Cadaver lab not what I expected....

[DPTHopeful2012]

Hi everyone, I just had my first gross anatomy cadaver lab today and surprisingly, I didn't like it that much. I was looking forward to the cadavers and dissecting because I love anatomy, but I felt frustrated most of the time. It was a bit interesting to see actual muscles and placements of structures, but I wasn't excited by anything.

To be honest, it all felt really tedious and the whole process of dissection was just sloppy to me, since we didn't really know how to find structures. It was a guessing game most of the time and I accidentally cut through muscles that I wasn't supposed to. We were following a dissection textbook which helped somewhat, but I felt like I needed the prof helping me the entire time. My partners were somewhat helpful, but most of the time were walking around and seeing other lab groups' cadavers (which is fine, but I felt like I needed their help).

I just feel like so much time was spent dissecting and the payoff was just okay, not spectacular. I have the rest of the semester doing this and I'm not looking forward to it. To be honest, I'd rather just view dissected cadavers and point out the structures, rather than do it myself.

Will this lab get better and will I feel less frustrated as the semester goes on? Does cadaver lab always feel this tedious? Will it become more exciting? Maybe I should keep waiting til it excites me? Thanks, all.

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[JD573]

I took gross anatomy last semester, and I felt the exact same way. The process of dissecting is very tedious, and I truly felt the time I spent cleaning (removing fat and fascia), would have been better served studying. I can't speak for everyone, but anatomy lab isn't very fun. You have to do so much work just to find something you could have easily pointed out on a model. I hope you start to feel better about it, but the day I passed anatomy was the best day of DPT school so far. Good luck and remember that perseverance is the key!

 

[noyceguy]

I have some bad news for you. PT school is mostly not exciting. In fact, you can see cadaver lab as a perfect metaphor for the whole process. You put in a bunch of tedious, boring, repetitive work that is anything but exciting. Then at the end you stand back after all that work see that you actually do have a bit of knowledge. Then you move on to the next thing.

I have said it before on these boards and I will say it again. PT SCHOOL IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE FUN OR EXCITING. It is not designed for your enjoyment, or for you to like it. It is designed to prepare you to pass the boards and do a job to a certain standard.

As for cadaver lab, enjoy the only time in your career where you can see the body in this much detail. Just start cutting off fat until you can see the good stuff, then memorize that sh#t.

 

[Azimuthal]

I personally loved cadaver lab. I used half the time to dissect and the other to study. I guess it's all in how your professors structured your lab.

Also, we had two PhDs and up to 6 TA's assisting us. 15 minutes before dissections, we were given instructions on what to do and what to look for. I don't know how some of you were left alone with a textbook? Nothing good will come out of that.

 

[PTMattI]

I have some bad news for you. PT school is mostly not exciting. In fact, you can see cadaver lab as a perfect metaphor for the whole process. You put in a bunch of tedious, boring, repetitive work that is anything but exciting. Then at the end you stand back after all that work see that you actually do have a bit of knowledge. Then you move on to the next thing.

I have said it before on these boards and I will say it again. PT SCHOOL IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE FUN OR EXCITING. It is not designed for your enjoyment, or for you to like it. It is designed to prepare you to pass the boards and do a job to a certain standard.

As for cadaver lab, enjoy the only time in your career where you can see the body in this much detail. Just start cutting off fat until you can see the good stuff, then memorize that sh#t.

I disagree with this statement.....I am currently in my 2nd semester of my 2nd year and I am about to start clinic in May. First year was a little boring because it was mostly foundational science classes such as neuro, anatomy, cardio pulmonary etc...however in my 2nd year we are doing a lot of manual muscoloskeletal skills and other intervention stuff /exercise. It can definitely be stressful / tedious at times but I can legitimately say I look forward to coming into class everyday.

 

[NewTestament]

I have said it before on these boards and I will say it again. PT SCHOOL IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE FUN OR EXCITING. It is not designed for your enjoyment, or for you to like it. It is designed to prepare you to pass the boards and do a job to a certain standard.

Somebody is clearly not having a good time in PT school. It's demanding and challenging, and that's why it is fun. Your lack of enthusiasm will hurt you as a PT.

 

[1027453812]

How can PT school not be fun or exciting when you decided to put the time and effort to sign up for it for 3 years? I am confused.

Although I am simply an applicant I am looking forward to starting school. As for the work-load, I will cross the bridge when I get there.

 

[PTMattI]

How can PT school not be fun or exciting when you decided to put the time and effort to sign up for it for 3 years? I am confused.

Although I am simply an applicant I am looking forward to starting school. As for the work-load, I will cross the bridge when I get there.

It all depends on the individual, your classmates and your school. I have classmates who for the most part like school, and there are others who dread coming in everyday. If you have the right mindset and enjoy learning and bettering yourself, you should for the most part enjoy your experience.

Dont get me wrong, there are still aspects of it that are not so great such as the long hours, stressful competencies, learning about medicare lol, but if you just have a positive mindset you will be fine.

 

[02143]

Cadaver lab is frustrating at times, and will always be incredibly tedious - but, it should get better and can become very rewarding. Maybe I am optimistic, because I absolutely loved my cadaver lab (and would love to be in the lab every semester), but your eyes will get better at finding structures and you become more aware of what arteries, nerves, veins, ligaments, etc look like. It is frustrating to know that you cut through things, but your skills will get better. Also, remember that your dissection skills are not expected to be perfect. There are multiple cadavers for each class and each one will present in its own manner -- if you accidentally cut something on yours, find another body that has it intact so that you can still learn. Make sure you have an atlas on hand and don't be afraid to slow down and look something up to see where it runs/where you should expect to see it. The understanding that you gain of the human body after cadaver lab is invaluable. Don't be discouraged after day 1!

 

[noyceguy]

I appreciate all the information I learned in cadaver lab. I use that information when examining and treating patients. It is very useful. However, the acquiring of that information - the long hours spent memorizing origin/insertion/action/blood supply/innervation of muscles with my face six inches from a dead body was not "exciting." This does not means all the learning is not worthwhile. It just means it is not "fun" or "exciting." I hope I have made this point clearly. If you happen to think that the process of learning in PT school is fun, then that is great. Whether or not someone makes a good PT has little to do with whether they enjoy school itself. So to the OP, if you don't enjoy it or if you do enjoy it, you'll probably be OK in the end.

 

[Azimuthal]

I think cadaver lab is now more to appreciate the complexity and variation of the human body rather than be an anatomical guide for PT skill acquisition. That experience is relatively priceless to many students such as myself. I am very thankful to our donors.

 

[DPTHopeful2012]

Thanks for all the feedback, everyone.

To clarify what I mean by "exciting," I'm not expecting it to be like puppies, rainbows, and candy canes in cadaver lab, but so many 2nd and 3rd year students told me I'd find it really interesting to dissect and view the structures in person. I must've heard "you'll love it," "my favorite class so far," "have you had cadavers before? no? you will really like it" about 30 times from various people. I do find it a bit interesting, but I'm not loving it, if you know what I mean. Yes, it was interesting to see the external obliques in a cadaver, but I wasn't thrilled or anything by it. It took soooo long to dissect to get to that point and the pay off didn't seem worth it. Don't get me wrong, I am very thankful for people who have donated their bodies to science to help me become a better health professional, but right now I would be fine if I didn't have to dissect.

It's nice to know that others found the process tedious and I'm hoping I'll find the time in lab useful as the semester goes on. I'll just give it time. Later in the semester we will be learning muscle testing, goniometry, etc so hopefully when it all comes together and I can apply it, I'll find it more interesting.

In terms of whether or not we should be having fun/excitement in PT school, I definitely believe there are times when we should feel that way because we're studying to be in a profession that we all are interested in and we're surrounded by people who want the same thing. Of course there will be times of stress. But I don't believe that we should never enjoy PT school. It shouldn't be torture, in my opinion. If it is, then your'e definitely in the wrong field, in my opinion.

 

[noyceguy]

Thanks for all the feedback, everyone.

To clarify what I mean by "exciting," I'm not expecting it to be like puppies, rainbows, and candy canes in cadaver lab, but so many 2nd and 3rd year students told me I'd find it really interesting to dissect and view the structures in person. I must've heard "you'll love it," "my favorite class so far," "have you had cadavers before? no? you will really like it" about 30 times from various people. I do find it a bit interesting, but I'm not loving it, if you know what I mean. Yes, it was interesting to see the external obliques in a cadaver, but I wasn't thrilled or anything by it. It took soooo long to dissect to get to that point and the pay off didn't seem worth it. Don't get me wrong, I am very thankful for people who have donated their bodies to science to help me become a better health professional, but right now I would be fine if I didn't have to dissect.

It's nice to know that others found the process tedious and I'm hoping I'll find the time in lab useful as the semester goes on. I'll just give it time. Later in the semester we will be learning muscle testing, goniometry, etc so hopefully when it all comes together and I can apply it, I'll find it more interesting.

In terms of whether or not we should be having fun/excitement in PT school, I definitely believe there are times when we should feel that way because we're studying to be in a profession that we all are interested in and we're surrounded by people who want the same thing. Of course there will be times of stress. But I don't believe that we should never enjoy PT school. It shouldn't be torture, in my opinion. If it is, then your'e definitely in the wrong field, in my opinion.

Good luck with the rest of the class, I'm sure you'll get more into it when you get everything all dissected out.

 

[NewTestament]

You will learn everything when you and your classmates come after classes are over. I hardly learned anything while I was dissecting except when one of the professors or TA's pointed things out. Get together with some of your classmates and quiz each other. Three or four students together can identify almost all the structures you need to identify for the practical.

 

[markelmarcel]

noyceguy hit the nail on the head... for those of you saying, "well you shouldn't be in PT school if you don't enjoy it" -- have you actually gone through school the entire way? I just graduated in December and I am praising God that it is OVER and I never have to go back!!! Yes, I had fun and a lot of good memories, but the pure adrenaline rush I have from never having to attend another 8am lecture or spend another weekend missing out on friends/family get togethers (baby showers, bridal showers, birthday parties, football games, etc) is amazing.

So, yes, you make the best of it... but honestly, PT school is something that I am more than happy is over!

So, my advice to the OP is dig in and make the best of every situation you can. Try to find unconventional ways to learn and yes, there will be classes you love that others hate (I think I'm the only person in my graduating class that loved cardiopulmonary) and classes you hate that others told you that you'd love. It's all part of the process and all part of finding out who you are as a person and as a PT! Good luck!

 

[noyceguy]

noyceguy hit the nail on the head... for those of you saying, "well you shouldn't be in PT school if you don't enjoy it" -- have you actually gone through school the entire way? I just graduated in December and I am praising God that it is OVER and I never have to go back!!! Yes, I had fun and a lot of good memories, but the pure adrenaline rush I have from never having to attend another 8am lecture or spend another weekend missing out on friends/family get togethers (baby showers, bridal showers, birthday parties, football games, etc) is amazing.

So, yes, you make the best of it... but honestly, PT school is something that I am more than happy is over!

So, my advice to the OP is dig in and make the best of every situation you can. Try to find unconventional ways to learn and yes, there will be classes you love that others hate (I think I'm the only person in my graduating class that loved cardiopulmonary) and classes you hate that others told you that you'd love. It's all part of the process and all part of finding out who you are as a person and as a PT! Good luck!

Yeah, I can't wait to be in that position myself. Done and working.

It's real easy to say what PT school should be about when you've done it for one whole week. It's another thing entirely to have done it almost every day for 2-3 years.

 

[schnell8]

I have some bad news for you. PT school is mostly not exciting. In fact, you can see cadaver lab as a perfect metaphor for the whole process. You put in a bunch of tedious, boring, repetitive work that is anything but exciting. Then at the end you stand back after all that work see that you actually do have a bit of knowledge. Then you move on to the next thing.

I have said it before on these boards and I will say it again. PT SCHOOL IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE FUN OR EXCITING. It is not designed for your enjoyment, or for you to like it. It is designed to prepare you to pass the boards and do a job to a certain standard.

As for cadaver lab, enjoy the only time in your career where you can see the body in this much detail. Just start cutting off fat until you can see the good stuff, then memorize that sh#t.

I think this depends on your program and your faculty. I am in my second semester of my first year at UM - Flint and we have been having a blast! Of course there are lots of boring typical lectures but the faculty tries to make things very interactive and fun for us.

As for cadaver lab, we had it our first semester and it is a pain when your removing skin and fat at first. I enjoyed it more once when all the 'busy' work was done. But nonetheless, I was personally happy when it was done...lol

 

[DPTHopeful2012]

I think this depends on your program and your faculty. I am in my second semester of my first year at UM - Flint and we have been having a blast! Of course there are lots of boring typical lectures but the faculty tries to make things very interactive and fun for us.

As for cadaver lab, we had it our first semester and it is a pain when your removing skin and fat at first. I enjoyed it more once when all the 'busy' work was done. But nonetheless, I was personally happy when it was done...lol

LOL last week we had to remove the abdominal contents. I'm not gonna lie, that was definitely disgusting and I don't usually get grossed out by things. I'm glad that's in the past now and can start dissecting to find nerves, muscles, bony landmarks, etc. We actually discovered that one of the cadavers had the same medical condition that I had surgery for last semester (fibroids in uterus) and I'm going back to lab in a couple days to view it on my own time since it wasn't the cadaver I'm assigned to. Now that is definitely something I want to see because I can relate to it very well.

In reply to some of the few posts above, I know I'm only in my 2nd semester of PT school so I might not have the years under my belt, but I do understand that constant studying and missing social events in order to study for exams sucks, however I feel like being in school will never be as bad as being in the workforce. I just think it's easier to be in school than working full-time. Right now I don't have to answer to a boss, I have a fairly flexible schedule, and I'm not always trying to please other people. I do miss making money, but I have the rest of my life to do that and will only be in school for another 2.5 years. That's just the way I see it, I guess.

 

[DesertPT]

It all depends on your personality and what interests you...I'm a lab rat so dissecting doesn't seem particularly tedious to me...and I love the basic sciences that underlie PT and those are some of the classes I look most forward to.

Some people have personalities more suited for the way being a student is structured, but that doesn't mean those that don't wont succeed or make good PTs. If you dread going to school every day for 2 years though, that's probably not a good sign...

 

[Mad Jack]

I never really got the whole "I can't wait to cut up cold, smelly dead people" mentality that many people have. If you aren't going into a profession or field that does surgery, the whole thing just seems like a boring waste of time.

 

[callmecrazy]

In reply to some of the few posts above, I know I'm only in my 2nd semester of PT school so I might not have the years under my belt, but I do understand that constant studying and missing social events in order to study for exams sucks, however I feel like being in school will never be as bad as being in the workforce. I just think it's easier to be in school than working full-time. Right now I don't have to answer to a boss, I have a fairly flexible schedule, and I'm not always trying to please other people. I do miss making money, but I have the rest of my life to do that and will only be in school for another 2.5 years. That's just the way I see it, I guess.

I know this is a tangent from the original topic, but this made me say "huh?!" I've never had to answer to a boss in the way you answer to a professor. And let's be honest, obtaining grades is largely dependent on pleasing the person grading you in a style of assessment that may or may not fit your learning style. I've worked full-time in more than one career, and the independence of working has been unmatched by the student experience. As an employee, I prioritize, schedule, and execute everything I do under a general set of guidelines as I see fit. Being a student means functioning on someone else's very specific schedule (ie.syllabi). I'm genuinely curious (ie. please don't read this as offensive), but have you worked full-time in a career-driven position before? It's really kind of awesome...

On topic, our first semester anatomy cadavers were dissected for us. Dissection was an elective later in the program. I wasn't interested in that aspect and still felt like I got the foundation I needed. I think I would have felt it was more tedious than exciting too.

 

[markelmarcel]

I know this is a tangent from the original topic, but this made me say "huh?!" I've never had to answer to a boss in the way you answer to a professor. And let's be honest, obtaining grades is largely dependent on pleasing the person grading you in a style of assessment that may or may not fit your learning style. I've worked full-time in more than one career, and the independence of working has been unmatched by the student experience. As an employee, I prioritize, schedule, and execute everything I do under a general set of guidelines as I see fit. Being a student means functioning on someone else's very specific schedule (ie.syllabi). I'm genuinely curious (ie. please don't read this as offensive), but have you worked full-time in a career-driven position before? It's really kind of awesome...

I thought the SAME thing! And just in a curious manner, as you do... Because, working is awesome. There is no homework, no outside of work assignments (well for the most part dependent on what your job is!) and generally you have way more free time and can have a life and hobbies! HOBBIES! Real ones! I'm so excited that I'm going to get to do the things I used to enjoy doing and didn't have time to do because of studying!

 

[DesertPT]

I thought the SAME thing! And just in a curious manner, as you do... Because, working is awesome. There is no homework, no outside of work assignments (well for the most part dependent on what your job is!) and generally you have way more free time and can have a life and hobbies! HOBBIES! Real ones! I'm so excited that I'm going to get to do the things I used to enjoy doing and didn't have time to do because of studying!

True dat...just working full time for 3 months in the summer makes me dread going back to school when the semester starts.

 

[DesertPT]

noyceguy hit the nail on the head... for those of you saying, "well you shouldn't be in PT school if you don't enjoy it" -- have you actually gone through school the entire way? I just graduated in December and I am praising God that it is OVER and I never have to go back!!! Yes, I had fun and a lot of good memories, but the pure adrenaline rush I have from never having to attend another 8am lecture or spend another weekend missing out on friends/family get togethers (baby showers, bridal showers, birthday parties, football games, etc) is amazing.

So, yes, you make the best of it... but honestly, PT school is something that I am more than happy is over!

So, my advice to the OP is dig in and make the best of every situation you can. Try to find unconventional ways to learn and yes, there will be classes you love that others hate (I think I'm the only person in my graduating class that loved cardiopulmonary) and classes you hate that others told you that you'd love. It's all part of the process and all part of finding out who you are as a person and as a PT! Good luck!

I agree with this totally too. This has been my experience with undergrad (on a smaller scale) and I imagine it will be my experience with grad school too.

Luckily I tend to be interested by almost all classes. I just take the attitude that every class is an opportunity to learn something I don't already know and if you have to be there anyway you might as well listen in a appreciate the body of knowledge in that subject for what it is...I can't say this has been true for every class, but most.

 

[jesspt]

I thought the SAME thing! And just in a curious manner, as you do... Because, working is awesome. There is no homework, no outside of work assignments (well for the most part dependent on what your job is!) and generally you have way more free time and can have a life and hobbies! HOBBIES! Real ones! I'm so excited that I'm going to get to do the things I used to enjoy doing and didn't have time to do because of studying!

You mean other than reading and staying abreast of current best research so you can provide appropriate science-base practice, right?

 

[noyceguy]

You mean other than reading and staying abreast of current best research so you can provide appropriate science-base practice, right?

Hilarious.

 

[NewTestament]

You mean other than reading and staying abreast of current best research so you can provide appropriate science-base practice, right?

I'm always surprised when students tell me they don't read or research while they're doing clinicals. As if all learning occurs in the clinic.

 

[markelmarcel]

You mean other than reading and staying abreast of current best research so you can provide appropriate science-base practice, right?

I'd much rather read things leisurely that apply to patients I'm currently seeing than be forced to do 4+ hours of research for a PBL case.

 

[jesspt]

I'm always surprised when students tell me they don't read or research while they're doing clinicals. As if all learning occurs in the clinic.

Well, I think some of that can be attributed to a mentorship problem, as I had several clinical instructors during my affiliations that hadn't read an article critically in years. But, I think this is relatively common attitude among PT school graduate

 

[markelmarcel]

I'm always surprised when students tell me they don't read or research while they're doing clinicals. As if all learning occurs in the clinic.

Well, I think some of that can be attributed to a mentorship problem, as I had several clinical instructors during my affiliations that hadn't read an article critically in years. But, I think this is relatively common attitude among PT school graduate

I actually did a fair amount of research during all of my clinicals, especially for patients that my CI/staff were unsure of or had a diagnosis they weren't comfortable with... My BS is in education, so it's safe to say that I put a lot of stock and self-motivation in being educated and continuing education beyond what is expected. That being said, I can't imagine there isn't one person that immediately upon graduating that didn't say, "Thank god all that studying is over!" -- Researching for work and/or researching to keep yourself on top of the profession is completely different than fulfilling required assignments by professors. I always find that learning is much more gratifying when it is self-induced by your own curiosity and want to better yourself.

Additionally, the employer I chose is focused on continuing with evidence-based research/practice and holds monthly journal clubs on varying topics, all staff routinely go to continuing education courses/conferences and even though I haven't officially started yet, I've been to two meetings to discuss different joints as the clinical director is preparing for her orthopedic specialist exam. So, I feel it's very important for new grads to find employers that are invested in continuing education and place a certain amount of importance on that. Then again, maybe I feel that way because of my previous background in the education field coupled with the particular program I went through... Having a problem-based curriculum definitely makes you willing/ready to simply "look it up" when you come across something you're unfamiliar with in the clinic.

 

[noyceguy]

I actually did a fair amount of research during all of my clinicals, especially for patients that my CI/staff were unsure of or had a diagnosis they weren't comfortable with... My BS is in education, so it's safe to say that I put a lot of stock and self-motivation in being educated and continuing education beyond what is expected. That being said, I can't imagine there isn't one person that immediately upon graduating that didn't say, "Thank god all that studying is over!" -- Researching for work and/or researching to keep yourself on top of the profession is completely different than fulfilling required assignments by professors. I always find that learning is much more gratifying when it is self-induced by your own curiosity and want to better yourself.

Additionally, the employer I chose is focused on continuing with evidence-based research/practice and holds monthly journal clubs on varying topics, all staff routinely go to continuing education courses/conferences and even though I haven't officially started yet, I've been to two meetings to discuss different joints as the clinical director is preparing for her orthopedic specialist exam. So, I feel it's very important for new grads to find employers that are invested in continuing education and place a certain amount of importance on that. Then again, maybe I feel that way because of my previous background in the education field coupled with the particular program I went through... Having a problem-based curriculum definitely makes you willing/ready to simply "look it up" when you come across something you're unfamiliar with in the clinic.

You make a very good point about self-initiated education being more fulfilling than required education. I find myself bored to tears having to memorize congenital heart defects and blood values, etc. But when I see something I don't understand in the clinic, I look it up in Dutton ot whatever and apply it the next day in the clinic - and that is a good feeling. I think what some of these new students don't understand is that just because a person thinks learning the entire curriculum is chore, that doesn't mean that person is not interested in learning. There is a world of difference there. I admit there are vasts swaths of PT I do not care about - chest PT, pediatrics, etc., but that simply means I have a particular interest in ortho - and not that I don't care about patients, being a good PT, etc.