California Programs; need info

[path-hopeful]

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Hello, I'm applying for path (28 programs actually) all over the country but my ideal location is southern California for no reason other than the fact that my family lives there. Does anyone know any dirt on path programs in socal? Which ones are the best/worst and what kind of scores/achievements do I need to get into the best ones? Thanks!

 

[dermpathlover]

Hello, I'm applying for path (28 programs actually) all over the country but my ideal location is southern California for no reason other than the fact that my family lives there. Does anyone know any dirt on path programs in socal? Which ones are the best/worst and what kind of scores/achievements do I need to get into the best ones? Thanks!

I only know about dermpath programs in SoCal. We willl have to wait for LADoc to fill us in.

 

[LADoc00]

Hello, I'm applying for path (28 programs actually) all over the country but my ideal location is southern California for no reason other than the fact that my family lives there. Does anyone know any dirt on path programs in socal? Which ones are the best/worst and what kind of scores/achievements do I need to get into the best ones? Thanks!

I didnt apply to a single SoCal Path program for residency but some of their fellowships are solid.

Where in socal? The place is bigger and more populous than most states.

On the west side, you got Cedars and UCLA. Lots of people write off Cedars (similar to Mt. Sinai in NYC I would imagine...of course Im gonna some hate for that..), but being there can secure you a potentially interesting fellowship slot, especially if they get that GI fellowship off the ground. And they have probably some of the best job connections in SoCal IMO. See everyone thinks UCLA owns West LA, nope, not even close. I have been at the UCLA ER at 3am on a Saturday and seen people screaming, crying to be taken to Cedars instead...and I would as well, trust me.

That said UCLA has the best range of fellowships overall, including Binder's derm program. And if you are single, Westwood is a target rich environment like no other.

All the places in LA pretty much have the bread and butter: Surg path, heme and cytopath fellowships. I would say in terms of Surg path, UCSD is my fav (lots of reason, Wiedner is a badass, its Kaiser afflitate which is the biggest employer in the area, lots of cyto exposure) but then you have these real diamond-n-rough type deals like a surg path year at UCLA Olive view that almost no one knows about but would allow you to really spread your wings before going out to private prac.

You got real outliers like Loma Linda, out there on the fringe but honestly they have some of the best faculty in Socal and even all of California. Loma Linda runs the Osler course now too so I bet they have near 100% board pass rates.

Then you got USC...rough neighborhood, well really rough. (There is a strip club around the corner that had some religious people protesting outside and some local vatos drove up and gunned em down) But has some real interesting people and some very serious entrepreneurs (they founded things like IMPATH etc.).

 

[trent05]

I interviewed at Cedar's. The fellowship spots are good. I think they have Heme, GI, GU, and some others. One question I asked at every place I interviewed (and I interviewed at almost 20 places) was does your program give preference to it's residents for fellowship spots. Of all the places I interviewed at, only Cedar's said NO. They went on to say that they prefer outside applicants and discourage their residents from staying. That statement alone moved Cedar's about 5 spots down my rank list. Several other programs told me that if they had a decent applicant from their program they wouldn't even interview other applicants. It really varies from program to program. A good program director will really push to get their solid residents the first shot at a good fellowship at their institution. Of course you really don't know for sure until you are in the program and get the down low.

 

[path-hopeful]

I'm probably the most interested in USC and UCSD. I've been to UCSD before and I like the area, and I think I have a pretty good chance at getting into USC. I would go to Loma Linda, but I'll rank that one lower because I'm not so fond of the area. What is the difference between Harbor UCLA and Westwood UCLA? Why do people "write off" Cedars Sinai, are they pretty selective? I guess what I really want to know is are there any programs with bad attendings, bad facilities, or bad administrations? You don't always get the truth out of interviews.

 

[DarksideAllstar]

I only know about dermpath programs in SoCal. We willl have to wait for LADoc to fill us in.

I see that you added several more "zero star" fellowships to your`tag line there. Shouldnt you be working on your dermpath abstract for USCAP?

 

[LADoc00]

I interviewed at Cedar's. The fellowship spots are good. I think they have Heme, GI, GU, and some others. One question I asked at every place I interviewed (and I interviewed at almost 20 places) was does your program give preference to it's residents for fellowship spots. Of all the places I interviewed at, only Cedar's said NO. They went on to say that they prefer outside applicants and discourage their residents from staying. That statement alone moved Cedar's about 5 spots down my rank list. Several other programs told me that if they had a decent applicant from their program they wouldn't even interview other applicants. It really varies from program to program. A good program director will really push to get their solid residents the first shot at a good fellowship at their institution. Of course you really don't know for sure until you are in the program and get the down low.

I think that predominantly stems from Cedars getting absolute bottom of the barrel pickings for YEARS. They probably feel burnt, I assume from sending complete jack asses out into private practice and ruining their rep with local community practices.

As I said, I personally wouldnt go there. Just naming options.

 

[LADoc00]

I see that you added several more "zero star" fellowships to your`tag line there. Shouldnt you be working on your dermpath abstract for USCAP?

I dont even understand his zero stars crap, you cant do a fellowship in EM or Environmental path....if you can somewhere please link that.

 

[dermpathlover]

I dont even understand his zero stars crap, you cant do a fellowship in EM or Environmental path....if you can somewhere please link that.

I saw it on the list of fellowships at Pathology Outlines.com

That is all I know about them.


Do not take offense to my rating a fellowship as zero stars. If you love eyepath, then that's fantastic. My rating system is 100% based on the applicability to private practice and the ability to earn $$$. Some of the ratings might be a little harsh, like TM and FP, but I don't believe you can earn big bucks in those fields unless you are a hustler. If you are a hustler, you can earn big bucks no matter what you do...sell tires, make donuts, real estate agent, etc..

The world needs eye pathologists, renal pathologists, cardiac pathologists, etc....it just will not be me.

I would rather do something I enjoy for 500,000 a year then do something I love for 125,000 a year. Call me crazy, if you want.

 

[dermpathlover]

I see that you added several more "zero star" fellowships to your`tag line there. Shouldnt you be working on your dermpath abstract for USCAP?

Oh, and I have three abstracts for USCAP. 2 are gimmies, one is a bit of a long shot. C U N SD, BIOTCH.

 

[LADoc00]

The world needs eye pathologists, renal pathologists, cardiac pathologists, etc.....

Ummmm says who? No, no we dont!

regular pathologist will do just fine for those areas. Crap, I could take a high school graduate and put them through just Osler and they could do most cardiac path.

 

[LADoc00]

Oh, and I have three abstracts for USCAP. 2 are gimmies, one is a bit of a long shot. C U N SD, BIOTCH.

Wow, dude you are going WAY overboard. Cultivate the other needed people skills, for example:

Smoozery 101: LADOC's guide to using an advanced knowledge of mixed drinks to impress potential employers.
Yes, I'll have a Golden Dragon with a bit of lemon peel.

or

Contracts 110: LADOC's guide to getting a free Porsche.
Well, should the courier system fail, a high performance automobile such as Porsche's new Cayman turbo, will ensure our valued clients the turnaround time they expect.

 

[Cabbage Head]

Wow, dude you are going WAY overboard. Cultivate the other needed people skills, for example:

Smoozery 101: LADOC's guide to using an advanced knowledge of mixed drinks to impress potential employers.
Yes, I'll have a Golden Dragon with a bit of lemon peel.

or

Contracts 110: LADOC's guide to getting a free Porsche.
Well, should the courier system fail, a high performance automobile such as Porsche's new Cayman turbo, will ensure our valued clients the turnaround time they expect.

Smoozery 101/Contracts 101 = 4 star fellowships

 

[dermpathlover]

Smoozery 101/Contracts 101 = 4 star fellowships

A two year fellowship of 6months DP, 6months GIpath, 6months GUpath, 6 months legal/contract/business/management training . Now that would be 4 star fellowship!

To ensure eligibility to sit for the DP boards, the six months of business training could be classified as "derm clinic" where you would have to go spend an hour a day in the derm clinic seeing "gross DP".

 

[LADoc00]

A two year fellowship of 6months DP, 6months GIpath, 6months GUpath, 6 months legal/contract/business/management training . Now that would be 4 star fellowship!

To ensure eligibility to sit for the DP boards, the six months of business training could be classified as "derm clinic" where you would have to go spend an hour a day in the derm clinic seeing "gross DP".

I think a simple solid surg path fellowship and a dermpath slot and you will be honestly set. Dont kill yourself. The whole point of path is la dolce vita.

Seriously, being a crazed gunner in path doesnt really get you the same thing it might say in an integrated plastics program.

Fo example, let say you and notdermpathlover, a fellow resident, both embark on a residency at UCSF. Youre both roomates in a little pad off Irving somewhere. You are working 16 hours a day, doing abstracts and crap, projects whatever. Notdermpathlover is at the XYZ bar chatting people up. He happens to chat up some ex-UCSF who are in private prac up in Pac Heights one night. You both do the 4 year residency, he does the surgpath fellowship and gets a job in the city. You do GI/GU, then a year of dermpath. You also want to live in the city, so you apply to the same group. Of course they offer you more than notdermpathlover started at, maybe 50 grand more, BUT, he is 1 year closer to partnership than you. In the grand scheme of things over a 30 year career, each extra month in training has a fairly substantial opportunity cost.

You both end up in adjacent townhomes near Golden Gate park, but notdermpathlover has this lightness and happiness about him because he never stressed. Maybe you pull out in your matching Porsche boxsters each morning and he smiles over to you with a lil hottie in the passenger seat, while yours is empty...food for thought.

Is this on your coffee table dermpathlover:

 

[cytoborg]

I think that predominantly stems from Cedars getting absolute bottom of the barrel pickings for YEARS. They probably feel burnt, I assume from sending complete jack asses out into private practice and ruining their rep with local community practices.

As I said, I personally wouldnt go there. Just naming options.

I interviewed there 2 years ago, knowing virtually nothing about it, and was really impressed. They have made some big changes in the last few years. They have great leadership that have turned things around. The residents have gotten a lot of input into shaping the program, and they seemed happy (not to mention quite sharp). They go on to impressive fellowships, and I like the philosophy of doing fellowship at a different place than residency, to broaden one's experience and expand connections. They do seem to have great job connections in southern CA. The program also seems to have good resources financially, which is always a plus. I also liked how they had set up the rotation schedule and surgpath schedule.

 

[LADoc00]

I interviewed there 2 years ago, knowing virtually nothing about it, and was really impressed. They have made some big changes in the last few years. They have great leadership that have turned things around. The residents have gotten a lot of input into shaping the program, and they seemed happy (not to mention quite sharp). They go on to impressive fellowships, and I like the philosophy of doing fellowship at a different place than residency, to broaden one's experience and expand connections. They do seem to have great job connections in southern CA. The program also seems to have good resources financially, which is always a plus. I also liked how they had set up the rotation schedule and surgpath schedule.

Yep, I definitely recommend doing a fellowship somewhere other than where you trained. Heck, I even know people who cherry picked the best AP residency and CP residency at different places AND did a stellar outside fellowship as well. Those types have glowing letters of rec coming out their asses.

 

[pathstudent]

Hello, I'm applying for path (28 programs actually) all over the country but my ideal location is southern California for no reason other than the fact that my family lives there. Does anyone know any dirt on path programs in socal? Which ones are the best/worst and what kind of scores/achievements do I need to get into the best ones? Thanks!

No Cal programs are hard to get into as there are only 2 (plus the one in Davis) north of the Hollywood Freeway.

There are a lot more So Cal programs and I am sure if you apply to all of them and interview at all of them that you will get a spot at one of them.