Being Low Income or Disadvantaged or 1st gen in the Admissions Process...

[bearcalbear2019]

Hey all,

I just read this guide on how to interpret MCAT scores and stumbled upon this infographic with MCAT Scores.
I noticed the MASSIVE disparity between 1st gen students (mean 496.3) vs non (mean 501.8), as well as FAP recipients (mean 496.4) vs non recipients (500.7). The difference is literally 4/5 points. 496 is in the 35th percentile, while 501/502 are in 52th/56th percentiles. Within 1st gen/FAP students, the 95th percentile in these subgroups are a 512 (86th percentile). I'm astonished by the massive disparity as a 1st gen/FAP recipient who scored a 512, which I thought was pretty meh but is top 5% within my subgroups.. It's crazy to think the top schools have 519/520 medians which seems so detached lol.

I'm curious on how well do schools account for these factors based on these disparities? Are 1st gen/FAP students really held to the same standard as students whose parents are engineers or doctors? It just goes to show how the playing field is so uneven.. I'd like some feedback from people and some of the adcoms to see how schools combat these disparities in the admissions process if they do, because I'm honestly terrified to apply next cycle. My most successful premed friends are those who come from posh backgrounds, while my not so well off friends changed career paths by their 3rd year, so I really struggle with meeting premeds who come from similar backgrounds.

@Goro @LizzyM @gyngyn

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[mackie10]

Hey all,

I just read this guide on how to interpret MCAT scores and stumbled upon this infographic with MCAT Scores.
I noticed the MASSIVE disparity between 1st gen students (mean 496.3) vs non (mean 501.8), as well as FAP recipients (mean 496.4) vs non recipients (500.7). The difference is literally 4/5 points. 496 is in the 35th percentile, while 501/502 are in 52th/56th percentiles. Within 1st gen/FAP students, the 95th percentile in these subgroups are a 512 (86th percentile). I'm astonished by the massive disparity as a 1st gen/FAP recipient who scored a 512, which I thought was pretty meh but is top 5% within my subgroups.. It's crazy to think the top schools have 519/520 medians which seems so detached lol.

I'm curious on how well do schools account for these factors based on these disparities? Are 1st gen/FAP students really held to the same standard as students whose parents are engineers or doctors? It just goes to show how the playing field is so uneven.. I'd like some feedback from people and some of the adcoms to see how schools combat these disparities in the admissions process if they do, because I'm honestly terrified to apply next cycle. My most successful premed friends are those who come from posh backgrounds, while my not so well off friends changed career paths by their 3rd year, so I really struggle with meeting premeds who come from similar backgrounds.

@Goro @LizzyM @gyngyn

While I'm not an adcom and I can't speak on their behalf, I tend to believe there is a bit of understanding for 1st gen students and those with more difficult upbringings. I'm a 1st gen student myself and not someone with super stellar stats (GPA or MCAT). I won't say I'm a completely terrible applicant because there are things that still stood out in my application, but I'm not considered mega competitive on the stat playing field. Stats are important don't get me wrong, they really do make or break the majority of apps out there, but being able to explain your experiences (in your ECs, personal statement, interviews, etc.) does have value too. Schools spend hours upon hours looking at apps. Those evaluations don't just include your grades or MCAT but also what else you can bring to the table, what makes you capable of being the future doctor they're looking to enroll. Otherwise the selection process for schools would be much quicker if screening grades/MCAT was the only aspect they considered.

I guess the only advice I have to give is to keep your head up and do your best while you're still in school! Work on those grades/mcat because they're still important, but also work on the things that make you unique and show your commitment to medicine! Things that can tell adcoms what kind of person you are. You don't have to come from a family of doctors to get into medical school, I can assure you that. None of my family has degrees and many of them don't even speak English. But hey, I'm going to be starting my education pretty soon! And I'm extremely excited and thankful for that!

 

[deleted480308]

You have the same test they do, study hard

 

[dr_kateb]

Life is unfair. Someone is always going to be smarter, richer, more charismatic, attractive, etc which translates to opportunities and privileges, and more money. Work harder, it's the only thing you can do.

Schools are trying to make doctors. Just because someone grew up less privileged doesn't mean he/she would be a better one than someone who owns an island in the Caribbean.

 

[LizzyM]

Schools do account for these disparities in the same way the account for URM students. AMCAS has questions about your parents' level of education, your family's income and whether you've ever been on government assistance, etc. Schools consider these types of diversity and are more likely to accept/recruit people in these groups whose records are consistent with success in medical school.

This.

When you get to medical school, you will get the same exams as the rest of the class. You'll need to pass those exams and some schools will grade on a curve with students scoring significantly below the mean failing the exam. Do you expect that you can hold your own in a classroom full of people who scored much better on the MCAT? That's the proof of the pudding.

 

[EasyEveryoneWouldDoIt]

as a first generation refugee who came to this country with my family with only the clothes on our backs, i honestly prefer to be held to the same standard as everyone else. med school is med school and like LizzyM said everyone takes the same test. everyone takes the same board scores. adcoms won't do me any favor if i can't perform to the same level as my classmates while in school

 

[Med Ed]

I'm curious on how well do schools account for these factors based on these disparities?

It varies A LOT from school to school.

One of the drivers for revamping the MCAT was a desire to level the playing field among applicants of different backgrounds, making it a bit more about aptitude and a bit less about your zip code. Hasn't worked out.

The part that has been semi-successful, however, is the revised scoring system. The data show that people near 500 have solid overall performance on two key factors: passing Step 1 on the first try and progressing to year 3 on time. So if most of your applicant pool's economic diversity is sitting in the 500-504 range you shouldn't hesitate to accept some of them. But again, uptake has been really variable.

 

[getdown]

You're not alone in this process and many of us have succeeded despite being at a disadvantage. Just like doctorcocter said, life's not fair and no one truly plays on a level playing field. That's just the way it is. What you do have control over is your own study habits and your own decisions. Yes, you'll have to sacrifice more and take on more loans in order to reach the same goal as those with more money. But you know what? As long as you can pass your boards and medical school there's no difference at all in your ability as a physician. True training happens as a resident, not during medical school.

Also remember, all that struggle builds character and prepares you for the rigors of residency where it's going to be really hard. You'll see that your more well to do classmates will have a hard time adjusting to the work hour demands and complain a lot. You'll be that resident who doesn't complain, be grateful of the opportunity, works hard and stays late to finish your duties. That stuff does not go unnoticed by attendings. And you know how that makes a difference? When that phone call comes asking about how you are as a physician and whether or not they should hire you into their practice we'd be more than happy to give a full throated endorsement. Not to mention the good practices everyone wants are not the ones advertised online. THose are the ones filled through word of mouth. You think we'd risk our reputation to recommend a problem resident? Nope. So be strong and know you'll face challenges. Training is temporary but the life skills you learn from struggling are valuable as well.

 

[bearcalbear2019]

It varies A LOT from school to school.

One of the drivers for revamping the MCAT was a desire to level the playing field among applicants of different backgrounds, making it a bit more about aptitude and a bit less about your zip code. Hasn't worked out.

The part that has been semi-successful, however, is the revised scoring system. The data show that people near 500 have solid overall performance on two key factors: passing Step 1 on the first try and progressing to year 3 on time. So if most of your applicant pool's economic diversity is sitting in the 500-504 range you shouldn't hesitate to accept some of them. But again, uptake has been really variable.

Schools do account for these disparities in the same way they account for URM students. AMCAS has questions about your parents' level of education, your family's income and whether you've ever been on government assistance, etc. Schools consider these types of diversity and are more likely to accept/recruit people in these groups whose records are consistent with success in medical school.

I'm curious on what schools do when they see these boxes checked and wished AMCAS released statistics on them. I agree with what you all said about hard work and it's on the same level at medical school. I'm just hoping that ADCOMs are considerate of these sorts of students in evaluating them and in their process of screening them, and wish there was more transparency on that. Of course there's never going to be an even playing field but I know it's a work in progress for medical education. I don't want to be seen as lesser compared to my peers by adcoms just because of my background/scores

 

[deleted480308]

I'm curious on what schools do when they see these boxes checked and wished AMCAS released statistics on them. I agree with what you all said about hard work and it's on the same level at medical school. I'm just hoping that ADCOMs are considerate of these sorts of students in evaluating them and in their process of screening them, and wish there was more transparency on that. Of course there's never going to be an even playing field but I know it's a work in progress for medical education. I don't want to be seen as lesser compared to my peers by adcoms just because of my background/scores

Then don’t have lesser scores.

 

[ciestar]

I'm curious on what schools do when they see these boxes checked and wished AMCAS released statistics on them. I agree with what you all said about hard work and it's on the same level at medical school. I'm just hoping that ADCOMs are considerate of these sorts of students in evaluating them and in their process of screening them, and wish there was more transparency on that. Of course there's never going to be an even playing field but I know it's a work in progress for medical education. I don't want to be seen as lesser compared to my peers by adcoms just because of my background/scores

I was a FAP recipient working full time while studying for the MCAT. I didn’t do a formal course and got what equates to a 511 on the MCAT. You don’t NEED a formal course. You need self discipline. Buy some books to do content review and use other resources for practice tests. Don’t use this as a crutch. It isn’t going to fly, as it won’t make up for say a 500 score.

 

[Ad2b]

I don't want to be seen as lesser compared to my peers by adcoms just because of my background/scores

You don't want to be seen as lesser because of scores but you want them to consider you because of SES and URM?

I'm a little confused.

I'm white, of northern European descent (think they call me a mutt - pick your continent, I have relatives there). My parents are high school educated, elderly, considered poor by today's standards and likely, even when I was growing up. I'm also old(er) than most applicants.

If I check the boxes AGAINST me:

1. old(er)
2. bad old(er) GPA
3. 2x MCAT
4. SES
5. 2nd gen

I should have no chance in Hell, Cayman Islands. Right?

But I don't think like that - I simply am putting my best foot forward and if the people who have similar stats, similar backgrounds AND are URM or SES or BOTH? And they get in and I don't?

Awesome! I cannot focus on who might have a better advantage than me and bit@3 about it, ALL I can do is put MY best foot forward and hope for the best.

To me, looking at it any other way sets yourself up for discouragement.

 

[Gilakend]

I am 1st gen college and grew up below the poverty line. While you won't get looked easier on for admissions, the experiences you have are valued, especially if you can write about them eloquently and explain how having these experiences brings value the medical school. In all of my interviews my background was brought up in a very positive manner and I had one interviewer email me after telling me again. YMMV obviously, but I think it goes to show the experiences are highly valued and very rare among med school applicants.

You have to get to the same point as everyone else (which is fair, you shouldn't want to be held to different standards), but if someone had to run 1 mile to get there and you had to run 10, it certainly looks a whole lot more impressive.

 

[Gilakend]

Hey all,

I just read this guide on how to interpret MCAT scores and stumbled upon this infographic with MCAT Scores.
I noticed the MASSIVE disparity between 1st gen students (mean 496.3) vs non (mean 501.8), as well as FAP recipients (mean 496.4) vs non recipients (500.7). The difference is literally 4/5 points. 496 is in the 35th percentile, while 501/502 are in 52th/56th percentiles. Within 1st gen/FAP students, the 95th percentile in these subgroups are a 512 (86th percentile). I'm astonished by the massive disparity as a 1st gen/FAP recipient who scored a 512, which I thought was pretty meh but is top 5% within my subgroups.. It's crazy to think the top schools have 519/520 medians which seems so detached lol.

I'm curious on how well do schools account for these factors based on these disparities? Are 1st gen/FAP students really held to the same standard as students whose parents are engineers or doctors? It just goes to show how the playing field is so uneven.. I'd like some feedback from people and some of the adcoms to see how schools combat these disparities in the admissions process if they do, because I'm honestly terrified to apply next cycle. My most successful premed friends are those who come from posh backgrounds, while my not so well off friends changed career paths by their 3rd year, so I really struggle with meeting premeds who come from similar backgrounds.

@Goro @LizzyM @gyngyn

Also, curious about where you found the breakdown of scores achieved by 1st gen/FAP. I tried to find it but couldn't and am curious to look at it. Link?

 

[PursuingHappy]

Hey all,

I just read this guide on how to interpret MCAT scores and stumbled upon this infographic with MCAT Scores.
I noticed the MASSIVE disparity between 1st gen students (mean 496.3) vs non (mean 501.8), as well as FAP recipients (mean 496.4) vs non recipients (500.7). The difference is literally 4/5 points. 496 is in the 35th percentile, while 501/502 are in 52th/56th percentiles. Within 1st gen/FAP students, the 95th percentile in these subgroups are a 512 (86th percentile). I'm astonished by the massive disparity as a 1st gen/FAP recipient who scored a 512, which I thought was pretty meh but is top 5% within my subgroups.. It's crazy to think the top schools have 519/520 medians which seems so detached lol.

I'm curious on how well do schools account for these factors based on these disparities? Are 1st gen/FAP students really held to the same standard as students whose parents are engineers or doctors? It just goes to show how the playing field is so uneven.. I'd like some feedback from people and some of the adcoms to see how schools combat these disparities in the admissions process if they do, because I'm honestly terrified to apply next cycle. My most successful premed friends are those who come from posh backgrounds, while my not so well off friends changed career paths by their 3rd year, so I really struggle with meeting premeds who come from similar backgrounds.

@Goro @LizzyM @gyngyn

Don't worry about anyone else. Your score is just fine to get into a great medical school. I have two MCAT scores, 497 and 515, and I've had success this cycle. Sure; It may be because I'm first generation, low SES, and URM. But I would like to think it is because I did well, despite the obstacles I faced growing up. Be honored to have achieved so much despite coming from a more difficult background. Once you're in school, the tenacity you displayed will be evident if you continue to work just as hard, if not harder, than you did to achieve a 512.

Go ahead and apply. You might be pleasantly surprised. Good luck

 

[bearcalbear2019]

Then don’t have lesser scores.

LOL wish it was that easy

You don't want to be seen as lesser because of scores but you want them to consider you because of SES and URM?

I'm a little confused.

I'm white, of northern European descent (think they call me a mutt - pick your continent, I have relatives there). My parents are high school educated, elderly, considered poor by today's standards and likely, even when I was growing up. I'm also old(er) than most applicants.

If I check the boxes AGAINST me:

1. old(er)
2. bad old(er) GPA
3. 2x MCAT
4. SES
5. 2nd gen

I should have no chance in Hell, Cayman Islands. Right?

But I don't think like that - I simply am putting my best foot forward and if the people who have similar stats, similar backgrounds AND are URM or SES or BOTH? And they get in and I don't?

Awesome! I cannot focus on who might have a better advantage than me and bit@3 about it, ALL I can do is put MY best foot forward and hope for the best.

To me, looking at it any other way sets yourself up for discouragement.

Ultimately I would just like to be looked and compared within reasonable context of my background.

Also, curious about where you found the breakdown of scores achieved by 1st gen/FAP.
I tried to find it but couldn't and am curious to look at it. Link?

Please see here https://www.aamc.org/download/462316/data/mcatguide.pdf.

Just gonna work with what I got and do my best!

 

[Ad2b]

Ultimately I would just like to be looked and compared within reasonable context of my background

Which is the way it should be.

like I said:

Same stats, same everything down to ECs, nod should go to URM/SES individual and I have to believe it does. As it should.

The US does not have enough URM/SES people getting into medicine and I support whatever the schools are doing to help that fact improve. Certainly, as much time as I've spent in Black communities and Somali, and Hmong, and x-y-z - those populations would be more comfortable being served by someone of their own race/ethnicity/nation of origin.

And I'm 100% okay with all of that. However, I am also 100% willing, able and have volunteered in those communities to help if there is a shortage.