Best programs for CP training?

[Path1221]

As I'm coming to the end of the interview trail, I've noticed that every program I've interviewed at has given me the whole "many programs are good at AP training but we are one of the few that is also good at CP" spiel.

For someone who is looking for good AP training but is also concerned with good CP training and heavily considering a CP fellowship, which programs do actually excel in CP?

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[LADoc00]

As I'm coming to the end of the interview trail, I've noticed that every program I've interviewed at has given me the whole "many programs are good at AP training but we are one of the few that is also good at CP" spiel.

For someone who is looking for good AP training but is also concerned with good CP training and heavily considering a CP fellowship, which programs do actually excel in CP?

CP is going to be either UPenn or WashU.

Many many programs literally had no CP until recent history, places like Stanford. If you wanted to be AP/CP you had to Stanford then UC CP training (which was super competitive to get into for obvious reasons as they had to train all their own folks as well!).

But in terms of elite CP it has to be UPenn, WashU, Utah, Mayo.

UPenn/WashU pioneered the entire training program, Utah/Mayo have huge reference labs where you can get crazy in depth exposure.

 

[Euchromatin]

Agree with LADoc00 for the top tier big dogs in terms of prestige although I have no personal experience with their CP training quality for residents.
If you are less competitive or have some geographic restrictions, you could also consider mid-tier programs that offer CP fellowship(s), especially in whatever CP area it is you are interested in, assuming they have reasonably high volume/large CP labs and the resident training overall doesn't suck. Not sure how much things will have changed since I was scoping out places for my own training in the midwest/great lakes region, but I recall at that time that a couple of the very few chemistry/chemical pathology fellowships in the country were in southeast Michigan - Beaumont offered blood bank and chemistry, and University of Michigan had molecular, blood bank and chemistry. I think UM also now has David Keren, guru of protein electrophoresis and flow cytometry.

 

[LADoc00]

I think surgical pathology at Hopkins began around 119 years ago and stemmed from surgeons as opposed to "physicians" who desired to have a more formal training of surgical disease in a lab setting. Lab medicine aka CP began in an early form after WW1 with the ASCP but didnt train actual pathologists in CP specifically until later, maybe after WW2? And back then it was just WashU and UPenn, then Hopkins I think.

Dr. William Henry Welch created AP.

Im very mad at myself as I cant remember the faculty member credited at Penn who created CP, but gold stars for SDN posters who figure this out!

 

[Vicinal]

I think surgical pathology at Hopkins began around 119 years ago and stemmed from surgeons as opposed to "physicians" who desired to have a more formal training of surgical disease in a lab setting. Lab medicine aka CP began in an early form after WW1 with the ASCP but didnt train actual pathologists in CP specifically until later, maybe after WW2? And back then it was just WashU and UPenn, then Hopkins I think.

Dr. William Henry Welch created AP.

Im very mad at myself as I cant remember the faculty member credited at Penn who created CP, but gold stars for SDN posters who figure this out!

Was it James Tyson?

 

[LADoc00]

Was it James Tyson?

No but maybe William Pepper? I dont know, I thought it was someone more recent than that though.

 

[StatistPriceControlsFail]

Iowa is excellent in CP. And in general. Residents have real responsibility (dictate/write reports & get called first) in all rotations--even as PGY1s.

 

[deleted642280]

There are more and more programs now good at CP but still also a lot phenominally bad at it, so it may help to ask the following questions to get a feel:
1) Is CP time protected? (You are not on autopsy call, you are not on frozens, you are not grossing or expected to do AP related activities with all your "free" time)
2) When do you start CP rotations? If you are considering a CP fellowship, you cannot wait until 3rd year to have any CP rotations to decide
3) Have any of your residents failed CP board exams in the last few years?
4) When and what type of CP didactics are given every week?
5) When you are on rotations, do you get to sign out panels/workups to the attending and take "real" calls?

 

[ClinPathDO]

I am only a first year at UTSW but I feel our CP training is rather strong.

 

[yaah]

CP training is only as strong (or weak) as the individual doing the training. You could spend most of your CP days learning from everyone in the lab, sitting in on meetings, etc, and learn all you need to learn. It's nice if they have good targeted lectures though.

A lot of people seem to think that AP is learned by doing, while CP is learned by reading. Obviously, you have to do a ton of reading to learn enough CP for the boards. But practical CP is also learned by doing.