Boards studying

[HbyHA]

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sooooo its that time again... anyone who is currently studying for/recently took the boards have any sage words of advice?

more food for my daily panic attack about this subject...

 

[Gyric]

Do what you need to do to keep the panic at bay, but realize that apart from being a good resident there is not much useful you can do at this point, imo (definitely cram before the test though, maybe 3-4 weeks). It can be good to harness the panic and study a few areas you are weak in, but the test is not that bad and does not justify terror. If you are really worried you can take AP and CP separately, for twice the fee.

 

[Parts Unknown]

sooooo its that time again... anyone who is currently studying for/recently took the boards have any sage words of advice?

more food for my daily panic attack about this subject...

Step 1: Don't panic. It won't help. Better to just take a deep breath and enjoy the hum of the freight train as it steadily and inexorably rolls in your direction.

Step 2: Ignore Gyric. While true that being a good resident is your best single weapon for the exam (particularly AP), there is a huge body of information the test draws on, and much of it is not covered well or at all in residency (particularly CP). Unless you are hyperthymestic and have spent the last 3.5 years reading Henry's every night, you will need to study for this thing. Like it or not, the failure rate is uncomfortably high, the failure rate on retakes is even worse, and the cost of failure is exorbitant in terms of money, time, and anxiety about future employment.

Step 3: Everyone who went before me told me to pick a few resources and stick with them. I absolutely agree. You can't know it all, so don't try.

AP: Second half of Robbins is good, as is the Wash U Manual. Lefkowitch for questions. Cibas for cyto. Do the Osler lectures, and repeat the ones you like. Look over whatever remembrances you can to get some idea of what the boards considers testable points.

CP: Quick Compendium (I like the first edition better than the second). Clinical Laboratory Science Review for questions. Do the Osler lectures; micro is particularly helpful, with the exception of parasitology. CAP's Color Atlas of Hematology is good.

Step 4: Put yourself on a schedule, but still have some fun on occasion. No sense in burning out before you even make it to Tampa.

Step 5: Don't listen to this:

 

[Pingu]

The first thing I would advise is images, images, and more images. The AP image section has a lot of cyto and heme-ish stuff. I used Holladay Cytopath Review Guide and felt that quite a few questions were almost identical. For CP, I cut the Koneman color plates out of the book and carried them around, i also cut the color plates out of my old Henry (I don't think the new Henry has color plates). For Heme images I used Naiem Atlas of Bone Marrow and Blood Pathology.

The second thing that shows up on both AP and CP in a higher percentage than you would expect is lab management crap. CPT coding, medicare and medicaid regulations, and on and on...There is a good chapter in Cibas and a section of questions in Holladay.

For Blood Bank...Blood Bank Guy Notes off of his website

 

[yaah]

Above points are all good. The comment about being a good resident I agree with - there were quite a few questions on my boards that I knew simply by hanging around labs and paying attention during signout or doing a little extra. But unfortunately most of the boards is not experience-related. It is just acquiring knowledge and hopefully retaining it. Whatever method works best for you, you should do. I hate flashcards so I did not do those, but other people swear by them. I like practice questions so I tried to do as many of those as I could. Looking at a lot of images is also helpful - particularly micro images.

Some people take courses like the ASCP course or Osler. Usually they are less helpful for AP if your program is a good one, but they are helpful for CP. I did not take one but I know people who did. The only area where there is a defined excellent specific study source is blood bank, as pingu said - bbguy.org.

 

[yaah]

FYI there is also a post in the FAQ sticky about boards studying.

 

[smellycat]

Step 1: Don't panic. It won't help. Better to just take a deep breath and enjoy the hum of the freight train as it steadily and inexorably rolls in your direction.

Step 2: Ignore Gyric. While true that being a good resident is your best single weapon for the exam (particularly AP), there is a huge body of information the test draws on, and much of it is not covered well or at all in residency (particularly CP). Unless you are hyperthymestic and have spent the last 3.5 years reading Henry's every night, you will need to study for this thing. Like it or not, the failure rate is uncomfortably high, the failure rate on retakes is even worse, and the cost of failure is exorbitant in terms of money, time, and anxiety about future employment.

Step 3: Everyone who went before me told me to pick a few resources and stick with them. I absolutely agree. You can't know it all, so don't try.

AP: Second half of Robbins is good, as is the Wash U Manual. Lefkowitch for questions. Cibas for cyto. Do the Osler lectures, and repeat the ones you like. Look over whatever remembrances you can to get some idea of what the boards considers testable points.

CP: Quick Compendium (I like the first edition better than the second). Clinical Laboratory Science Review for questions. Do the Osler lectures; micro is particularly helpful, with the exception of parasitology. CAP's Color Atlas of Hematology is good.

Step 4: Put yourself on a schedule, but still have some fun on occasion. No sense in burning out before you even make it to Tampa.

Step 5: Don't listen to this:

Very good information above. Yes, I agree, don't cram. You need to go through the material multiple times before it sticks.
I would just add:

1. Check out the color plates in Koneman for microbiology. Some of the images are similar or nearly the same. I agree that the osler lecturer for micro was awesome. Listen to it a few times.

2. I flipped through the cyto books just looking at the pictures. I thought that really helped.

3. I thought the remembrances from the past years was REALLY helpful. It also can be a guide to studying. If I had never heard of a certain topic, I would read about it. Read above and below the topic. There is a lot of information that was covered on the boards that isn't easy to find. I had to find them in case reports or some obscure site.

4. Read quick compendium 2-3 times cover to cover. A good blood book (CAP or ASCP) with images of acanthocytes, auer rods (blood cell morphology) and such is helpful. Also know what causes them or what certain things are made of (Heinz bodies and such).

5. You will feel like you got through something, remember it the next day easily, sort of remember it the next couple of days, and completely forget what it is in a week. I think it happens to everyone (at least to me) so just keep going through the material systematically. Repetition was key for me. The test is multiple choice so hopefully the answer choices will jog your memory.

6. I thought drawing pictures and mnemonics were very helpful. If I had time, I would color my pictures too. Also, the more disgusting, the better. ;p

7. If there is someone in your program with similar learning styles and fund of knowledge, I think it was sooooo helpful to go over stuff, talking the material out. You will remember things easier if you teach it to someone or remember talking about it with someone. One on one is good. I don't think group studying is very beneficial.

8. This sounds sort of lame, but I DID study the night before AP and CP. Going over some of the material the night before was really helpful. I know I got at least a few questions doing that.

9. You should start with slides on day 1. They changed the format on us that year. So expect that. I actually liked it a lot better than having it after lunch.

10. Book your stuff through travelocity (book the hotel and flight together to get the best discount). It was cheaper than getting the discount through ABP. The hotel is nice too. I would highly recommend staying there.

Good luck and make sure you have someone to hug after the exam.

 

[Pingu]

10. Book your stuff through travelocity (book the hotel and flight together to get the best discount). It was cheaper than getting the discount through ABP. The hotel is nice too. I would highly recommend staying there.

I second this. I used expedia and booked hotel and flight together and saved several hundred dollars (and even got a better room). The ABP discount is barely a discount.

 

[levels x3]

Convince your friends to go with you to Bern's Steak House the evening the exam ends and make a reservation in advance. Sure we talked about the test, how can you not? But the anxiety and frustration were seriously mellowed by the great steaks and lots of good wine.

Oh, and after CP, I really felt that just knowing the Quick Compendium well would get you a long way toward passing...perhaps all the way in fact.

 

[Gyric]

AP: Second half of Robbins is good, as is the Wash U Manual. Lefkowitch for questions. Cibas for cyto. Do the Osler lectures, and repeat the ones you like. Look over whatever remembrances you can to get some idea of what the boards considers testable points.

CP: Quick Compendium (I like the first edition better than the second). Clinical Laboratory Science Review for questions. Do the Osler lectures; micro is particularly helpful, with the exception of parasitology. CAP's Color Atlas of Hematology is good.

I think starting your prep in Jan may still be overkill if you are a well-trained confident resident (my program told me that none of our residents had ever failed above a certain RISE threshold, which was pretty much all of our residents). If you struggled with the RISE or are in a program where residents routinely fail, then throw everything you have at these tests; the pass rate is definitely not 100%.

For what its worth, I kept it simple and went through Lefkowitch once (some chapters were good, others were worthless) and also once through the CP quick compendium companion (which was overall good, but which had many errors; see a past thread in which some of us posted the correct answers) and made a few notes to cram in right before the test. I did not touch Robbins etc. I memorized the equations in the back of Mais, but did not go through the chapters. I did a few questions in an ASCP cytopath book, but did not find it that helpful. I reviewed some particularly good faculty handouts, went through most of my recut collection and continued my practice of completing the weekly JHU surg path and cytology on-line cases (thanks to the JHU residents for putting these up. cytology was especially helpful!). Right before the test I also went through the Osler BB, Koneman images and Utah Webpath gross images. I completed all of this in the 6-8 weeks prior to the test (which was not too busy for me). On the test days I was only able to remember fine details from what I studied over the last 2-3 weeks, which I is why I would not go overboard on studying. I studied surg path alot over the course of residency, but this was not targeted to boards studying.

The level of detail can get quite extreme, for some of the questions I had to dig deep into my molecular biology PhD training to come up with an answer and rare questions seemed to be at the primary literature/case report level. Some of the images were of poor quality and/or had no clear best answer. Still many of the questions were easier than those on the RISE imo. CP, in particular, was easier than I expected based on what everyone told me.

Here is a relevant post after my group took boards:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=541107&page=2

 

[HbyHA]

thanks for the helpful tips everyone. i'm really not too freaked out the majority of the time. I'm at a large program with good training where no resident has failed the boards in sometime. i have a study plan in mind that seems along the lines of what most people here have suggested. i just needed a little encouragement after comparing my plan with those of my fellow residents who seem in all out freak-out mode and seem hell bent on memorizing every textbook that crosses their path. i have accepted the following truths:

1) everyone surrounding me is Type AAAAAAAAAAA+ personality who probably should be on major anxiety medication

2) boards have no relevance to the real world, just another hoop to jump through and all i need to do is pass

my motivation is the hardest thing to keep up since i'm headed to FP-land (mock me if you must, i don't care) and i truly detest all things surg and cyto path, and i guess CP in general.

 

[BrainPathology]

2) boards have no relevance to the real world, just another hoop to jump through and all i need to do is pass

This is not quite 100% true.. there are things I learned studying for the boards that showed up on the exams that have come in handy especially with older attendings who have no clue about some things. It will make it a lot easier for you to study if you actually believe that some of the things you learn that you don't learn in residency actually help you to sign out cases after you're done.

The high failure rates are more a reflection of programs unwillingness to get rid of people who don't belong in pathology or medicine in general than a reflection of monstrously difficult exams. With steady, consistent studying at whatever style you have and enjoy you'll pass. For me this meant 1 - 2 hours 3 days a week starting in January and steadily increasing to a max of 5-6 hours a day in May and the first half of June.

We need more good FP people, so no mocking there. If anything those kinds of specialties show a true love of your work and not a propensity for chasing other things. (so many more people have decided that they LOVE derm path lately for example)

 

[Pingu]

1) everyone surrounding me is Type AAAAAAAAAAA+ personality who probably should be on major anxiety medication

Another good piece of advice is to avoid talking about studying with your fellow residents. It can cause you to doubt yourself and your abilities and can lead to a lot of stress and insecurity that you really don't need right now.

If you want to actually study with someone, that is fine, but try to avoid getting sucked into conversations about overall hours studied, etc. Everyone learns and studies differently and just because someone says they studied 12 hours straight doesn't mean they learned anything.

 

[yaah]

That is good advice - when you study around other people sometimes you get really fixated on one minor point which may or may not be relevant. In the time it takes you to look up and get the "right answer" to one random question you could be reviewing about two dozen other more high yield topics.

Then again, I have never been one to study in groups. Some people love it because they can't motivate themselves on their own, or they like quizzing each other.

 

[HbyHA]

This is not quite 100% true.. there are things I learned studying for the boards that showed up on the exams that have come in handy especially with older attendings who have no clue about some things. It will make it a lot easier for you to study if you actually believe that some of the things you learn that you don't learn in residency actually help you to sign out cases after you're done.

fair enough. i think i just am a little frustrated about certain areas that may have been more useful to me than say, general surg path, are completely NOT taught at my program (cardiac path, toxicology, ect) and my autopsy training was kind of mediocre.