“Can’t see my self doing anything els” v.s fall back plan

[DoctorSwagger]

Some might say go into medicine if you can’t see yourself doing anything else. That notion seems to be taken positively. At the same time, during an interview, we might be asked about our fall back plan if we don’t get into medicine. Should the interviewee lie and say “idk maybe BME”? I get that showing a fall back plan shows maturity and blah blah blah. But I’m still confused about this because both notions contradict one another.


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[DiscusKeeper]

Your answer should be discovering the weaknesses in your application, working on them sufficiently, and reapplying. If you're gonna say anything else, then try to connect it back to why you want to do medicine. E.g. if your backup plan is a career in teaching, connect this to how you love the idea of being a life-long learner in medicine and having the opportunity to teach others, including patients.

Realistically, it's okay to have a backup plan though.

 

[PipetteDreams]

I had an interviewer ask me that question repetitively. I just finished my PhD, and he kept telling me my reasons "weren't good enough," I was "better suited for faculty," and I "don't know what [I'm] getting into" (despite volunteering, shadowing, clinical collaboration, best friends/mentors being clinicians, etc). This went on for a long time.

Finally, I got teary-eyed with frustration, humiliatingly enough, and said "I have explored every other option. I have tried to convince myself to do anything else, and to not want to go down this path. This is the only career I see myself being fulfilled by -- I don't know what else you want from me!"

On the way out of the interview, he said, "Good job, I was just trying to rile you up," and winked.

I was accepted. I suspect he would have not wanted to see a "Plan B."

 

[BurntFlower]

The fallback plan is to strengthen your application by doing research/clinical/non-clinical activities and then re-apply again. Adcoms want to see your commitment to medicine.

 

[3toedsloth]

Sometimes they keep asking this super late in the cycle.

I was asked in like the beginning of feb "what will you do if you're not accepted?" I paused and had to think of an answer that was better than "go somewhere I've already been accepted." lol....

 

[LizzyM]

Sometimes this question is meant to see what interests you... what other professions would be a good fit for your interests and your skill set. For some people this might be engineering, for others teaching or counseling or investment banking. Then you are going to be asked why that other profession interests you. Fine as long as you have an answer that seems to make sense.

 

[OneTwoThreeFour]

Piggybacking off of @LizzyM, I tended to ask this question more to see what people are passionate about. The whole "I'd reapply" thing is actually the most boring answer in my book. Show me you want to work with people and help others.

 

[mimelim]

I'll be honest, I cringe whenever I hear that people 'expect' or 'want' someone to talk about reapplying at that they couldn't see doing anything else. For me it is a pretty big negative that you don't have a plan B.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I'll be honest, I cringe whenever I hear that people 'expect' or 'want' someone to talk about reapplying at that they couldn't see doing anything else. For me it is a pretty big negative that you don't have a plan B.

Just goes to show you that you can’t predict what the interviewer wants to hear. In my last mock interview, I was asked what I would do if I don’t get accepted. Well, in my program, if I don’t get accepted, I don’t have the option of reapplying for 3 years as I will have to go back to the fleet to serve out my commitment. I explained that and said that I would attempt to better my application during that time. I then said that if I didn’t get in again, I would apply to law school and explained why I think law would help me fulfill my goals.

In the feedback, she said that I wasn’t committed enough to medicine because I had a plan B.

 

[Osminog]

You have a Plan B? Uncommitted and indecisive. You don't have a Plan B? Immature and overly idealistic.

There's no winning in the cruel world of med school interviewing.

 

[mwsapphire]

Just goes to show you that you can’t predict what the interviewer wants to hear. In my last mock interview, I was asked what I would do if I don’t get accepted. Well, in my program, if I don’t get accepted, I don’t have the option of reapplying for 3 years as I will have to go back to the fleet to serve out my commitment. I explained that and said that I would attempt to better my application during that time. I then said that if I didn’t get in again, I would apply to law school and explained why I think law would help me fulfill my goals.

In the feedback, she said that I wasn’t committed enough to medicine because I had a plan B.

That honestly scares the crap out of me.
What do you do if you don't have a plan B? Become a bum?

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

That honestly scares the crap out of me.
What do you do if you don't have a plan B? Become a bum?

You apply endlessly until you bankrupt yourself and become homeless, putting your spouse and kids (if you have them) into poverty. Because that's a mature and realistic answer apparently.

 

[mwsapphire]

You apply endlessly until you bankrupt yourself and become homeless, putting your spouse and kids (if you have them) into poverty. Because that's a mature and realistic answer apparently.

I get that you're joking but it honestly seems like that's what that woman wanted to hear.
I switched from general bio to bioinformatics and am taking most of the classes needed for the biotech concentration, ( can't be awarded both so and that 6th class doesn't fit), and am seriously looking at how I could still do clinical lab based work and do medicine from the other side. That would be my answer and it honestly seemed so mature and reasonable to me but apparently that interviewer wouldn't have liked it. I'd apply for a second cycle, but then I'd just pursue this backup plan.

 

[gyngyn]

Having a alternate plan shows resilience, adaptability and maturity.
Mere persistence is not laudable.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Having a alternate plan shows resilience, adaptability and maturity.
Mere persistence is not laudable.

Tell that to my mock interviewers.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I get that you're joking but it honestly seems like that's what that woman wanted to hear.
I switched from general bio to bioinformatics and am taking most of the classes needed for the biotech concentration, ( can't be awarded both so and that 6th class doesn't fit), and am seriously looking at how I could still do clinical lab based work and do medicine from the other side. That would be my answer and it honestly seemed so mature and reasonable to me but apparently that interviewer wouldn't have liked it. I'd apply for a second cycle, but then I'd just pursue this backup plan.

Just be honest. I think it's definitely safer to be honest and have a plan to reapply with a better app with a plan B in case you don't succeed again. If you happen to get someone that wants an immature, try until you die answer, so be it. That one thing isn't going to sink you I don't think.

 

[gyngyn]

Tell that to my mock interviewers.

I would mock them!

 

[LizzyM]

Who is this mock interviewer @Matthew9Thirtyfive ? Is it a pre-med advisor??? You know the consensus on those folks, don't you? I suspect this may be one more example of why they have a reputation for idiocy.

 

[Lawpy]

Who is this mock interviewer @Matthew9Thirtyfive ? Is it a pre-med advisor??? You know the consensus on those folks, don't you? I suspect this may be one more example of why they have a reputation for idiocy.

So you think interviewers would like to see a Plan B? Then what is your response to this?

I had an interviewer ask me that question repetitively. I just finished my PhD, and he kept telling me my reasons "weren't good enough," I was "better suited for faculty," and I "don't know what [I'm] getting into" (despite volunteering, shadowing, clinical collaboration, best friends/mentors being clinicians, etc). This went on for a long time.

Finally, I got teary-eyed with frustration, humiliatingly enough, and said "I have explored every other option. I have tried to convince myself to do anything else, and to not want to go down this path. This is the only career I see myself being fulfilled by -- I don't know what else you want from me!"

On the way out of the interview, he said, "Good job, I was just trying to rile you up," and winked.

I was accepted. I suspect he would have not wanted to see a "Plan B."

I was accepted. I suspect he would have not wanted to see a "Plan B."

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Who is this mock interviewer @Matthew9Thirtyfive ? Is it a pre-med advisor??? You know the consensus on those folks, don't you? I suspect this may be one more example of why they have a reputation for idiocy.

It was set up through a premed committee, yes. She was nice and gave really solid feedback on everything else. That was kind of the only part that seemed weird to me.

 

[LizzyM]

I think that there are a variety of answers to the question of Plan B. It can be a clear desire to know in a round about way why a candidate has chosen medicine and what other careers might have been considered or would be a plan B. Someone who says, podiatrist or dentist or optomitrist is in a different boat than someone who says "i-banking or corporate law because I like to know how systems work and have influence over them". Then you get something out of left field like "chef, or drummer in a rock band" and that requires a long conversation to figure out.

It may be different when someone is a career changer or who has been well down one path before switching (after all, if an applicant has a PhD, the Plan B, quite clearly, can be to take an academic position in a college or university).

 

[PipetteDreams]

So you think interviewers would like to see a Plan B? Then what is your response to this?

It may be different when someone is a career changer or who has been well down one path before switching (after all, if an applicant has a PhD, the Plan B, quite clearly, can be to take an academic position in a college or university).

Right. My long-term goal is to be a physician scientist, and that was true at the onset of my graduate career. A significant portion of my interview with this faculty member was to demonstrate that I wasn't avoiding the fight for tenure and low NIH funding rates. I believe he wanted to see me (passionately) defend my desire to pursue patient care.

 

[LizzyM]

Right. My long-term goal is to be a physician scientist, and that was true at the onset of my graduate career. A significant portion of my interview with this faculty member was to demonstrate that I wasn't avoiding the fight for tenure and low NIH funding rates. I believe he wanted to see me (passionately) defend my desire to pursue patient care.

And if that were the case, then if the question were," If not medicine, then what??" quite reasonable responses might have been podiatry, dentistry, or another profession that provides clinical care at a leadership level and has opportunities for research.

 

[trobinsonmd]

There are two ways to answer this question... either say you will fix your weaknesses and reapply... or say that and then follow it up by saying should I not get in a second time, I would be interested in pursuing x,y,z... the x,y,z should all have characteristics that are in-line with medicine (i.e. teacher, professor, PA,)... do not list other high paying jobs that have nothing to do with medicine, such as attorney or anything in finance... I was on the adcom at my school and I asked a few ppl this question at interviews, lawyer was actually a very common reply and that is kind of a red flag, even if you are genuinely passionate about law.

 

[Lawpy]

There are two ways to answer this question... either say you will fix your weaknesses and reapply... or say that and then follow it up by saying should I not get in a second time, I would be interested in pursuing x,y,z... the x,y,z should all have characteristics that are in-line with medicine (i.e. teacher, professor, PA,)... do not list other high paying jobs that have nothing to do with medicine, such as attorney or anything in finance... I was on the adcom at my school and I asked a few ppl this question at interviews, lawyer was actually a very common reply and that is kind of a red flag, even if you are genuinely passionate about law.

why is that?

 

[trobinsonmd]

why is that?

good question... unfortunately a lot of applicants go into medicine for the money and the one part of the interview is partly about trying to identify these people and weed them out... if someone mentions other high earning careers (even if they are interested in them genuinely), it COULD be misconstrued as them being in it for the money... it's just not a risk worth taking and I know that at my school, they told me and all the other interviewers to be weary of this

 

[Lawpy]

good question... unfortunately a lot of applicants go into medicine for the money and the one part of the interview is partly about trying to identify these people and weed them out... if someone mentions other high earning careers (even if they are interested in them genuinely), it COULD be misconstrued as them being in it for the money... it's just not a risk worth taking and I know that at my school, they told me and all the other interviewers to be weary of this

how does your school view career changers with a finance or law background?

 

[RNtoMD87]

I really dread this question. I feel like if I try enough, I can definitely get accepted, even if I have to work at it, and apply a couple years. However, if for whatever reason, I could not get accepted, I would follow the nursing path, since I'm already an experienced nurse. However, I fear that they would see this answer and be like "Oh so you don't mind being a nurse. Why become a doctor?" When frankly I can't see my myself staying a nurse as I am bored to tears.

 

[trobinsonmd]

how does your school view career changers with a finance or law background?

Positively... I'm at a top 5 school and I have a few friends on adcoms at some top 10 schools and they have told me they about a few investment bankers who were making big bucks but hated it and wanted to do something else, so they applied to med school... I think cases like that are viewed in a positive light because it shows that the applicant is very passionate and serious about medicine if they are leaving a huge salary and luxurious life to pursue it

 

[trobinsonmd]

That seems to bring up an ethical dilemma. What if a person's backup plan is something like law, finance, or engineering? Maybe there are things that they legitimately find interesting about those career fields. Should they lie and say nursing or PA to avoid the stigma of money? If that's the case then there's something wrong with how adcoms are interpreting answers for this question.

I would think that having a realistic, financially sound backup plan shows maturity and good forward planning.

I should have qualified my answer with the following; if law or finance are FOR SURE your back ups and you absolutely MUST reply with one of those careers, then offer a few reasons why and draw parallels to medicine for sure... guess i forgot to say that because it is really really rare that I hear of someone with those answers qualifying them with that... we simply ask what the fallback plan is, but we usually don't ask why... so people who say law or finance tend to just leave it at that and don't defend their answer, leaving them vulnerable to their answer being misconstrued

 

[863168]

Seems like during the pre-medical process everyone keeps questioning your motivation to want to become a doctor. Then when the fire hose effect hits you full blast in medical school you begin to question your own motivation about why you still want to become a doctor. Ironically, once you get in it seems like everyone around you keeps pushing you to finish it because they assumed the hardest part for all students was getting into a program. Which is not always the case.

 

[mwsapphire]

I literally never thought this would be a harder interview question but it seems like it is....

 

[OneTwoThreeFour]

I think this is another example of over-thinking it and making it harder than it is. My answer (4ish years ago): "While of course I hope to become a doctor, if I were unable to do so I would look for another job where I could help to improve the lives of others. I grew up with a mother who is a social worker and I really admired the connections she made with the people she worked with and the meaningful difference she is able to make in their lives. To have the opportunity to do that would be a privilege and truthfully, I consider that one of the biggest draws for medicine."

Something like that. You can draw parallels with just about any field as long as you think about it enough. The question is not about what the Plan B is, it is what your reasoning for Plan B is. As far as @Matthew9Thirtyfive 's situation- I don't know what your answer was but when people have told me law school in the past it felt like a "I need to go to some kind of graduate school" answer.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I think this is another example of over-thinking it and making it harder than it is. My answer (4ish years ago): "While of course I hope to become a doctor, if I were unable to do so I would look for another job where I could help to improve the lives of others. I grew up with a mother who is a social worker and I really admired the connections she made with the people she worked with and the meaningful difference she is able to make in their lives. To have the opportunity to do that would be a privilege and truthfully, I consider that one of the biggest draws for medicine."

Something like that. You can draw parallels with just about any field as long as you think about it enough. The question is not about what the Plan B is, it is what your reasoning for Plan B is. As far as @Matthew9Thirtyfive 's situation- I don't know what your answer was but when people have told me law school in the past it felt like a "I need to go to some kind of graduate school" answer.

I gave a pretty detailed answer as to why law would help me fulfill my goals and why I would enjoy it were I unable to get into medical school after two cycles. I’m a 34 year old non-trad with a wife and kids and a good career in the military, so it definitely didn’t come off as just needing to go to grad school.

 

[RNtoMD87]

It seems like they look down on people in search of knowledge or achievement. What's wrong with that? I make plenty of money as a nurse. I help people as a nurse. I like my job.

But I'm capable of more. I want to reach my potential.

Hell- when you die and the you that you became and the you that you could've been meet.

 

[863168]

@RNtoMD87 If you have the energy to achieve lots of potential then I would suggest you just try out sky diving.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

@RNtoMD87 If you have the energy to achieve lots of potential then I would suggest you try out sky diving.

You lose your potential really quick jumping out of an airplane.

 

[863168]

You lose your potential really quick jumping out of an airplane.

That's why you need to have the fuel to build it back up.

 

[The Unburnt]

I was also very weary of this question going into interviews and ended up being asked this question at multiple interviews. It was especially awkward because every time I was asked this question I had already been accepted to a program and it was always phrased "what if you can't get into to medical school? what will you do?" and I was like but I digress. I approached the question by first making it clear that I would do stuff to improve my application and reapply. Then I said "if you mean what would I do if I could NEVER get into medical school-" and I was just honest. If I couldn't practice medicine I would probably go into public health and do some kind of epidemiology research. I made sure to explain why I had chosen that answer and how it would fulfill me in a similar way that medicine will.

I think what @OneTwoThreeFour said is true, the explanation behind whatever alternate career you choose is more important than the career itself. I wouldn't just name a career without explaining why I chose that answer. I'm just a lowly incoming M1 tho so what do I know

 

[RNtoMD87]

@RNtoMD87 If you have the energy to achieve lots of potential then I would suggest you just try out sky diving.

Actually you would have a lot of kinetic by jumping from an aeroplane. By merely flying in such a craft at altitude you would have potential.

 

[863168]

Actually you would have a lot of kinetic by jumping from an aeroplane. By merely flying in such a craft at altitude you would have potential.

True that. Kudos to you.

 

[Goro]

Some might say go into medicine if you can’t see yourself doing anything else. That notion seems to be taken positively. At the same time, during an interview, we might be asked about our fall back plan if we don’t get into medicine. Should the interviewee lie and say “idk maybe BME”? I get that showing a fall back plan shows maturity and blah blah blah. But I’m still confused about this because both notions contradict one another.


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When I ask this question, I'm less concerned with the dedication to Medicine, as I am with the candidate's maturity and wisdom. I expect people to have a Plan B. I do not want to hear "I'll keep on applying until I'm 80!" Too many people confuse determination with competence.