Best DO schools to specialize

[Hamber_Gorl]

I want to become a dermatologist, I was wondering which DO schools have the best match rates for competitive specialties?

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[voxveritatisetlucis]

To match derm, you honestly want to go to a top tier MD school. Of course one can match from low tier MD or DO, but if you’re set on derm, it’s worth waiting to improve your application imo. Only 30 DO matched derm in 2022 compared to roughly 500 MDs

 

[Hamber_Gorl]

To match derm, you honestly want to go to a top tier MD school. Of course one can match from low tier MD or DO, but if you’re set on derm, it’s worth waiting to improve your application imo. Only 30 DO matched derm in 2022 compared to roughly 500 MDs

so there’s no tiered system for DO schools in terms of competitive specialties? 🥺

Can I “fellow into” Derm? If I can’t get a derm match?

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

From what I’ve read on here, there are no really tiers for DO schools like there are for MD schools with the exceptions being

Established schools > new schools
Schools with home residencies > schools without home residencies

 

[Kardio]

so there’s no tiered system for DO schools in terms of competitive specialties? 🥺

Can I “fellow into” Derm? If I can’t get a derm match?

Go to an MD school and be a very strong student or be in the top 2-3% of all DO students and also have exceptional networking skills (or a parent as a derm PD).

There is no derm fellowship.

 

[Hamber_Gorl]

Go to an MD school and be a very strong student or be in the top 2-3% of all DO students and also have exceptional networking skills (or a parent as a derm PD).

There is no derm fellowship.

Gotcha. I have good networking skills, but no family in medicine. I see most lower stat applicants apply DO and MD on Reddit.

My mcat is 496–> 506. I have FAP and my amcas primary is submitted. I’m working through aacomas now for DO, but do you think I should just shoot my shot for MD? I can afford to apply to more lower tier MD schools if I leave out DO.

I think I would like Patho or anesthesiology, but my main drive is Derm.

 

[Dr Meow]

Gotcha. I have good networking skills, but no family in medicine. I see most lower stat applicants apply DO and MD on Reddit.

My mcat is 496–> 506. I have FAP and my amcas primary is submitted. I’m working through aacomas now for DO, but do you think I should just shoot my shot for MD? I can afford to apply to more lower tier MD schools if I leave out DO.

I think I would like Patho or anesthesiology, but my main drive is Derm.

MD's have trouble getting derm. With your stats, and assuming you're class average in med school, no matter MD or DO you're probably not gonna get derm.

I'd apply, do my best, hope for derm, but don't expect it. And have a backup specialty. If you cannot accept anything except derm, then don't do med school.

My mcat is 508 which is around your mcat. I study 12 - 16 hours a day in med school. And I'm still around 60 percentile.....
Don't underestimate the insane level of memory and intellect of your peer competitors.

 

[Hamber_Gorl]

MD's have trouble getting derm. With your stats, and assuming you're class average in med school, no matter MD or DO you're probably not gonna get derm.

I'd apply, do my best, hope for derm, but don't expect it. And have a backup specialty. If you cannot accept anything except derm, then don't do med school.

My mcat is 508 which is around your mcat. I study 12 - 16 hours a day in med school. And I'm still around 60 percentile.....
Don't underestimate the insane level of memory and intellect of your peer competitors.

Thank you for this insight 🙏🏼 it’ll be a privilege to be alongside high stat rockstars in med school. I didn’t mean to come off as “competing with my peers” or anything. I’m grateful to have made it this far, I just really like skin lol.

You’re right though, I shouldn’t expect derm. I think I’d like Patho and anesthesiology. I’m just really at a crossroads between spending money on DO vs more MD applications because I’m a low stat applicant with dreams of specializing outside of FM/IM.

 

[Dr Meow]

Thank you for this insight 🙏🏼 it’ll be a privilege to be alongside high stat rockstars in med school. I didn’t mean to come off as “competing with my peers” or anything. I’m grateful to have made it this far, I just really like skin lol.

You’re right though, I shouldn’t expect derm. I think I’d like Patho and anesthesiology. I’m just really at a crossroads between spending money on DO vs more MD applications because I’m a low stat applicant with dreams of specializing outside of FM/IM.

np!
Though in the eyes of a huge chunk of your peers, it is very much a competition. You'll have your allies, the people you trust and study with. And then there will be people who will not help you and active get in your way. They'll share their notes and resources only to people within the mini group. Make sure to make connections early. Once the groups is set, it'll be harder to join another. Early on, in the first 2 weeks or so, people talk to everyone trying to find their perfect group. Then eventually, these people will be all you have time to talk to and rely on. Everyone else becomes someone you can ask on groupme but not your inner study group. This is better in schools that are Pass/Fail or doesn't have class ranking.

But if you accept patho/anesthesia, then DO is FINE! You still need to do well though.
But with those mcats, unless you have extraordinary GPA + Extracurriculars, DO is your only chance. Actually, I would apply only DO in your case unless you can get a much much higher mcat. But it may not be worth your time for patho/anesthesia to waste years fixing app for MD which still isn't guaranteed even with amazing stats.

 

[BoneWizard]

If you go to a DO school your odds of matching derm are largely dependent on you.
It's actually not too bad as long as you have the stats for it. The 2020 DO match rate for seniors with a Step 1 of 240+ is ~90%. If you had 240s on both steps (or just step 2 after P/F) and at least 2 pubs your chances are pretty good, getting there is going to be harder at a DO school though just because its harder to make connections.

 

[Dr. Puffs]

With your MCAT a low tier MD school is possible but I would choose applying DO schols for a chance to get in medical school sooner rather than later.

 

[Proudfather94]

I want to become a dermatologist, I was wondering which DO schools have the best match rates for competitive specialties?

What state are you from? State DO schools match pretty consistently. If not LECOM or PCOM are likely your best chances.

 

[Hamber_Gorl]

What state are you from? State DO schools match pretty consistently. If not LECOM or PCOM are likely your best chances.

Thank you. I'm in FL, when you say LECOM, should I apply to all campuses?

 

[Proudfather94]

Thank you. I'm in FL, when you say LECOM, should I apply to all campuses?

Yeah l would go to the main campus if you can but they are all good.

 

[umsami]

PCOM or MSUCOM would be two good ones. Both longstanding schools with good reps.

Maybe NOVA, but I'm not sure. FL has derms up the wazoo--but they also have an MD school. (Plus it's a newer DO school.)

 

[PhD_to_DO]

I want to become a dermatologist, I was wondering which DO schools have the best match rates for competitive specialties?

Whether you attend a DO or an MD school, your odds of matching into xyz specialty are going to be primarily based on what you do while in school, to develop a competitive application for residency. That said, the reality is that you haven’t started medical school yet and while you may have certain interests now, when you start clinical rotations, there is a very strong chance that you may find yourself interested in something totally different than when you started. I came into medical school knowing that I was going to do EM or a dual EM/IM or EM/FM residency. Low and behold, I’ve discovered a talent for physiology and a growing passion for GI medicine after having spent a week shadowing a GI attending. Come in with an open mind to all that you are going to learn and be exposed to and be prepared to work hard. Competitive specialties are competitive for a reason and they are tough for any student, DO or MD, to match into. But if you put in work and do what you need to do, I believe that you’ll end up where you want to be.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

Whether you attend a DO or an MD school, your odds of matching into xyz specialty are going to be primarily based on what you do while in school

This just isn’t true. Look at the match list for T20 schools versus a low tier MD versus a DO school.

Hopkins will usually have like 8-10 match neurosurgery, whereas a low tier MD might have 1. Unless you’re implying that students at low tier MD and DO schools just don’t work as hard. Same with derm. Look at how many match derm from Harvard on average. This is bad advice if the OP is set on derm.

 

[Proudfather94]

This just isn’t true. Look at the match list for T20 schools versus a low tier MD versus a DO school.

Hopkins will usually have like 8-10 match neurosurgery, whereas a low tier MD might have 1. Unless you’re implying that students at low tier MD and DO schools just don’t work as hard. Same with derm. Look at how many match derm from Harvard on average. This is bad advice if the OP is set on derm.

I'd argue that the average Hopkins student is selected to have better study habits and work ethic as well as more privilege and connections than the average low tier MD student. I think if you filled Hopkins with the average low tier MD student you would see a sharp decrease in neurosurg matches.

 

[Doctoscope]

Also, the general advice from physicians is to not go into medical school dead-set on a specialty. If you're derm-or-die and fail to match, then you're in for a miserable career in a specialty you hate. You also rob yourself of the chance to explore and discover specialties that hadn't even crossed your mind. With your stats, apply broadly to both MD and DO programs, and if you're fortunate enough to get accepted somewhere (same for any one of us, since 60% don't get in) go into medicine prepared to grind, and be OK with the fact that you may not match and will have to do another specialty.

 

[hippieMD]

Nova Southeastern consistently gets 2-3 students matching derm a year. We have good connections with the local programs.

We get a lot of crap from this forum but the school is established and has good connections. Just check the match list.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

I'd argue that the average Hopkins student is selected to have better study habits and work ethic as well as more privilege and connections than the average low tier MD student. I think if you filled Hopkins with the average low tier MD student you would see a sharp decrease in neurosurg matches.

This is possible and probably explains some of the variance, but there are a bunch of low tier MD schools with average step scores that are higher than that of Hopkins. Now that step 1 is p/f, students from top tiers will be at an even greater advantage.

For example, based on the average step scores and match lists, we know that there were people from Hopkins scoring in the 220s and 230s yet still matching at MGH, JHU, UCSF. This would have been impossible for low tier MDs and DOs. I’m sure plenty of people from Hopkins match derm with applications that are below average amongst derm applicants.

 

[TragicalDrFaust]

I concur with most of the above posters, you’re literally more than 10x better off going to MD school if you want to match derm. That being said, check the match lists for schools. Most will have them posted on their website. Otherwise request from their admissions office. At my own DO school, we had a decent match list, for a DO school, including several orthos and one or two derms last year. Out of 160.

 

[Proudfather94]

I concur with most of the above posters, you’re literally more than 10x better off going to MD school if you want to match derm. That being said, check the match lists for schools. Most will have them posted on their website. Otherwise request from their admissions office. At my own DO school, we had a decent match list, for a DO school, including several orthos and one or two derms last year. Out of 160.

I can't see this year's match but the last 4 years in a row have had a derm match at the DO school I'm going to.

 

[Hamber_Gorl]

Nova Southeastern consistently gets 2-3 students matching derm a year. We have good connections with the local programs.

We get a lot of crap from this forum but the school is established and has good connections. Just check the match list.

I made a DO match spreadsheet and you're right, 2021 they had 3 Derms which is super cool. And their Clearwater campus is right on the beach 😍 Why do people here hate on NOVA?

 

[Hamber_Gorl]

I can't see this year's match but the last 4 years in a row have had a derm match at the DO school I'm going to.

Are you at CCOM? Thats the only school who's match data I can't find. Not even from 2020 :c

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

Are you at CCOM? Thats the only school who's match data I can't find. Not even from 2020 :c

There’s a match thread for MD and DO schools on here

OFFICIAL - 2022 Match Lists

It's that time of the year again - post the match lists here. Congratulations 4th years, your hard work paid off: you're going to be amazing doctors wherever you matched. Previous Years: 2021 | 2020 | 2019 | 2018 | 2017 | 2016 | 2015 | 2014 | 2013 | 2012 | 2011 | 2010 TABLE OF CONTENTS...

forums.studentdoctor.net

DO 2022 match thread?

Do we have one of these going?

forums.studentdoctor.net

 

[Ho0v-man]

Going DO doesn’t doom you to primary care. But derm is tough no matter where you go. It’s probably the only specialty that disproportionately selects from the top MD schools. No one should be derm or bust though.

But if you don’t think you could ever improve your app in a meaningful way, then just apply broadly. Don’t try to save money. Get a 0% APR credit card or take out a loan. Whatever. Because trust me, you do not want the stress of a second app cycle. Besides, with your stats you’ll get in DO. So do you want to maybe start med school next year, or definitely start med school next year. If you don’t even plan to improve your app, then not applying DO is literally wasting a year of your life.

With that being said, prioritize state funded DO schools like OSU as they have research opportunities you’ll need to build an app. This is much harder to do at private DO schools. There is no tier for DO (but there should be).

 

[chilly_md]

I made a DO match spreadsheet and you're right, 2021 they had 3 Derms which is super cool. And their Clearwater campus is right on the beach 😍 Why do people here hate on NOVA?

See Goro’s post on NOVA (and other DO schools to avoid):

Take DO acceptance or reapply MD

I deleted them because the conversation became distracted from your original question. FWIW I was "complete" in mid October at my current school and half of my class was accepted after February (however, for the vast majority of MD the earlier the better and most fill up by January) For DO...

forums.studentdoctor.net

Having 3 derm matches and being near a beach does not make up for other issues.

 

[Hamber_Gorl]

There’s a match thread for MD and DO schools on here

OFFICIAL - 2022 Match Lists

It's that time of the year again - post the match lists here. Congratulations 4th years, your hard work paid off: you're going to be amazing doctors wherever you matched. Previous Years: 2021 | 2020 | 2019 | 2018 | 2017 | 2016 | 2015 | 2014 | 2013 | 2012 | 2011 | 2010 TABLE OF CONTENTS...

forums.studentdoctor.net

DO 2022 match thread?

Do we have one of these going?

forums.studentdoctor.net

Tysm!

 

[PhD_to_DO]

This just isn’t true. Look at the match list for T20 schools versus a low tier MD versus a DO school.

Hopkins will usually have like 8-10 match neurosurgery, whereas a low tier MD might have 1. Unless you’re implying that students at low tier MD and DO schools just don’t work as hard. Same with derm. Look at how many match derm from Harvard on average. This is bad advice if the OP is set on derm.

I’m not implying anything other than no matter where you attend medical school, your odds of matching to whatever specialty are going to largely dictated by what YOU do. Obviously attending an MD, or better yet, a T-20 MD, means that the odds of matching into a competitive specialty are better but you still have to put the work in to get to the residency that you want. Period. I stand by what I said.

 

[Hamber_Gorl]

Going DO doesn’t doom you to primary care. But derm is tough no matter where you go. It’s probably the only specialty that disproportionately selects from the top MD schools. No one should be derm or bust though.

But if you don’t think you could ever improve your app in a meaningful way, then just apply broadly. Don’t try to save money. Get a 0% APR credit card or take out a loan. Whatever. Because trust me, you do not want the stress of a second app cycle. Besides, with your stats you’ll get in DO. So do you want to maybe start med school next year, or definitely start med school next year. If you don’t even plan to improve your app, then not applying DO is literally wasting a year of your life.

With that being said, prioritize state funded DO schools like OSU as they have research opportunities you’ll need to build an app. This is much harder to do at private DO schools. There is no tier for DO (but there should be).

Is it worth applying if I'm OOS/ no ties? From OSU's website: "Our emphasis is placed admitting students from Oklahoma and those who want to practice in Oklahoma. The majority of OSU College of Osteopathic Medicine students are from Oklahoma."

 

[Dr Meow]

Is it worth applying if I'm OOS/ no ties? From OSU's website: "Our emphasis is placed admitting students from Oklahoma and those who want to practice in Oklahoma. The majority of OSU College of Osteopathic Medicine students are from Oklahoma."

With DO schools, you can apply to nearly all of them. When I applies last year, there was around......35(?) I think and I applied to most of them. There's some brand new ones from last year or so poping up but you can ignore them I think.

DO doesn't care so much if you're in state or out of state (unless they specifically state it). Most don't care. I got interviews all over the place. And we have similar stats (except I get 0 volunteering or clinical) so you should get a better result than me.

*** oo I gotta say. Once you do get into med school, fulfilling research will be VERY TOUGH at a DO school. Most DO schools do not have in house research. Some biggers schools do like MSUCOM I think. And even if you do manage to find research, it'll most likely be summer research. You most likely will not publish anything. Good projects take 1 year+. You COULD write case reports during anatomy however I was told case reports do not count as research unless n=3 or greater for that particular anatomical anomoly.
*** So in conclusion, if you can get 1 publication before entering med school, that would help you so much. (assuming you don't waste 2+ years to get it).

 

[Hamber_Gorl]

With DO schools, you can apply to nearly all of them. When I applies last year, there was around......35(?) I think and I applied to most of them. There's some brand new ones from last year or so poping up but you can ignore them I think.

DO doesn't care so much if you're in state or out of state (unless they specifically state it). Most don't care. I got interviews all over the place. And we have similar stats (except I get 0 volunteering or clinical) so you should get a better result than me.

*** oo I gotta say. Once you do get into med school, fulfilling research will be VERY TOUGH at a DO school. Most DO schools do not have in house research. Some biggers schools do like MSUCOM I think. And even if you do manage to find research, it'll most likely be summer research. You most likely will not publish anything. Good projects take 1 year+. You COULD write case reports during anatomy however I was told case reports do not count as research unless n=3 or greater for that particular anatomical anomoly.
*** So in conclusion, if you can get 1 publication before entering med school, that would help you so much. (assuming you don't waste 2+ years to get it).

This is sooo helpful thank you so much💕 I think I have my DO list: LECOM, NOVA, RVU-COM, KCU-COM, PCOM, CCOM, DMU, ATSU, ROWAN, OSU, MSU, and OUCOM. Do you think I should add more? Idk how many secondaries I can pump out, does the 2-week limit apply to DO as well?

I have 3 pubs (1 non-science as a first author idk if that counts) and was just about to quit my lab position to get more clinic hours because mine are old (I racked up 1000+ hours scribing but that was 6-8 years ago) but now I'm re-thinking it because my PI is determined to push 2 manuscripts out by this year.. Maybe I can do both part-time...

 

[PhD_to_DO]

This is sooo helpful thank you so much💕 I think I have my DO list: LECOM, NOVA, RVU-COM, KCU-COM, PCOM, CCOM, DMU, ATSU, ROWAN, OSU, MSU, and OUCOM. Do you think I should add more? Idk how many secondaries I can pump out, does the 2-week limit apply to DO as well?

I have 3 pubs (1 non-science as a first author idk if that counts) and was just about to quit my lab position to get more clinic hours because mine are old (I racked up 1000+ hours scribing but that was 6-8 years ago) but now I'm re-thinking it because my PI is determined to push 2 manuscripts out by this year.. Maybe I can do both part-time...

One thing to consider for research purposes is that depending on the type of research you do, you may be able to maintain your existing research affiliation(s) and continue to work on projects through medical school. I was able to do this and in my first year of medical school, I was able to present three posters (1st author), two abstracts (2nd author), and have two first author manuscripts and a third manuscript that I’m listed on (one in publication and the other two being considered for publication). I’m starting my second year and hope to present a poster at OMED 22 and another at APHA. I’m fortunate that my school, UIWSOM, encourages research participation and we have a small but growing research infrastructure at the school; a number of my classmates have projects going on or they were able to continue working with previous research groups with the blessing of our research dean.

 

[OrphanedDoc]

MD's have trouble getting derm. With your stats, and assuming you're class average in med school, no matter MD or DO you're probably not gonna get derm.

I'd apply, do my best, hope for derm, but don't expect it. And have a backup specialty. If you cannot accept anything except derm, then don't do med school.

My mcat is 508 which is around your mcat. I study 12 - 16 hours a day in med school. And I'm still around 60 percentile.....
Don't underestimate the insane level of memory and intellect of your peer competitors.

I just want to address the fact that while dermatology is definitely going to be difficult depending on the school you get into, I wouldn't discount the power of sub-Is good social skills and not being a complete idiot and respectful. Those are literal interviews they would be likely to not care what degree you have if they like you. I'm sure schools with a history of accepting DOs will have some sub-I spots to apply to, hopefully. If they like you, then when you submit your application you would need competitive stats which means a good step score, your MCAT means nothing for that just do your sketchy, boards and beyond, or the DO equivalent and do your Anki (I do neither but that's what the gunners do at my school). Then pray. Also, I'm not a genius but studying 12-16 hours is a lot, at least at my medical school, I was studying about 4 hours on a good day during 1st year (P/F unranked year) and I did somewhat below average only because I simply didn't study for some exams as much but there were several exams I easily score in the mid-90s on and that will place you above average in medical school. It's how you study not how long. So definitely is a fight but refining how you learn will go a long way to securing the academic aspect of your DO application. I myself want to apply to ENT but I am fortunate to go to a top 50 MD school. Apply to MD schools depending on your application or story you don't know what may happen. I got into way more MD schools than I was expecting.

 

[Dr Meow]

I just want to address the fact that while dermatology is definitely going to be difficult depending on the school you get into, I wouldn't discount the power of sub-Is good social skills and not being a complete idiot and respectful. Those are literal interviews they would be likely to not care what degree you have if they like you. I'm sure schools with a history of accepting DOs will have some sub-I spots to apply to, hopefully. If they like you, then when you submit your application you would need competitive stats which means a good step score, your MCAT means nothing for that just do your sketchy, boards and beyond, or the DO equivalent and do your Anki (I do neither but that's what the gunners do at my school). Then pray. Also, I'm not a genius but studying 12-16 hours is a lot, at least at my medical school, I was studying about 4 hours on a good day during 1st year (P/F unranked year) and I did somewhat below average only because I simply didn't study for some exams as much but there were several exams I easily score in the mid-90s on and that will place you above average in medical school. It's how you study not how long. So definitely is a fight but refining how you learn will go a long way to securing the academic aspect of your DO application. I myself want to apply to ENT but I am fortunate to go to a top 50 MD school. Apply to MD schools depending on your application or story you don't know what may happen. I got into way more MD schools than I was expecting.

Congrats on having a good memory. But for those like me where remembering anything new is like lifting the sun, I need every second I can get.

 

[Ho0v-man]

Is it worth applying if I'm OOS/ no ties? From OSU's website: "Our emphasis is placed admitting students from Oklahoma and those who want to practice in Oklahoma. The majority of OSU College of Osteopathic Medicine students are from Oklahoma."

Yeah. Theres not exactly an abundance of Oklahomans that are capable of being a doctor. That plus there already being an MD school and I think I remember that OSU was going to expand at one point. Also it’s Oklahoma. People aren’t falling all over themselves to live there.

That means there’s definitely spots for OOS applicants.

Furthermore, you need to stop worrying about the yield and cost of applying. You need to just apply everywhere. The cost of a few more apps is not worth the loss of a year of attending salary.

 

[chilly_md]

Is it worth applying if I'm OOS/ no ties? From OSU's website: "Our emphasis is placed admitting students from Oklahoma and those who want to practice in Oklahoma. The majority of OSU College of Osteopathic Medicine students are from Oklahoma."

I will have to disagree with the other opinions here. If you are not from a bordering state and have no rural experience, it would be a waste of an application.

 

[Dr Meow]

I will have to disagree with the other opinions here. If you are not from a bordering state and have no rural experience, it would be a waste of an application.

I'm from an east coast state and I got interviews for Arkansas, idaho, new mexico, virginia, and north carolina... maybe some that I forgot.
Absolutely not a waste of an application.
I applied with 0 rural experience. 0 volunteering. 0 shadowing. Didn't even shadow a DO.

 

[chilly_md]

I'm from an east coast state and I got interviews for Arkansas, idaho, new mexico, virginia, and north carolina... maybe some that I forgot.
Absolutely not a waste of an application.
I applied with 0 rural experience. 0 volunteering. 0 shadowing. Didn't even shadow a DO.

VCOM, Campbell, ARCOM, BCOM, and ICOM also are not OOS unfriendly like Rowan and OSU are.

 

[Dr Meow]

Oh i see, you were talking about OSU and not DO in general. My bad

 

[chilly_md]

Oh i see, you were talking about OSU and not DO in general. My bad

Correct. The vast majority of them take OOS students. OSU, Rowan, Michigan State and Ohio Heritage (though they have a contract to help ensure OOS students serve the state) are the main outliers where they tend to want stronger applicants if they don’t fit the mission.

And TCOM and Sam Houston are TMDAS schools, but usually OOS students don’t think of mistakingly applying there.

 

[Dr._Babu]

Gotcha. I have good networking skills, but no family in medicine. I see most lower stat applicants apply DO and MD on Reddit.

My mcat is 496–> 506. I have FAP and my amcas primary is submitted. I’m working through aacomas now for DO, but do you think I should just shoot my shot for MD? I can afford to apply to more lower tier MD schools if I leave out DO.

I think I would like Patho or anesthesiology, but my main drive is Derm.

Keep in mind that a dermatopathology fellowship after a path residency is a good option to meld interests in path and derm