt a bit like the pot calling the kettle black haha. That is why I mentioned myself in that post briefly. I was going to actually put myself on my own 'quiet people' list but decided that might be a bit too odd. Apparently I often come off as wolfy, despite the fact I've never been one haha. I am going to try to be around a bit more though, if that's what was giving you the sketchy feels
 
SummerTheLynx said:
Okay going through, I am placing my lynch on someone I don't want to lynch, but someone that will give me a lot of info on my spreadsheet

******lynch cdo*********

With that said, Jilary is making me think that she is a wolf right now. I will probably be going that way tomorrow.
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So Jilary is wolfy, but you're voting cdo?

1) Weird.

2) Why Jilary?

3) You probably explain this if I'd just keep reading... sigh.
 
LetItSnow said:
So Jilary is wolfy, but you're voting cdo?

1) Weird.

2) Why Jilary?

3) You probably explain this if I'd just keep reading... sigh.
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...keep reading, there's some flip-flopping on that front, and I don't know if I buy the explanations that went along with those flippyfloppies.
 
**********
PippyPony said:
...keep reading, there's some flip-flopping on that front, and I don't know if I buy the explanations that went along with those flippyfloppies.
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giphy.gif

*********
 
Trilt said:
Okay can we chill with the plurality crap? Unless I'm crazy, with 25-27 players we've gotten nowhere near hitting plurality this game. A little bit of pressure on someone isn't a bad thing, and all the hand wringing about it is annoying.
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My comment was a joke, hence the y'all.

Like, chillax bro 😉
 
I'm fine with voting quiet people if only to get them to be less quiet. Doesn't mean they have to die every time but the reaction to the votes can be useful.

I think if you know you're a quieter player you kind of have to live with the fact that it's going to be brought up as a reason to lynch you.
 
SummerTheLynx said:
Not necessarily. I have a history of doing this. I will explain to you the logic of why after the game, to not provide an explanation of it to the wolves.

For others to weigh in on: Cdo has already pretty much said that she has 1 of the few villager roles. IMO, you say what it is at this point. Doctor can self protect traditionally in Dyachei games, and traditionally in mafia. This way she can't hide behind the "I have a role" claim if she doesn't, and slide by for a few extra days. I don't see a downside to her just coming out and saying what it is now that she has identified herself as a rolled villager. Its a dumb convert choice as a wolf, if there even exists in the game. And it's too risky to try and kill her as she will almost assuredly be protected.
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(Caveat: I am only aware that we are on D2 - I haven't read yet to see who y"all lynched and who got killed overnight. So this may not make sense in that context.)

I realize she said she had a roll, and I agree with your wolf logic.

But up to this point, cdoconn had been tallying enough marks in my columns to be 'hard wolf' (I go on a 5 scale - hard wolf, possible wolf, neutral, possible village, hard village.)

I dunno what panned out, but I probably would have (and maybe will, depending on the next few hundred posts I have yet to read) lynched cdoconn D2. N1 should provide evidence to support cdoconn's claim, and if it doesn't ... I'd lynch.
 
I've just skimmed at this point but my thoughts at the moment...

I'm not big into lynching people just for being quiet in the first couple of days. I know that I struggle finding things to talk about in the early days of a game so it doesn't stand out as suspicious behavior to me. I also don't think it works very well in my experience.

I'm interested in hearing from Jilary today.

I do find it strange that no one seemed to remember that there was a day vig in the last basics game... but since it seems to be basically all of you that forgot I guess I believe it.
 
SkiOtter said:
Lyra- don't give explanations for people because then they can just piggy back onto what you say and be like "yeah that's what I meant" even if it's not. Could totally be what cdo meant, but it was discussed last game to not answer questions for others because then they can just piggy back on your answer since it was suggested by someone else.
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Awwwww. Someone was paying attention to my bitching!!!

👍

Or SkiOtter is pocketing me. Although at that point I hadn't even checked in. So pretty seriously doubtful.
 
kcoughli said:
Offering to role reveal, implying she has a role, was unfortunate. Now I'm conflicted about whether or not she should reveal what role. Hedging and hesitating could be the mark of a wolf trying to come up with something convincing. But revealing gives the wolves information they didn't already have.

Pippy made a good point actually ( intentionally or not) that her claiming a role but not revealing what it is actually creates some wifom confusion for the wolves. Do they try to kill her immediately? Leave her around so it looks suspicious? Lock the protector (if one exists) and have free reign on the rest of the villagers?

Makes me conflicted about whether or not she should reveal. Either way I don't think we should lynch her

Sent from my Nexus 5X using SDN mobile
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I don't think it creates any confusion for the wolves. If cdoconn isn't wolf, they mark her down on their sheet as "important villager," and go about killing other villagers for a while. And, if they have a blocker, block cdoconn.

Let the village lynch cdoconn N2 instead. Or N1, if y'all did that.

Nah. From the wolves' perspective, it just gives them more info than they had, but they still have a full field of choices to kill.

*shrug*
 
SummerTheLynx said:
@DVMDream - you probably know dyachei best. Mafia TYPICALLY does not have day abilities held within. Do you think in a back to the basics game, dyachei would incorporate something as non-traditional as a day ability?
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Over at MU, day vig is a common enough role.
 
cdoconn said:
I wonder if it means that there's also a night vigilante. Since I specifically have to say during the day to kill someone, I wonder if there's also one for nighttime as well.
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If you really are day vig, then yes, probably there is a night vig.
 
Animal Midwife said:
He's more right than wrong when it comes to lynches.
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MORE right than wrong? No, he's really not. That is biased reporting. STL knows that.

He <is> good at finding wolves. Not saying that. But > 50% of the time? NOBODY is that good.
 
LetItSnow said:
If you really are day vig, then yes, probably there is a night vig.
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Would there be two vigs in one game? That seems excessive to me but I haven't played enough WW to comment really :shrug:
 
Doctor-S said:
@SummerTheLynx seems to adamantly believe @Jilary is a non-villager. Does STL have any new comments concerning her suspicions about Jil at this time?

It also appears as if @DVMDream threw away a vote on D1 by voting for LIS.

I noticed that DVMD never changed her LIS vote (for the rest of D1) - even though LIS was 100% silent for the entirety of D1. Any thoughts?
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I was busy (but, yanno, note my comments about people using real life business......).

With regard to DVMD's vote - there is history there. I'm not surprised by her vote, and it isn't wolfy OR townie. I wish I had been in-thread sooner to pick a fight back at her. 🙂
 
LetItSnow said:
MORE right than wrong? No, he's really not. That is biased reporting. STL knows that.

He <is> good at finding wolves. Not saying that. But > 50% of the time? NOBODY is that good.
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#alternativefacts?
 
SummerTheLynx said:
Day abilities are not basics. Period. I ran the mafbot for a part of the time, and if I had added a role that was a day ability (and I had done some interesting modifications overall) I would have gotten yelled at. But it's honestly a fair enough vote, I should have seen that, and didn't
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Context matters - and YOU of all people know that.

Dy has played far more games over at MU lately than here. And day vig over there is NOT uncommon. You should expect that to tilt her modding.

You seem to intentionally by constraining your thinking to "Dy running games here at SDN." That doesn't make sense. Last I checked, she was playing 4 games at once over there .... and she mods over there .... her interaction with that crowd has very much effected her play and her modding.
 
DVMDream said:
That's not what "throw away vote" means....

I also had no reason to change my vote on D1 with no info. There is no need for everyone to be voting for the same 1-3 people, especially now when plurality is in effect. We need to be careful with voting and bandwagoning. I also did the LIS vote as partially a joke and in part to see how he reacted... he never showed up so never got to see his reaction.
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Not that it is very compelling, but I would have laughed. Or picked a fight for fun. Not sure. Depends on whether my kids were pissing me off at the moment or not, I suspect.
 
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