Canadian Postgraduate Fellowship Positions for Foreign Medical Graduates

[caribbbeanboy]

To all fellow colleagues,
I am starting this thread to help us foreigners share knowledge and help each other to obtain a direct postgraduate fellowship at a Canadian University.

I have graduated from the University of The West Indies and have 4 years of training post medical degree. With the MRCP (uk )qualification I am qualified as an Internal Medicine specialist at home.

I have been seeking a postgraduate position in Canada and have spoken to and met with many program directors. I being a foreigner am not able to apply through the match - Carms and hence I have not written the MCCEE, MCQEE exams.

Most of the responses have been an outright "NO" or that the additional positions are kept for Middle Eastern/Gulf State graduates as they have funding and give additional stipends to certain faculty members. Unless you personally know the directors, It would seem virtually impossible to get into a 2 year fellowship in Canada. I am still trying and one last University is attempting to give me a position , however fitting me in to their program is difficult as they have 3 residents/fellows and space is a major problem for most Universities.

I would like to know what your experience is with applying to Canada and how we can help each other to solve this.

Thanks

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[NewCanadian]

I'm going to respond by inviting you to consider some questions. (This is not about your training and competence.)

If you're neither a canadian citizen or permanent resident of canada, why would you think you could get a training post in canada?

If you haven't done any canadian exams, why would a director consider you over another person who has done canadian exams?

If you're not from saudi arabia, why don't you have your own funding? (the saudis come to canada with funding, and they have to go home after they finish. )

why would you believe that if you were to personally know the directors this would get you what you want?

are you aware of the issues of money and infrastructure which limit the number of doctors who can train and work in canada?

are you aware of return in service obligations for imgs who train in canada?

are you informed on what exactly is a fellowship and a subspecialty, in canadian terminology?

supposing you were to be offered a 2 year post, what would you do afterwards? do you have hopes to work in canada? have you applied to emigrate to canada? would you go to another country? why would a canadian medical school pay for you to train if you leave for another country?

these are issues you may (or may not) have thought about. Just asking.

 

[caribbbeanboy]

I really appreciate your honest reply.
As you know not everyone has the same opportunities as you and we have to look to foreign schools such as the US, Canada,UK.
The reason I am asking about Canada is that graduates from the Caribbean do get into fellowship positions without doing the Canadian exams and they do have funding and they do return home and they also have contracts with these Universities.
I am sure alot of Canadian would disagree with a foreigner taking up a post in a subspecialty program but the Universities really do try their best to accomodate us.

we do not plan to stay in Canada. All we require is the training. Is it that unfair that we ask for help?

 

[Medstart108]

Hey caribbbeanboy, it is possible to get a postgraduate fellowship position. NewCanadian is wrong on this issue, I have seen first hand clinical fellows and they are predominantly from abroad from countries like UK, Australia, India etc. I am not referring to residents only to the canadian definition of fellows which does not include cardiology for example, but includes cardiac electrophysiology for example.

I also have the links to prove it:

http://www.cardiologyfellowships.co.uk/intervention/vancouver-canada/
http://www.cardiologyfellowships.co.uk/intervention/toronto-canada/

Now this is just for cardiology but i'm sure things like this exist for other specialities as well.

 

[NewCanadian]

I really appreciate your honest reply.
As you know not everyone has the same opportunities as you and we have to look to foreign schools such as the US, Canada,UK.
The reason I am asking about Canada is that graduates from the Caribbean do get into fellowship positions without doing the Canadian exams and they do have funding and they do return home and they also have contracts with these Universities.
I am sure alot of Canadian would disagree with a foreigner taking up a post in a subspecialty program but the Universities really do try their best to accomodate us.

we do not plan to stay in Canada. All we require is the training. Is it that unfair that we ask for help?

??? Unfair to ask for help??? I only invited you to consider some questions.

 

[ophthalmologist_tr]

Hi all,

I am an ophthalmologist who practices in Turkey. In my country there is no fellowship position for ophthalmologists that is why my only chance is applying international fellowship programme. Is anybody here can help me for ophthalmology fellowship programmes in Canada..

Regards..

 

[The Sugar_Diabeetus]

Hi all,

I am an ophthalmologist who practices in Turkey. In my country there is no fellowship position for ophthalmologists that is why my only chance is applying international fellowship programme. Is anybody here can help me for ophthalmology fellowship programmes in Canada..

Regards..

Fellowship positions for foreign grads who do not have postgraduate training from Canada are hard to come by.

That doesn't mean that you would not be able to obtain one. However, there is nobody here who can answer your question for several reasons. All i can do is answer the question based on what i have seen

For the most part such positions are granted outside of our matching system (i.e. CaRMS). Therefore you would have to contact each individual university with an ophthalmology program to inquire if A) they have an available fellowship program, B) they have somebody available to supervise/train you, C) they have space. I would add that high level, niche fellowships have less competition. e.g neuro-opthalmology, or oculoplastics.

You would also have to ensure they your credentials were acceptable to the licensing body for the province you were planning on obtaining the fellowship in. Whether this means you would have to take some of the the Canadian exams is unclear.

Lastly, and probably most importantly is funding. Funding for these positions is very difficult to come by. Sometimes for a research positions, your potential supervisor can afford to pay you out of their research grant. However most times, like in the case of the Saudi guys, they bring funding directly from their local governments.

Your best chance is probably the US. Numerous Canadian graduates will go to the US for high level niche training within their area of speciality. But again, you will probably need to contact individual programs and most likely do the US exams.

 

[Medstart108]

Fellowship positions for foreign grads who do not have postgraduate training from Canada are hard to come by.

That doesn't mean that you would not be able to obtain one. However, there is nobody here who can answer your question for several reasons. All i can do is answer the question based on what i have seen

For the most part such positions are granted outside of our matching system (i.e. CaRMS). Therefore you would have to contact each individual university with an ophthalmology program to inquire if A) they have an available fellowship program, B) they have somebody available to supervise/train you, C) they have space. I would add that high level, niche fellowships have less competition. e.g neuro-opthalmology, or oculoplastics.

You would also have to ensure they your credentials were acceptable to the licensing body for the province you were planning on obtaining the fellowship in. Whether this means you would have to take some of the the Canadian exams is unclear.

Lastly, and probably most importantly is funding. Funding for these positions is very difficult to come by. Sometimes for a research positions, your potential supervisor can afford to pay you out of their research grant. However most times, like in the case of the Saudi guys, they bring funding directly from their local governments.

Your best chance is probably the US. Numerous Canadian graduates will go to the US for high level niche training within their area of speciality. But again, you will probably need to contact individual programs and most likely do the US exams.

Its not impossible actually, most Canadian fellows are not Canadian at all. The most popular countries they come from are the UK, Australia, Ireland, India and the Middle East.

 

[The Sugar_Diabeetus]

Its not impossible actually, most Canadian fellows are not Canadian at all. The most popular countries they come from are the UK, Australia, Ireland, India and the Middle East.

Most Canadian fellows ARE Canadian.

However, they may have been Canadians that went out of the country for medical school and have now returned for post-graduate training. A smaller amount of fellows are those who were born, lived and trained outside of the country. But, because they have either PR/citizenship and have Canadian post-graduate training (or training recognized by Royal College), they become eligible for fellowship training.

Somebody who is neither a PR/citizen nor has Canadian post-graduate training will have a tough time finding what they want.

 

[ophthalmologist_tr]

thanks for all replies.

I wrote to fellowship coordinator of cornea depertment of Toronto university, who is called A. Slomovic. He sent me an application form. I want to ask some questions related to these questions in that form.

1) HAVE YOU PASSED PARTS 1 & 2 OF THE MEDICAL COUNCIL OF CANADA EVALUATING EXAMINATION? Yes____ No____ (attach certificate)
2) IF YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ABOVE EXAMINATION, YOU MUST BE REGISTERED AS AN OPHTHALMOLOGIST IN YOUR COUNTRY ACCEPTIBLE TO THE UNIVERSITY OF TORONTO (attach certificate)
3) ARE YOU REGISTERED WITH THE COLLEGE OF PHYSICIANS AND SURGEONS OF ONTARIO?
4) EDUCATIONAL LICENCE NUMBER:__________________________
5) GENERAL LICENCE NUMBER:______________________________

What are the educational and general licence numbers?
Do i have to sit the exam in first question?
For an IMG what are the requirements of registiration with college of physicians and surgeons of ontario?

Regards

 

[The Sugar_Diabeetus]

thanks for all replies.

I wrote to fellowship coordinator of cornea depertment of Toronto university, who is called A. Slomovic. He sent me an application form. I want to ask some questions related to these questions in that form.

1) HAVE YOU PASSED PARTS 1 & 2 OF THE MEDICAL COUNCIL OF CANADA EVALUATING EXAMINATION? Yes____ No____ (attach certificate)
2) IF YOU DO NOT HAVE THE ABOVE EXAMINATION, YOU MUST BE REGISTERED AS AN OPHTHALMOLOGIST IN YOUR COUNTRY ACCEPTIBLE TO THE UNIVERSITY OF TORONTO (attach certificate)
3) ARE YOU REGISTERED WITH THE COLLEGE OF PHYSICIANS AND SURGEONS OF ONTARIO?
4) EDUCATIONAL LICENCE NUMBER:__________________________
5) GENERAL LICENCE NUMBER:______________________________

What are the educational and general licence numbers?
Do i have to sit the exam in first question?
For an IMG what are the requirements of registiration with college of physicians and surgeons of ontario?

Regards

the program director has basically asked you to submit your credentials for evaluation.

I would assume that you do not have MCCQE part 1 and 2. In fact without post-graduate training in North America it is my understanding, you would not be eligible to sit for part 2.

However, he has given you an alternative. You may submit official or notorized copies of your credentials to him. They will evaluate whether this is acceptable to the university. I would also explain your situation to him a little further, and see if they are willing to work with you or facilitate your application.

Your biggest challenge will to obtain licensure from the college of physicians. They will either grant you a general licence or educational license based on a successful application. But nobody here can answer the specifics of what they are looking for. You will have to contact them directly and explain your story.
Mostly likely you will have to submit a formal application to them, and pay a processing fee.

Unfortunately, you have a very high probability of being unsuccessful. The odds are stacked against you with regard to processing your credentials, and most program directors will not be relatively enthusiastic about having to assist with somebody's application unless they are a preferred candidate.

 

[ophthalmologist_tr]

the program director has basically asked you to submit your credentials for evaluation.

I would assume that you do not have MCCQE part 1 and 2. In fact without post-graduate training in North America it is my understanding, you would not be eligible to sit for part 2.

However, he has given you an alternative. You may submit official or notorized copies of your credentials to him. They will evaluate whether this is acceptable to the university. I would also explain your situation to him a little further, and see if they are willing to work with you or facilitate your application.

Your biggest challenge will to obtain licensure from the college of physicians. They will either grant you a general licence or educational license based on a successful application. But nobody here can answer the specifics of what they are looking for. You will have to contact them directly and explain your story.
Mostly likely you will have to submit a formal application to them, and pay a processing fee.

Unfortunately, you have a very high probability of being unsuccessful. The odds are stacked against you with regard to processing your credentials, and most program directors will not be relatively enthusiastic about having to assist with somebody's application unless they are a preferred candidate.

Thank you so much for this helpful post.

Unfortunately I gave up..Application of registration is approximetely 1500 canadian dollars and as you say I 'll be unsuccessful. If I wouldn't have to obtain licensure from the college, i thought that i had a chance to submit my International Council of Ophthalmology exams certificates and European Board of Ophthalmology Diploma. I will try USMLE then. Thanks a lot!!

 

[The Sugar_Diabeetus]

Thank you so much for this helpful post.

Unfortunately I gave up..Application of registration is approximetely 1500 canadian dollars and as you say I 'll be unsuccessful. If I wouldn't have to obtain licensure from the college, i thought that i had a chance to submit my International Council of Ophthalmology exams certificates and European Board of Ophthalmology Diploma. I will try USMLE then. Thanks a lot!!

Those sound like high quality credentials, at least to me. I know first hand UK credentials are most acceptable to the college, so i would venture certain european credentials could work.

But again, i cannot broadly say what the college of physicians may or may not find acceptable, especially since you're applying for a position granted outside our matching system.

Again, i would advise you to physically contact the college and get their opinion. I would also actually speak to the program director.
But yes, there is every chance you could waste the $1500 application fee.

 

[ophthalmologist_tr]

Those sound like high quality credentials, at least to me. I know first hand UK credentials are most acceptable to the college, so i would venture certain european credentials could work.

But again, i cannot broadly say what the college of physicians may or may not find acceptable, especially since you're applying for a position granted outside our matching system.

Again, i would advise you to physically contact the college and get their opinion. I would also actually speak to the program director.
But yes, there is every chance you could waste the $1500 application fee.

I will try to contact with college, thank you for your kindly manner

 

[dnoel075]

I am Canadian but I am in medical school at a Caribbean school and planning on doing my residency in the US in Internal Medicine. Will I be in a good position to apply for fellowships in Canada afterwards? Is it next to impossible or will I actually have a chance?

 

[respidoc]

hello everyone! i have completed my graduation in medicine (MBBS) and have also completed my post graduation in respiratory medicine. I would like to peruse some fellowship program in respiratory medicine in Canada. What is the best possible way of doing so? would i have to repeat my residency in respiratory medicine in Canada for the purpose of doing fellowship.