Basic science research question

[gstrub]

I have been toiling over ENT these last few days, so I figured I would ask the question here.

I am in a MD/PhD program (PhD in Biochemistry and Molecular Bio). I know ENT looks favorably at research, so in that department I am pretty well set (I have a MS in human genetics as well, and have my own F30 grant through the NIH (neurological diseases and stroke)). I am in the 3rd PhD year, hopefully will be rotating back to MS3 in August.


1. Do I need ENT specific research to be competitive? I might be able to get a little, but maybe not. I am hoping that basic science research would actually be more valuable than most of what students are bringing to the table (namely short clinical research projects).


2. My numbers used to look good, but in the scope of ENT not so much anymore. Step I 230, top 1/2-1/3 of class (I won't get officially ranked until I re-join the M3 class), won't be AOA (actually can't get it b/c of MD/PhD timing, but wouldn't have anyway). Will the MD/PhD put me into "competitive status"?

3. If so, will I need to apply to EVERY program? I am hoping for a more research-oriented institution, but I'm not sure my grades will be good enough.

Any help from you wizened ENT residents or upperclassmen is greatly appreciated.
-G

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[earboy]

gstrub,

As for #1, no it's not vital to have done ENT research. By getting your PhD and demonstrating a commitment to research, you've done far more than most applicants by 1)obtainging the degree, 2)getting your own F30. If you want to seem more ENT-like, I guess you could write up a case report or two. WHile you're in lab or in 3rd yr, get to know some of the ENT faculty and later on ask if they have any interesting cases for case reports. It will make it look like your interest is truly in ENT and all the programs that look favorably upon research will be plenty happy with your PhD. It means you know science and how to conduct it. You can apply that knowledge to any discipline.

2. Your step is just at or maybe slightly below some programs cutoffs. It is by no means below all the cutoffs and the fact that you are a MudPhud may give you more cushion in that aspect. Will it kill you if you don't get an interview at every program? Because pretty much no one does.

ENT PD's care most about your surgery and medicine core rotations and probably your ENT Sub-I during 3rd/4th yr. Worry about doing well on those when it's time.

If my memory serves me correctly, I don't think the majority of matched applicants are AOA. Maybe 50/50 or so. Someone else can correct me....SO don't worry about that.

3. NO you won't need to apply to every program but I would apply to over 40.

You are special with that PhD and programs with research tracks or that are big into research will definitely look favorably on you. WHen I was applying, one of my classmates matched at Hopkins. We both interviewed there. We are both normal and easy to get along with. My board scores, AOA status, etc. were all significantly higher. He was an MD/PhD whose research was very much in line with some of the ongoing stuff there. He also had a few faculty conections there. I ranked them pretty high and I'm pretty sure that played a large role in that process. Do you see what I mean?

You'll just have to roll the dice and see what happens. Your USMLE could be a bit higher but it's too late for that. And for some programs, especially ones not into research, it may affect your chances at those programs. When that time arrives and you think you can get significantly higher on your Step 2 than Step 1, then take that test to show it on your app. And many, many programs will love that PhD and, hence, you.

Good luck.

 

[gstrub]

Thanks for the advice. I feel better! Anyway I am good friends with a PGY3 ENT guy here...so I have an "in" to get some research done, shadow, and basically just get to know the ENT faculty. My friend says my personality will mesh well with the rest of the ENT guys.

Anyway, as far as 40 programs go, wow...back when I was considering general it was closer to 20. Well here is a list I came up with...completely based on geographical baggage. I know the major names will be a tougher match, but any opinions on the remainder of the list would be appreciated!

Alphabetically by state:
Arizona:
Mayo

California:
Kaiser
Irvine
UCD
UCSD
UCSF
Stanford

Colorado:
Denver

Connecticut:
U Conn
Yale

DC:
GW
Georgetown

Florida:
Tampa

Georgia:
Emory
MCG

Maryland:
Hopkins
U Maryland

Mass:
BU
Harvard
Tufts

NJ:
UMDNJ

New Mexico:
U NM

North Carolina:
UNC
Duke
Wake Forrest

Oregon
OHSU

South Carolina:
MUSC

Tenn:
Vandy
U Tenn

Texas:
UT Southwestern
U Tex Galveston
Baylor
U Tex Houston
U Tex San Antonio

Vermont:
UV

Virginia:
MCV

Washington
UW

That's nearly 40...wide enough net cast?

 

[chirurgino]

Agree with earboy's reply ... I'll emphasize the fact that you do NOT need to have done any ENT-specific research during your PhD. I applied as an MD-PhD, my research had nothing to do with ENT, and it didn't seem to hurt, even relative to those MD-PhDs who had done ENT-specific PhDs. I hadn't even done case reports or anything like that when I applied. Research is so highly valued in ENT that your PhD will definitely help to push open doors for you.

That being said, you should be able to intelligently discuss what you learned during your PhD and how (no one will hold you to this at this stage, obviously) those things can help you in your future ENT research career.

I wouldn't sweat your Step I score at all - it's not low enough to close doors on its own - make sure you do well on Medicine, Surgery, and your ENT sub-I, however. I wouldn't mess with taking Step II early and trying to improve (because...what if you don't improve?).

 

[gstrub]

Tough call on Step II...I think I could improve my score significantly. Also, my program has no obligations for 4th year, meaning I am done in August at the end of my 3rd year. That gives me plenty of time to get some ENT work done here or on an away rotation if I so choose, and study my a$$ off for the boards. I would think a big step II might seal the deal with regards to the better programs, but I understand the risk. I think I would rather have the score than not have it at interview time though.


A buddy of mine is a ENT resident here...he is going to hook me up with some ENT research opportunities/shadowing. I am glad of the MD/PhD though...I'm not sure I could make it without the extensive research experience and demonstration of funding potential (ie F30).
Thanks again.

 

[earboy]

You don't want to do just as well on Step 2. You want to get 240 or higher. If you feel like you can get that, do it. It will give the programs more confidence in you. Doing just as well won't inspire confidence. Anyway, that's what I think.